so called onion routing
Cari Machet
carimachet at gmail.com
Wed Aug 5 14:08:52 PDT 2015
i dont see it as poetry or emotion i see it as logic but prove logic to be
lacking poetry or emotion empirically/logically
these kinds of degrading segregations or silos of thought are also
christian in my mind which in turn for me is capitalist like in an
anti-enlightenment kind of way ie logic good emotion or instinct bad
instinct is really important to understand like in the tsunami that hit
thailand remember ? Animals didnt really die en mass as they knew it was
coming so they got out of dodge as they say ... did they have a gauge that
told them to get the fuck out sure they are closer to life so they can
sense it better or they got a signal in some form .... sound probably its
really logical actually but why didnt oh so logical humans get the same
info?
ethics are not emotional by nature - really ethics are logical we may get
hints that something doesnt feel right in our gut but then i think it can
be logically laid out as to why as well : murder isnt just emotional there
are lots of factual ramifications that follow from the murder as i am
native american and basically my family was murdered by the fake USG i can
first person talk about the logical ramifications of my family not being
allowed to exist
please prove your point about `lateral thinking` which i would term
horizontality ... if it isnt effective in a given space i often have seen
that the structures that are monolithic are why so i would be interested to
see any other formulations ... as i am a problem seeker ...uuuuhhh then i
know where to work
i think we agree that ideology is not functional but i am not sure we see
the same problems to solve ... i am not sure there is a clear understanding
that life is being heavily designed by a 'few' people in power and they are
designing it for many years to come like they have plans and shit so...
somehow i dont think the plans include medicine for the sick or literacy
for everyone... lets not even discuss food and water or combating mass
murder of the planets inhabitants
heres a video about what people often section off as logic and emotional or
creative sides of the brain ... our own interfaces should be looked at as
evidence not only because of their structures information but to show our
limited scope and not just thru our form but thru the
manipulation/propaganda about our form/forms which you seem to be driving
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyyjU8fzEYU
i think in order to make the machines of the future - like the ones that
will decide on their own wether to kill you or not in a battle - then this
kind of emotion/logic mis-equation will need to be worked on
On Wed, Aug 5, 2015 at 10:41 PM, Travis Biehn <tbiehn at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 5, 2015 at 3:02 PM, Cari Machet <carimachet at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> its religious thought to even utilize the word 'evil' let alone think in
>> those terms and religious thought is a capitalist parasite >>> read
>> nietzsche for fuck sake he wrote in the 1800's
>>
>> That's my point, glad we agree.
>
>
>> one of my arguments is that it is structurally unsound to rely on one
>> method >>> especially if built by your enemy - i look to nature as other
>> thinkers do/have and i think about buckminster fuller - his analysis of
>> panther dna making them vulnerable to extinction because it is all so/too
>> similar ... in any given situation i do not think in terms of one solution
>> ... i have used this analogy before ... sperm: there are lots of them in
>> one load ... they all race to get to the egg sure but, they actually help
>> each other to penetrate - they dont care who gets in as long as one of them
>> transforms the egg into a being (i mean i cant really speak for sperms in
>> general but it has been analysed like this)... thats their job ...they even
>> have been seen to help each other non-competative like :: this is the kind
>> of structures we need moreso not monolithic structures that blind us ...
>> its really a geometry problem for me... math
>>
>> OK, 'yes' monoculture is threatening and certain practices provide clear
> 'intelligence signals'. Unrestrained 'lateral thinking,' while
> intellectually stimulating and interesting, does not always map to fact.
> There's a step, where you rigorously research whether your theories are
> correct.
>
> but also it is all ethical to me as well : if my family was murdered by a
>> fucker i wouldnt go and use that fuckers infrastructure cause they made it
>> for me to use and sent some other fuckers around the globe selling it cause
>> like the fucker murdered my family i wont support them in any way ever
>> ....why would i talk myself into supporting the murderer of my family when
>> i could think about, invent or utilize other methods - its just really not
>> logical
>>
> This is an emotional argument, not a logical one. To continue the appeal
> to emotion, isn't it vaguely poetic? Using alternative methods are fine,
> but the existence of alternatives does not justify demonizing other
> approaches.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 5, 2015 at 9:19 PM, Travis Biehn <tbiehn at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, just get a new DHCP lease - rock solid.
