[ot][personal] cult reading notes

Undiscussed Groomed for Male Slavery, One Victim of Many gmkarl+brainwashingandfuckingupthehackerslaves at gmail.com
Fri Sep 16 09:45:10 PDT 2022

ch 7

this chapter is entitled protection of the self and loved ones, but at first it
seems to be describing itself as mostly about discerning what a
destructive cult is, so as to avoid it, rather than what to do when
one is focused on you or people you care about. maybe i am wrong.

- 12 tribes is a cult started by a sideshow barker. i ran into this
cult in a mental care program, where we would visit a restaurant they
owned. somebody told me they were talking with a waitress who told
them how important it was to give your life to men. (this, combined
with the leader being a normal male rather than say a religious figure
or woman, means the cult is destructive. indoctrination like that
indicates women aren't given rights.). they used recruitment messaging
that harkened to the freedoms of the sixties. hard to find messaging
like that. i had collected some of it out of interest.

- rev jim jones ordered a famous massacre in jonestown, but started as
an honestly caring religious worker, dedicated to helping the poor. as
he started learning and using cult techniques to gain power he became
more and more deranged. the author blames amphetamines but i would
influence of the people who shared the techniques: i.e. that he was
actually in a larger cult of cults. i would suspect the author of
being influenced to not consider or share this.

- cults have methods to induce euphoria which defectors retain and can
accidentally create cults with

- certain personalities and behaviors have a stronger tendency to
produce cults, often in feedback with an addiction to power. leaders
tend to care more about power and attention than material resources.
- cult leader dangerous properties: (1) psychologically unstable (2)
believe own propaganda e.g. that they are god (3) surround themselves
with devotees

i experience invasive internal experiences around being a mind
controller or such occasionally. it's interesting that i also
experience strange internal pressure to have some of the cult leader
traits. i wasn't aware they were associated with it.

- a criminal background of a cult leader may include something similar to fraud

- recommendation to run web searches may be outdated, don't know

- cults may have boards of directors who simply all obey the cult
leader. checking for real empowerment of members can be a good check.

- cult recruitment involves deception. new information is provided
when the person will have difficulty critically analysing it. things
generally happen via a seemingly-unrelated front organisation.
recruiting involves honing in on or stimulating potential weak spots
in the recruitee[s]. communication tends to be unidirectional, such
that only the recruitee reveals information about themself. rapid
onboardment is preferred.

- "During the indoctrination, sometimes the person doesn't contact
family and friends for days or weeks. When they eventually do, a
radical personality change is evident. The individual often changes
his style of clothes and speech patterns and behaves in an
uncharacteristically distant manner. Often, the person's sense of
humor is blunted. Previous interests, hobbies and goals may be
abandoned "because they are no longer important." " "This personality
change does seem to wear off a bit over time, if the individual
doesn't continue to contact the group or participate in it is
activities. However, when the person maintains contact, the new
identity can and does grow ever stronger."

re humor, compare to: i experience a forced, biting humor i can't
control. often people report discouragement from me laughing at their
suffering when i don't understand why i am laughing at all.

"A person may have been politically liberal before, but is now a
staunch conservative."

- "Increasing numbers of groups have deliberately avoided such
practices for some time in order to allay suspicion."

"In some cases, a person's behavior changes over months"

"deliberately designed to undermine the new member's relationships
with family and friends"

heavy work encouraged in part by criticising excessive sleeping
whereas praising minimal sleeping of leader. this is likely an
inversion, and also part of a large cocktail of lies and "inversions"
used to sustain the norms of cult membership. cult leaders and mind
controllers are likely much more experienced at surprising or
misleading people complexly to sustain something, than those resisting
them are at using similar tactics to protect themselves. likely or
possibly people doing this to resist are being manipulated, if focused
on. not that true information should ever be shared with those running
a cult.

