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[Razer]

On 09/05/2016 08:39 AM, Dmitry Sherman wrote:
> unsubscribe
> 


The bottom of the page Buhbye
https://lists.cpunks.org/mailman/listinfo/cypherpunks



>> On 5 Sep 2016, at 18:13, Razer <rayzer at riseup.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> On 09/04/2016 10:30 PM, Zenaan Harkness quoted, I believe John Young:
>>
>>> That sounds like what cypherpunks was set up to combat, the withdrawal from politcial affairs into safe sanctuary of infallible mathematics...
>>
>> That's how ALL the problems start. Cloistering and it's whorehouse,
>> Academia.
>>
>> Einstein said if he had known what they were going to do with his
>> theoretical works he would have never cooperated.
>>
>> Don't be "Einstein".
>>
>> Rr
>>
>>
>>
>>> Forwarding the following for our collective prayer:
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Forwarded message -----
>>> Could not, agree, more !
>>>
>>> Identify yourselves, all defeatists, trolls, counter intelligence
>>> "professionals", cold water bots, and horsey nay sayers all polluting
>>> relevant, indeed dire discussion with distracts and "comedy" !
>>>
>>> Better still, don't !
>>>
>>> Read. Absorb. Imbibe.
>>>
>>> Then contemplate for at least three nights.
>>>
>>> Then, carefully, draft even the smallest, as long it be constructive.
>>>
>>> Then re-read that draft. Consider it be useful for those who might
>>> have but a small flame, that flame which might be gently fostered and
>>> fanned with others into a bright and future defining flame!
>>>
>>>
>>> And if your soul weeps for truth, for compassion as much as passion,
>>> warmth and empathy as much as strength and bold eclat, and with your
>>> humble words you have passed your own test, then post!
>>>
>>> Speak to this world which so desperately needs your care, your ability,
>>> your genuine contribution.
>>>
>>> anon
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 09:12:25AM -0400, John Young wrote:
>>>> What is striking about discussion on the two cryptography mail
>>>> lists, both set up to minimize discussing political and social
>>>> issues to avoid cypherpunks acceptance of them, is the
>>>> tentative reconsideration of those issues due to Snowden's
>>>> revelations, miniscule as they are.
>>>>
>>>> Notable among those raising the political threat are those
>>>> who disdained the issue on cypherpunks and stomped off
>>>> to set up alternatives ham-handedly moderated to cease
>>>> and desist the "off-topic."
>>>>
>>>> A few now say, bray more like it, NSA has betrayed us
>>>> through political manipulation of officials and the public,
>>>> and that is an important point which often came up on
>>>> cypherpunks and still does, with somewhat less
>>>> complaining about it.
>>>>
>>>> For Snowden has shown the political has won out over
>>>> the technical, and the technicals are fraught with what to
>>>> do about it, and much fingerpointing is going on along with
>>>> a few claims of having forewarned this betrayal would
>>>> happen. No moderation yet has shut down this "off-topic."
>>>> But much gumming and gnawing of the futility of technical
>>>> means against the vulgar political.
>>>>
>>>> What has been shown in the discussion is that the
>>>> technical wizards are not nearly as competent at the
>>>> messy political as they are at technical sophistication.
>>>> The resulting conversation is a mish-mash of fairly
>>>> high level technical discourse interleaved with fairly
>>>> clumsy political opinionating. So technical clubs
>>>> are being swung to answer political jabs, that is
>>>> petty squabblling and exchange of slurs has replaced
>>>> rational discourse. Thus the convo has become
>>>> politicized with as much stupidity and ignorance
>>>> as sharp thinking and mutual respect.
>>>>
>>>> NSA and its bosses would be happy if this became
>>>> the norm in cryptography as in the real world. And some
>>>> opine that this outcome is being, and has been in the
>>>> past, and will be in the future, orchestrated for just
>>>> that result.
>>>>
>>>> That sounds like what cypherpunks was set up
>>>> to combat, the withdrawal from politcial affairs into
>>>> safe sanctuary of infallible mathematics coated with
>>>> unending challengences to implement illusory
>>>> protection from political mayhem. So it has come
>>>> to pass, there is no refuge from politics, and the once
>>>> reviled tin-hats of conspiracy theories are replacing
>>>> anomymous masks, especially by the best and brightest
>>>> cryptographers who have been hoodwinked far more
>>>> than dreamed of in earliest days of cypherpunks.
>>>>
>>>> Still, there are die-hard PR-driven comsec experts
>>>> rolling out advice for what to do to protect the public --
>>>> meaning, cynically protecting their severely damaged
>>>> reputation of "concern for the public interest (R)".
>>>> Not yet willing to admit losing the comsec and privacy
>>>> war so avidly promoted with HTTPS, SSL, PGP, PFS,
>>>> OTR, Tor, on and on, they continue to hustle comsec
>>>> customers with promises of here's what we have got
>>>> to do, take it from us experienced veterans (read my
>>>> remarks, hear my TV interviews, read my messages
>>>> on cryptography, gorge on recyclings on Slashdot,
>>>> Twitter, Reddit, Voice of America, EFF. Guardian,
>>>> New York Times, ProPublica, ACLU, EPIC, on and
>>>> on):
>>>>
>>>> Lo, special prosecute NSA, take it to the courts, a
>>>> tired political gambit for media semaphoring, fund
>>>> raising, conceding technical defeat and begging
>>>> political rescue by what's that you say, account
>>>> churning lawyers, political lobbyists and journalistic
>>>> hacks.
>>>>
>>>> That is so obnoxious, murmurs the cryptography mail
>>>> lists, so opportunistically off-topic, moderator do your
>>>> censoring, let's get back to the good stuff. Despite
>>>> the murmurrings there recurs calls for "cut the cowardly
>>>> shit, let's fight." One guess who said that.
>