Cryptocurrency: Brings Down GovBankCorp

Punk punks at
Sat Jul 20 16:24:28 PDT 2019

grarpamp wrote:
>Bitcoin's price dipped after Trump's negative tweet. 
	correlation is not causation 

>>  as to 'digital cash'* bringing down governments, that's just fantasy.

> A digital "cash / currency"... those terms are containers
> into which people dump various descriptive words and
> capabilities in order to try to define them,

	you can define 'digital cash' as having the best properties you can wish for - and govcorp will still be able to attack THE USERS more or less easily. Point being, crypto systems by themselves are powerless. 

>> *cryptocurrencies are not cash AT ALL since they require massive infrastructure

> The infrastructure need only do some list of useful things
> such as keep accurate ledger, run timely and relatively
> inexpensive tx processing, and cost more in distributed
> collective defense than any attacker can muster or gain
> from offense. "Massive" (which you failed to define) is
> not necessarily a requirement.

	massive infrastructure is the #1 requirement. In order to have 'digital cash' you need foundries, each one costing 5000 million dollars(all of them currently owned by govcorp of course) and a global telecom network. As we all know the global telecom network is the NSA's spying network ususally referred to as 'the interweb'. And to produce the hardware that makes up the interent we need a few 10s or 100s of billions to pay for more foundries, optic fiber and whatnot. 

	THAT is the infrastructure needed for 'digital cash'. Compare that to the costs of gold...

> > all depend on ONE unique ledger
> Most cryptocurrencies that utilize a single unique ledger
> do so in a redundantly distributed fashion, etc.

	yes, the ONE ledger is managed in a distributed fashion, but it still is ONE ledger. Well except in things like the lightning network where channels are actually peer to peer. But even if the second layer is more decentralized, it still relies on the base layer acting as a  clearinghouse. So there still is a centralized bottleneck.

>Unlike N different central "cash" or Gold ledgers where N
is the number of accounts you have at such GovCorpBank

	well that's my point. Systems that require a ledger are centralized by design. The moment you start using a ledger supposefly based on gold you are not using gold anymore. Just 'golden' IOUs.

>> even govt paper bills are real cash, they are actually
>> decentralized and anonymous.

>If those are your exclusive set of words you like to
>define "cash" by, then that "cash" works for you.

	what I mean by 'cash' is a something that doesn't need a middleman. I can pay you using bits of metals, or even physical bills issued by a govt mafia, without needing an internet connection and without anybody knowing that the transaction took place apart from us two. Digital 'cash' does not have those properties. 

>However "govt paper" implies government exists,
which is most certainly not an ideal situation.

	of course. The drawback of physical bills is that the govt can print tons of them. But apart from that, we can use bills to make transactions that are 'anonymous' and don't go through any central clearinghouse.

>And "decentralized", living somewhere between
a single point dot and 100% distributed amongst
all peers, can have certain risks and mindfulness
needed as well.

	by decentralized I mean that transactions using 'physical tokens' do not need to be recorded in or go through any unique database for them to work. And by the way, that's how barter and money worked since the dawn of history. Banking was a step BACKWARDS. 

>> Gold and other commodities

>That only works within your range of personal travel.

	yes and? You see, freedom isn't free and there's no 'free lunch'. You can personally manage your own money, or let god's choosen master race do it...

>When you start wanting to "transmit" gold,
then you have to create transmission systems
for physicals and messages, create ledgers,

	oops, so you're not using gold anymore, as pointed above. 

>create trust and security systems and etc that
can span that distance. So in order to effectively
transmit gold, you've essentially created a
cryptocurrency system to do so, at which point
gold itself can and will likely become moot.

	lawl, gold would be the source of that currency's value, so not 'moot' at all. Still,  such systems are a FAILURE by design. 


>The real problem is that you created and allowed
the wrong cryptocurrency system ie: GovBankCorp
as the first such generation of a transmission system.

	well yes a honest banking system is theoretically possible. But to get one we need to burn down wall street with all the bankers included. Burn them alive. So who's going to do that? 

>You now have more or less all of the crypto
and tools needed to create a far better
transmission system.


>Most of humanity does not currently desire
to moving society back to your quaint
local agrarian communes or whatever it
is your aggression is advocating for.

	what 'agression' are you talking about

>Cryptocurrency can work via sneakernet
and even by hand calculation... it just
becomes extremely slow.

	lawl - pointless comment. 

>The minimum general assumption in cryptocurrency
is that both electricity and digital communication
and computation methods will remain up and generally
accessible to everyone.

	an absurd assumption that stupidly ignores the fact that the digital infrastructure is fully owned by govcorp. Hey, you can't even talk about 'cryptocurrencies' in the 'libertarian' 'cryptography' mailing list. 

>At which point, so long as society and ultimately
human DNA maintains the desire for a "forward" progress
that includes electricity comms and compute tech,

	yeah, techno 'progressive' garbage which you actually do not understand. 

>GovBankCorp Fiat will remain below Gold
which will remain below Cryptocurrency which
becomes top dog and moots all others.

	gold isn't below 'cryptocurrencies' at all. Except in the minds of 'techno' 'optimists' who are useful idiots for the NSA. 

>Maintain fallbacks in the mix as you wish.
But don't be so stupid as to continue to allow
GovBankCorp to rule over and keep you in slavery.

	I'm simply  pointing out that your 'digital cash' is  worse than gold and that believing that it would 'magically' overthrow governmetn is laughable wishful thinking or worse. 

>No one ever said crypto was invulnerable
to global thermonuclear war,

	lolwut. Crypto is completely vulnerable to a bunch of peopel being thrown in jail for 'money laundering', a bunch of 'mining farms' being raided, etc etc. 

> they just said
you'll have MUCH bigger problems than worrying
about where your crypto, "cash", or gold is.

If you're smart, you'll end government before
they can reach for the launch keys.

	yeah and I dont need you and your $5b 'progressive' foundries to tell me that. 

@InsertNameSpace said:
Capitalism cannot thrive with a socialist central banking system,

	capitalism? The hell is that?. As to the current 'progressive' and 'digital' economic system it works perfectly well with central banking, does it not. 

>"The United States government is a foreign corporation

>Benjamin Franklin of Pennsylvania once gave a speech endorsing the adoption of the Company's flag by the United States as their national flag. He said to George Washington of Virginia, "While the field of your flag must be new in the details of its design, it need not be entirely new in its elements. There is already in use a flag, I refer to the flag of the East India Company."

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