Universal Basic Income

juan juan.g71 at gmail.com
Wed Nov 9 11:12:35 PST 2016


On Tue, 8 Nov 2016 16:26:34 -0800
Jacob Core <jacob.core at gmail.com> wrote:



> >> While I largely agree with this list regarding government, I do
> >> agree about UBI.
> >
> > 	So you agree with libertarian/anarchist anti-government
> > views, but you still want yet another government scam? That doesn't
> > 	seem to make much sense...

> Yes, it is contrarian. But what else would you propose to move us to?

	Individual self-government and an economic system in which
	people can work *as little* as they want.


> As it stands at the moment, you need currency to get basic goods,
> such as bread. In the future what will we do to get basic items? 

	The system based on work and money exchanges (which is
	nothing but...barter) is bad, but the other option(s) are 
	worse I think.


> I
> think that we should all be taking care of each other, without any
> federal government involved; 

	Well, if voluntary socialism works, and you like it, go for it.
	

> I do doubt however that the US will
> ever, at least in my lifetime (I'm 25), be able to move away from the
> idea of capitalism (in the sense of buying and selling basic things,
> such as bread, water, and internet access)

	If you don't pay for something, somebody else has to pay for
	it, unless we are talking about truly free things. Food isn't
	usually on the list. Telecom hardware isn't either...

	Even if you somehow took money out of the equation, things
	still have to be produced and that takes work.



> Care to explain how simplistic jobs are irrelevant?

	I mean, right now there are peole working at mcdonalds, but if
	mcdonalds was gone, they'd be working at a different place.
	Even in the current rigged non-free market there's some degree
	of 'automatic reallocation of resources' so to speak.



> >
> > 	Of course it you start with government premises you'll
> > arrive at government conclusions...

> I won't disagree, but the government probably has the best access to
> employment information at this point. It would be amazing if everyone
> published, or at least made independently available, their employment
> figures. 


	Yes, but I wasn't referring only to the data. What I mean is,
	people losing their mcdoanlds jobs is obviously a problem for
	the now ex-employees but it's also a problem for the government
	and the establishment. Unemployed people don't pay taxes and
	might get funny ideas in their heads. 

	
> I'm not arguing that that UBI is the best method, but rather
> that, given our current government, it is the best method we have
> available to make things more equal. 

	

	I don't object to a radical 'redistribution' of wealth, taking
	it away from the corporate mafia and gov't employees. But it's
	even more important to get rid of the privileges that allow
	people to get rich and powerful in the first place. 


> It is also entirely likely that
> this bottle of bourbon, since it is election day, may have had a part
> to play in the past couple of e-mails. 

	=P


> 
> Apologies about the thunderbird/gmail formatting....
> 
> [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonald%27s
> 
> [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burger_King
> 
> [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_in_the_Box
> 




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