Sheeple earning sheeps' disease (Re: Neverending Cycle ( was : Re: USPS: glowing by leaps and bounds ))

David Honig honig at sprynet.com
Wed Oct 24 12:01:31 PDT 2001


At 10:11 AM 10/24/01 -0700, mmotyka at lsil.com wrote:
>David Honig <honig at sprynet.com> wrote :
>>
>>Personally I'd prefer a non-colonial foreign policy that doesn't generate
>>such antipathy.  
>>
>>The message of the WTC is this: regular ole' non-mil sheeple *are* held
>>responsible for
>>the actions of their government.  *Even* in the US.  What a concept.
>>I suppose the sheeple in Dresden (etc.) know what that's like.  
>>
>>When the US populations' endocrines settle down, maybe they'll clue in to
>>cause and effect.  Doubt it.  Getting involved in others' family feuds is
just
>>too much fun.
>>
>>What was it General Washington said about foreign entanglements?  I'd tattoo
>>it onto every congressvermin's forehead.
>>


>Not that it isn't a good direction to head but I wonder what your
>time-scale is for the conversion of a society that cannot survive
>without an influx of inexpensive resources from foreign sources into
>something less colonial? It has to be decades at a minimum.

Tomorrow.  No USG money, no USG troops outside the US.

>In the meantime how do we deal with the Islamic Fundamentalist nutters?

We have an immediate obligation to fight back.   If we can find something
to hit.
This is not an exception to the above withdrawl --this is striking back, to
maintain
our reputation, only.  

But we can certainly let the foreign tyrants whom we currently defend, at our
peril (and frankly disgrace), fend for themselves.

Let *their* oppressed earn *their* freedom.  Let US citizens go over and fight
if they want to, as private citizens, as many did during e.g., the spanish
civil war.  But as a government do not engage in foreign entanglements.
Because
karma happens.  Behavior has consequences.  

Otherwise, sheeple will continue to earn sheeps' disease --anthrax, etc.
As you say, the US is far too vulnerable, and will shut down ---which 
is one of the Jihad's goals.  Part of 'getting our attention'.

>Or our own Christian Fundamentalist nutters for that matter. I don't
>want to hear about good and evil, Christian vs. Muslim, True faiths vs.
>ersatz faiths or right vs. wrong. 

But you *will* when the interventionists gripe about how oppressed the poor
inhabitants are, and "shouldn't we intervene?".  Of course the
interventionists
want to spend *your* money and your offspring pursuing *their* grand plans.
 Which look
much like colonialism and culture war from the other side.

The crew that did the WTC is
>dangerous. Those who are sending anthrax through the mails are
>dangerous. 

No argument there.

Near-term solutions are called for. I would like to see
>solutions that don't involve further trashing of our civil rights but I
>have no compassion for the terrorists or freedom fighters or whatever
>the hell you want to call them.
>
>Mike

I'm waiting for some asian caucus to declare that, given the circumstances,
all arabs should be sent to Nevada.

.....
If you look up "Schelling points" you find Tim's 
http://www.inet-one.com/cypherpunks/dir.1996.07.25-1996.07.31/msg00032.html
metaphor about interfering with another family because you disapprove of
how they raise their children.  Basically the Soviet Union "died and left
US boss" of the neighborhood.  But the US, playing self-appointed cop, 
has made lots of enemies; and even cops must sleep.  The sleeping giant
finds that someone has tried to burn his house down while he sleeps.
The giant needs to hit back, then stop accumulating enemies.

Free trade does not make enemies.  Government intervention does.
Funny how consensual acts are ok and nonconsensual ones not.

...
Mind you, I believe in right and wrong -hell, I quote Rand- and 
I'd be happy forcing all the tyrant-governments (from the French, English,
Mexican, etc. 
to the Saudis) to accept the US constitution, *all of it*, or else.  
But that's questionable and going to create enemies.  If someone did that
to you, you might take up arms too (or planes, or spores, given the
asymmetry).

Best to stay out of their family feuds (Yugoslavia, Palestine, Ireland,
Spain, africa, etc.) and don't force them to "do it our way or else" --even
though our way is the right way.  
Lead by example.  Not intervention.  

...
To those who gripe we need the oil (or other resources): ask the families of 
the WTC corpses if doubled gas prices (for a few years until a safer supply
rises) 
are worth it.





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