USA 2020 Elections: Thread

grarpamp grarpamp at gmail.com
Sat Feb 5 16:42:35 PST 2022


>From trying to remove restrictions and methods that
can be used to verify even just the simple concept of
"one vote per person", Democrats are now trying to close all
remaining paths to challenging their own fraudulent elections.
You don't "reform" elections by making it even harder to raise and
have election questions heard and resolved in realtime.
These "reforms" seem more geared to enabling and shoring up
the next fraudulent election than not.

[1] And of course power always acts together to cut off any party
that is currently out legitimately protesting redressing grievances
of its authoritarian rule. And thus it did exactly that on Jan6.
And hasn't since done a thing as a body to honestly look into and
resolve the questions with those raising them... no formal commission
of the public, nothing, except for doing what power does... persecute people.

There is no legitimacy in forcing any human to take any action.
In addition to a number of legal and principle analysis that found
that the VP, legislatures, employees, etc could indeed act to
refuse to act, pause, deliberate, review, amend, reform, things
regardless that such has rarely been done, and that such bodies
and peoples have ways to replace such people if they wish.
Pence, as a human being, had the right to refuse to
go along with it and to halt the entire show, or not,
as only he himself saw fit. Given the pressure, most
would have capitulated, or expressed as he did.
Nor did the near singular focus then on electoral / vote
issues bring to address all the other meta issues.
If the US people would step back and take a
good meta look at what goes on and into their elections,
from money to fake news, censorship to propaganda,
shoddy closed source systems, to outright election fraud, etc...
there's no other conclusion but that elections are entertainment,
a joke, a game, not of by and for the people, but of by and for power.
If the people don't stop and take a stand for reform,
to resolve answers to standing questions,
at such opportune moments, they never will.
Other countries pause and even repeat elections to resolve
issues all the time, the US is not special, and there's no reason
that could not or should not have been done.
Then there's the question of why they continue to put up
such colossal systems of power in the first place.



Trump Responds, Criticizes Pence Over Comments Regarding Jan. 6

https://www.theepochtimes.com/trump-responds-criticizes-pence-over-comments-regarding-jan-6_4258287.html
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/news/news-hktthafwz61481
https://apnews.com/article/mike-pence-donald-trump-election-2020-84ff467d9ff5bfaad084e274f69ac521
https://twitter.com/realLizUSA/status/1489796362308886531
https://apnews.com/article/voting-rights-donald-trump-presidential-elections-elections-election-2020-ec7cf78961b17a72074706812fe17b9b

Former President Donald Trump late Friday issued a statement in
response to former Vice President Mike Pence who, earlier in the day,
disagreed with Trump about his role in the electoral vote
certification process on Jan. 6.
Vice President Mike Pence presides over a Joint session of Congress to
certify the 2020 Electoral College results on Capitol Hill in
Washington on Jan. 6, 2020. (Erin Schaff/The New York Times via Getty
Images)

At a speech to the conservative Federalist Society in Lake Buena
Vista, Florida, Pence said that the former president was “wrong,”
after Trump said on Jan. 30 that Pence “did have the right to change
the outcome” of the election.

Pence, as vice president, served as the president of the Senate and
presided over the joint session of Congress to count Electoral College
votes on Jan. 6, 2021—the final step in the Electoral College system
to certifying a president-elect.

“If the Vice President [Mike Pence] had ‘absolutely no right’ to
change the Presidential Election results in the Senate, despite fraud
and many other irregularities, how come the Democrats and RINO
Republicans … are desperately trying to pass legislation that will not
allow the Vice President to change the results of the election?” Trump
said in a statement.

“***** Actually, what they are saying, is that Mike Pence did have the
right to change the outcome, and they now want to take that right
away. ***** Unfortunately, he didn’t exercise that power; he could
have overturned the Election!” the 45th U.S. president said.

Pence on Friday told the conservative legal group at the event in
Orlando: “There are those in our party who believe that as the
presiding officer over the joint session of Congress, I possessed
unilateral authority to reject Electoral College votes. And I heard
this week that President Trump said I had the right to ‘overturn the
election.’

