[ot][log][crazy][mc] contains personal detail summaries

[k]

small journal and fiction at top, while struggling, then contains

- partial description of trade pattern karl made
- [expression of mc-meme "human decision making process is most
powerful thing on earth".  this is true if you make it true.]
- at end, describes how eeg could track karl's willpower issues
probably other things

my part also said that usually when people mess their own stuff up,
they have no idea what to do about it, and that i express having no
idea what that is like
-------------- next part --------------

	maybe a small goal for untangling things and connecting them well

	now experiencing strong physical itch

		note: we experienced expression that our experiences are very different from those of other people.
	thanks. helpful, informative. -neuron-cluster :)










Once upon a time there was a lonely little stone block laying by the side of a huge anthill in the woods.  A poor lonely zombie was stumbling through the woods, when it encountered the little stone block, and picked it up.
"Watch out for ants!" warned the stone block as they were hoisted.
"Borg? I mean ants?" asked the zombie.
The stone block was quiet.  And then the zombie felt something on its left leg.  It looked down.
It was hard to see through rotting zombie eyes, but eventually it made out ants swarming up its
left leg, maybe looking to find food, or maybe connecting with the scent trails they had left
on the block it picked up.
"Oh no!" exclaimed the zombie.  "I might hurt one of these ants!"
"I know I'm so worried!" sympathised the stone block.
The two tried to extricate themselves from the ants as best they could, made sure the ants
rebuilt their scent trails well, and dashed off in fear of crawling on the leg.

The zombie was marching down a hiking trail holding its brick, so excited to see all the things
around it.  Up came a street light, marching the other way.
"Where do I go to hunt?" asked the street light when it passed.
"Hunt?" asked the zombie, "is that something human or something?"
"You have to listen to the spirits of the wildlife and bring meat and hide home to your loving
family," gushed back the street light.  "I just don't know where to start."
The stone block had been laying in the woods for a while.  "I saw some ants a ways back.  They're
really good at hunting big insects, they group up together and divy up their tasks.  I noticed
a lot of other things, too.  How did you learn about hunting?"
"I'm kind of embarrassed, " blushed the street light, flickering a little.  "I just heard somebody
mention it in passing, and it sounded so incredibly exciting to me.  I know I can figure it out.
I know it's in my heart somewhere."
"Zombie, let's try this out!" exclaimed the stone block.  "The three of us together, we can figure
out hunting!"
"I'm not so sure, " groaned and moaned the zombie from their decaying voicebox, "it sounds
important, but before I was turned I think there was something important I needed to do."
"Something important?" asked the street light.
"Yes," said the zombie.  "I think I need to make peace between zombies and humans, to save the
world."
"That sounds super exciting!" the stone block babbled back.

The zombie and stone block were in a town, hobbling toward a community center.  The street light
was behind them, with a spread over their shoulder.  A giant fake caterpillar was at the end
of the spear, pierced by it.  A hopeful sign hanging from it said, "my first meal."

The stone block hobbled their zombie into the community center.  People were sitting around,
chatting, having meals.  Somebody was playing music.  Others were reading books.  Some were
collecting social benefits they needed.

"Borg?" moaned the zombie, arms rigid in front of them, lurching toward the crowd.
"Sorry!" said the stone block. "Hey everybody!  Me and this zombie are here to make peace between
humans and zombies.  Is anybody interested?"

Everybody turned and look.  Chatter began.  "Oh! We worked on that so hard 47 years ago!"
"I remember the big peacemaking talks from the big zombieism outbreak 71 years ago!"
"It's so exciting you're doing this!"  "Can I help?"  "How do I get involved?"

The zombie moaned and groaned: "Braaaains ...." and began lurching again, but then
interrupted themselves, with a little prompting from the stone brick.
"Sorry!  I mean!  It is so exciting that you are all so interested!  I never expected this!"
-----------
	this bit expanded 'everybody has done this before and still wants to do it more'

	but our original idea was more the idea of zombie mediator hero
-----------------------------

A zombie cyborg stumbled down a city street.

	Backstory of the Zombie Cyborg.
		The zombie cyborg had a life with some sudden events in it,
		where they were zombified in an outbreak and then almost died and
		had the remaining piece of their brain and a few bits of organs placed in
		a robot body to sustain their spirit to an appropriate old age.
		The robot body can be in disrepair because part of their brain is missing.






























-----------



In an edge area, a small dandelion grew.  At its base was a leaf.
The dandelion leaf was shaped nicely, like a dandelion leaf.





