A Chat With T.L. Wahl- St. Louis' First Amendment Advocate- Rob Black
   Ain't the Only Porn Guy to Have Run for Mayor
   Vegas is going nuts trying to legislate lap dancing, and a bunch of
   right wing religious goofballs in Cincinnati got the Marriott Corp. to
   cave in on the showing of pay-per-view movies in a Marriott. This of
   course prompted us to give TL Wahl a call and see what was doing in St.
   Louis. Wahl along with his wife Suzie was a recipient of the Hal
   Freeman Freedom Isn't Free Award at the recent Night of the Stars.
   [Ironically the "Stars" have to pay to go to a benefit honoring them.]
   Wahl likes to say he's the only guy in America convicted twice of
   prostitution for having sex with his own wife. Wahl runs openly
   advertised $200 "educational seminars," but the cops in St. Charles
   County saw it another way and figured Wahl's brand of Tupperware party
   was more like hooking. Having lost at the appellate level, Wahl asked
   the Missouri Supreme Court to hear his case but as yet hasn't received
   an answer. Wahl also writes and comments on First Amendment issues.
   Gene: Anything new on your legal front?
   Wahl: Oddly enough, we have not heard back from the Missouri Supreme
   Court as to whether or not they will hear our case. It's taken quite
   awhile. That's unusual. Otherwise things here are kind of quiet.
   Gene: Are you still doing your educational seminars.
   Wahl: We're not doing performances at this moment. They told us in St.
   Charles County that if we did the show again, we'd get 30 days in jail.
   And they use the word "show". Thirty days in jail would be pretty hard
   for me to take financially.
   Gene: You're pretty active on the local political scene.
   Wahl: Yeah. I've run for state representative. I've run for alderman
   here in St. Louis and I ran for mayor of Lake St. Louis. Suzie applied
   for the job of police chief back in 1991. When I ran for mayor I put
   together a booklet listing the issues that I thought were confronting
   the city. And I walked on foot every street in the city and knocked on
   every door of every resident in the city. I didn't win the election but
   that booklet was well regarded. But a lot of people used and referred
   to that booklet as far as the issues that would have to be dealt with.
   They did come to a boil and did have to be dealt with. A lot of the
   times the solutions I had proposed were the ones they ended up using.
   Gene: I think Cincinnati's going to be the start of some pesky little
   First Amendment mosquito bites
   Wahl: It goes back and forth. This being basically a theocracy in
   disguise, whenever they get a chance with a national threat or a
   national emergency they take that opportunity to swing the pendulum
   their way. But that's okay. We're not quitting. One of the things that
   we've considered doing in St. Louis is offering our performances for
   free. The problem with our performances is that there's sex and there's
   money. They consider that prostitution. Thereby we'd circumvent the
   whole prostitution aspect of it. We haven't worked real hard on that in
   finding a location, but that is a possibility and we'll see what the
   court rules. One day we may put the seminar on for free and see what
   they come up with next. I don't think they'd ever get us on obscenity
   because we offer scientific value in our presentation.
   Gene: What are your feelings about receiving the Freedom Isn't Free
   Award.
   Wahl: I was really genuinely honored. I remember when I heard about
   that award many years ago I really did think I'd like to have that some
   day. At the same time I'm kind of embarrassed because there I am in the
   room with the previous award winner who took a bullet in the back and
   is paralyzed for life. I got the award without being physically
   attacked, permanently attacked or spending any real time in jail. I
   haven't been through what some of those guys have been through.
   Gene: How long have you been active as far as First Amendment issues.
   Wahl: We were outed by our controversy in September 9, 1991 when the
   cops came in with a bogus search warrant [the Wahl's had an amateur
   video company] in honor of the local police chief's political campaign.
   They came in with a bogus search warrant, had a very public parade and
   we blew it all up in their faces. That's when we decided the best
   defense was a good offense. We've been very vocal about every issue,
   particularly censorship issues ever since then. When the local county
   prosecutor held a sideline job teaching law courses at the community
   college and told those people in the classroom that his opinion making
   an X-rated video was an act of prostitution, I sued him for libel. I
   also sued him for having a part time job. I sued the prosecutor on and
   on. I filed five or six lawsuits against him. His name was Tim Braun.
   None of the suits went anywhere. They were more of nuisance suits than
   anything else but they got in the newspaper and got us press. It drew
   attention to issues and we helped get him beat finally. A couple of
   years ago he publicly announced that at the behest of a local
   censorship group, Citizens Against Pornography, he was going after
   local video stores. They sent letters to the local video stores telling
   them they had better get rid of their stuff or face prosecution. I went
   around to the stores and said we need to have an organized effort to
   get this guy out of office. They trusted me with their mailing lists.
   Here I am, a mail order guy but I promised them I wouldn't use their
   mailing lists for my own purposes. I didn't. I printed up flyers