Rich Burroughs wrote:

At 02:56 PM 1/6/97 +1000, Robert Barnes wrote: [snip]

...

My bottom line feeling with respect to this is that we cannot expect freedom unless we are willing to exercise responsibility. It is apparent that the people who are noisiest about freedom of speech and content censoring are working tirelessly to abuse the list and provoke the very opposite of their stated ideals.

Hmmm. There has been some of that, but some of use who have spoken about freedom of speech have done so because of legitimate concerns, not just to gain advantage in an ongoing, juvenile campaign.

I would say that there had been a lot more than "some of that". I believe that moderation as proposed does not really limit anyones Freedom of Speech. After all the list is intended as a forum to discuss the topic of cryptography and it's use by society, the list is not advertised as a free for all abuse forum or an unlimited conduit for spam. If you want Freedom of Speech go stand on a soapbox in your local town square. Would you complain that people who choose to walk on by and not listen to you are violating your right to Free Speech? Cypherpunks has the right to say "Enough, take the raves, rants and spam somewhere else". You are free to say what you want, but if it is off-topic, I don't want to see it in my inbox.

<snip>

I think the idea of two versions of the list is an excellent one, and it avoids the issues raised by presenting the list in only a moderated form. If people want the spam they can have it, and if they don't they can take advantage of John and Sandy's work, and read a more coherent version of the list. I will certainly choose the latter, but it is nice to know that the choice is mine. John and Sandy -- thanks for getting this rolling.

You will certainly be in the minority, but you are right, the choice is yours to make and everyone else's as well.

Rich ______________________________________________________________________ Rich Burroughs richieb@teleport.com http://www.teleport.com/~richieb U.S. State Censorship Page at - http://www.teleport.com/~richieb/state dec96 issue "cause for alarm" - http://www.teleport.com/~richieb/cause

-------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Barnes Phone: +61 7 32529722 Fax: +61 7 32571403 Tritronics (Australia) Pty Ltd Email: robertb@tritro.com.au PGP Key fingerprint = 02 A6 22 5E 26 D3 7C 4D E2 91 9E 15 AC EA B1 58 Send e-mail with "get key" in the "Subject:" field to get a copy of my public key