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From dbrown at alaska.net  Thu Sep 10 10:28:25 1998
From: dbrown at alaska.net (Dave Brown)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 01:28:25 +0800
Subject: oil, greens, recycling, and poly-ticks.
In-Reply-To: <199809092123.OAA17355@leroy.fbn.bc.ca>
Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.19980910205225.0096d7d0@alaska.net>

Ray Arachelian typethed the following...
>
>Raymond D. Mereniuk wrote:

>
>What pisses me off is that in NYC the gas prices are ridiculous high...
>$1.35/Gal is the regular gas, drive just a few miles over a tunnel or bridge 
>to n NJ, it's $1.00 or $.99 depending on which pump you hit...  go a bit
south,
>say VA, and in some areas it drops as low as $0.87 a gallon!
>
>Shit, if it weren't for the tolls and the drive, I'd be getting my gas out of
>NYC all the time, but doing so wastes enough and costs enough in tolls to not
>make it worth the effort...
>
>Just out of curiosity what are prices around where you guys live?

Prices in Anchorage are about $1.15 in the summer and $1.30-5 when the
tourists leave. And we have all the oil you can use and a bunch of
refinery's up here. 
We get shafted nearly as bad as you do.

 --Dave

Lucidity Paradox:  Explain a concept in sufficient detail, and it will
become clearer and clearer until it eventually disappears.

From s9812127 at postino.up.ac.za  Thu Sep 10 11:00:03 1998
From: s9812127 at postino.up.ac.za (s9812127 at postino.up.ac.za)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 02:00:03 +0800
Subject: Writing skills
Message-ID: 

YoU wR1t3 l1K3 tH1s aGa1N & 1'll f1 at m3 you, dickhead...
> From:          Jrjeffro at aol.com
> Date:          Wed, 9 Sep 1998 19:27:05 -0700 (PDT)
> Bcc:           

> HaCkaZ OnlY Da EliTeHelLO YaLL DiS is Da MaDD AAOOLL HaCka Ima startin a GreWp fOR HaCs Only So In OthA WerDS yA gOttA KnOw The WAreZ anD HoW toO UsEr FaTe AnD AOL So MaIl Or Im Me FoR Da TeTaIls 
f
> YeR LeeTo K Pe at CE FrOmE The LeeTs HacKJeFFrO)
> >
> 
-/"Those who desire to give up freedom in 
-/exchange for security will not have,
-/nor do they deserve, either one." - Thomas Jefferson
-/ Crayven.

-/"Those who desire to give up freedom in 
-/exchange for security will not have,
-/nor do they deserve, either one." - Thomas Jefferson
-/ Crayven.

From s9813117 at postino.up.ac.za  Thu Sep 10 11:14:52 1998
From: s9813117 at postino.up.ac.za (s9813117 at postino.up.ac.za)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 02:14:52 +0800
Subject: No Subject
Message-ID: 

From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 11:40:44 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 02:40:44 +0800
Subject: If there's a trial will some of us be witnesses?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <199809110742.AAA07729@netcom13.netcom.com>

hmmmm, I doubt carl johnson will claim he is innocent. or
has he? the trial is only necessary if he doesn't plead
guilty. depending on his lawyer & the evidence, that seems likely to
me if he was involved. there aren't any cpunks with the 
resources to take on uncle sam, except maybe... 

seriously, though, it's fun to fantasize. it would certainly
be the trial of the century. better than unabomber & oj
simpson combined. 

that reminds me.. before they caught him I always thought
the unabomber was probably on the cpunk list. I was quite
surprised when his antitechnology rant came out. he's got
the rant part down, but not the technology part!!

at one time, kevin mitnick was on this list, rumor has
it. probably many of the world's premiere hackers have been at one time or
another.

From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 11:46:36 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 02:46:36 +0800
Subject: Joe Cypherpunk
In-Reply-To: <199809091200.IAA18283@www.video-collage.com>
Message-ID: <199809110747.AAA08019@netcom13.netcom.com>

wow, a new site called sixdegrees.com, in which everyone
registers and reveals who their friends are. the privacy
implications are really incredible. yet supposedly
close to 1 million people joined, with 900,000 of them
connected!!

 wow!! boy, it sure would be interesting to
write software that analyzed this data.

 reminds me of another program someone wrote that looked
up proper nouns in the ciabase database, I think, and
showed the relationships. probably the kind of software
that intelligence agencies use all the time. pretty sophisticated.

amazing what the information revolution is bringing. in
many ways, extraordinary things can be done merely by
sloshing information around in creative ways. no one
has really predicted some of the coolest stuff that
is happening.

wheeeeeeee!!! cyberspace is so much fun!!!

From tcmay at got.net  Thu Sep 10 11:56:46 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 02:56:46 +0800
Subject: Bits are Bits
In-Reply-To: <33CCFE438B9DD01192E800A024C84A1928463C@mossbay.chaffeyhomes.com>
Message-ID: 

At 1:54 PM -0700 9/10/98, Matthew James Gering wrote:
>> Um, actualy not. It is actualy illegal for me to allow you to
>> borrow my books, CD's, albums, etc.
>
>Uh, how so? Distribution copyright covers first-sale only, after that
>the owner can lend or sell that item. If it were not for this, public
>and private libraries could not exist.

Several misc. points. Perhaps related, but I don't have the time to try to
figure out all the relations.

* Books: OK to resell. OK to lend. May or may not be OK to rent.

* Recorded music: OK to resell. OK to lend to private parties for
noncommercial use. NOT OK to rent.

* Recorded videos: OK to resell, OK to lend to private parties for
noncommercial use, OK to rent. (There are video rental stores, but not CD
rental stores.)

* Software: OK to resell if license allows it, if original is destroyed, if
no copies are kept, blah blah blah. (Very complicated.) Not legal to rent
software since around the mid-80s, when software rental stores stopped.

* It is not illegal under the Act passed by Congress authorizing a blank
media tax. (I think it was called the Home Recording Act, or somesuch.
Circa 1992-4.) The Act requires that blank tapes be taxed and then says
that "noncommercial use" is declared to be legal. In other words, the
government is collecting money from us and says as a result we get to tape
stuff for our own use.

* I myself have taped about 600 CDs and DATs, digitally taped onto DAT. (I
use a Sony home deck for some purposes, a Sony DATMAN for others, and a
Tascam DA-P1 portable for others. The Tascam is neat in that it ignores the
SCMS bits and thus allows unlimited DAT-to-DAT copying.) A friend of mine
has taped over 4500 recordings...he's a bit obsessive about his library of
"free" music. He uses public libraries to get a dozen or so CDs at a pop,
then loads them into a carousel player and records for 3-5 hours each
night, and often during the day.

* There is talk that the Bern Convention, which the U.S. recently signed,
overrides this Home Recording Act (or whatever the title was).

* As to public and private libraries, I think the situation is much more
unsettled than Matthew makes out:

-- lending (and presumably rental?) of books is allowed, by convention.

