list of people censored on lists.debian.org

Sun Mar 15 05:12:03 PDT 2020

Zenaan, it's a pleasure to see compliments and courtesy on this 
robotic, rude, intolerant, prejudiced, cantankerous, bilious, 
insulting, repugnant, monotously accusatory, blathering, 
knee-jerking, cowardly-psuedo-abusive, dot dot dot, forum.

At 07:46 AM 3/15/2020, you wrote:
>On Sun, Mar 15, 2020 at 11:26:27AM +0100, Daniel Pocock wrote:
> > On 14/03/2020 14:17, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
> > > Hi Daniel,
> > > your ongoing battle appears to be staunch, humorous, 
> challenging, depressing, and uplifting all at the same time.  We feel for ya.
> >
> > Thanks for your feedback
> >
> > I'm not an LWN subscriber so I can neither see nor comment on the thread
> > you mentioned.
>
>I emailed you a copy.
>
>
> > But from the title, I derived this:
> > https://danielpocock.com/handling-attacks-on-volunteers-and-their-families/
>
>Damn bro, thank you so much for sharing your story!
>
>These lines:
>
>     .. "People tried to give me orders about what I can and can't 
> tell the community who elected me to represent them."
>
>     .. "If you have any doubts about this, you can check the DM 
> keyring log, why would they move me to the DM keyring if I had done 
> anything that would remotely justify an expulsion? Anybody on the 
> DM keyring can still upload all of their packages.  In what kind of 
> organization do you expel or fire somebody and still keep asking 
> them to do stuff for you like that?"
>
>     .. [from a linked email] "Ian, How can you consider post hoc 
> evidence gathering and justification to be ethical?"
>
>
>just absolutely nails it for me!
>
>
>Again, thank you for sharing, and thank you for your living of your 
>principles!
>
>It is clear to many that not only Debian, but many other places in 
>FLOSS land have been overrun by petty Nazis, and fragile snowflake 
>like ones in particular.
>
>
> > > I'm wondering if you ever subscribed to the cypherpunks mailing 
> list last year?  It's a small community, but passionate, and at 
> least so far as the law allows, uncensored.
> > >
> > > If it floats yer boat, perhaps join the rest of us outcast 
> n.ggers at the cypherpunks corral ;)
> >
> > It sounds interesting but the biggest challenge for me is always to
> > serve the users.  That's what being a real Debian Developer is about, it
> > is written in the Debian Social Contract, point #4.
> >
> > With users in mind, I'm working on some tools to neutralize harassment
> > and abuse, for example, a Mozilla Thunderbird MailExtensions plugin for
> > adding the BCC and List-* headers to each message.  Then, if somebody
> > feels they have been harassed by a list admin, they can continue
> > participating in a conversation with minimum inconvenience.
> >
> >
> > > At the moment no easy answers have presented themselves,
> >
> > but there are some good answers that require a little bit of work.  That
> > is what I'm working on, that is why it is taking some time.
>
>
>Sounds like a useful tool.
>
>
> > > In any case, I've no doubt many are very proud of you, and of 
> the posts you have no doubt "inspired", hint hint, nudge nudge, and 
> a few of which have been leaked to the public (and to my very 
> grateful eyes just now) by LWN:
> > >
> > >   Handling attacks on a community
> > >   https://lwn.net/Articles/814508/
> > >
> > >     ..  It is not hard to find examples of the kinds of 
> messages that are being targeted (e.g. here, here, here, and here 
> for fairly recent examples).
> > >
> > >     [Snowflake trigger warning, the next 4 messages may well 
> trigger you if you are a CoC-wielding, wilting snowflake.]
> > >
> > >     delegation for the Anti-Anti-Harassment team
> > > 
