Re: Stop the presses -- Anti-terrorism bill not that bad
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hallam-Baker Wrote --
Date: Sun, 04 Aug 1996 20:20:20 -0400
I personally think that tagants is an insuffieicent approach to the problem. Given the number of gun related homicides in the US it is not unreasonable to require each individual cartridge to be stamped with a serial number and for gun dealers to be required to record each individual purchase. That at least was my advice to the UK govt after Dunblane.
There's four major problems with this. First off, a large number of guns used in homicides are revolvers or derringers (anyone got the numbers?). These guns don't spit out the shells. So, it would be utterly useless to do so. The second problem is the number of shells expelled in the US every day. I doubt there's enough room on the butt end of a shell to print that number (it couldn't be printed on the sides, as this would screw up the fit of the shell, and possibly weaken it). And, it'd be almost impossible getting gun manufacturers to pay for the equiptment that it would take to emprint serial numbers. The third number is that cartridges are recycled. Aside from reloading your own, there's a large number of people that sweep up brass from gun ranges to reload themselves. The idea that someone swept up the brass could get almost anyone off. The final problem is the paperwork. Cops today can barly keep up with the paperwork involved with the Brady Bill. Could you imagine if they had to keep track of AMMO purchases?
If people go arround claiming that ownership of guns is necessary so that people can commit acts of treason against the US govt then it is inevitable that there will be pressure for greater
The provision to give people the means to commit treason against the government are in the Constitution. That's why the second amendment is there -- to empower the people to protect themselves against the government. Then there's the first amendment, which is there partially so that the people can keep the government in check with speech and the press.
regulation. The NRA has been playing a bad hand stupidly. By raising the militia argument they have played into the hands of abolitionists. It would be entirely foolish for the crypto
The NRA, I'm sorry to say, has screwed up royally. It's about time that they regroup, or else they fall. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.2 iQEVAwUBMgUWzVZoKRrkPmSJAQGNPQf/TMJdVIPG+znJdWK3DlxmANXyLpz7qs8Z ESHxWo5unmVuDMSGhLGNT15GabdlMozgmatM11iFXmtpzXSBDMwUQOGS29ScgF6l PW3PBJ0AMscr16GFJu7EcaJStXXAKPCb3mIQmd/JEs51uwpPVgz65fMyRhq3LALF 2fSnNybWGpX60QefZfvtxd6ePx5FyO05v5BJD916N9rh5sRcyspO9Bn5gdvqZaEF MjcYiDuV1qMl1oO7FAF41HDpw1x8hVp1BsUyN812aBl2YbYYxTaQwjE+BaEmExM7 wLgwUBLZ809fqBWeXpGw8CBmy4FmM7KwiI4fxGxdbcgnFBvRavTrdQ== =SY5x -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- Sean Sutherland | mailto:maverick@interconnect.net PGP Key ID - e43e6489 | http://www2.interconnect.net/maverick -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- GCS/C d- s+:+ a--- C+++ V--- P L E- W++ N++ K w o O-(++) M-- V PS+ PE++ Y PGP++ t--- 5+++ X++ R b++ DI+ D+ G e- h! !r y -----END GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
For anyone who's interested, the antiterrorism bill is finally up on Thomas. It's H.R. 3953, the Aviation Security and Antiterrorism Act of 1996. The discussion about it is also there, in the congressional record. It's interesting. -- You should only break rules of style if you can | Tom Weinstein coherently explain what you gain by so doing. | tomw@netscape.com
Phill writes
Given the number of gun related homicides in the US it is not unreasonable to require each individual cartridge to be stamped with a serial number and for gun dealers to be required to record each individual purchase.
Phill, as usual, displaying your ignorance? Many of my friends reload spent brass. I realize that you might not get this idea, but guns are a technology that hasn't advanced significantly since 1900 or so, other than maybe lightening things with plastic stocks. (The few innovations that have been tried, like trounds and caseless ammo, haven't ever taken off). The result of this is that a heavy fraction of the people who own guns have the ability to LOAD THEIR OWN AMMUNITON. Indeed, anyone who wants to can do it! Even without a PhD! In fact, lots of cheapskates who like to shoot a lot regularly go out to ranges and sweep up other people's spent brass. If you open up a good magazine for those of us who aren't scared of guns, you will see ads for dozens of inexpensive devices to help you trim and fix cases in a semi-automated way, and to load ammo mostly by turning a crank. BTW, such devices are trivial to make yourself, and plans are readily available. Its all low technology. Were you not totally ignorant of how guns are used, this wouldn't be news to you. Now, on top of that, our ignorant socialist friend seems to forget that brass is not immutable -- that is, that it would take about thirty seconds and an awl would get rid of any serial number you cared to stamp. On an empty case, its even easier. The real key here is of course that idiots going crazy and killing 20 people in a schoolyard kill fewer people than slippery wet floors, and the whole thing is so insignificant that it can be ignored. The drug related killings would go away were drugs legalized, as would a heavy fraction of the petty crime, and most of the rest of the abuses of guns are so tiny in comparison to the legitimate uses as to be insignificant. (Oh, and by the way, Dr. Hallam-Baker -- I consider suicide, which is counted in the HCI "statistics" on gun deaths, to be a perfectly legitimate use of a weapon. Its every person's right to off themselves any time they like by my way of thinking, and you have no right to force people to live against their will any more than you have the right to force them into slavery.) Perry
On Wed, 7 Aug 1996, Perry E. Metzger wrote:
(Oh, and by the way, Dr. Hallam-Baker -- I consider suicide, which is counted in the HCI "statistics" on gun deaths, to be a perfectly legitimate use of a weapon. Its every person's right to off themselves any time they like by my way of thinking, and you have no right to force people to live against their will any more than you have the right to force them into slavery.)
Concur, as long as the estate is charged the cleaning bill. If you off yourself with a gun, please put down plastic. It's simple, it's effective, and it's considerate.
Perry
-- I hate lightning - finger for public key - Vote Monarchist unicorn@schloss.li
participants (4)
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Black Unicorn -
Perry E. Metzger -
Sean Sutherland -
Tom Weinstein