-- rental of software is no longer allowed (court case?)...it seems to have
ended around 1984 or so, when the software rental place near me announced
it could no longer rent software titles

-- rental of CDs is not apparently allowed...but sales of used CDs
are...and liberal return policies on new CDs are common (defacto rental).
The music store chain, "Wherehouse," was involved in a major court case on
this several years ago. I presume from their continued sale of used CDs
that they won. (The case may have involved whether record labels could
refuse to sell to them, a choice I would of course support, in a free
society.)

-- rental of videos is allowed. (Why videos but not CDs? What about books
on tape? What about books on CD, either audio or CD-ROM?)

Anyway, I can discern no clear point here. It all seems hodge podge.

* Just today I was at a store which was selling many copies of major
programs at deep, deep discounts. A set of "used" installation diskettes
for Microsoft's "Excel" was selling for $24.95. And so on. There is little
enforcement of laws supposedly stopping this.

* There is no ipso facto reason why a book publisher could not require as a
condition of sale that no resales, rental, or lendings occur with the
publisher's permission. In fact, some have argued for this.

* If the courts intervene to say such restrictions are not allowable, how
can such restrictions exist for software? (Sure, the usual and tired
"replicability" argument. But a publisher and author are "losing" just as
much when a bestseller is rented or lent out a dozen times instead of
generating sales....)

In closing, it's all a hodge podge. Books are just bits. Saying one set of
bits may be lent out, but another set may not is not a stable solution.

And we all know what cyberspace is doing to all of these points.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 12:11:39 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:11:39 +0800
Subject: Impossible Analysis Paper at Crypto98
In-Reply-To: <199809110124.VAA25687@dewdrop2.mindspring.com>
Message-ID: <199809110813.BAA09626@netcom13.netcom.com>

a proof that you have an unbreakable cypher has a lot
of implications to the P=?NP question. if the analysis
is novel and elegant, than it might very well leads to
insights into P=?NP of computer science.

From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 12:35:09 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:35:09 +0800
Subject: SNET: [FP] Alaska: Nearly 93% of new parents choose Enumeration At Birth (EAB)
Message-ID: <199809110836.BAA11054@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: "ScanThisNews"  (by way of jeremy.compton at stonebow.otago.ac.nz (Jeremy Compton))
Subject: SNET: [FP] Alaska: Nearly 93% of new parents choose Enumeration At Birth (EAB)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 01:37:30 +1200
To: snetnews at world.std.com

->  SNETNEWS  Mailing List

======================================================================
SCAN THIS NEWS
9/10/98

This article actually ran in '96, but it is worth reviewing.

======================================================================

Press release from Alaska's Department of Health and Social Services
found at: http://health.hss.state.ak.us/htmlstuf/com/pr/media.htm

Electronic Birth Certificates and Social Security Cards at Birth Make Life
Easier For Parents

Februrary 6, 1966 (sic)

The Alaska Department of Health and Social Services Bureau of Vital
Statistics reports that the Electronic Birth Certificates (EBC) have been
installed in all but three of Alaska's hospitals. In a little over a two
year time period, the Bureau has gone from no electronic birth certificates
to nearly 99% of all Alaska hospital births coming to the Bureau in
electronic format. "Innumerable man-hours have been saved at both ends of
the registration process," said Al Zangri, Chief of the Bureau. In
addition, in cooperation with state-wide hospitals, the Bureau has
implemented the Social Security Administration's Enumeration At Birth (EAB)
program statewide during 1995. The Enumeration at Birth program allows
parents to request a social security number for their newborn through the
birth registration process. This program has proven to be so popular with
new parents that nearly 93% of all births transmitted to the Bureau request
a social security number.

=======================================================================
-----Original Message-----
From: Katherine A.
Sent: Thursday, Sep. 10, 1998
=======================================================================
Reply to: 
=======================================================================
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->  Posted by: "ScanThisNews"  (by way of jeremy.compton at stonebow.otago.ac.nz (Jeremy Compton))

From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 12:35:10 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:35:10 +0800
Subject: IP: The big blackout?
Message-ID: <199809110836.BAA11018@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: "Douglas E. Renz" 
Subject: IP: The big blackout?
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 15:50:53 -0400
To: "'Chris Ball'" <1stlight at mail.tds.net>, "'En_Agape'" , "'Kim/Jr'" , "'Kristen'" , "'Steve Cortese'" , "'Tom Young'" 

September 7, 1998

The big blackout?

Regardless of your own Y2K preparedness, the slow-moving electrical industry
could leave you in the dark
By Blaise Zerega

Companies scrambling to bring their computer systems into year-2000
compliance may discover that their time and effort will be for naught. A
lack of preparedness by North America's electrical industry may pull the
plug on many companies' transition plans.

Although many electric companies have already begun addressing year-2000
compliance, some have not. It was only in June that the first industrywide
efforts got under way, which may not leave enough time for testing and
contingency planning, according to experts.

"I can't tell you overall how we stand. Based on the information we receive,
we'll build contingency plans off that," said Jon Arnold, chief technology
officer of the Edison Electric Institute (EEI), a trade organization in
Washington that represents companies supplying roughly 75 percent of North
America's electricity.

The North American Electric Reliability Council (NERC) will present the
first industry report on year-2000 readiness to the Department of Energy
(DOE) on Sept. 14, with public release slated for Sept. 17. Until the
publication of this report, serious questions about the capability of power
companies to generate, transmit, and distribute electric power -- and the
consequences for IT system and business disruptions -- will abound.

Industry experts point to the electric system's interconnectedness as the
potential source of most problems. North America is divided into three
interconnected power grids, which are made up of electric generating,
transmitting, and distribution companies. These thousands of companies
compose a high-level network that is only as strong as its weakest segment.

"If you have a failure in one place, it can affect the power delivery in
many places," said Stephanie Moore, an analyst at the Giga Information
Group, a research company in Westport, Conn.

The risk posed by interconnectedness is made worse by deregulation. For
example, a California company purchasing power from a Tennessee company may
not receive it because of a transmission problem in Kansas.

Unfortunately, companies have very few alternative power options, analysts
say. Large companies should investigate on-site power generation, largely
from generators, while small companies with limited resources might resort
to candles and a return to paper -- until power is restored and IT systems
brought back up.

"The truth is, I don't have any good advice," said Rick Cowles, director of
industry year-2000 solutions at Tava Technologies, in Penn's Grove, N.J.

Many companies have been slow to tackle the year-2000 risks of their power
supply, concentrating instead on their internal computing systems, analysts
said.

A large Fortune 200 manufacturer in the Midwest is taking this risk
seriously, but has yet to cement a plan to manage the risk. The manufacturer
has more than 50 worldwide locations and is urging its local facilities to
contact their electricity suppliers immediately.

"As we start to develop insight to what those providers are capable of,
we'll draw that into business continuity and contingency planning," the
manufacturer's year-2000 project leader said.

Other companies such as credit card provider Household International will
use in-house resources to meet the possibility of power disruption.

"All our major facilities are being prepared to handle any external or
internal failure, [by] having back-up generator and back-up diesel
capability," said Thomas Wilkie, Household International's director of risk
management, in Prospect Heights, Ill.

For now, companies have to wait while the electric power industry as a whole
undertakes the critical steps of gaining and sharing information.

"We can't answer questions on preparedness at this point," said Gene
Gorzelnik, director of communications at NERC, in Princeton, N.J.

