corporate vs. state

[Anonymous via panta]

Harmon Seaver wrote:
> > >If a member of a club, to which you belong, commits an act of
> > > violence, are you liable for that act?
>
>    No, but if the "club", as an entity, does such, you should be. If
> the corporation pollutes, all and sundry owners and employees should
> be equally liable. Or maybe liability adjusted to investment or wage,

What exactly do you mean when you say that the club "as an entity" commits an act?  That the club/corporation assembled its members into some kind of Voltron super-mecha-bot, which went on a rampage through the rainforests of Tokyo?

A corporation is not a physical entity.  It is abstract, a name for a group of people.  A corporation can no more act as an entity, than "cybershamanix.com" or "Islam" or "the cypherpunk movement".  Employees or members of those groups can act; people can claim to act "in the name of" those groups.  But that is not the same thing as the group itself acting as an entity.

What you really mean is that if some employees of a corporation commit a crime, you'd like to see the other employees punished also.  Guilt by association.

Many in the US government are pushing the idea that an abstract entity is a concrete being that can commit crimes and be punished.  And not just the War On Terror; all these "conspiracy to provide material support" and "jihad training" charges are about building a case against some arbitrary group, and then arguing that the accused is liable for crimes committed by others associated with that group.

When Tim May puts three rounds in the base of Bob Hettinga's geodesic skull, the feds kicking in your door will tell you that The Cypherpunks did it.  Be sure to remind them that you deserve equal punishment.

> i.e., the biggest stockholders and highest paid employees get the
> longest sentences. The concept that no one is actually responsible
> for the criminal acts of a corporation is patently absurd. 

"limited liability" doesn't shield employees or agents of a company from punishment for crimes they commit.  It serves to prevent one employee from being punished for the actions of another.