: I recommend that we give up the battle and go fight the real war. We are : totally outgunned if we stick to this approach and are wasting our time. : What the entire net community should do is focus it's energies on chopping : NSA's budget, period. That's what these guys really care about after all. There was quite an interesting quotation in one of the British papers recently from Ames, the CIA spy who was caught - he said that the intelligence infrastructure in the US was a self-serving bureaucracy. I forget the exact wording, but it was the sort of thing you'd imagine the head of any big organisation like that would want to say but was never in a position to be able to - of course, now Ames can say what he likes :-) I wonder if he's available for interviews by the Cypherpunk Press ;-) G