NERC is compiling results of questionnaires sent in June to the 200 largest
North American power companies, and to four trade associations representing
3,000 distribution companies. Results will be included in the industry
report delivered to the DOE in September. NERC will follow the report with a
coordination of preparedness plans and scenario analysis ending in July
1999, and a coordination of precautionary operations during the year-2000
transition.

Although NERC and the EEI expect the September DOE report to be positive
generally, it is not clear whether "mom and pop" distributors or large
electric utilities -- generally thought to be more vulnerable -- present a
greater risk.

"In a lot of cases, you can't make the assumption that mom and pops are
going to be the problem, because the larger companies tend to have a lot of
automation," the EEI's Arnold said.

Another risk in need of assessment is the nuclear power industry. According
to the Nuclear Energy Institute, a trade organization in Washington, the
United States depends on nuclear power to generate 22 percent of its
electricity.

"You can't talk about [year 2000] and electricity without including the
nuclear power industry," Cowles said.

In June, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) sent a letter the 108 U.S.
nuclear power plants advising the industry of year-2000 risks and requesting
a detailed written statement of readiness by July 1, 1999.

Much like the NERC effort, the NRC information-gathering is a good first
step, but one that leaves companies considering contingency plans in limbo.

"My advice is wait for the [industry] reports and strike up a dialogue with
your utility at the local level," Arnold said.

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From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 12:35:12 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:35:12 +0800
Subject: IP: [FP] Smart Cards -- Public Acceptance?
Message-ID: <199809110836.BAA10995@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: "ScanThisNews" 
Subject: IP: [FP] Smart Cards -- Public Acceptance?
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 22:07:48 -0500
To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com

======================================================================
SCAN THIS NEWS
9/9/98

=======================================================================

New Poll: 76% Indicate Interest in Smart Cards

 SAN FRANCISCO--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Sept. 9, 1998--

 Smart Card Forum research study seeks keys to market success, ways to
bridge the gap between early adopters and the mainstream consumer market

 The Smart Card Forum (SCF), a multi-industry organization working to
accelerate the widespread acceptance of smart card technology, today
announced some initial top-line poll results of a qualitative and
quantitative research study it has commissioned. A detailed analysis of the
comprehensive study will be finalized in tandem with the Forum's Work Group
meetings this November in Florida.

 The Forum is attempting to better understand what North American consumers
would like in a smart card that they could carry around with them that
stores information or value (or both) from various applications (e.g.,
health care, insurance, banking, loyalty programs). These applications are
just some of what a smart card can do (the technology has many more
applications), but a study of how consumers perceive them will help the
industry better understand the potential size and shape of the future market
for smart card technology.

 "The smart card is a very exciting and powerful emerging technology," says
Forum President William J. Barr. "To extend its promise into the mainstream
commercial marketplace means understanding and then delivering what
consumers want. After all, it's a basic marketing premise that you have to
understand the public's needs before you can deliver a solution that will
win their support and loyalty. Previous Forum market research has shown
consumer interest in our industry; this next wave of research is designed to
provide us with more specific information that we can apply to the task of
introducing smart cards to the broadest possible consumer audience."

 FIND/SVP, a nationally known New York-based research and consulting firm,
was asked by the Forum to design the research study to capture consumer
perceptions of smart cards and the keys to their acceptance and use. To do
this, they designed a qualitative (14 focus groups) and quantitative
(telephone survey of 2,400) research study(a) conducted in the United States
and Canada. It was tightly focused to determine certain attributes of smart
cards, which applications would be supported and why, plus servicing,
branding, and pricing issues.

 For the purposes of the research, a very specific "smart card concept" was
developed and tested. It was described as a "card-sized unit with a memory
that can hold just about any kind of information but requires some sort of
reader to input or output data." Among the research findings:

- three quarters of those polled (76%) said they were "extremely," "very" or
"somewhat" interested in the smart card concept; about one-third (31%) were
"very" or "extremely" interested

- of the 31% "very" or "extremely" interested, the majority said that they
would "definitely want" smart cards for applications such as med-alert
information (74%); health insurance ID (62%); ATM and related bank access
(59%); drivers licenses (56%); and credit cards (53%)

- the most interested group were, in general, willing to pay up to $50 to
obtain a smart card, and a $25 annual fee to maintain the card

- that same group carried far more cards in their wallets than those not
interested (6.3 cards vs. 3.9 cards)

- those most interested fit the profile of early technology adopters:
younger, higher income, own a PC, etc.

- convenience and security were seen as key motivating factors for adoption

 "These initial results reveal a number of interesting things we didn't know
before," says Barr. "First, smart cards -- as they were conservatively
described in the research -- have a potential core early-adopter
constituency to start with of about a third of the population. Second, some
of the applications a smart card can enable are easily understood and
appreciated by that segment of the population. That's good news for the
industry, because it is the use of smart cards for each of these individual
things that will collectively increase the momentum towards
multiple-application smart card interoperability and ubiquity."

Interest in smart cards.

 All focus group respondents expressed interest in the "smart card concept."
It should be noted that these groups were pre-screened to eliminate
"technophobes," and participants developed concepts themselves, so higher
levels of enthusiasm for smart card technology were to be expected.

 However, approximately three-quarters of those polled in the telephone
survey said they were either "somewhat," "very" or "extremely" interested in
the smart card concept. About a quarter were not interested.

 Who are most interested in the idea of smart cards?

 The research discovered that those interested in smart cards - compared to
those "not interested" in the concept -- are:

- much more likely to have PCs, cell phones, or other high-tech devices (98%
vs. 68%) - much more likely to look forward to new technology (44% vs.
18%) - younger (38 vs. 48 years old) - have higher incomes ($54,000 vs.
$45,000) - already carrying more cards than those not interested (6.3 vs.
3.9)

 "Those numbers tell us that as an industry, we must extend our efforts
beyond the classic early adopter community and connect with the majority of
consumers who need to be educated about the many benefits to them of smart
card technology," says Barr.

 "Our ability to bridge that gap will determine the future success of our
industry."

One card to replace many.

 As designed by the focus groups, "Such a (smart) card would replace most of
what they now carried in their pockets and do other things as well. It would
not be used in addition to the cards in the wallets, but instead of those
cards."

 Of those interested in having a smart card (N=741): *T Would want only one
smart card 35% Would want two smart cards 30 Would want three smart cards 27
Would want four or more cards 6 *T One card that does many things.

 Within the qualitative phase, people were able to easily generate potential
uses for a smart card. More than 100 plausible application ideas were
generated, both for personal and for business use. These included: replacing
money and credit cards, replacing many of the cards in one's wallet, storing
records, and managing daily events.

 Of those interested the smart cards, respondents said that they would
"definitely want" them for:

Med-Alert information 74%, Health insurance ID 62, ATM and related bank
access 59, Drivers license 56, Credit cards 53, Prescription card 51, Car
information 50, Money for small purchases 48, Medical records 44, "Other" ID
39, Discount shopping cards 39, Money for larger purchases 36, Frequent
flyer information 34, "Other" membership cards 26.

