CDR: RE: Parties

[Carskadden, Rush]

Eric,
     Glad to hear that all it takes to "get your vote" is a reckless
executive pardon of criminals that is designed to utilize executive power to
bypass the checks and balances system and negate the efforts of the
legislative and judicial branches of government (known in some circles as
"saying 'fuck the constitution'"). So to clarify (because I am completely
baffled), you are saying it doesn't matter what the outcome of any
legislative effort is at all? You seem to be saying that you are in favor of
voting on your own "concious" (conscience?) regardless of outcome. So when
they take every freedom you have, when your social security number is bought
and sold amongst governments and big businesses, when every facet of your
life is documented and displayed publicly, with any attempt at obfuscation
deemed illegal, you will say that it is ok, because you voted with your
conscience, and it didn't matter if your cause won.
     Of course it matters. At least to me it does. You may not agree, but I
would like to see my privacy and personal freedoms protected by the
government (in addition to my own strong efforts at defending them myself).
That is not the case right now, and the Libertarian party has done fuck all
to change it. So my question to you, posed for the third time, is whether
you think it is easier to give a third party (you seem to think that it
should be the Libertarian party, and I tend to agree with you) viability in
Washington with our efforts (or rather MY efforts, as you are quite content
to lose the fight), or whether it would be easier to convince an existing
power to take up our cause. I am not currently trying to start a third
party. I think I was very clear in my initial email about the third party
talk being theoretical. I am in no position to be in the business of
redefining political partisanship, and if I was, I would not have achieved
that position by asking opinions of people who assert that crypto anarchy
will make governments obsolete in the near future. In short, thank you again
for your Andy Rooney moment, but you seem to have abandoned the question
completely. 

ok,
Rush Carskadden


-----Original Message-----
From: Eric Murray [mailto:ericm at lne.com]
Sent: Friday, October 27, 2000 1:16 PM
To: Carskadden, Rush
Cc: cypherpunks at algebra.com
Subject: Re: Parties



On Fri, Oct 27, 2000 at 12:54:39PM -0500, Carskadden, Rush wrote:
> Eric,
>      Yeah, there is the Libertarian party, and they get a lot of electoral
> votes. In fact, I think that our next president will be Harry Browne. Our
> work is done. Let's go get a drink. 
>      Seriously, what we are discussing here is the feasibility of
> establishing a credible power base for a third party. I don't think (and
> maybe you disagree with me here) that the Libertarian party has achieved
> this at all. I don't think that the current Libertarian party CAN
establish
> this kind of voter confidence. The current presidential candidate for the
> Libertarian party, Harry Browne, has done little to gain voter enthusiasm
> with such bold and impractical claims as the statement that his first
action
> in office would be granting executive pardon to drug offenders. 

Well, that gets my vote!

Why should I vote for someone who doesn't stand for what I beleive
in just because the media says that they're "not electable"?
That's the kind of loser attitude that's gotten us a contest
that'll assuredly elect either an idiot (Bush) or a fool (Gore).
Unfortunately Americans are more interested in voting for a "winner"
than they are in voting their concious.   A "Libertarian Lite"
party wouldn't get the principled voters away from the Libertarian
party and wouldn't get any more mainstream voters than any other
third party gets.

But if you really want to do it, go ahead.  The cipherpunks list
isn't a very good place to discuss it though, as most posters seem
to think that the Libertarian party isn't radical enough, and besides,
crypto anarchy will soon make governments obsolete.


-- 
  Eric Murray           Consulting Security Architect         SecureDesign
LLC
  http://www.securedesignllc.com                            PGP
keyid:E03F65E5
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