“President Trump is wrong. I had no right to overturn the election,”
said the former vice president. “The presidency belongs to the
American people, and the American people alone. Frankly, there is
almost no idea more un-American than the notion that any one person
could choose the American president.”

He continued, “Under the Constitution, I had no right to change the
outcome of our election. And Kamala Harris will have no right to
overturn the election when we beat them in 2024.”

The audience applauded Pence’s line about beating the Democrats in the
upcoming presidential election, but remained silent when Pence said
earlier that “Trump is wrong,” reported The Associated Press.

Later Friday, Trump issued a statement through his political action
committee, Save America, criticizing Pence’s remarks.

“Just saw Mike Pence’s statement on the fact that he had no right to
do anything with respect to the Electoral Vote Count, other than being
an automatic conveyor belt … to get Biden elected President as quickly
as possible,” Trump said.

*****
“Well, the Vice President’s position is not an automatic conveyor if
obvious signs of voter fraud or irregularities exist. That’s why the
Democrats and RINOs are working feverishly together to change the very
law that Mike Pence and his unwitting advisors used on January 6 to
say he had no choice.

“The reason they want it changed is because they now say they don’t
want the Vice President to have the right to ensure an honest vote,”
Trump continued. “In other words, I was right and everyone knows it.

“If there is fraud or large scale irregularities, it would have been
appropriate to send those votes back to the legislatures to figure it
out. The Dems and RINOs want to take that right away. A great
opportunity lost, but not forever, in the meantime our Country is
going to hell!”
*****

A group of Democrats and some Republicans, led by Sen. Susan Collins
(R-Maine) has been meeting behind closed doors to discuss potential
changes to Electoral Count Act that would make it more difficult to
challenge results of a future presidential election, reported The
Associated Press. The group hopes to come up with draft legislation in
the near future.

Collins told reporters at the Capitol that Trump’s repeated assertions
that Pence could have altered the outcome of the election “underscored
the need for us to revise the Electoral Count Act, because they
demonstrated the confusion in the law and the fact that it is
ambiguous.”

Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) said on Feb. 1 he is
open to the effort, and said the Electoral Count Act “is flawed and it
needs to be fixed.”

Leading up to Jan. 6, Republican electors in seven
states—Pennsylvania, Georgia, Michigan, Wisconsin, Arizona, Nevada,
and New Mexico—had cast alternative slates of votes for Trump.

Pence presided over the joint session on Jan. 6, where he read out the
electoral votes for all 50 states. During the session, Pence did not
acknowledge the alternative slates of votes for Trump from the seven
states and only read off the certificates for Biden.

At the time, Pence’s office didn’t return an inquiry from The Epoch
Times on why he didn’t acknowledge alternate slates.

On Jan. 6, Trump called on Pence to send key battleground states’
electoral results back to state legislatures and he said that if Pence
“comes through for us, we will win the Presidency.” Trump also said in
a statement the day prior that Pence had “several options” under the
U.S. Constitution. “He can decertify the results or send them back to
the states for change and certification. He can also decertify the
illegal and corrupt results and send them to the House of
Representatives for the one vote for one state tabulation,” Trump
wrote.

But shortly before the joint session began, Pence indicated he would
not reject any disputed electoral votes, saying he lacked the power to
do so under the U.S. Constitution.

“Given the controversy surrounding this year’s election, some approach
this year’s quadrennial tradition with great expectation, others with
dismissive disdain,” Pence said in a statement at the time. “Some
believe that as Vice President, I should be able to accept or reject
electoral votes unilaterally. Others believe that electoral votes
should never be challenged in a Joint Session of Congress.

“After a careful study of our Constitution, our laws, and our history,
I believe neither view is correct.”

But Pence did support efforts by Republican legislators to object to
the certification of electoral votes.

“Given the voting irregularities that took place in our November
elections and the disregard of state election statutes by some
officials, I welcome the efforts of Senate and House members who have
stepped forward to use their authority under the law to raise
objections and present evidence,” Pence said in a letter to Congress
at the time.

Congress ultimately certified the Electoral College votes for Joe
Biden after the chambers debated and voted to reject Republican
lawmakers’ challenges to electoral tallies from Arizona and
Pennsylvania.

[1] ... above.


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