>>>
>>> This is actually pretty easy; First read the protocol spec then read the
>>> code.
>>>
>>> If there is a backdoor or vulnerability, please let everyone know.
>>>
>>> If you can do away with evils like centralized directory servers while
>>> retaining sybill resistance please publish your ideas.
>>>
>>> If your arguments are that the project is intrinsically evil, by virtue
>>> of the authors being tainted with 'reptilian money' - that's not really a
>>> technically robust.
>>>
>>> -Travis
>>>
>>> On Wed, Aug 5, 2015, 9:24 AM Cari Machet <carimachet at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> i think there could be solutions utilized like easily shifting the ip
>>>> address of comp and router yourself in your own little hut > 'ghost' it but
>>>> not thru others .... pretty fucking simple i know but maybe effective in a
>>>> really different way than having the fake government of the US build
>>>> something and use people that are activists against them to make it work
>>>> also i think the infrastructure is too bulky
>>>>
>>>> i like to think about satelites (and thats all i will say about that) -
>>>> i dont know i would have to have a real think about solutions it is very
>>>> important to think about it and not just the problem for sure but i dont
>>>> think the methodology of tor is a solution i think it is a stoppage point
>>>> that people are not seeing beyond ... people dont think it has been
>>>> penetrated and i have no proof of that but maybe that isnt the main problem
>>>> for me ... structurally speaking it is a disaster ... the masses being
>>>> handed a tool in order to subvert the government??? as they say you cant
>>>> make this shit up
>>>>
>>>> i know that when i was in syria i could get a fucking video call in the
>>>> desert where there was nothing ... this was syria not a rich country per
>>>> say like at all so i think the choking of the communication system is super
>>>> in play ... if others dont think thats a problem then they need to educate
>>>> themselves ... do people that live in the US on this list even know that
>>>> the infrastructure of fiber optics that underlies the communications may
>>>> not even be utilized in their city and that the reason it is not used is
>>>> because the communication companies bought a contract with there city that
>>>> freezes it all up? please look into the chatanooga model if you dont know
>>>> about this 'freemarket' bullshit>>>> also fyi iraq had video calls
>>>> nationwide in 2000 or even before ... now i am not sure what tech they were
>>>> using i think radiowaves and shooting the signal over land that way but it
>>>> all points to a tremendous shut down of functionality .... not that it was
>>>> probably all that healthy for people but...
>>>>
>>>> sure we can write each other little words on this frame of
>>>> communications but see what happens when attempting to shift in a large way
>>>> ... like when they printed the 3d gun... people had to git fr USA & like
>>>> when barrett made project pm and this is a major reason i think there
>>>> should be as many solutions as possible not just one - not as easy for
>>>> gov/corp to take them out
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Aug 5, 2015 at 11:15 AM, Juan <juan.g71 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 4 Aug 2015 22:36:00 -0700
>>>>> coderman <coderman at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> > On 8/3/15, Juan <juan.g71 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> > > ...
>>>>> > > http://www.onion-router.net/History.html
>>>>> > > 1995:
>>>>> > > Initial work on Onion Routing begins, funded by ONR.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > back in this day, fully saturated ISDN pairs made for great zero
>>>>> > knowledge overlays, too.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > the real question is, what do you propose to do better?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> what I was getting at is that, if I'm not mistaken, syverson
>>>>> and co. claim to have 'invented' 'onion routing'
>>>>>
>>>>> but they didn't come up with the ideas and didn't even come up
>>>>> with the name apparently
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > if TCP Tor is just a jump toward datagram traffic analysis resistant
>>>>> > overlays, how little it matters what origins for this open source",
>>>>> > distributed, public infrastructure?
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>> do you consider your governemnt to be a 'repressive regime'
>>>>> coderman?
>>>>>
>>>>> does tor protect people from your goverment's attacks?
