[saga-rg] SC-05 meeting notes

Andre Merzky andre at merzky.net
Tue Nov 22 15:20:45 CST 2005


Hi all, 

as you know, we had a F2F meeting at SC05.  Well, it turned
out to be a rather small group, but we had a nice chat ;-)

Here are the meeting notes:

  Participants:
   Thilo Kielmann
   Shantenu Jha
   Yusuke Tanimura
   Andre Merzky

  - Charter:

    We has a discussion with our ADs earlier that day (and
    the day before.  And the days before that... ;-).  It
    seems they are to support our WG charter proposal, but
    asked us to add:

     - exit strategy
     - a milestone to revise the API spec process and the
       document structure.

    We did that, the new charter draft (with only these
    changes) is attached.  Please comment this week,
    otherwise the charter will be submitted to the GFSG as
    is.


  - Task model:

    We agreed that, in order to shorten the discussion, and
    to keep the OO spec free from language issues, the task
    model will be described in verbose text in the spec, and
    the explicit incarnation will be left to the language
    bindings.

    We further agreed, that for C++ we are going to
    implement one or more of the models discussed lately,
    and to get feedback based on the implementation, and to
    revise the language binding in respect to that feedback.
    Otherwise we see the group discussing for quite some
    time still, while the implementation is stuck at that
    point...

  - Issue list:

    we went through the API issue list.  I don't have
    detailed notes on that, but a check of the CVS logs
    tells you what we did...  As a reminder, the CVS details
    are on the wiki.

  - We had backroom talks with the Ninf and GridSolve people
    at SC, about GridRPC.  The direction is still the same:
    work on including the GridRPC API into the SAGA
    look&feel.  However, the GridRPC API might get revised
    in that process...

  - we talked to Keith Jackson, and he agreed on reviewing
    the python language bindings for the API as soon as we
    get to that stage (after the C++ reference I guess)

  - we had an interesting meeting about a message based
    communication API.  That is currently not related to
    SAGA, but could be interesting in the future.  Notes
    about that meeting will follow to this list, in about a
    week.

Comments/questions/corrections are as always welcome!

Cheers, Andre.



-- 
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| Andre Merzky                      | phon: +31 - 20 - 598 - 7759 |
| Vrije Universiteit Amsterdam (VU) | fax : +31 - 20 - 598 - 7653 |
| Dept. of Computer Science         | mail: merzky at cs.vu.nl       |
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| 1081 HV Amsterdam, Netherlands    |                             |
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-------------- next part --------------
 The Charter 

 Informational Section
 ---------------------

  Area:           Applications [Standards]

  Name of group:  Simple API for Grid Applications
      
  Acronym:        SAGA-WG

  Type of group:  Working Group (WG)

  Chairs:         Tom Goodale         goodale at cct.lsu.edu
                  Shantenu Jha        s.jha at ucl.ac.uk                  
                  Andre Merzky        andre at merzky.net

  Secretaries:    TBD
 
  Email list:     saga-wg at ggf.org 

  Web page:       http://forge.ggf.org/projects/saga-wg/

 Charter:
 -------

    Focus/Purpose:
    -------------

    Many application developers wish to make use of the exciting
    possibilities opened up by the advent of the Grid.  Application
    developers, however, have their own agendas to pursue and often
    cannot spare the time or resources to fully investigate the vast
    wealth of Grid technologies and APIs which currently exist.  They
    would rather be presented with a simple API close to the
    programming paradigms and interfaces they are used to.

    For example, the process of copying of a remote file may involve
    interaction with a replica location service, a data transport
    service, a resource management service, and a security service.
    It may involve communication via LDAP/LDIF, GRAM, HTTP, and GSI,
    as protocols or protocol extensions. A Fortran application
    programmer,  however, wants to see a call very much like:

          call fileCopy (source, destination)
        
    Although this example is simplified, it illustrates the motivation
    for our work. The APIs specified by this WG will deliver a similar
    level of abstraction for a range of basic operations which need to
    be grid aware.  The precise set of operations is to be decided by
    the WG based upon application requirements and use cases; examples
    of such operations may be file access, job submission, monitoring
    or steering.

    The  group  will  lower the  barrier   for  application
    developers  to  make   use  of the   grid by  providing  a  small,
    consistent API for the operations of interest, the Simple API for
    Grid Applications (SAGA).

    Scope:
    -----

    The proposed API specifically targets applications, which aim to
    take advantage of some of the features that the Grid offers. The
    scope of the API is open to all application areas -- scientific
    and non-scientific.  The scope is primarily defined by the Use
    Cases received; but will also reflect the areas of expertise of
    active members of the group. Simplicity and conciseness will be
    the governing principles. Currently the use cases received are 
    from scientific application areas and are collected in the 
    "SAGA Use Case document" (http:// i will add later).

    The API targets developers of applications who wish to grid enable
    their applications whilst spending as little time as possible
    learning new paradigms.  Such developers typically wish to devote
    their time to their own goals and minimise the time spent coding
    infrastructure functionality. The API will insulate application
    developers from middleware.

    The specification of services and the protocols to interact with
    them is out of the scope of the WG.  Rather, the API seeks to hide
    the detail of any service infrastructures that may or may not
    exist to implement the functionality that the application
    developer needs. The WG will, however, actively liase with all
    grid-middleware groups within the GGF to ensure compatability.

    The WG will continue to identify projects outside GGF with similar
    API-focus and goals, and will seek their input in the development
    of the API and its implementation. The WG will provide detailed
    examples and cook-book.

    Exit Strategy:
    --------------

    The group will revisit its charter and scope after the completion
    of the SAGA API Spec version 1.0. It  will either finish its work,
    or continue its work with a revised charter, or spawn off new
    groups with related focus to continue the work on the API version 2.

    Goals:
    ------

    The SAGA-WG is the logical evolution of the SAGA-RG, which
    produced the informational document ("SAGA Use-Case Document") and
    did preliminary work on the "SAGA Requirements Document".  The
    main goal of the WG is the creation of an API specification as a
    GGF standard recommendation.  On the road to that specification,
    SAGA-WG will build upon the SAGA-RG documents and produce the
    following:

    * Informational Document:
      "Requirements document"
      - define exact scope of API
      - define target user groups for API
      - define programming languages to be supported
      - define organisation of API documents (e.g. one per subsystem
        or language, or one complete document) 

    * Informational Document:
       "SAGA compatability with GGF middleware"
        This document will survey the compatability of SAGA
        reference implementations with underlying models of
        grid-middleware including, but not confined to OGSA.

    * Recommendation Document:                                   
      "SAGA-API Specification" 
       The SAGA API specification.

    Milestones:
    -----------

    GGF16: - Presentation of "Requirements document"
           - Submit Informational Document "SAGA Compatability with GGF middleware"
           - SAGA API Specification pre-v1.0

    GGF17: - Submission of SAGA API Specification v1.0
           - Implementation details review.

    GGF18: - Work commences on extending the functional scope of SAGA (v2.0)
           - in relation, revisit WG charter

    GGF19: - Present Draft Language Bindings (C++/Java/)




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