 According to Barr, "we are pleased by these findings on applications,
because that's what smart cards are supposed to be all about. Smart cards
are supposed to perform lots of diverse functions, and we're pleased that
those surveyed could identify so many of them. Multi-application
interoperability is both the objective of the Smart Card Forum and the key
to unlocking the business potential of our industry."

The ideal way to distribute and control smart cards.

 A consensus emerged among those most interested in the concept about how
one would/should get and maintain a smart card:

- consumers would obtain a "starter" smart card from one of many sources,
either free or for a small fee

- they would "build" onto it by adding identification and licenses, personal
data, and credit data (among others), either free or for a small fee

- users would pay an independent service an annual fee to help maintain and
protect the card

- individual smart card-holders would allow different organizations
different levels of access to the card

Respondents disliked the idea of a single authority having access to all
their smart card key data. They accepted that in the absence of such an
authority, problems with maintaining the card, replacing it, canceling it,
etc. would become overwhelming. Accordingly, their plausible solution was
"distributed," allowing for widespread sale of smart cards at a very low
price, with the cards supported by an individual choice of one of many
independent "bonding agencies" paid monthly or annual fees for their
services. It was thought that data might also be backed up by this agency
(in encrypted form), or saved by the card's owner who would have two
versions of his/her card made.

Mild preference for adding data oneself 61%, Mild preference for having one
company to call for problems 59%, Mild preference for many suppliers 58%.

Pricing.

 In general, the research discovered that of those most interested in the
smart card concept, respondents were willing to pay up to $50 to obtain a
card, and approximately a $25 annual fee to maintain the card.

 Potential smart card users rarely envisioned a single-use card that would
be used in addition to the cards in their wallets. Rather, they were
interested in a card that would put multiple uses on a single device. The
key reasons for embracing the card thus focused heavily on convenience:
fewer things in one's wallet, fewer things to remember to carry.

 Another initial motivator might be security. A smart card can be made
significantly more secure than a normal magnetic stripe card, and when
introduced to that information, survey participants indicated that smart
cards might, by "electronically storing receipts in some way," provide
additional reassurance. The use of electronic fingerprinting (biometrics) as
proof of identity was also seen as a way to protect the security of
information stored on smart cards.

 "Security" was also interpreted as meaning medical safety and physical well
being. Accordingly, a smart card with emergency information accessible by
physicians and paramedics was also considered desirable.

 Other ways to encourage initial smart card use focused on having a smart
card doing certain things better than its "dumb" predecessor (e.g. a
"faster" or "less expensive" card). Using the card as an electronic key, to
which other applications might be added later, was also seen as a possible
benefit.

The bottom-line.

 "Using a very precise and narrow definition of a smart card, we have
discovered useful new information that we can apply as the full spectrum of
smart card applications emerges into the mainstream commercial environment,"
says Barr. "This is just the beginning of our industry's efforts to learn
about how we can connect with and educate consumers whose interest in smart
card technology increases in relation to the information they have about
it."

 The Smart Card Forum (www.smartcardforum.org) is a non-profit, multi-
industry organization of 200 members working to accelerate the widespread
acceptance of multiple application smart card technology by bringing
together, in an open forum, leading users and technologists from both the
public and private sectors.

NOTES:

- The "qualitative" aspect of this study comprised a set of 14 focus groups
that were conducted in four US cities (New York City, NY; Chicago, IL; San
Francisco, CA; and Jacksonville, FL), and two Canadian cities (Guelph and
Toronto, ON).

- The "quantitative" aspect comprised a much larger and more "projectable"
sample of 2,400 American and English-speaking Canadian citizens aged 18 and
over who completed a structured telephone interview. Respondents were
capable of using a smart card (e.g., had some other form of "plastic" card
or checking accounts) but otherwise were randomly selected.

CONTACT:
Megan McDonnell
Environics Communications
1 (203) 325-8772, #14
mmcdonnell at environics-usa.com
or
Karen Silberman
Smart Card Forum
1 (703) 610-9023
help at smartcardforum.org

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From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 12:35:24 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:35:24 +0800
Subject: IP: [FP] FW: CA Fingerprinting legislation
Message-ID: <199809110836.BAA11006@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: "ScanThisNews" 
Subject: IP: [FP] FW: CA Fingerprinting legislation
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 22:12:08 -0500
To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com

======================================================================
SCAN THIS NEWS
9/9/98

[Forwarded message]
======================================================================
Fr:	Jon Golinger, CALPIRG
Re:	Wrap-up on Bank Fingerprinting/Biometrics Legislation in California
this year
Date:	9/9/98

As you know, there was significant activity in the State Legislature this
year surrounding the use of fingerprints and other biometric identifiers
by banks and commercial entities.  This is an effort to summarize what
happened this year and solidify a coalition to work together on these
issues next year and in years to come.

There were two main bills introduced to address the
fingerprinting/biometrics issue - SB 1622 by Senator Steve Peace, which
would have prohibited banks from fingerprinting customers, and AB 50 by
Assemblyman Kevin Murray, which would have created some guidelines for
the use of fingerprints and other biometrics in the commercial sector. 
Neither piece of legislation passed this year.

SB 1622, backed by CALPIRG, the Privacy Rights Clearinghouse, ACLU, Ralph
Nader, and others, was approved by the State Senate and the Assembly
Judiciary Committee.  Opposed by the California Bankers Association and
some law enforcement officials, the bill was voted down in the Assembly
Banking Committee in early August and remained there for the rest of the
year.

AB 50, backed by the California Bankers Association and some law
enforcement officials, was heavily amended and approved by just one
Committee, the Senate Judiciary Committee, after extensive negotiations. 
Opposed by Nader, ACLU, CALPIRG, Privacy Rights Clearinghouse, and the
California Reinvestment Committee, AB 50 was expected to pass but was
pulled from the Senate Floor and killed by leadership the day before the
session ended.

So, the status quo leaves many California banks still fingerprinting
customers and the potential for other commercial uses of biometrics very
much an open question.  However, the banks and their allies failed to
close the door on this issue by passing the weak "consumer protections"
in AB 50 that would have effectively paved the way for fingerprinting and
biometrics in a variety of commercial situations and made it difficult to
pass consumer-friendly legislation in the future.

This issue will surely be the subject of legislation next year.  I
believe that it would be in the interests of those concerned about
privacy, discrimination, and "Big Brother" issues related to this subject
to begin discussions or meetings before the new legislative session
begins about a plan for the coming year.  We may also want to consider
establishing a "Privacy Coalition" to work on these and related issues as
they arise.  I will be in touch with interested groups and individuals
about this in the coming weeks.

We can be certain of one thing:  the banks and their allies will be back.
 So will we.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jon L Golinger [mailto:calpirg.golinger at juno.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 1998 2:56 PM
To: mcdonald at networkusa.org
Subject: CA Fingerprinting legislation

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From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 12:35:49 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:35:49 +0800
Subject: IP: Looming Y2k Crisis
Message-ID: <199809110836.BAA11030@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: "Douglas E. Renz" 
Subject: IP: Looming Y2k Crisis
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 15:53:12 -0400
To: "'Chris Ball'" <1stlight at mail.tds.net>, "'En_Agape'" , "'Kim/Jr'" , "'Kristen'" , "'Steve Cortese'" , "'Tom Young'" 

   36 Seemingly Innocuous Questions That Pry the Truth
  Out of Managers and Programmers Regarding the Year 2000
   (Y2K) Problem and Their Organization's Looming Crisis

                   (c) Gary North, 1997
                 http://www.garynorth.com

The author hereby gives permission to any reporter,
columnist, or journalist to e-mail a copy of this report
to any colleague in the profession.

