Re: dispersed DES
Good point about the source of the appended bytes. The reason I think it might be more secure is that the length of the appended segment is less than the length of the key on each pass, so it would seem to be the equivalent of a one-time pad for those relying on the appended bytes to get the key. That is my only basis for not worrying about wekening effects. Any holes?
dct@newt.cs.byu.edu
Let me see if I understand your scheme: you prepend 4 unpredictable bytes to the data before running through each single des cycle. What do you do with the 4 bytes from each cycle that are shifted into the end of the datastream? Is the datastram vulnerable to independent search there, too? Assuming the 4 bytes really are unpredictable, and assuming you deal with both "ends" of the stream, there doesn't seem to be an *obvious* attack that allows independent search for each of the 2 or 3 des keys. There was a paper in Eurocrypt this year (that I haven't seen yet) that discusses some not-so-obvious properties of multi-cipher modes that may reveal another attack, however. If you don't think you've weakened 3-des, now the question is whether you've strengthened it (or otherwise improved it). Your method doesn't seem to increase the complexity of a brute force attack on the 112 (or 168) bits of 3-des key material. In fact, you may have actually increased the number of bits of key material (if the decryptor has to know extra secret bytes in order to recover the ends of messages) that the good guy has to manage without increasing the work factor for the bad guy. 3 des is plenty strong, and if you don't trust or otherwise don't want to use 3-des, it's not clear that this offers an improvement. -matt
On Thu, 26 May 1994, Matt Blaze wrote:
Assuming the 4 bytes really are unpredictable, and assuming you deal with both "ends" of the stream, there doesn't seem to be an *obvious* attack that allows independent search for each of the 2 or 3 des keys. There was a paper in Eurocrypt this year (that I haven't seen yet) that discusses some not-so-obvious properties of multi-cipher modes that may reveal another attack, however.
This was probably Eli Biham's talk during the rump session titled "Cryptanalysis of multiple modes of operation". His conclusions were basically that you should use the "traditional" triple DES -- other variants had a nasty habit of being *very* vulnerable to diff cryptanalysis. -- Rolf ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Rolf Michelsen "Standards are wonderful -- Email: rolf.michelsen@delab.sintef.no everyone should have one" Phone: +47 73 59 87 33 -- Ancient FORTH proverb ----------------------------------------------------------------------
participants (2)
-
Matt Blaze -
Rolf Michelsen