Cryptocurrency: zk-SNARK Privacy Coins, Why and How They Work

grarpamp grarpamp at
Thu Jun 20 16:28:21 PDT 2019

On 6/20/19, Punk <punks at> wrote:
> 	some more FACTS on zcash

Seems you got your meds straight enough to post at least some
tangible instead of your typical angsty asshole troll self ;)


Yeah, 2017 was Sprout, trying to quote old tech news is lame.
You need to evaluate in light of new late 2018 Sapling MPC and
both optional and mandatory turnstyling.

And in general, in light of the future independant ZK MPC paramgen project
for use in all sorts of global tech, not just from and in one particular coin.

Being fair, note also the massive security advisory Zcash dropped
a few months ago. And the analysis papers on Monero too.

In early development days, no [privacy] coin or tech is safe from exploit.
So go put all eyes on them all and make them all better,
and throw away the shit ones.

> 	quote:"There is no evidence whatsoever that the first Trusted setup was
> compromised."
> 	sure sure. Absence of evidence is evidence of abscence!! Right? Right?

Sometimes objective, subjective analysis, statistical assurance is enough
for the world than proof. The world relies on AES, SHA, ed25519, etc. Even
if the world "trusts" those algos, there's still only 2^N security odds in them.
2^N is not proof. Proof is hard. Even ignoring adversaries. Choose your own N.

> 	quote:"at the time of writing this 23% of all network transactions are
> shielded. "
> 	in other words 77% of transactions ARE PUBLIC.

That's a result of user choice, and default setting, to make them public.
And it's a two year old article using old data.

However Zcash project, and all other privacy coins... really
should commit private z-addr as default to their source codes
so that users have to actively choose to use public t-addrs.
And the private t-addr option should probably go away,
especially given work on viewkeys.

> 	quote:"Zcash founders decided to allocate 10% of the 21 million Zcash that
> will ever be issued to go to a set of addresses dubbed the “Founders
> Reward”"
> 	sp 10% of all monetary base has been TAXED.

Earlies including Satoshi are sitting on easily well over 20% of BTC.
There's no real difference there, and none have foreswear, burn,
or techically cannot spend it. Nor are those percents much relavant
in the end... any attempted game hurts their own coin value and
coin network, and they'll eventually get bought up by millions of
others at which point over time they become moot.

TAXED is physically stolen by force from you without your consent.
No, you CHOSE to buy into BTC Zcash whatever, at some particular
time since genesis, KNOWING there were already such allocations.
So that argument and any like it are false. Go start a faircoin (wtf ever,
they are hardly not), join a commune, or become a Statist and forcibly
redistribute to yourself. There are even now coins and sick games you
can choose that will actually steal, burn, or inflate away your holdings
from under you too if you have masochistic love for that.

> 	quote:"For an average transaction size of 2000 bytes in a Private "
> 	that is to say, private transactions are 10 times bigger than bitcoin
> transactions. So what would happen if zcash was actually USED and

What would happen if ANY coin that relies on storing the whole
fucking chain forever is actually USED. Get real. Go evolve the tech
beyond that ancient form and mentality of UTXO validation.

There is tx size in flight and processing, that's one limit... bandwidth.
If you can't handle or design that out, yes you've got severe problems.

But instead of looking stupid quoting 2k as the final state of things,
run the estimates, if it's too big, go research how to make
real tx and privacy smaller, and leave 2k behind.

Then there is limitation of all the pointless storage, and growth of it.
That can be designed out by using a UTXO state db instead,
thus no need to maintaining all the tx blocks that went into it.

There are projects producing the tech to do state db's.
Go look them up.

And if all else fails, there will be strong private "gold" wealth
wallet coins, feeding via a second mode, or DEX,
into daily tx coins.

Only stupid say coin "X" is great.

Free your mind.

> 	quote: "Fiction: Zcash is not widely accepted on Darknet markets and
> somehow that’s a bad thing
> 	Opinion: This last one always leaves me saying WTF? Why would you want to
> promote the use of your favorite crypto-currency on dark marketplaces? The
> only reasons I can think of are self-centeredness, greed, and
> short-sightedness (or a combination of all those).
> 	"
> 	oh look! the piece of shit who wrote that article is making it quite clear
> that he's against freedom.

Just like music, movie, software pirates stubbornly refusing
to get off clearnet or use new tools... darknet markets are
similarly affected by foolish refusal to change. All may have
their reasons, but are not so often based on objective analysis
of if something is truly better choice or not. Nor does their
masses of drug addled on forums exactly help analysis either.
And more susceptible to shill armies selling snakeoil to them.

> 	quote:"Zcash doesn’t need darknet markets to be successful and I hope that
> Zcash doesn’t ever get widely used on them."
> 	priceless
> 	quote:"Illegal use is often an unfortunate by-product of any advance in
> technology."

If it's not good enough to be used in black, darknet, prediction markets,
it's not good enough for global mainstream use either.

Now excuse me while I go dissolve some more coke off these $20's.

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