                       INTRODUCTION

     The Year 2000 (Y2K) Problem is real.  If it weren't,
Chase Manhattan Bank would not have budgeted between $200
million and $250 million to solve it.

     Nobody knows what the fallout will be.  My Web site
offers summaries and links to documents posted all over
the Web.  But there are so many potential falling dominoes
that nobody can predict most of what's going to happen.

     We will be hit from all sides without warning.
Things that nobody is thinking about today will be
disrupted.  For example, the water-control locks on the
Panama Canal are controlled by a mainframe computer
system.  Jimmy Carter and Congress signed away the Canal
back in 1977.  It goes to Panama on January 1, 2000.  Will
the U.S. government fund this Y2K repair?  (Ha!)  If not,
what happens to the canal in 2000?  What happens to
shipping?  The government is not discussing this.

     Dominoes.  Nothing but dominoes.  Maybe you can find
some interesting ones locally.

     I have set up a closed discussion forum on my Web
site for reporters who are working on Y2K assignments.
You can post messages to each other.  Maybe it will help.
If you find an interviewing strategy that works better
than what I suggest here, let me know.  Meanwhile. . . .

          I.  EXPECT TO BE STONEWALLED OR MISLED

     This reporting assignment is easier for women.  The
company's PR department will assume that a woman doesn't
know anything technical.  The manager or PR flak may be
less guarded.  If you're a woman who majored in English
lit, let the public relations people know this early.

     For general background, read the cover story of
NEWSWEEK (June 2).  This is an accurate account.  If
anything, it is overly subdued.  You need to know what is
at stake internationally before you begin research on how
the Millennium Bug will affect your community.

     My report is no cure-all.  A well-informed manager is
going to be paranoid about a story on Y2K and his
organization.  You have to hope you wind up interviewing a
manager or spokesman who really doesn't understand the
problem.  The closer you get to the truth, the more that a
careful manager will raise his "deflector shields."

     "We cannot divulge any proprietary information."
     "Our contractor is in charge of this project."
     "No, he cannot speak with you about this."
     "Our vendors are taking care of this."
     "No, we cannot supply their names."
     "We are on schedule: late 1998."

     When you hear any of these, be assured: you're onto
something important.  To get the full story, you must now
earn your paycheck.

     You can invoke the time-honored, "We want you to have
an opportunity to tell your side of the story."  You may
choose to hand him a photocopy of the NEWSWEEK article.
"This paints a pretty glum picture.  I had hoped to find
out if things really are as bad as this report indicates.
If your organization is on top of this problem, I would
like to be able to report this to our readers."  You can
gently make it clear that a refusal to answer questions
will make the company's situation look bad -- maybe worse
than it really is.  If you can't get access to a
programmer, keep asking the spokesman questions, even if
you get "no comment" to all of them.  Write each refusal
down in your notebook.  This will make him nervous.

     The most important Y2K-threatened organizations in
your community are the public utilities: water/sewers,
natural gas, and above all, electricity (the national
power grid is at risk).  You could do a powerful series of
articles on just these.  They can't stonewall you as
easily as a private firm can.  They are politically
controlled.  You can go to members of the public utilities
commission, tell them they you're being stonewalled, and
ask for help.  Ultimately, public utilities commission
members will become personally liable if the system goes
down and they knew about it in advance.  You can even
print out two or three of the documents I've posted on my
Web site under "Litigation."  Hand these print-outs to one
or more of the PUC's members.  My site's address is:

http://www.garynorth.com

     A member of a public utility commission is at great
personal risk if he lies or deliberately misleads the
public, and then a disaster takes place.  Call it
"Chernobyl syndrome."  Ask one or more of them to run
interference for you.  You want the interview.

     If you absolutely can't get access to a programmer at
a public utility, print out a copy of this report and hand
it to every member of the public utilities commission.
Tell them they had better get these questions answered for
themselves, and soon.

     I know of only one detailed local Y2K study that is
easily available: the report on North Platte, Nebraska,
written by three Creighton University economics
professors.  I have posted it on my site under
"Government."  A front-page story on Dick Brich, the
programmer in charge of the county's computer system,
appeared in the May 1, 1997 issue of USA TODAY.

     To understand the programming problem, you need a
standard for comparison.  Here is a good one.  Social
Security has had 400 programmers working since 1991 to fix
its system, which has 30 million lines of code.  The SSA
discovered the problem in 1989.  As of 1997, the system is
still noncompliant.  (See my Web site's category,
"Government.")  Use Social Security your benchmark.

                 II.  WHAT IS THE THREAT?

     You should assume that the spokesman or manager who
has consented to be interviewed has no idea of what is
involved technically in a Y2K repair.  He does not know
how long it will take.  Neither does anyone else.  Nothing
on this vast scale has ever been attempted in the
Information Technology world.

     The company probably has an official deadline:
December 31, 1998.  This has been forced on management by
the threat of post-1999 litigation: a due diligence date,
just in case the repair fails.  At least a year of testing
is necessary to verify that the repair is bug-free or at
least manageable.  The question is: Manageable by how many
people?  Kathy Adams of Social Security says that a 1%
error rate is too high.  With either 43 million or 50
million monthly checks -- she invoked both figures on
separate occasions -- either 430,000 or 500,000 phone
calls would hit the branch offices within days.  It would
overload the SSA's system, she says.  (Her estimate is
just for month one.  What if these complaints all not
taken care of, and another 1% error rate happens again
next month?  SSA will get a cascading effect -- noise,
confusion, and telephone busy signals.  Shutdown!)

     Medicare expects to pay a billion claims in 2000.
What percentage of errors would overwhelm the system,
assuming the system doesn't shut down on Jan. 1, 2000?

     But the manager who is speaking with you -- think of
him as Dilbert's boss's boss -- has not thought about any
of this.  So, he has no idea what constitutes a failed
repair, short of an absolute shutdown.  His job is to
paint a happy-face picture for you and all other
inquirers.  If the company is facing a disaster, he
doesn't want you to find out, assuming that anyone in the
company has warned him, which is doubtful.

     Everyone in the company has an incentive to lie.
Dilbert is paid to write code.  He does not make waves.
Meanwhile, his boss is threatened with getting fired if he
tells senior management, "I can't get this project
finished on schedule.  The system will crash."  The boss
says his team in on schedule.  Who can check up on him to
find out if he's behind schedule?  Nobody in management.
He collects his pay until December 31, 1999, at which time
he turns into Maxwell Smart: "Sorry about that."

     Senior managers desperately want to believe the IT
department, so they don't ask further questions.  They
hope that all their competitors are in the same condition,
which is surely the case.  This is why bond-rating
services have refused to downgrade any organization's
bonds because of Y2K risks.  They're all equally at risk.

