request for comment re "contributor-covenant.org"

[Sean Lynch]

On Fri, Jan 29, 2016 at 5:35 AM <shakeitoff@ghostmail.com> wrote:

> >> Genuinely anti-social communication is actively discouraged, and this
> includes
> >> those who communicate deceptively regarding their own needs and or
> social
> >>environment requirements, as well as those who communicate in a passive
> >> aggressive way. If you this any of these types of communication may
> apply to
> >> you, then be prepared to suffer the consequences should you join this
> mailing
> >> list- we shall roast you in words, with glee!
>
> Why doesn't the gleeful roasting extend to the bigotry and chauvinism on
> this list? Why are these silently accepted?
>
I think the answer is that they're difficult subjects to address. People
generally prefer to address issues they think they understand. Not to
excuse it; it's something everyone needs to work on, but it's going to take
some time. There's also the self-selection effect where most of those who
"roast you in words, with glee" differ from trolls only that they seek out
some form of legitimacy for their trolling. It seems to me that a far
better way to deal with "anti-social communication" would be to ignore it
and encourage others to do so if it's trolling, or to privately reach out
to the person to try to help them understand why their method of
communication is counterproductive, if it seems like they can be gotten
through to.

> Cypherpunks defines government as “a home for bullies masquerading as a
> collective defense.” Interestingly, that is how I would describe your above
> approach.
>
To be fair, none of us is going to kidnap you and throw you in a cage, nor
shoot you, nor blow you up with a nuclear weapon. There are degrees of
bully. Though I think it would be more appropriate to describe government
as "a home for kidnappers, murderers, and thieves masquerading as a
collective defense."

> Be careful of becoming the oppressor.
>
Indeed.

> Look around. Do the people around you look like you? Think like you? Come
> from the same background as you?
>
> This is a problem. The lack of diversity in this group is not a magical
> phenomenon without a root cause.
>
Agreed.

> There is a deeper problem. If (and how) this should change is up to this
> community.
>
> Sadly, the ideals of this community are often lost in the (typically
> incoherent) bigotry spewing from the trolls.
>
Yep. Trolling is a problem in any public community. The best way to make
trolls go away if there is no active moderation is to ignore them, but that
requires encouraging those who respond to them to avoid doing so in the
future. IOW, you need leadership regardless of whether you have moderation
for a community to thrive. Moreso, in the absense of moderation.

> 4.12.4. "Crypto Anarchy sounds too wild for me."
>
>  - I accept that many people will find the implications of crypto anarchy
> (which follows in turn from the existence of strong cryptography, via the
> Crypto Anarchy Principle) to be more than they can accept.
>
>  - This is OK (not that you need my OK!). The house of Cypherpunks has
> many rooms.
>
> All are welcome. I hope.
>
In crypto-anarchy generally, yes. In this particular community, well, like
in any community it's going to take hard work.

> >> There are forums and mailing lists which are suitable for those who have
>
> >> learning difficulties (reference?), for those who need an emotionally
> sensitive
> >> environment (be sure to check if you need professional medical or
> >> psychological support), and for those who are beginniners in the field
> of
> >> technology discussed on this mailing list.
>
> Wow. How fucking elitist can you be?
>
Indeed. I thought this was a crypto-anarchist community, not a space for
social inepts to come where they don't have to take responsibility for
their complete lack of empathy or even basic consideration for others. But
that's probably an unrealistic expectation given the general state of
nerd-dom right now.
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