Wikileaks is the Endgame

[Mirimir]

On 06/26/2016 09:16 PM, juan wrote:
> On Sun, 26 Jun 2016 20:57:51 -0600
> Mirimir <mirimir at riseup.net> wrote:
> 
>> So juan, what do you recommend instead of Tor?
> 
> 	To 'defend' against 'local' adversaries, the only thing that
> 	tor allegedly does? I don't recommend anything, but it looks
> 	like VPNs can be as good or as bad as tor. You can even nest
> 	them, can't you.

Yes, VPNs will provide as much privacy as Tor does for purely local
adversaries. But if your adversary can get logs from the VPN server, or
the hosting provider, you're screwed. With Tor, such adversaries would
need to get logs from at least two of the three relays in circuits. And
circuits change frequently, so that means lots of relays.

And sure, you can nest VPNs. So a nested chain of three VPNs arguably
does as much as a Tor circuit. But it's static. Or at least, I haven't
figured out how to automate switching. And there's also the matter of
paying for a bunch of VPNs.

Anyway, I hedge my bets by accessing Tor through nested VPNs.

>> What do you use for privacy and/or "anonymity"?
> 
> 	Nothing. I'd play with freenet but I don't want to install
> 	java, so...

Right. I2P also runs on Java.

>> Why do you use the Internet? It's arguably just as pwned as Tor is.
> 
> 	Except that when I use the internet I'm not tring to hide
> 	anything. 

Well, that's cool, if it works for you. Doesn't work for me, however.

> 	And no lying piece of shit advertised the  internet as
> 	having anything to do with :
> 
> 	"Anonymity Online."
> 
> 	Or that the internet lets you  : 
> 
> 	"Protect your privacy. Defend yourself
> 	against network surveillance and traffic analysis." 

You have a point. But far too many people do seem to believe that
they're anonymous on the Internet.