     III.  ASSESSING THE ORGANIZATION'S VULNERABILITY

     Here are the Six Fundamental Questions:

     1.   "In what ways is your system is dependent on
          dates?"  (It's is a soft-core version of this:
          "If you fail to fix this, what happens?")
     2.   "When did the company find out about Y2K?"
     3.   "At what stage is the repair: inventory,
          assessment, code-fixing, testing [ha!]?"
     4.   "How many lines of code are in the system?"
     5.   "How many programmers are working on it?"
     6.   "What is your deadline to begin testing?"

     It is a standard estimate that a skilled programmer
with a date-search software tool ("silver bullet") can
correct about 100,000 lines of code a year.  This number
is crucial to your final story.  If you can find out how
many lines of code the organization must correct and the
number of programmers working full-time on the repair, you
can estimate whether there is any chance they will get the
problem fixed.  By this I mean the local computer.  This
does not solve the ultimate problem: integrating a
repaired computer with other computers, which, if not
repaired, or repaired with a different approach, will send
bad data into the first computer, ruining the repair.
(There is no agreed-upon standard for Y2K repairs; every
programming team is on its own, all over the world.)

     Be generous.  Let's say that the programmers are all
hot-shots.  Let's say they can fix on average 10,000 lines
a month.  Multiply this by the number of months left until
the universally agreed-upon date for the beginning of
testing: December 31, 1998.  Then multiply this number by
the number of programmers.  This will tell you if the
outfit has a chance of meeting the deadline for testing.
If the programmers miss the deadline -- and in 85% of all
large-scale code revision projects, they do -- then this
outfit the equivalent of the Titanic.  Do you think that a
program that's at least 500 times more complex than your
word processor can be re-coded by a committee and not
suffer a crash or a major glitch the first time it's run?
They had better test it.  What happens if they don't have
time?  Second, what happens if the test crashes the new
system?  The Jan. 1, 2000 deadline is a brick wall.

     Normally, 40% of a Y2K repair budget must be
allocated for testing.  This means 40% of the time budget
unless proven otherwise.  It may be higher in complex
systems -- above 100 million lines of code.  The spokesman
may tell you the truth about the Y2K discovery date if
he's proud of it: 1995 or early 1996.  Keep thinking
"Social Security."  They found out in 1989, got started on
the repair in 1991, and it's still not compliant.

     "Which stage?"  He may not know at which stage their
repair team is.  If he does know, he may not want to tell
you.  Maybe the programmer in charge will, if he doesn't
think it's privileged information.  So, your goal is to
get the spokesman to turn you over to the senior
programmer -- or, better yet for information purposes, a
subordinate programmer, who probably has no idea of the
sensitivity of the information he possesses.

         IV.  DETOUR: "PACKAGED SOFTWARE SOLUTION"

     I don't count these among the 36 questions.  The
spokesman may tell you that they will soon buy a packaged
system.  If you were conducting this interview in 1992,
this might make sense.  Today, it's too late.  Packaged
systems for highly complex, highly customized software are
very expensive to buy and very time-consuming to
implement.  A packaged system is no panacea today.

     The problem is this: How can they port their old data
and operations to the new, date-compliant software?  This
job takes years.  (Some consultants say that it's now too
late to repair code in the old systems.  I'm of this
opinion.  But is there enough time to design and implement
a replacement system?  Management hasn't a clue.)

     He may tell you that they are switching to a
client/server system.  Ask how much the old system cost.
Unfortunately, he may have no idea.  The new system had
better cost at least five times as much, given the
difference in prices (inflation).  If the new figure isn't
at least five times higher than the old one, the company
doesn't understand the magnitude of the complexity of the
old system and the difficulty of switching.  (On this
point, I was advised by Cory Hamasaki, a full-time Y2K
programmer.  For his voluminous Web postings, as well as
his humor, search "Hamasaki" on www.dejanews.com )

[Side Note: in a July 2, 1997, letter to me, Hamasaki
reported on the U.S. government's present Y2K status.  He
lives near Washington.  "Everywhere I checked last year,
they said that they were either working on it or had
solved the problem.  This year, the same places are saying
that it'll be tough, but they're having meetings and are
doing their planning.  What will they say next year?  I
expect that they will finally be past denial, and the
screaming and scape goating will begin."]

     If he says they plan to outsource the job to India or
Ireland, ask: "Do you have a contract with the software
repair company yet?"  These companies are now booked up or
are close to it.  The shortage of mainframe programmers is
real, though not yet an insurmountable problem.  It will
become insurmountable in 1999.  A WASHINGTON POST story
predicts a U.S. shortage of 500,000 to 700,000.  Another
estimate places England's at 300,000.  (I have posted this
information on my Web site under "Too Late?")

     If the company has "outsourced" the project, request
an interview with the contracting firm's project manager.
If he says no, then you're onto something.  But if you
can't get additional information, the interview will be
much harder.  You will have to interview the person inside
the local outfit who serves as the technical liaison.

           V.  HOW TO GET ACCESS TO A PROGRAMMER

     After you ask the spokesman about the date they
discovered the problem, ask him a technical question that
seems to be important to you, but which is actually
designed to get him to let you get your interview with a
programmer.  I suggest this question:

     7.   "Which method of dealing with the problem
          have you chosen: encapsulation, windowing,
          or expansion?"

     He won't know.  It's a purely technical question.
Nobody with decision-making capacity in management would
know the answer.  So, his ego isn't involved if he says he
doesn't know the answer.  You must now press politely but
firmly him allow you to interview a programmer.

     What if he asks why you want to know?  Answer: "So
that I can estimate how their repair will integrate with
the repairs made by other firms in your industry."

     You do, in fact, need to know this.  This, in fact,
is the crucial Y2K issue.  Any repair of one system that
fails to integrate with the industry's other newly
repaired systems will either: (1) kick the local computer
out of the system or (2) bring down the whole system.  If,
for example, the banks don't get together on their fixes,
you and I will not be getting paid for our brilliant
writing skills in 2000 and beyond.  (Sad, but true.)

     If the spokesman thinks you're interested mainly in
techie-type information, he may leave you alone with a
programmer.  That's your goal.  If he insists on being in
attendance, you must ask questions that seem to be merely
technical, but which will get the programmer to tell you
facts that will enable you to estimate whether the
organization is going to make it.

                VI.  YOU AND THE PROGRAMMER

     The lower on the hierarchy he is, the less he knows
about what constitutes sensitive information.  Even if the
PR flak knows, he may be hesitant to tell the guy to shut
up.  He may not want to appear to be stonewalling.

     The more information you can get early, the less
vulnerable you'll be to a "no further questions"
announcement.  That's why your early questions should be
more technical.  They will seem innocuous.

     Ask the programmer about windowing, expansion, and
encapsulation.  The guy will know.  Ask him why they
adopted their approach.  The answer may or may not be
comprehensible.  Let him talk.  It loosens his tongue.
(OK, OK: loosens HER tongue.  This is no time to worry
about political correctness.)  He's in his element.

     8.   Ask to see some of the code.  It will be
          gobbledegook to you.  But ask to see it.

     9.   Ask the guy to tell you what he has to do to
          change a date.  Sit next to him at his screen
          and watch how he does it.  This will give you an
          education.  Also, it puts him in his element.
          He's more relaxed.  He's in charge.  Meanwhile,
          the spokesman is as clueless as you are.