- norm of psychosomatic illnesses, and minimal medical care, lets cult
leaders heal people
personal experience

- no privacy; gives power to cult

- involving cult members in a long discussion of current events, art,
or history, can reveal them being out of touch

- members demonstrate very minimal decision-making skills, having been
encouraged to ask permission for everything

- forms of control vary widely

- "members of destructive cults are psychological prisoners" via
strong planted phobias

- it is dangerous to criticise a group that has many blindly obedient
members available to strike back

- People's Temple was originally a ministry oriented toward helping
the poor, before becoming a destructive cult

- "The Center for Feeling Therapy disbanded when its leaders simply
walked away one day, leaving hundreds of confused and disoriented

strong mind control leaders disappearing is quite painful and leaves
one suffering severely. the mind eventually fills in, pretending to be
the leaders, to cope.

- harmfulness unrelated to size of cult.

the author repeatedly emphasizes the harmfulness of cults. one could
guess he is still scared, possibly especially in an environment where
cults are spreading messaging that counters his and his clients'

= the next [i was going to write something i thought was pretty
important, but a canine interrupted me and i forgot it.] but maybe i
was thinking it would be good to ask the author to specify how current
different information is. for example, this section is on questions
you can ask recruiters. the impact of questions like these could
change significantly over the years, specifically it could put you
into a different handling strategy if the questions are from a
mainstream anticult book, like a cracker seeing you sniff their
packets. suddenly you are the most important victim to be handled with
the most dangerous tools.

- ask protective questions "in a very direct yet friendly manner, and
demand very specific answers" i'd emphasise _friendly_, maybe as if
one is interested. book says to not get caught into side
conversations; to focus on the questions, and to be free to walk away.

- "How long have you been involved with this group? Are you trying to
recruit me into any type of organization?" if they have been involved
a long time, they should have ready answers to other questions

- "Can you tell me the names of all the other organizations that are
affiliated with your group?" look for front groups and a principal
group. May have to ask the clear, straightforward question multiple
times. Ask them to find out for you, ask for their number without
giving yours, tell them you'll call the next day.

- When lies are revealed, be assertively annoyed and leave!

- "Who is the top leader? Tell me about their background and
qualifications. Do they have a criminal record?"
a follow up question "how could you have become involved with a group
without checking these things out first?"

note: these questions may build suspicion of trusted groups, which
would warrant adjusting them

- legitimate groups give information before commitment

- "What does your group believe? Does it believe that the ends justify
the means? Is deception allowed in any circumstances?" this may reveal
curiosity is being used as a motivator. legimiate groups can summarize
their central beliefs.

- no legitimate organization needs to lie to people in order to help
them, despite any accusations of false media

- "What are members expected to do once they join? Do I have to quit
school or work, or donate my money and property, or cut myself off
from family members and friends who might oppose my membership? What
did you do for a living before you joined the group, and what do you
do for a living now?"

- "Is your group considered controversial by anyone? If other people
are critical of it, what are their main objections?"

- "How do you feel about former members of your group? Have you ever
sat down to speak with a former member to find out why they left the
group? If not, why not? Does your group impose restrictions on
communicating with former members?" legitimate groups do not restrict
contact with former members. asking for details about leaving,
reasons, happier after leaving, can reveal lying about communicating
with former members

- "What are the three things you like least about the group and its
leader?" this is supposed to be a check for mind control. those mind
controlled simply to worship the leader have unique responses. the
concept may be a brief shock.

- "What else would you rather do in life than be a member of the
group?" the wrong answer is "nothing"

- "Did you take the time to talk with former members, and read
crticial literature about the group, before you joined, in order to
make up your own mind? Is this something you'd be willing to do now?"

- ask the questions of other members too.

- bring a skeptical friend and don't ever split up, leaving before splitting up

- search engines are helpful but do not trust them due to disinformation efforts

results in swift escort out, but more importantly gives _others_ the
opportunity to act on what is obvious and leave with you.

- don't engage curiosity at someone else's direction unless you are
comfortable being confrontational and engaging conflict aggressively.
you could lose your free will for years. overconfidence is not helpful

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