Here's the deal, as this certified non-lawyer sees it: * There is ample precedent for forcing suspects to hand over materiel other than spoken or written data. Keys to safe deposit boxes come to mind, as do of course blood and urine samples. * The tricky case is one in which the key is actually a phrase like "I am a drug dealer and I did the crime". I'm not exactly sure how this would be used in court; maybe something like "I refuse to reveal that information on the grounds that the key itself is in the form of a statement which could be construed to be incrimintating." Of course, I don't know why you couldn't always say that... If Mr. Godwin isn't too bothered by the re-emergence of this thread, he may choose to share with us further thoughts on the topic raised in the second bullet. My guess is that such a situation will have to be tested in court, and I can only hope that it gets tested with the assistance of some very skilled counsel. -- Mike McNally : m5@tivoli.com : Day Laborer : Tivoli Systems : Austin, TX ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Remember that all experimentation does not produce extrapolated results. - k. pisichko