     If possible, conduct the rest of the interview while
the programmer is staring at his screen.  It will give him
confidence.  Look at his screen or your notebook as much
as you can.  A lot of eye contact may make him nervous.

     You're after information about the number of lines of
code in the system.  Ask him:

     10.  "Would you have adopted either of the other
          approaches if you had been facing a system
          with fewer lines of code?"

     Let him talk code.  He feels more secure.  Then ask:

     11.  "How many lines of code are in the system?"

     If the spokesman doesn't intervene here, you've got a
story.  If it's 5 million lines or more, the outfit is in
big trouble.  It's a huge, complex system.

     Now you want to find out how many programmers are
working on it full-time.  Ask (12).  He might even tell
you.  Next:

     13.  "When did you begin the actual code
          repair?"

     If he says that they're still in the assessment or
inventory stage, this outfit is dead.  Management just
doesn't know it yet.  Any programming team that is not
actively repairing code today will be incapable of
finishing the job by 2000.  You will want to visit my Web
site for confirmation.  Read the California White Paper.

     Once you have the Six Fundamental Questions answered,
you can begin to evaluate the company's actual condition.
The spokesman may not know how to put all this information
together.  In fact, he probably doesn't know.  He may not
even see what you're up to when you ask about which stage
the repair is in.  If he does, he may invoke "proprietary
information."  Keep going: you're now after "no comments."

           VII.  ASSESSING THE TASK'S COMPLEXITY

     14.  "I've heard that there are more languages
          embedded in a system than just COBOL.  How
          many have you come across?

     Some systems will have 20 other languages.  Assembler
is one of the monsters.  Find out if any of the system is
written in Assembler.  (Most of the IRS's system is in
Assembler.  The IRS told Congress in June of 1997 that it
needs $258 million in 1998 to repair its system.  The IRS
may not get this money, given its admission in January,
1997, of its 11-year, $4 billion failure to consolidate
its system into one.  Interesting?)  Then ask:

     15.  "How difficult will it be to keep all of
          the languages and programs in this system
          to remain integrated after you've made the
          necessary date changes in the code?

     One major problem is the compiler: a piece of
software that fits all parts of the system together.  The
compiler that the original programmer used to build the
system was not designed to handle 4-digit dates.  It may
not have been updated -- in fact, probably has not been
updated.  The company that made it may be out of business.
So, if he mentions "compiler," pursue the matter, but
don't mention it first.  Remember, you're ignorant.

     Now go for the jugular.  You must play the "please
help me to understand all this" role.  You just don't
understand.  You had better hope that the flak doesn't
either, if he's still sitting in the room.

     What you're after here is information regarding the
vulnerability of this organization.  Which kind of dates
can blow up the system and why?  He won't tell you if he
thinks you're looking for bombs, but he'll tell a whole
lot if he thinks he's your new-found mentor.

     If you're looking at the screen or a print-out of
indecipherable code, look helpless.  Always look helpless.
You may even ask the spokesman to sit closer.  Let this
become a joint-learning experience.

     16.  "You use dates in your computer software
          and in old data records.  How do you or
          your software tools find them?"

     He probably won't volunteer that there are hidden
dates in the system's programs.  Dates are hidden in
subroutines that his "silver bullet" can't find.  Finding
these is a very difficult, time-consuming task.  Ask:

     17.  "Can the tool you use automatically find
          every date in the code?"

     It can't.  There is no such thing as a true silver
bullet.  This is why the task is so painstaking.

     18.  "How do you spot dates if they're not visible?"

     Find out.  He may tell you about the screwball names,
such as some old girlfriend's first name, that the
original programmer used to identify his clever,
undocumented code.  I emphasize "undocumented."  Ask:

     19.  "Do you have the original documentation in
          front of you when you do the search?"

     If he says the company doesn't have it (which is
probably the case), you've hit pay dirt.  Don't let your
face show it.  Say, "Boy, that must make your work hard."
It does.  Let him whine about it a bit.  Next:

     20.  "I'm having trouble understanding all this.
          Am I interpreting this correctly?  Is the
          problem that all of these dates are stored
          as mm/dd/yy or in any other combination
          that has yy instead of yyyy?"

     This is indeed the problem.  The fate of the world's
economy hinges on the solution to it.  Then ask:

     21.  "If your dates are not already in the yyyy
          format, do you have to go in and add the
          extra 2 digits, line by line, through the
          entire system, including all of the old
          data files?"

     Let him explain this to you.  Then. . . .

     22.  "Is it true that when you rewrite a single
          line of code, this can have unpredictable
          repercussions in other parts of the
          system?"

     Here is the terrifying truth -- a truth that
literally threatens the survival of our economy.  If a
programmer makes a date change in one line of code, this
can have unforeseen repercussions -- always bad --
anywhere else in the system.  This is why final testing is
crucial.  It is also why final testing will crash many
systems.  Then the team will have to start over: search
all of the lines of code for non-date anomalies (no date-
locating silver bullet tool can help here), rewrite the
affected code, and test again.  The system may crash
again.  It probably will crash again.  Time will be
running out.  All this testing, fixing, and re-testing
must be done in 1999.  This assumes that firms actually
meet the formal deadline for testing: December 31, 1998.

     This is why Chase Manhattan Bank (200m lines of
code), Citicorp (400m lines) and AT&T (500m lines) have
problems.  So do you and I if we expect the economy to
stay afloat after Dec. 31, 1999.

     23.  "If one change can crash the system, do you
          have to check every line of code in every
          program to insure that if a date is being
          used, it can accept the new date format?"

     He had better say yes.  If he says his "silver
bullet" tool can help him do this, fine, but he is still
limited to about 100,000 lines of code a year.  Ask him
how many lines of code he can fix in a year (24).

     Now, you must take him into new worlds where no man
has gone before.

     25.  "How will you test the system after all of
          the dates have been changed?

     He had better tell you by parallel testing: running
data into the original program and the revised one
simultaneously, to see if the revised system crashes.

     26.  "How long will it take to test all this?"

     If he estimates anything under six months, use this
for comparison purposes with other local systems.  The
larger the program, the longer the testing period should
be.  Now, for the killer, the one that is unanswerable:

     27.  "Won't parallel [mirror] testing require
          two times your computer capacity and
          staff?"

     If the spokesman lets him answer this, he has made a
big mistake.  The rule for mainframes is "24 x 7 x 365":
all year long.  These expensive machines are run all day
at 90% capacity except for routine maintenance in non-
prime time.  Here is the Achilles Heel for all of the Y2K
repair hopes: there will not be enough excess computer
capacity -- memory, data tapes, and staff -- to run full
parallel testing if every system that must be fixed is
brought to the testing phase.  On the other hand, if there
is no shortage in capacity, then it's because very few
firms have reached the testing phase.  (This is my bet.)
Finally, if systems aren't tested in 1999, most of them
will crash or act up to the point of uselessness in 2000.

     28.  "Does your firm plan to rent computer time
          in order to run the tests?"

