new idea for random number generation

[\0xDynamite]

On 8/4/17, Steve Kinney <admin at pilobilus.net> wrote:
> On 08/03/2017 02:54 PM, \0xDynamite wrote:
>> Speaking of cryptography (harhar),

That joke, btw, was because there's hardly any discussion on this lists subject.

>> I was contemplating an idea to
>> generate random streams of random numbers using chaos theory (not the
>> first), specifically the logistic equation [3.5x(1-x)], when I came
>> across the argument (http://www.cs.utsa.edu/~wagner/laws/chaos.html)
>> that such generators are "psuedo-random", but I don't think is true.
>>
>> The equation is capable of producing an infinite stream of numbers
>> that get more random as you continue to use the equation.  The amount
>> of true randomness approaches the depth of your word size, but in
>> theory you can create an implementation with arbitrary depth (say
>> 10000 bits).
>>
>> Is this interesting to anyone?
>
> Thing is, the output of an equation that takes one iteration's output as
> input for the next round, etc. is 100% deterministic:  The same
> equation, with same initial input, produces the same output every time.

Would not a coin flip with the exact same initial parameters (height,
force, deterministic air currents, and striking surface) have the same
result?

> Being unable to predict an iterated feedback function's 9 millionth
> digit on its 9 millionth iteration by any means other than actually
> iterating it 9 million times qualifies the function as "chaotic."

Yes, although I differentiate between deterministic chaos and
non-deterministic by using the term "stochastic" for the former.

> Only physical sources can generate real entropy in this sense:  Decaying
> isotopes, noise from a leaky diode, tumbling dice, snapshots of variable
> hardware states in a computer (least significant n. digits of CPU
> temperature, fan speed, keystroke intervals, etc.) do qualify as
> entropy;

That's part of the question, are those things deterministic, albeit at
several more orders maginitiudes than our computers?

I ask this semi-rhetorically, because in my cosmology, the universe
must have some non-determinism in order for life to appear.

Marxos