Cypherpunks and terrorism

[Sunder]

On Wed, 12 Sep 2001, Nomen Nescio wrote:

> Sure, but whose chicken?  Maybe our own policies and beliefs have turned
> against us, to our detriment.  There have been a number of reports that
> bin Laden uses cryptography and even steganography tools.  This could
> still have a significant crypto connection.

So fucking what?  I'm sure he also uses toilet paper and soap, cellphones,
pens and paper. Hey, let's ban those too.  If a terrorist uses such items,
heaven forbid should anyone else be allowed to lest they be likened to a
terrorist!
 
> But if not this time, then next time.  Sooner or later a catastrophe
> will happen due to our technology.

Oh, you mean like Hiroshima or Nagasaki?  Oh well, let's just shit on
Uncle Sam for inventing the nuclear weapons before Germany could.  Nah, we
should have idly stood by while Germany built their own nukes, that way
you couldn't blame "our technology"

> Most people's worries seem narrow.  "Will I get in trouble?  Will the
> software be banned?"

I think at this time, and I don't speak for most people - I'm simply using
my own views and extrapolating, that most people are glad they are alive
and breathing.  Most people are pissed and want retaliation.  Most people
aren't thinking "Hmmm, maybe I shouldn't use crypto, the telephone, mp3's
or the radio because they can also be used by terrorists."
 
> What about, "Should I be a contributor to the murder of thousands?  Should
> I be promoting technology which could lead to a backlash against freedom?"

Hey two way radios, cell phones, pen and paper, ink, cutlery can be used
against freedom.  Do you see Gerber, the knife makers volutarily going out
of business?  Or whatever company made the plastic knives used in this
attack because they were used by terroists?

Did Ryder, the company whose moving van McVeigh used to bomb OKC shut down
because their "technology" could be used by terrorists?

Get a fucking clue you troll!
 
> Some terrorists have exactly this as their goal.  They are hoping
> to trigger a counter-reaction, an over-reaction, by the authorities.
> They want to see a crackdown on liberties, a police state.  This will
> weaken the enemy and demoralize him.  It will increase hostility and
> make the population less willing to support the government.

Perhaps, but I think terror is the ultimate goal, not a supression of
freedom.  Fear, uncertainty and doubt, not a loss of freedom are the aims
of terrorists.  After all if they were worried about freedom being such an
important thing, their countries would have freedom, rather than the
extreme religeous bans.
 
> Perhaps some readers share this view.  Tim May, spiritual leader of the
> cypherpunks, has expressed support for the actions of Timothy McVeigh
> in murdering schoolchildren in Oklahoma City.  He has frequently called
> for the killing of every resident of Washington, D.C.  Will he now speak
> out in favor of the death of tens of thousands in New York City?
> 
> Perhaps, for him, this is the true cypherpunk goal: promote murder and
> catastrophe in order to trigger a spasm of Western totalitarianism,
> hoping that the state will then self-destruct.
> 
> If so, then laws like the DMCA and SSSCA should be welcomed with open
> arms.  Likewise with prosecutions for pornography and, even better,
> bans on software technologies.  These measures work hand in hand with
> the responses to terrorism in strengthening the control of the state
> over the individual.

DMCA and SSSCA have to do with mp3's and videos. Not crypto.  Now I'm
100% certain that you are a troll sent to demoralize this list against
cryptology.  Go fuck yourself.

 
> Those few remaining cypherpunks who cling to the original goal of freedom,
> privacy and liberty, should face the moral issues squarely.  A case
> can be made that the technologies we favor are a positive force in the
> world, even though they can be used for destructive means.  But there are
> arguments on both sides, especially in a world where a few people can use
> the shield of anonymity to coordinate actions that lead to massive deaths.
> 
> The point is, cypherpunks must face and accept the responsibility for
> the harm their technologies can cause, as they should also feel pride
> in the positive effects.  And they must be able to show, at least to
> themselves, that the positives outweigh the negatives.

Ok Mr. Troll, go and dig out the proof that said terrorists were
cypherpunks.  Go and dig out the proof that Diffie, Hellman, Rivest,
Shamir, Adelman, Schneier, and Zimmerman were on those planes holding
plastic knives.  

Fucking troll!  If anything, you have a lot more in common with those
responsible for this atrocy than you do with any freedom loving citizen of
the USA.  Or for that matter any cypherpunk.

This was an attack against our liberty.  Against our freedom.  Perpetrated
by those who hate liberty and would love to enslave their countries under
severe religious laws.  They hate us most of all because they believe our
freedom is what makes us "The Great Satan"

And you sir, are spewing the very same agenda they are.  I suggest you
turn yourself in to the FBI this moment for the terror monger that you
are!