>>>>>
>>>>> do you think tor helps the US government in any way?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> do you think it's 'hypotetically' acceptable to murder say a
>>>>> 100
>>>>> people so that 1 million people can 'anonymously' browse
>>>>> their newspaper or favorite sports website?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > cooperation is the future. learn to do it least badly :P
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > best regards,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Cari Machet
>>>> NYC 646-436-7795
>>>> carimachet at gmail.com
>>>> AIM carismachet
>>>> Syria +963-099 277 3243
>>>> Amman +962 077 636 9407
>>>> Berlin +49 152 11779219
>>>> Reykjavik +354 894 8650
>>>> Twitter: @carimachet <https://twitter.com/carimachet>
>>>>
>>>> 7035 690E 5E47 41D4 B0E5 B3D1 AF90 49D6 BE09 2187
>>>>
>>>> Ruh-roh, this is now necessary: This email is intended only for the
>>>> addressee(s) and may contain confidential information. If you are not
>>>> the
>>>> intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use of this
>>>> information, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this email
>>>> without
>>>> permission is strictly prohibited.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cari Machet
>> NYC 646-436-7795
>> carimachet at gmail.com
>> AIM carismachet
>> Syria +963-099 277 3243
>> Amman +962 077 636 9407
>> Berlin +49 152 11779219
>> Reykjavik +354 894 8650
>> Twitter: @carimachet <https://twitter.com/carimachet>
>>
>> 7035 690E 5E47 41D4 B0E5 B3D1 AF90 49D6 BE09 2187
>>
>> Ruh-roh, this is now necessary: This email is intended only for the
>> addressee(s) and may contain confidential information. If you are not the
>> intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use of this
>> information, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this email
>> without
>> permission is strictly prohibited.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Twitter
> <http://t.sidekickopen17.com/e1t/c/5/f18dQhb0S7lC8dDMPbW2n0x6l2B9nMJW7t5XZs1qg55-N5w02yWRbBJdW8q-c7s56dVZzf3drS6C02?t=https%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2Ftbiehn&si=5459291358625792&pi=85053832-b347-4864-f933-3c0f9f6c6138>
> | LinkedIn
> <http://t.sidekickopen17.com/e1t/c/5/f18dQhb0S7lC8dDMPbW2n0x6l2B9nMJW7t5XZs1qg55-N5w02yWRbBJdW8q-c7s56dVZzf3drS6C02?t=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.linkedin.com%2Fin%2Ftravisbiehn&si=5459291358625792&pi=85053832-b347-4864-f933-3c0f9f6c6138>
> | GitHub
> <http://t.sidekickopen17.com/e1t/c/5/f18dQhb0S7lC8dDMPbW2n0x6l2B9nMJW7t5XZs1qg55-N5w02yWRbBJdW8q-c7s56dVZzf3drS6C02?t=http%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Ftbiehn&si=5459291358625792&pi=85053832-b347-4864-f933-3c0f9f6c6138>
> | TravisBiehn.com <http://www.travisbiehn.com> | Google Plus
> <http://t.sidekickopen17.com/e1t/c/5/f18dQhb0S7lC8dDMPbW2n0x6l2B9nMJW7t5XZs1qg55-N5w02yWRbBJdW8q-c7s56dVZzf3drS6C02?t=https%3A%2F%2Fplus.google.com%2F%2BTravisBiehn&si=5459291358625792&pi=85053832-b347-4864-f933-3c0f9f6c6138>
>
--
Cari Machet
NYC 646-436-7795
carimachet at gmail.com
AIM carismachet
Syria +963-099 277 3243
Amman +962 077 636 9407
Berlin +49 152 11779219
Reykjavik +354 894 8650
Twitter: @carimachet <https://twitter.com/carimachet>
7035 690E 5E47 41D4 B0E5 B3D1 AF90 49D6 BE09 2187
Ruh-roh, this is now necessary: This email is intended only for the
addressee(s) and may contain confidential information. If you are not the
intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any use of this
information, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this email without
permission is strictly prohibited.
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: text/html
Size: 17766 bytes
Desc: not available
URL: <https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/attachments/20150806/3e3786d8/attachment-0002.txt>
More information about the cypherpunks
mailing list