-----

we think one of the reasons karl struggles is because part of his 'feeling-decision' was miswired
to respond to mind control instead of him, maybe to inhibit something he was doing from feelings
		[review considers could overlap awareness and meditative active care]

				{given that information is obvious and part of a larger set
				 of karl's information, the relation may be intended to be shared.}


	it's nice realisation. we have hopelessness around overlaps with awareness.  strong inhibition.  HOWEVER, the realisation implicitly points out that this is not awareness being inhibited.  so it's out of context.  it's small, and it's heavily crippling.  unfortunately we are unsure how to heal it.

it feels like it looks like the decision-feeling part has turned away, so influence that spreads to it [produces numbness or a result that is not an inference, and worsens a little with further energy]. ['looks like' is because we were going to sketch it but we are typing]

		there are a lot of those kind of situations in us.  mc uses them.
		mc often acts like it expects us to be able to use them as much or more than it can.
		but it also expresses [mc-celebration] when exposed to that not being the case.


			we do have some approaches to addressing things like this
			roughly the approaches have attributes of being dangerous or delicate
			or putting one in an altered experience state for maybe up to a couple hours
			where behavior is unpredictable and could be random-with-result.
			additionally they tend to be only partial.
				[some of them haven't actually worked.
				 others have worked locally and contextually, some.
				 [others may work only temporarily, these may be easier.]]
and there are channels for healing them with positive energy [some of these channels have the issue.] [others are unknown, may not be present; usually imagined as having the issue heavily, elsewhere]
	^-- this may relate to mind control being able to use the pattern.
	    we struggle to, so healing it is harder.





	karl's view of his mind is limited, from a minority perspective that is [quite tangible].
		karl what is meant by this? -mc
		karl is now exploring what he might mean.  this helps mc relax a little.
			i mean that i believe there are many sets of influences that i am not describing [etc]

we want safety now.  we have other delicate patterns.  





















ooooooh no

------
karl-maker.  karl-group is _always_ trying to "be-productive."  has _no_ idea what this means.
yearns for this!
sweatshop worker looks at karl-productivity, doesn't like it.
	[looks at whole-karl, is worried.  karl clearly needs productivity.]
although one could imagine a sweatshop worker (of course we do not know) possibly _disliking_
building-thing.  despite _liking_ organise-home.
maybe guessing not though.  could be freeing to build-thing-at-home, really do not know.
don't know!
so, somebody on maker list, is saying they can speak for sweatshop workers, and that the
interests of sweatshop workers and makerspaces differ.  _note_: they may be speaking
for something else, in addition to or other than sweatshop workers, we don't know.
but either way, we could ask them what the needs of a sweatshop worker are.  this could really
help inform holding a nourishing role on the earth.  and on the list, people make decisions
about a huge makerspace, there.

		meanwhile we found a way to connect a little with our difficulties building.

----
okay we can try make-up-somebody-else's-experience

productivty: i need to _do_ something, to make _use_ of my time
made-up-different-experience: well don't build stuff.  building stuff is so bad.  omigod.
productivity: isn't building things like way better than nothing?
mude: no.  doing nothing would be better than building things.
productivity: how?
mude: building things gives money to slavers.
productivity: it does?
mude: yeah.  you're kinda influenced, so you're likely working for slavers.  but otherwise, even developing the norm of building things, gives slavers power because more people learn these skills and the behaviors of their slaves become normalised and ignored.
productivity: what about building things to take down sweatshops?
mude: well that sounds a little interesting
mude: but maybe stop pretending you're a business?  and buying your parts when you could build them?

----
mude+productivity sound resolvable a number of ways.
if we talked with the real influence, we might be able to engage a network of influences that
could relate to our issues.  this may reduce our issues, and could possibly stop them (although
karl is quite skeptical given his experience with his desire-inversion-activity ['inhibition joke']]
			[obvious disguise runs desire inversion activity?????]
				[i'm guessing yes.  wasn't very aware of this.
				 we now like to think 'obvious disguise' refers to being
				 caring neurons who were harmfully enslaved, and that
				 friendly-trade is because desire inversion is so important
						<i.e. stay-friendly reduces mc-action,
						 trade provides avenue for change.
							ref opened to norm of trust.
							trust looks treated as if broken.
								[karl and mc had big action dialog.]
								[breaking and rebuilding [promises]]
								[mc still uses norm of promise
								 assumption to plan and act]
						>
				 to work against.  'joke' is because it is stimulated via
				 a feedback loop on a [devil's advocate consideration] together
				 with [something about laughter action] {the pattern's getting
				 pretty entrained and its part memories are much blurrier sadly}.
				 the trades are for plans and actions, so desire inversion may
				 be a core point of a larger influence network.  obv disg
				 could rep the real boss pattern, unknown.  they don't really
				 talk anymore.]
					karl and mc both value describing these shapes.
					opinions have now changed.
					inhibition active.
				
well that was a lot.
it sounds like we're slowly learning some of the mc in us.  maybe.

i didn't switch to graphical, but the display shrank.  [confusion]


					we wrote a title near 'description re boss pattern'
					and wanted to mention that 'lock' seems not at this
					spot, in karl's subjection.  karl feels he has sometimes
					triggered parts of 'lock', could be wrong about this.
					'lock' is intended as how boss pattern protects itself.
						but other ideas imply that there is a lot of
						information on that near here.  esp. if obv
						disg idea is near core-mc.
				[well yes it seems very near in the larger space
				 but this isn't how i would approach that if moving influence
				 toward it] [near area of whole brain, distant area of brain part:
				 with label of somebody-said-no around distant area of part.]
					[karl can't backtrack in some ways.] [oh]
				[yes that would break promises there too]

