Re: "Got a subpoena?"
On Thu, 30 Nov 1995, sameer wrote:
What about a court order to (a) start comprehensive logging, and (b) not tell anyone under penalty of ______ .
I am unaware of any authority for such an order.
Aren't court orders part of the public record? I don't quite
Yes, but court orders can be sealed pending further order of the court.
Okay, maybe with your qualifications you can answer this. It has always mystified me why "the authorities" think they can engage in wiretapping without informing the person wiretapped that this has occurred, despite the fact that there was apparently never any precedent for this practice before the "wiretap era." In addition, I would like to be able to figure out a method to allow the de-facto disclosure of such activities, and to in fact force the phone company to do so, if they are asked to tap my or anyone else's phone. It occurred to me that even if there was a prohibition on explicitly revealing that such a tap exists, it should be possible to require the telephone company to certify that no tap exists, and to require that this certification will be followed by an explicit and immediate de-certification message the moment the phone company is unable to maintain such certification. The receipt of such a letter/fax/email will indicate that a tap has been placed, despite the fact that it will not say so.
EBD
Not a lawyer on the Net, although I play one in real life.
On Sat, 2 Dec 1995, jim bell wrote:
On Thu, 30 Nov 1995, sameer wrote:
What about a court order to (a) start comprehensive logging, and (b) not tell anyone under penalty of ______ .
I am unaware of any authority for such an order.
Aren't court orders part of the public record? I don't quite
Yes, but court orders can be sealed pending further order of the court.
Okay, maybe with your qualifications you can answer this. It has always mystified me why "the authorities" think they can engage in wiretapping without informing the person wiretapped that this has occurred, despite the fact that there was apparently never any precedent for this practice before the "wiretap era."
Because Congress passed the Electronic Communications Privacy Act which is codified, as amended, at 18 U.S.C. Section 2510 et seq. Section 2511(2)(a)(ii) states in part: "Notwithstanding any other law, providers of wire or electronic communication service ... are authorized to provide information, facilities, or technical assistance to persons authorized by law to intercept wire, oral, or electronic communications ... if such provider ... has been provided with [a court order or a certification by an appropriate official that a court order isn't required ...].
In addition, I would like to be able to figure out a method to allow the de-facto disclosure of such activities, and to in fact force the phone company to do so, if they are asked to tap my or anyone else's phone. It occurred to me that even if there was a prohibition on explicitly revealing that such a tap exists, it should be possible to require the telephone company to certify that no tap exists, and to require that this certification will be followed by an explicit and immediate de-certification message the moment the phone company is unable to maintain such certification. The receipt of such a letter/fax/email will indicate that a tap has been placed, despite the fact that it will not say so.
Sorry. In subsection B of the the statute I quoted above, it states in part: "No provider of wire or electronic communication service ... shall disclose the existence of any interception ... with respect to which the person has been furnished a court order or certification ... except as may be otherwise required by legal process and then only after prior notification to the Attorney General or .... Any such disclosure shall render such person liable for the civil damages provided for in section 2520. No cause of action shall lie against in any court against any provider ... for providing information ... in accordance with the terms of a court order or certification under this chapter." Thus providing evidence of that one of the uses of lawyers is to [attempt to close loopholes. EBD
EBD
Not a lawyer on the Net, although I play one in real life.
Not a lawyer on the Net, although I play one in real life. ********************************************************** Flame away! I get treated worse in person every day!!
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