* Clear goals.

* A leader, someone who would call the shots, and would also serve as the person you'd have to convince.

* Open communications. Shrouding a project in secrecy is a good way to kill it. This is one potential advantage we have over the spooks.

It _is_ doable. I know the skill is out there. Wei Dai, Eric Young, Peter Gutmann, and others have proved themselves quit capable of writing good solid code. Sameer Parekh has done an incredible job with PR. Phil Karn, Dan Bernstein, and some others (who I'm not sure want to be named) are talking to the government. GUI I'm less sure about, but I'd hope that some cpunks would come out of the woodwork.

It is not a matter of ability, but of will.

It is also a matter of funding of course. While development can be donated time, the rest often takes money. Still, its something to look into. Handling RSAREF is sapping much of my time, otherwise I'd jump right in, however I like to always pause before committing my time to endeavors. I wouldn't mind helping out though. Certainly Consensus probably has some resources with its own contacts to contribute. I agree with your points though. Another thing to consider, are some alternate methods of enterprise design that involve better communication, iteration of goals vs product, etc. (Actually I need to work on a speech about this that is coming up soon. Yet another project. :) Jonathan ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ..Jonathan Zamick Consensus Development Corporation.. ..<JonathanZ@consensus.com> 1563 Solano Ave, #355.. .. Berkeley, CA 94707-2116.. .. o510/559-1500 f510/559-1505.. ..Mosaic/WWW Home Page: .. .. Consensus Home Page ..