On 9/1/16 2:28 PM, juan wrote:

On Thu, 1 Sep 2016 13:59:16 -0700
"Stephen D. Williams" [1]<sdw@lig.net> wrote:


On 9/1/16 1:35 PM, juan wrote:

On Thu, 1 Sep 2016 13:21:19 -0700
"Stephen D. Williams" [2]<sdw@lig.net> wrote:


On 9/1/16 1:16 PM, juan wrote:

On Thu, 1 Sep 2016 12:34:53 -0700
"Stephen D. Williams" [3]<sdw@lig.net> wrote:


Our
political system limits and weeds out crazy, preventing it from
taking over.

        The US is full of crazy fucks like you, and of course the
% of crazy fucks among politicians, military murderers and the
        corporate mafia is even higher.


Says one of the craziest people most of us know.

You have a loose definition of crazy.  Or a crazy definition of
crazy.

But I'll ask anyway: What's your evidence?

        Reality. And reality is exactly what crazy people have
problem grasping.

My reality is more real, and therefore more correct, than your
reality.  Prove me wrong.

So, let's go back to my statement:
"Our political system limits and weeds out crazy, preventing it from
taking over."

Prove that isn't true.

        You made the crazy claim, you should prove it. However
        since you are one of those crazies you talk about, you can't do
        it.

   I did prove it: History is packed full of evidence.  By induction,
   proof.


        And I actually have zero interest in reading the kind of stuff
        that a hitlery clinton supporter (you in this case) can write.

        And to make things even crazier, you are a hitlery clinton
        supporter posting in an allegedly crypto-anarchist mailing list.
        The ANARCHIST bit should clue you in...if you were not out of
        touch with reality (i.e. crazy)

   Have you actually read the Manifesto in its several forms?  Do you
   understand it?
   What do you think that crypto-anarchy does and does not imply?  Are you
   sure that everyone else agrees?
   The people who think that "anarchy" in "crypto-anarchy" means "*"
   aren't really thinking too hard.
   [1] [4]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crypto-anarchism
   [2] [5]http://www.activism.net/cypherpunk/crypto-anarchy.html
   Did you read my point about free-speech-anarchy a few weeks ago?  Did
   you understand it?
   What about the point I just made about adapting and adopting solutions
   to emerging changes?
   Cypherpunks has always straddled a number of areas; exploring the
   implications of crypto-anarchism is one of them.  Even in May's quotes
   in [1], it isn't necessarily the point to have a collapse of a system
   as a goal, but to examine it as a possibility.  I think the attitude is
   that if you come to believe that encryption and other security measures
   must be available, perhaps as an extension of free speech, and those
   cause weak or broken systems to collapse, then so be it.  All kinds of
   things have been exposed recently.  Do you think that makes the US any
   close to collapse?
   Bad systems should change drastically or collapse, good systems should
   adapt and flourish.  Do you disagree with that?


Especially prove that it isn't true for
Americans.  The US government kept functioning normally even through
a civil war, world wars, 3 industrial revolutions, all kinds of
corruption, etc.  Here, I'm not talking about exceptionalism in
general, just the point that if crazies make it into power, they are
limited and don't last.  Point out a better system.  (The British are
said to no longer be making fun of our political system as of
Brexit. ;-) )

I don't have time to get into it, but I think that the exceptionalism
perception, the quality of it, meaning, and use, is overblown in some
key ways.  We have evidence that certain things work and certain
things don't.  There is a big interplay with culture and back stories
that affect some of that, but most of it could transfer anywhere.
Maybe we're confused sometimes, but we have open debate to try to fix
that.  We regularly fix things that aren't working with only things
like rights as being inviolable.  It isn't 'we are Americans and
therefore you suck'.  It is more like "we have this cool open source
government project, why not fork it and see if it works for you
better than that old governmentware you're running".  We are tired of
being asked to fix your old broken down governmentputer because you
insist on running VMS and Windows.  Or your cousin's obsolete system
because you can't support them well.  Or whatever.  If you can make
it work, then do it.  Otherwise, upgrade.

sdw


sdw




   sdw

References

   1. mailto:sdw@lig.net
   2. mailto:sdw@lig.net
   3. mailto:sdw@lig.net
   4. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crypto-anarchism
   5. http://www.activism.net/cypherpunk/crypto-anarchy.html