Lucky Green wrote:
After reading many of your posts on the MIME issue, I have come to the conclusion that you _are_ wedded to a past long gone. I have not give up the hope that we will one day convice you stop accessing the net via the worst possible interface, a terminal server. The way you are using the net is through 1950's technology with 1950's results.
Hmmhh. I was _there_ in the 1950s, I _knew_ the 1950s. And let me tell you, this is *not* the 1950s. (Apologies to Lloyd Bentsen.) It may be backward, but it is how a huge fraction of the list accesses the Net. Am I wrong on this? Dial-up access to local POPs is a fact of life for many, many people. Do a "who cypherpunks" on the list and look at the sites. Many will be dial-ups, others will be access to university machines, via dial-ups, etc. Others will be a mix of corporate machines, some with better connectivity than others, and many with proprietary e-mail systems, such as VAXMail and the like. My guess is that fewer than 20% of the list are directly SLIP- or PPP-connected, with good access to the tools praised here by Amanda, Perry, you, and others. It might be a good idea to get some real statistics on this. We did this a couple of years ago, and there was talk about doing it again. For reasons I just addressed in another post, I foresee being on a dial-up (not a SLIP or PPP, that is) for a while. And I have relatively few complaints about it. My service provider keeps the 9446 current newsgroups, provides ftp and suchlike tools, and I don't have to be a sysadmin. Frankly, if I have to choose between not being able to see someone's MIMEd GIF and becoming a Unix sysadmin for my own site, I'll skip the GIFs.
You say that you use stuff that is far beyond ASCII and I believe you. However, one wouldn't know from hearing what tools you are using to access the net. You are competent, a computer person, but still you don't seem to understand that reading mail via a terminal server and elm is like having an oxen pull your car.
Even Perry admits to using emacs, and Unix mailers like elm are not exactly oxen. (I have a choice of several mailers, the usual ones. Big deal.) I also have commercial Eudora, the PowerMac version no less, so my offline mailer is adequate. This still doesn't mean non-ASCII (graphics, fancy fonts, equations) can be plausible placed in messages--and communicated to the list for reading/viewing.
I hate to break it to you, but it is no longer "most of us" who don't use these tools. And of the ones that don't use them, only very, very, few don't have them available.
Please don't characterize my views as Luddite wishes for a simpler world.
I don't think that you are wishing for a "simpler world". I believe that you haven't realized that the "simpler world" has long vanished in the dust of history and that you are one of the last hold outs living in an era past. Please don't be the last to leave.
I'd like to see some evidence that I am one of the last of my tribe. Call me Ishi. --Tim May -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay@netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^859433 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. Cypherpunks list: majordomo@toad.com with body message of only: subscribe cypherpunks. FAQ available at ftp.netcom.com in pub/tc/tcmay