Key witness in Assange case admits to lies in indictment - Stundin

David Barrett dbarrett at
Sat Jul 3 14:07:37 PDT 2021

On Sat, Jul 3, 2021 at 6:54 AM Karl <gmkarl at> wrote:

> You wouldn't know you hadn't received it if you didn't.  You reply to most
> of my emails.  Did you receive an email from me that you did not reply to,
> in which I referenced MOVE?

I'm sorry, I'm not intentionally ignoring it, I just don't know which you
are referring to.  Please repeat the point so I don't miss it.  Thanks!

I'm not trying to make a grand point, other than it's hard to criticize the
>> justice department's treatment of Assange given that he has done everything
>> in his power to avoid it.  Any perceived wrongs against him
> If it is illegal to try to avoid an appeal, it would be a separate crime.
> If we were to punish people for unrelated crimes at trials, everyone would
> have their suffering mathematically squared.  That is definitely not the
> intent of the law.  The law defines the punishment for crimes, not the
> irritation of its enforcers, David.

I'm sorry, I'm not quite understanding your point.  Can you re-state it
succinctly so I can respond to it better?

To repeat my point, I'm merely saying the US has done precisely nothing to
punish Assange yet: he hasn't been on US soil, in US courts, or really
touched by the US at all.  The US has *attempted* to extradite him for
trial, but so far has been unsuccessful.  Assange has been accused of
breaking a variety of laws in different countries (sexual abuse,
immigration violations, etc) , and has done his best to run from all of
them -- going so far as effectively imprisoning himself in an embassy for
nearly a decade -- all to avoid showing up in *any* court for *any*
of these.   To a very large degree, nearly all of Assange's suffering has
been entirely self-imposed hardships caused by running from the long arm of
the law.

Again, the only point I'm trying to make is that you can't blame the US
court system for being unjust when it's been denied the ability to do
anything at all.  This isn't to say that Assange is guilty/innocent -- I
genuinely have no idea.  And thanks to his extraordinary efforts to avoid
trial, nor does anybody else either (at least, nobody who believes in the
concept of justice being decided in courts, and not in the press).

  Yes, let's make sure those laws are properly interpreted and enforced.
>> But all of that *starts* with him showing up in court so we can all
>> actually hear the charges and see the evidence for real, and see what our
>> institutions actually do about it.  Running
> This of course rarely happens.  Trials are held half-privately and then
> people are locked up in prison and communications with them are censored.
> By the time they come out they are totally different people.
> That is the situation right now.  Julian has no way to prepare for a trial
> fairly because he is imprisoned elsewhere.  Can the USA get him his
> writings so he can prepare a defense with his lawyers that is backed by
> evidence?

"This of course rarely happens" -- are you sure?  There's something like
400 thousand federal trials every year; and *millions* of state trials.
Are you saying that it is *rare* for people to get justice?  My sense is
that the overwhelming majority of cases are executed competently and
reasonably -- even if imperfectly -- and are just so boring that nobody
talks about them.  We are talking about single-digit numbers of court cases
in this thread; we are explicitly talking only about the most extreme of
the most extreme outliers.  Please don't misinterpret these extraordinary
edge cases to be the common case.

Unless of course you have just given up on our nation entirely and think
>> even attempting to enforce our laws is inherently unjust.  But at that
>> point, you've taken such an extreme position, nothing less than revolution
>> will satisfy you.
> We actually have restorative justice programs in many areas.  There are
> cities and states where an accused criminal can opt for mediation rather
> than punishment today, David.

I'd love to learn more about this; I'm not familiar with mediation as an
alternative to trial for criminal cases (I thought that was only an option
for civil suits).  Can you link me to some good resources you recommend to
read more?  Thanks!


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