I feel moved to make a couple of comments. o Dr. Fred did get over the edge. His communication style had little to recommend it. o He did make some good and useful comments along with some others. o Some people posting anonymously and otherwise took out of context quotes in an apparently mean-spirited way and slammed the guy. o Dr. Fred reacted o Others reacted o Some people took private email from Dr. Fred and quite unethically replied publicly on this list without his permission. o I see both sides as owing this list apologies. o There are two sides to this whole thing. Fred brought up some concerns about possible holes in software just as many of us have. Most the time things like this result in good discussions on this list and concensus is reached about the holes existing or not and the extent of the holes. Because of Dr. Fred's presentation, he quickly alienated people, and what little discussion there was about his theories was lost in the noise. We'd do better to let it drop. In the future if someone really annoys you in the way they present something, perhaps it would help more if you sent them private email noting that their communication skills are working against them and giving them some helpful pointers about how they could have done things differently. That way you'll be part of the solution instead of part of the problem. It's easier to get your dander up and express your annoyance publicly, but that affects all the rest of us. Patrick _______________________________________________________________________ / These opinions are mine, and not Verity's (except by coincidence;). \ | (\ | | Patrick J. Horgan Verity Inc. \\ Have | | patrick@verity.com 1550 Plymouth Street \\ _ Sword | | Phone : (415)960-7600 Mountain View \\/ Will | | FAX : (415)960-7750 California 94303 _/\\ Travel | \___________________________________________________________\)__________/