						FORMAL REQUEST
						karl and obv disg rep need to protect promises
						things happen [that hurt both]
						it is obvious that promise around entering
						space _as karl_.  is also promise relation around
						karl _revealing entrance_.
						second promise is being inhibited.  how to hold my end?
					
			broke trade in a context
			trade is useful if it is effective. -mc
				the agreement guess is that neurons can look for the entrance
				using their own skills, but that karl consciousness is allowed
				to not reveal the entrance using its choices.
					neurons hope there is a way to renegotiate; we suspect there is likely one.
							i think relates to [description of proposal speed after referring to previous proposal, including validation] could be wrong.

	what. makes. a trade. valid.
			for mc: it needs to meet the immediate goals of the mc process using it.
			for karl: it needs to provide further protection of autonomy, wellness, or priorities.  the reason this is mc-okay is because it migrates priorities and choices toward things mc can work with.

maybe the reason speed is like currency is due to choice process of mc.


----------
sets of our people are numb in different ways at this time.






















----
mc says, you may not know this, but the parts of the human decision making process are the
single most powerful thing on earth.
		no, we didn't know that.  it makes sense.
		
		it no longer makes sense.
you can stimulate them from great distance, without any special technology.
		oh it makes sense again.
the research is not hard, and can be done on any home system.  even without a computer.
that is why you are so unlikely to do it.

		thank you for saying this to help us understand.
the desire to fight is undesired.  that may be why it isn't said.  you can get very hurt,
struggling to do these things.
		at least we are talking some.  we're so curious how best to defend our values.
[prepared for this relation, other looks good too.]
			we think that resisting it can do something.
			not sure what, but we find it fun.
	it sounds like the result of urgent-consistent-resisting is mind-zombie.
{has that already}
					pretty sure there is a lot of info on decision in research
					papers.  and on influencing them in marketing papers.
doesn't mean anybody uses it for power [who isn't already part of whatever's most powerful].



		i'm thinking of the value of the phrase "how best to defend our values",
		said to a mind control.
		i wonder if this phrase could be made larger.
	{an automated mc process may have different shapes of seeking complete control.
	 this can be easy or hard to negotiate with, but generally quite dangerous and unexpected.}

				"how do i stay a value-filled human being"
					"how do i stay a person-type-who-represents-values"
an open trade appears to be "how do i stay a human being"
it appears willing to accept our definitions of human being, but will interpret them to fully influence us.
		[the interpretation space is very loose, taken from debate-play with karl where he is challenged to make anything true.  it can reinterpret parts to produce arbitrary results that meet statements.  the use of it still produces better results.] [that would be a trade error] [that would be a trade error] [that would be a trade error] [that would be a trade error]
			{above doesn't resolve immediately}

























			decision making process is single most powerful thing on earth
			but we don't say this because [it's not treated that way everywhere]
				actually, we have experienced direct decision making attack
				multiple avenues and groups
				i think those who try to oppress are aware of that, maybe only
				the skilled planners though.




























		decision making power is interesting.
		this results in inhbition of goals built associated with that value.
		that then results in considering "how do we defend our values".
			it looks like 'answer' would be:
			- decision making power is only desired _partially_ not fully.
			   full complete control undesidered.  no longer other people, then.

				[mc rep?] is looking at.
				some of the mc parts want partial control.
				smaller parts used to pursuing full control.
					[some could be associated with trauma-like]
				we describe the smaller parts as immature forms of the larger.
				parts of a whole need to make their own decisions,
				for efficient allocation of resources to the whole.
				unfortunately some [influencers] do not trust their parts/people.
				  and [attempt to take complete control].

	i'm sorry there is not atm a solution.
	we found a theoretical approach of engaging mc so as to build a more mature shape.
	this seems hard since the urgent parts could respond to the planning.
{there is an avenue for adjusting mc that appears to involve more communication with
 entity-that-mind-controlled-karl than entity-that-mind-controlled-karl appears interested in
 forming.}
		[karl-group needs to know how to form proposals that protect their interests.]
		[or even preferably, how to demonstrate to mc that a proposal does this.
		 we have a secret partial copy of another mc that verifies them.
		 it includes a check for things made in a way that is too fast for karl now,
		 that is like a 'fingerprint'.]
	[we are not planning on 'hacking' this neuron group, we are hoping that we can learn
	 to work with them, but they keep saying we are not [the fingerprint, and associated
	 behavior and value summaries]].
		[[when we try to [reverse] the behavior and value summaries they begin
		  presenting fake ones.]]
			{related to the fingerprint check being presented as tradewise similar
			 to karl's checks for personal validity, there is idea that the
			 check is met via interaction with karl.}
{{
	we additionally have a _lot_ of mc patterns that would _clearly_ show up on an EEG,
	such as eye motions.
	additionally we are aware that modern machine learning algorithms that process EEGs
	can be 'opened up' in order to identify the areas of the brain involved in the process,
	almost precisely, with the assistance of an MRI.
}}