unsubscribe

[Dmitry Sherman]

unsubscribe

> On 5 Sep 2016, at 18:13, Razer <rayzer at riseup.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> On 09/04/2016 10:30 PM, Zenaan Harkness quoted, I believe John Young:
> 
>> That sounds like what cypherpunks was set up to combat, the withdrawal from politcial affairs into safe sanctuary of infallible mathematics...
> 
> That's how ALL the problems start. Cloistering and it's whorehouse,
> Academia.
> 
> Einstein said if he had known what they were going to do with his
> theoretical works he would have never cooperated.
> 
> Don't be "Einstein".
> 
> Rr
> 
> 
> 
>> Forwarding the following for our collective prayer:
>> 
>> 
>> ----- Forwarded message -----
>> Could not, agree, more !
>> 
>> Identify yourselves, all defeatists, trolls, counter intelligence
>> "professionals", cold water bots, and horsey nay sayers all polluting
>> relevant, indeed dire discussion with distracts and "comedy" !
>> 
>> Better still, don't !
>> 
>> Read. Absorb. Imbibe.
>> 
>> Then contemplate for at least three nights.
>> 
>> Then, carefully, draft even the smallest, as long it be constructive.
>> 
>> Then re-read that draft. Consider it be useful for those who might
>> have but a small flame, that flame which might be gently fostered and
>> fanned with others into a bright and future defining flame!
>> 
>> 
>> And if your soul weeps for truth, for compassion as much as passion,
>> warmth and empathy as much as strength and bold eclat, and with your
>> humble words you have passed your own test, then post!
>> 
>> Speak to this world which so desperately needs your care, your ability,
>> your genuine contribution.
>> 
>> anon
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sun, Sep 08, 2013 at 09:12:25AM -0400, John Young wrote:
>>> What is striking about discussion on the two cryptography mail
>>> lists, both set up to minimize discussing political and social
>>> issues to avoid cypherpunks acceptance of them, is the
>>> tentative reconsideration of those issues due to Snowden's
>>> revelations, miniscule as they are.
>>> 
>>> Notable among those raising the political threat are those
>>> who disdained the issue on cypherpunks and stomped off
>>> to set up alternatives ham-handedly moderated to cease
>>> and desist the "off-topic."
>>> 
>>> A few now say, bray more like it, NSA has betrayed us
>>> through political manipulation of officials and the public,
>>> and that is an important point which often came up on
>>> cypherpunks and still does, with somewhat less
>>> complaining about it.
>>> 
>>> For Snowden has shown the political has won out over
>>> the technical, and the technicals are fraught with what to
>>> do about it, and much fingerpointing is going on along with
>>> a few claims of having forewarned this betrayal would
>>> happen. No moderation yet has shut down this "off-topic."
>>> But much gumming and gnawing of the futility of technical
>>> means against the vulgar political.
>>> 
>>> What has been shown in the discussion is that the
>>> technical wizards are not nearly as competent at the
>>> messy political as they are at technical sophistication.
>>> The resulting conversation is a mish-mash of fairly
>>> high level technical discourse interleaved with fairly
>>> clumsy political opinionating. So technical clubs
>>> are being swung to answer political jabs, that is
>>> petty squabblling and exchange of slurs has replaced
>>> rational discourse. Thus the convo has become
>>> politicized with as much stupidity and ignorance
>>> as sharp thinking and mutual respect.
>>> 
>>> NSA and its bosses would be happy if this became
>>> the norm in cryptography as in the real world. And some
>>> opine that this outcome is being, and has been in the
>>> past, and will be in the future, orchestrated for just
>>> that result.
>>> 
>>> That sounds like what cypherpunks was set up
>>> to combat, the withdrawal from politcial affairs into
>>> safe sanctuary of infallible mathematics coated with
>>> unending challengences to implement illusory
>>> protection from political mayhem. So it has come
>>> to pass, there is no refuge from politics, and the once
>>> reviled tin-hats of conspiracy theories are replacing
>>> anomymous masks, especially by the best and brightest
>>> cryptographers who have been hoodwinked far more
>>> than dreamed of in earliest days of cypherpunks.
>>> 
>>> Still, there are die-hard PR-driven comsec experts
>>> rolling out advice for what to do to protect the public --
>>> meaning, cynically protecting their severely damaged
>>> reputation of "concern for the public interest (R)".
>>> Not yet willing to admit losing the comsec and privacy
>>> war so avidly promoted with HTTPS, SSL, PGP, PFS,
>>> OTR, Tor, on and on, they continue to hustle comsec
>>> customers with promises of here's what we have got
>>> to do, take it from us experienced veterans (read my
>>> remarks, hear my TV interviews, read my messages
>>> on cryptography, gorge on recyclings on Slashdot,
>>> Twitter, Reddit, Voice of America, EFF. Guardian,
>>> New York Times, ProPublica, ACLU, EPIC, on and
>>> on):
>>> 
>>> Lo, special prosecute NSA, take it to the courts, a
>>> tired political gambit for media semaphoring, fund
>>> raising, conceding technical defeat and begging
>>> political rescue by what's that you say, account
>>> churning lawyers, political lobbyists and journalistic
>>> hacks.
>>> 
>>> That is so obnoxious, murmurs the cryptography mail
>>> lists, so opportunistically off-topic, moderator do your
>>> censoring, let's get back to the good stuff. Despite
>>> the murmurrings there recurs calls for "cut the cowardly
>>> shit, let's fight." One guess who said that.