request for transcript: Bruce Schneier and Eben Moglen discuss a post-Snowden Internet

[coderman]

On Sun, Dec 15, 2013 at 7:40 PM, Juan Garofalo <juan.g71 at gmail.com> wrote:
> ...
>         What is currently true? Even tor developers admit that traffic analysis is
> feasible.

of course.  it's also expensive, relative to other options. i'm saying
NSA spends money carefully.



>         Are you telling me you know all the nsa does? You know they are not big
> enough to attack tor as 'global adversary' or whatever the jargon was?

never said either thing.  i'm also long on the record advocating for
the next generation of low latency anonymous networking that _does_
provide strong defense against traffic analysis.  turns out the
details are, um..  complicated ;)



>         Your reasoning is flawed. Yes, there may use cheaper means if that's all
> they needed. But that does not imply, at all, that other more sophisticated
> means are not available to them.

i'm glad that is not, in fact, my reasoning.

of course there are more sophisticated means available to them; that
will always be the case.  they've got BILLIONS and BILLIONS every
year, for their projects.

the point is not making something "NSA proof", which is an ill defined
and open ended venture.  the point is increasing the cost of their
efforts and narrowing their scope.

the more money they spend getting less and less in return, the better!