[MINISTRY] capitalism v fascism/ corporatism - what are we (the West) living under?

Zenaan Harkness zen at freedbms.net
Tue Jan 23 17:40:11 PST 2018


On Tue, Jan 23, 2018 at 03:59:38PM -0600, \0xDynamite wrote:
> > A capitalist, or “free market,” system is one in which the prices of
> > goods and services are determined by consumers and the open market,
> > in which the laws and forces of supply and demand are free from any
> > intervention by a government, price-setting monopoly, or other
> > authority.
> 
> WOAH WOAH woah, hold it right there.  You've just conflated two major
> topics of economic theory:  the free market and capitalism -- NOT THE
> SAME.  You can have a FREE MARKET under socialism and COLLECTIVE
> ownership.  But all the owners have to agree generally to sell it on
> the open market.

Firstly, you are quoting the article I posted.


> > Equally as bad is the fact that, in these same countries, large
> > corporations have become so powerful that, by contributing equally to
> > the campaigns of each major political party, they’re able to demand
> > rewards following the elections, that not only guarantee them funds
> > from the public coffers, but protect them against any possible
> > prosecution as a result of this form of bribery.
> 
> This is the real issue.  Apparently the drive and advantage given to
> individualism by the FREE MARKET itself (because the consumers have to
> REWARD the individual for him/her to become a giant) has given them
> enormous advantage, politically.  So again, the real question is:  why
> do the people do this?

Secondly:

 - Are you saying the American government is democratic?

 - Are you also saying that corporations succeed because in
   America there is a FREE MARKET (to use your all caps)?

 - Are you saying that "the people" who "do this" are acting in,
   on, or otherwise by, free market and democratic principles?


> > There’s a word for this form of governance, and it’s fascism.
> 
> And there's a word for this type of effect:  APATHY (from the people).
> There is an undiagnosed mental illness in the general populace,
> probably caused by mass injections of polio to children.  It is
> clinically diagnosable using the criteria of the DSM.
> 
> > Many people today, if asked to describe fascism, would refer to
> > Mussolini, black boots, and tyranny. They would state with confidence
> > that they, themselves, do not live under fascism. But, in fact,
> > fascism is, by definition, a state in which joint rule by business
> > and state exists. (Mussolini himself stated that fascism would better
> > be called corporatism, for this reason.)
> 
> I think this is a distortion of fascism, which to me simply means rule
> by ideology, not specifically business.

May be so.


> > The choice of the reader is to look upon the world as his oyster - to
> > assess whether he is more or less content with the country he’s in
> > and confident that it will continue to be a good place in which to
> > live, work, invest, and prosper, or, if not, to consider
> > diversifying, or even moving entirely, to a more rewarding, more
> > capitalist jurisdiction.
> 
> Huh?  No, what needs to happen is a diversification of economic experiments.

And the article you responded to above is pointing out the obvious -
that we do not have a modern democractic, or capitalist, experiment
... at least that's what I think it's saying…


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