Hey, folks, I thought all you had to do to create an alt.group was to have a news admin somewhere just make a group; send out a control message of somekind. I thought that alt groups didn't have to go through a charter, or voting process, or anything else. They just happened. Then, everyone just has to tell their local news admin that they went to see it, or they can wait until their news admin sees it flying by, and adds it to the available groups list at his own discretion. It's not like we want comp.cypherpunks or something, with a voting process, right? Cheers, Bob Hettinga ----------------- Robert Hettinga (rah@shipwright.com), Philodox e$, 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "Never attribute to conspiracy what can be explained by stupidity." -- Jerry Pournelle The e$ Home Page: http://www.shipwright.com/rah/ FC97: Anguilla, anyone? http://www.ai/fc97/
Hey, folks,
I thought all you had to do to create an alt.group was to have a news admin somewhere just make a group; send out a control message of somekind. I thought that alt groups didn't have to go through a charter, or voting process, or anything else. They just happened.
Then, everyone just has to tell their local news admin that they went to see it, or they can wait until their news admin sees it flying by, and adds it to the available groups list at his own discretion.
It's not like we want comp.cypherpunks or something, with a voting process, right?
It's not quite that simple. While a "Big 7" group requires CFD, charter and voting, once you pass tthose hurdles you're virtually guaranteed good propagation. alt has no "set" creartion procedure, but your group will not receive good propagation unless the powers that be "approve" of the idea. In this case, the people you have to convince are the news admins who must permit your control message to be honoured; time was most sites ran on autopilot, but joke and badly-named groups mean that most news admins now drop most newgroup messages on the floor. These people hang out in alt.config, and you should propose the group's creation there, followed by a couple of weeks of discussion, hopefully featuring many more supportive messages than non-supportive ones. After that, a newgroup message stands a much better chance.
Cheers, Bob Hettinga
Hip hip, John P. john@huiac.apana.org.au
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- John Pearson <john@cognac.apana.org.au> writes:
In this case, the people you have to convince are the news admins who must permit your control message to be honoured; time was most sites ran on autopilot, but joke and badly-named groups mean that most news admins now drop most newgroup messages on the floor. These people hang out in alt.config, and you should propose the group's creation there, followed by a couple of weeks of discussion, hopefully featuring many more supportive messages than non-supportive ones. After that, a newgroup message stands a much better chance.
alt.cypherpunks has been newgroup'ed, and I belive rm'grouped. Smart, consiencous newsadmins probably did not honor the rmgroup, as alt.cypherpunks should be acceptable, but most newsadmins are too overworked to actually look at most of the crap that comes through. For example, it hasn't received any messages on my news server, probably because the one upstream removed it. Therefore, it would be a Good Thing to continue any discussion on alt.config, and convince any cabal'ers who rmgroup it to re-new it. Sending out boosters every couple of weeks wouldn't hurt, either. alt.cypherpunks'less, Jer "standing on top of the world/ never knew how you never could/ never knew why you never could live/ innocent life that everyone did" -Wormhole -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQB1AwUBMwPWcskz/YzIV3P5AQEEOgMA1YEqI4VN6CbUg+MNHXpoLgzLWVDvCw/m gwiZbwOnXqXl6prS/mj1HIExqRt3AC1b1QIZmHktWvt2rAa1ERuQgkLPhcUzqHzh 5KbcB9XZ/raNELW9YAmXByav0yc/FD+r =rbHX -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
Mr. Blatz writes:
alt.cypherpunks has been newgroup'ed, and I belive rm'grouped. Smart, consiencous newsadmins probably did not honor the rmgroup, as alt.cypherpunks should be acceptable, but most newsadmins are too overworked to actually look at most of the crap that comes through. For example, it hasn't received any messages on my news server, probably because the one upstream removed it.
I haven't seen any rmgroups for alt.cypherpunks. Paul Bradley's newgroup for alt.cypherpunks is nowhere to be found, but Mike Duvos' newgroup made it onto the Net, and was reposted the next day by usenet@news.myriad.ml.org. Meanwhile, Paul Bradley seems to have finally figured out newgrouping and has created... alt.cypherpunks.announce alt.cypherpunks.social alt.cypherpunks.technical and, of course... alt.fan.paul.bradley The latter has been rmgrouped because it was not discussed in alt.config. I might suggest that deliberately tweeking the whiskers of the Cabal by gratuitous newgrouping is unlikely to bode well for alt.cypherpunks. -- Eric Michael Cordian 0+ O:.T:.O:. Mathematical Munitions Division "Do What Thou Wilt Shall Be The Whole Of The Law"
Jeremiah A Blatz wrote:
alt.cypherpunks has been newgroup'ed, and I belive rm'grouped. Smart, consiencous newsadmins probably did not honor the rmgroup, as alt.cypherpunks should be acceptable, but most newsadmins are too overworked to actually look at most of the crap that comes through.
Therefore, it would be a Good Thing to continue any discussion on alt.config, and convince any cabal'ers who rmgroup it to re-new it. Sending out boosters every couple of weeks wouldn't hurt, either.
So, basically, you're saying that the flight from censorship should be toward a new CypherPunk 'home' where one is effectively censored automatically unless one kisses the ass of a Cabal? Toto
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Toto <toto@sk.sympatico.ca> reminds me while I've killfiled him:
So, basically, you're saying that the flight from censorship should be toward a new CypherPunk 'home' where one is effectively censored automatically unless one kisses the ass of a Cabal?
Yup. You're begging resources, deal with it. We didn't kiss John Gillmore's ass, and he decided that he was tired of the shit and stopped letting us squat on his land. If we were paying him for the use of toad, he maybe wouldn't have the right to yank it so suddenly, but we weren't, so it's his call. Same with usenet. The "cabal" has high reputation capital. News admins the world over trust them. One might say that they deserve the respect they get, but that is immaterial to the discussion. the fact is that people who donate resources to usenet trust the cabal. Unless you have a contractual relationship, you're begging, and you have to convince your benefactors to give you stuff. If you have a different model for a world economy, feel free to post it. Jer "standing on top of the world/ never knew how you never could/ never knew why you never could live/ innocent life that everyone did" -Wormhole PS. Of course, the cabal didn't rmgroup alt.cypherpunks, thus showing that they do have some good sence yet. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQB1AwUBMwSyzMkz/YzIV3P5AQHgbgMApfVYTtanDNpL1A96oqMa0wk99GC6jfk9 p7V2KUBn2rl3rOJlBsYpgPWJRYxcMeich8tulf0NcUkh5ru7YdsACD7GYa7B7bz2 Kj6VnQibFnCKb2BTkQfkqYCpdKIUhvLL =dkhj -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
participants (5)
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Eric Cordian -
Jeremiah A Blatz -
John Pearson -
Robert Hettinga -
Toto