Actually I think its thier lack of foreseeing how a produbt can and will be used. Problems throughout thier line of products show this off. Most of thier products are a creation of Microsoft anyway, they've stolen, borrowed, purchased or purchased the company to obtain their products, then added features upon features so they can market the hell out of it to become #1 in market share. Many cases they've taken a reliable product and made it less than reliable. I don't understand why people continue to support Microsoft they way they do! Ponder the thought of Microsoft buying up every web server/broswer company in the first year or two of the WEB? Would it have made it where it is today? Ponder the thought of Micorosft having ultimate control over the IETF

In my experience, one of Microsoft's main problems when it comes to security has been its developers and program/product managers don't think like "bad guys" when it comes to design and subsequent exploits and holes. Unfortunately, the user is the ultimate loser.

Joel

BTW - The paranoid side of me wouldn't be surprised to see PC "espionage-enabled" viruses and trojans within the next few years. Their main purpose would be to either disable or patch various security features for later attacks, or directly snatch information off of hard drives and send it out over the Net. I know of a few lab projects of a similar nature, that were very easy to implement.

BTW: When is this list/listserver going to convert the reply-to fields to point to cypherpunks@toad.com? -- ------------------------------------------ There are no facts, only interpretations. I always wanted to be somebody,