new idea for random number generation

[Steve Kinney]

On 08/04/2017 09:59 AM, \0xDynamite wrote:
> On 8/4/17, Steve Kinney <admin at pilobilus.net> wrote:
>> On 08/03/2017 02:54 PM, \0xDynamite wrote:
>>> Speaking of cryptography (harhar),
> 
> That joke, btw, was because there's hardly any discussion on this lists subject.

Punk ass bitches 'round here don't much talk about ciphers.

>> Thing is, the output of an equation that takes one iteration's output as
>> input for the next round, etc. is 100% deterministic:  The same
>> equation, with same initial input, produces the same output every time.
> 
> Would not a coin flip with the exact same initial parameters (height,
> force, deterministic air currents, and striking surface) have the same
> result?

Only if measures are taken to maintain precise control of these
variables; in practical terms, a human tossing a coin will produce an
unpredictable result every time due to variations in muscle tension, the
path the coin takes, etc.

>> Only physical sources can generate real entropy in this sense:  Decaying
>> isotopes, noise from a leaky diode, tumbling dice, snapshots of variable
>> hardware states in a computer (least significant n. digits of CPU
>> temperature, fan speed, keystroke intervals, etc.) do qualify as
>> entropy;
> 
> That's part of the question, are those things deterministic, albeit at
> several more orders maginitiudes than our computers?

Again, the outputs of these processes can not be predicted unless their
inputs are under precise control, which in practical situations they are
not.  A big factor here is that the random number generators used to
make cryptographic keys are under the control of the user (or had better
be!), and the user will act to assure that the variables driving the
generator are not monitored to produce predetermined outputs.

> I ask this semi-rhetorically, because in my cosmology, the universe
> must have some non-determinism in order for life to appear.

This far, physics describes a Universe where the balance of Order and
Chaos is ideal for creating life.  Almost as if somebody set that up on
purpose.  To put a stop to that kind of "superstitious" speculation,
some physicists propose that a vast, unlimited number of distinct
universes must exist, each with its own physical laws, where only a few
have conditions supporting the development of life.  But if so, there
must be a larger cosmic context in which all these universes happen, and
the same speculation arises - how did this massively parallel trial and
error process get started?  Which jumps us up to yet another "higher"
context, etc. ad infinitum.

Verily, 'tis a mindfucker.

:o)



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