I think that the Clipper system has it's heart in the right place, but that it still has quite a few problems in implimentation. The keys to the system are kept separate, but NEVER is anything competely safe or foolproof. The keys, once used, have been exposed to about 10-15 different officials who, at their own leisure, may make a copy of the key and use it. Every time a key is used, more people have the opportunity to get it. After 800 wiretaps, the system is virtually useless. Through the use of Clipper and other various technologies, the US government is trying to hedge its way into control of the Net. This is not neccesarily a good thing. I think that the Net should have its own system of governemt: common sense. There would be no "President". There would only be a "Congress" of the people, which would include everyone. It could be set up as a newsgroup, or something. The use of keyed signatures would come in handy so that people would not be able to "stuff" the "votes", etc. I think it would be an interesting experiment. The "net.gov" would have its own electronic embassy, and the indivdual world governments would not be able to "force" their will upon everyone. The problem with a government making laws against certain on-line actions is that not all people are actually located in that country. The whole thing gets messier from there. A net.gov would solve a lot of problems. Any ideas? (I admit, it's not too appropriate, but I decided to get the discussion going. :) ) - DW - wallace@cs.widener.edu -- Sig of the Day -- Dennis.S.Wallace@cyber.widener.edu "Who the hell is Cthulu?" - Mark Schroy
Achbed Manganime writes:
I think that the Clipper system has it's heart in the right place, but that it still has quite a few problems in implimentation.
Assuming that Clipper becomes the de facto legal standard (if it's "just" an AT&T Clipperphone product, who cares?), the concept of mandatory key escrow and criminal prosecution of anyone caught (how?) not escrowing their keys is *anathema* (that means "completely against") to the most basic of individual rights. The implementation details which Achbed objects to are completely secondary to the basic concept of key escrow. We've debated this so many times, especially last spring, but with 750 people on the Cypherpunks list, many of them new subscribers, apparently we need to discuss the issues some more. I lack the energy to write a detailed rebuttal of key escrow, having written my first one in October 1992, 5 months before Clipper was announced, so I'll just draw some parallels to crypto key escrow: * Lock Escrow. To meet law enforcement needs, all locks on doors, windows, safes, and other locked containers must have their keys escrowed with the local police. Adequate safeguards will be in place to ensure that the police use these escrowed keys when they really need to. As Professor Dotty Dunning puts it, "Locked doors are not needed by honest citizens." * Photo Escrow. To cope with the rise of child porn and snuff films, photo processors will be enlisted in the War on Illegal Images. All film submitted for processing will be double-printed (the customer will pay for this, as with Clipper "key escrow"). Copies of all photos will be kept on permanent file at the local Photo Escrow Facility, maintained jointly by the National Education Endowment and the National Reconnaissance Office. The NEA and NRO will turn over photos ot those with the appropriate need. Polaroid cameras will be banned. A video camera standard has not yet been developed, so in the meantime, the government will make it more difficult for camcorders and VCRs to be imported from Japan and Taiwan. * Diary Escrow. Since many illegal acts are described in the pages of diaries and journals, the Administration has adopted this voluntary page escrow system. Failure to escrow one's diary pages will not in itself be a crime, but may taken as probable cause for a search of one's house and/or prosecution as a RICO offender or CypherPervert. Lawrence Detweiler, of the Colorado Legion of Decency, has accepted the position of Inquisitioner. Please understand that these proposals have a few rought edges in implementation that need to be worked out, but their "hearts are in the right places." Under Big Bro's boot, that is. War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Surveillance is Security! --Winston May -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay@netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^859433 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. "National borders are just speed bumps on the information superhighway."
participants (2)
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tcmay＠netcom.com -
wallace＠cs.widener.edu