> https://lwn.net/ml/debian-project/D8yjhiI1gZEt8XLHtzQI8NuwVViFQYh3UNoa7FtSy4zrYhnxbcRzorRBnWCOpPZbSO2ebmHC3xsuctHdpVtXMuVgj80vOwaMjr2PpDdx23U=@protonmail.com/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >     access an independent, uncensored version of Planet Debian
> > > 
> https://lwn.net/ml/debian-project/959afc2e-a0ae-bbdc-14bc-3d0b93de8903@debian.community/
> >
> >
> > That particular link is not trolling, debian.community is simply an
> > independent news site.  Being independent, it is only natural that it
> > will cover the issues that official newsletters will sidestep.  It is
> > 100% transparent, as explained on the About page.
>
>
>No doubt this "100% transparency" is one of the reasons -some- folks 
>don't like it :)
>
>
> > >     Outreachy favouritism and wasted Debian money
> > > 
> https://lwn.net/ml/debian-project/H3wJbOsvVY23EsMR7o0Y20StUbTWCkBFYV5KKlhez1xxWXyPnrd0Sr7Zxr_okyeIuEsADHXRhM-juXVUamswjXU70tCVXEpGIPNHkb4o3jY=@protonmail.com/
> > >
> > >     are Debian mentors nuts? the DebConf scandal
> > > 
> https://lwn.net/ml/debian-project/ea-mime-5e072373-6227-653ea4a2@www-2.mailo.com/
> > >
> > >     It is also clear that many participants on the mailing list 
> have concluded who is behind at least some of the 
> anonymous/pseudonymous attacks: Daniel Pocock. In fact, Pocock was 
> the subject of a different message from Hartman on debian-project; 
> while he did not directly connect the dots between the messages and 
> his action expelling Pocock from the Debian project entirely, it is 
> hard not to come to the conclusion that the two are related.
> > >     ...
> >
> >
> > Concluded?  How do they reach that conclusion?
>
>I don't know.
>
>
> > What you describe is
> > witch hunting, the stuff people did in the stone age before humans
> > discovered science[1].
>
>Daniel, I agree - those words are a quote from the LWN.net article - 
>apologies for any confusion.
>
>
> > There is no attempt to hide the source of the https://debian.community
> > site, it is neither trolling nor anonymous.
> >
> > Sending emails from a team address (like team at debian.community) is a
> > pattern that many groups use now in the Free Software world to make
> > themselves look bigger.  debian.community is a parody of those patterns
> > but it is not trolling.  One message from debian.community to the
> > debian-project list is not spam, it was clearly related to Debian.  One
> > on-topic message like that doesn't imply any connection whatsoever to
> > thousands of unrelated troll messages in FSF, FSFE, Debian, etc.
>
>FWIW, I do, naturally, agree with you.
>
>
> > > Bravo muffaluggerah, bravo! :D  Rip-roaringly bloody good 
> posts, whether wink winked by yourself, or inspired via others..
> > >
> > > FWIW Daniel, some of us wholeheartedly approve of your anti-PC 
> crusade :) -- the "politically correct" bullshit being elevated in 
> the world today is a form of insanity.  Opposing such insanity is 
> one of our sacred duties.  But such insanity is being funded far 
> and wide, so it can get a bit depressing at times :(
> > >
> > > Anyway, hat tip to you, Daniel.
> >
> > Notice I'm not being anti-PC.  I'm pro-user, pro-volunteer.  Its in the
> > Debian Social Contract, point #4.  That's why I feel confident as a
> > Debian Developer, its about the principle of it.
> >
> > The PC stuff is tangential: the problem is people who use PC as a
> > convenient excuse for their personal advancement and do no other work.
>
>"One of" the problems.
>
>Perhaps community segregation would help - segrate the snowflakes 
>into one list/forum/etc, and those who don't want mommy's 
>mollycoddling thank you very much, e.g.:
>
>   men at functional.community
>
>   snowCoCs at functional.community
>
>.. just a thought.
>
>Best regards,
>Zenaan
>
>
> > Regards,
> > Daniel
> > 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
> > --
> > Debian Developer
> > https://danielpocock.com