us - public system

[other.arkitech]

Zenaan, you said:

> Your communications on this list so far, seem to suggest that:
>
> -   you have not spent sufficient time to understand the basic
>     "security" issues which all humans presently face when
>     interacting on the Internet
>
> -   security, vs privacy, vs authentication, vs transparency
> -   why would people on this cypherpunks list want taxation?
>
>     Most fundamentally, to be taken seriously with any supposed
>     "advance", you might need to present that you properly understand the
>     current shortcomings with current systems.
>
>     It's all very well to have a public chat about something that
>     inspires you, but you have made certain proclamations (we can call
>     them "challenges" or "assertions"), and the lack of background might,
>     to some people, come across as though you are being a bit lazy,
>     wanting us to do all the work of educating you about all the above
>     things, and plenty more besides.
>
>     If you want to be taken seriously, you need to spend some serious
>     time understanding current problems.
>
>     We use certain phrases to highlight things which appear as
>     "flippant", such as the phrase "hand waving" - so e.g. when you
>     replied with the following phrase:
>
>     "typical reaction to this is nah, you choose tax or anonymity,
>     not both. Well, that's it, it can be done"
>
>     those words you chose to use, come across as flippant, or hand
>     waving (imagine the Queen waving her hand), or not serious.
>
>     The words you used might make it seem "obvious" to some people that
>     you don't really understand what you are talking about.
>
>     Words which demonstrate a little humility, might be good for you to
>     start using, if you want more relevant responses to the things you
>     say, e.g.: instead of "it can be done", you could have asked a
>     question, e.g.:
>
>     Person ABC has claimed in the past that anonymous
>     taxation collection is not possible - see this link:
>     http://example.url/anonymous-taxation-is-not-possible.html
>
>     Based on my current understanding, anonymous taxation collection
>     should be easy, just using an Ethereum algorithm which collects a
>     little 'gas' on each transaction - am I missing something, or is
>     it really this easy?
>
>     Then people can hopefully start to see your thinking, and you might
>     get more relevant responses.
>

I'll extend my answer to anonymous taxation in more detail if that is what you claim. These hand waving words are in the question, (they wasnt said by me), I agree the response might seem lazy and lacking of signs of humility, but there is actually a response on this:
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Q: Why do you think crypto anarchists would be interested in 'automating' taxation (theft) and 'public budgets'
   (distribution of stolen goods)
A: It forms part of a fight against centralized governments which are expensive and do not respect privacy and
   financial freedom.
   Let's say there exist a real need to have roads, or public health or, more close to cryptoeconomy, a need to have
   financial services, any fundamental need that is potentially subject to mass consumption.
   This is run by what we call a public system, this is understood.
   I felt the need to try solve the problem using computers.
   I saw how a system not specifically crafted to that particular purpose doubles as low-cost public system.
   It is all about improving or replacing the establishment with technological alternatives.




>     Next, you should get an idea of what the intentions for this
>     cypherpunks list are - for example, a place to discuss anarchy or
>     anarchism, as well as (actual) libertarianism.
>
>     So, in the context of this expectation, why do you say we should care
>     or be interested in a system which will collect tax?
>

Your question can be answered with the paragraph above which was located just below the one you commented. you've not understood my approach to libertarianism and to anarchy, which I am akin with.
You're confused with my use of the word taxation, which for you it might sort of tabu, but for me is something that deserves to be discussed more in a way of how bad current Govs are collecting them paying common services, and how new approaches could work respecting privacy and anonymity.
Anyway this is only one of the features that can improve the status quo of the society, which compared to the main one, the electronic cash system with renewed tech, which I also try to write about, is perhaps the most interesting one.
I am not lazy, I work hard, I surface little.

>     Finally, you really should try to understand about anonymity on the
>     Internet (it's --really-- hard); and also about human motivations -
>     if you think people will start using your anonymous taxation system,

It is not a taxation system, this is a misunderstanding.
It was a remake of bitcoin at the beginning which turned to be quite different at the end.


>     which people are the people you think will use it?

Anyone who values anonymity, privacy, technology, there is no exclusion.

>
>     You need to be ready to answer these questions, and try to answer the
>     questions people ask - if someone asks the question, and you don't
>     seriously try to answer, with some depth and detail, then some people
>     will not even bother to keep 'talking' with you, because it is too
>     much effort or too much work - some people might try, but others will
>     just say to themselves "he is being much too lazy, asking me to do
>     all the work to explain to him what he does not understand and to
>     extract out of him even the basic understandings about what he is
>     trying to do".
>
>     Good luck,
>

In general this post is ackward. Saying I lack of basic knowledge is a bit rude for someone who said forefront that has spent 3 years working on the development of system.
I don't have a clue of why you would say I want to learn the basics from you. In fact I'm always opening to learning on top of me having pretty good knowledge and training on all topics surrounding cryptocurrency and hi-tech.
I also empathize with the culture of this list.
I apologize if my wording confused you about my background.
Thanks for taking your time to answer.
--
Other Arkitech