     If he says no, ask how they can do in-house.  If he
says yes, ask this question:

     29.  "Where will you rent the excess capacity in
          1999 if other organizations are also
          looking to rent time on mainframes?"

     By now, the guy knows that you know they can't fix
it, test it, and implement it by 2000.  You've got your
story.  Nevertheless, keep on going if you're allowed to.

     30.  "Companies rely on outside vendors for some
          of their programs.  Have your vendors
          supplied you with Y2K-compliant updates?

     31.  "Most mainframes are not Y2K compliant, and
          currently no PC is.  Will you be replacing
          all of your computer hardware as well as
          your computer software?"

     32.  "Some of the firms that you interact may
          not make the deadline.  What steps will you
          have to take to insure data you get from
          other computers is also Y2K compliant?"

                 VIII.  BACK TO MANAGEMENT

     Now you can go talk to the spokesman back in his
office.  If he let you get this far, he doesn't understand
what you've got.  Move away from discussing his firm.
Discuss the industry.  This lets him relax.

     33.  "About how many suppliers does the typical
          organization in this industry rely on?"

     34.  "Is your firm typical, approximately?"

     35.  "Has the industry discussed contingency
          plans if some of its major suppliers should
          fail to meet the Year 2000 deadline?"

     Last question (36): "Where can I get copies of
anything that the industry has released on Y2K?"  If there
isn't anything, this industry is headed for a disaster.

                        CONCLUSION

     As the year 2000 approaches, this story is going to
move toward the front page of every newspaper.  As yet,
stories on local companies have been mostly tapioca
pudding.  Reporters are accepting at face value the happy-
face, "we're on top of this" PR interviews offered by
local managers.  The articles dutifully report the story:
"Yes, there's a problem, but it's being dealt with by the
[  ] company."  Fact: the only problem being dealt with
successfully the company is the reporter problem.

     If a local public utility goes down and stays down on
January 1, 2000, the days of wine and roses will end in
your community.  The larger your community, the greater
the problem.  It is fair to give people a warning if they
are really at risk.  But if they are at risk, nobody in
authority at the local public utility will want to admit
this.  Deferral has become management's job number-one.
This strategy works because nobody in the media blows the
whistle.  Reporters (as with almost everyone else) are in
denial about Y2K.  Deferral and denial are the Tweedledum
and Tweddledee of the Year 2000 story.

* * * * * * * * * * * *

                     ABOUT THE AUTHOR

     Ph.D., history, U. of California, Riverside.
Contributor,  (1997), edited by Leon
Kappelman.  

**********************************************
To subscribe or unsubscribe, email:
     majordomo at majordomo.pobox.com
with the message:
     (un)subscribe ignition-point email at address
**********************************************
www.telepath.com/believer
**********************************************

From vznuri at netcom.com  Thu Sep 10 12:36:03 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:36:03 +0800
Subject: IP: Web-sites for Starr's report on Clinton
Message-ID: <199809110836.BAA11041@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: Jan 
Subject: IP: Web-sites for Starr's report on Clinton
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 22:14:32 -0500
To: Ignition-Point 

	IMPORTANT NOTICE!!!!!

FOX News just announced the web-sites which will have 
Starr's report on Clinton to be posted sometime tomorrow.

I hope I have these all correct!   :0
   Jan
=============================
http://www.house.gov/icreport
http://www.loc.gov/icreport
http://www.access.gpo.gov/congress/icreport
 ******=========================================*****
"Among the elementary measures the American Soviet government
 will adopt to further the cultural revolution are...
 [a] National Department of Education...the studies will be
 revolutionized, being cleansed of religious, patriotic, and
 other features of the bourgeois ideology. The students will
 be taught the basis of Marxian dialectical materialism,
 internationalism and the general ethics of the
 new Socialist society."
     - William Z. Foster,
       Toward Soviet America, 1932

"...Stage III...would proceed to a point where no state would
have the military power to challenge the progressively 
strengthened U.N. peace force...
The manufacture of armaments would be prohibited...
All other armaments would be destroyed..." 
    -Department of State publication number 7277

**********************************************
To subscribe or unsubscribe, email:
     majordomo at majordomo.pobox.com
with the message:
     (un)subscribe ignition-point email at address
**********************************************
www.telepath.com/believer
**********************************************

From mok-kong.shen at stud.uni-muenchen.de  Thu Sep 10 15:04:52 1998
From: mok-kong.shen at stud.uni-muenchen.de (Mok-Kong Shen)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 06:04:52 +0800
Subject: radio net (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <33CCFE438B9DD01192E800A024C84A19284623@mossbay.chaffeyhomes.com>
Message-ID: <35F903D8.3E787140@stud.uni-muenchen.de>

Bill Stewart wrote:
> 
> Not per se, though there _is_ still one major restriction -
> the Defense Department gets a crack at patent applications,
> so if you try to patent a crypto algorithm or crypto phone,
> they can seize and classify your patent application and
> working materials, using the excuse of "national security".
> There was a case in the late 70s where somebody tried to patent
> a wimpy analog scrambler for CB radios, and got it seized,
> and a number of patent applications that got delayed a long time.

It seems then to be advisable to apply for international patents
simultaneously. One can e.g. apply for a European patent that is 
valid for a number of countries.

M. K. Shen

From sorens at workmail.com  Thu Sep 10 15:18:59 1998
From: sorens at workmail.com (Soren)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 06:18:59 +0800
Subject: radio net
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980909005149.0081d100@mail.xroads.com>
Message-ID: <35F90842.3D783D77@workmail.com>

HyperReal-Anon wrote:

> >>>>> Soren   writes:
>
>   > What about SSB?
>
>   >> FCC regulations prohibit amateur radio services from carrying
>   >> either encrypted OR commercial traffic.
>
> SSB modulation hardly counts as encryption. (?!)
> CFR 47  says:
>
> 97.113 Prohibited transmissions.
>
> (a) No amateur station shall transmit:
>
>   (1) Communications specifically prohibited elsewhere in this part;
>
>   (2) Communications for hire or for material compensation...
>
>   (3) Communications in which the station licensee or control operator
>   has a pecuniary interest...
>
>   (4) Music using a phone emission except as specifically provided
>   elsewhere in this section; communications intended to facilitate a
>   criminal act; messages in codes or ciphers intended to obscure the
>   meaning thereof, except as otherwise provided herein; obscene or
>   indecent words or language; or false or deceptive messages, signals
>   or identification;
>
>   (5) Communications...which could reasonably be furnished
>   alternatively through other radio services.
>
> [snip]
>
> 97.117 International communications.
>
> Transmissions to a different country, where permitted, shall be made
> in plain language and shall be limited to messages of a technical
> nature relating to tests, and, to remarks of a personal character for
> which, by reason of their unimportance, recourse to the public
> telecommunications service is not justified.

  The point being that Single side band transceivers are covered by a VHF
license, and don't count as ham/amateur although the spectrum overlaps.
Morse and other archaic codes are not required. Connectivity to telephonic
land stations is available.
In the mid-80's I purchased a yacht and sailed out over the horizon.  In
the preparation stages for this I investigated the comms availability and
ran head on into the old boys/popular mechanics of the '50's crowd, that
insisted I endure their hazing ceremony and learn Morse.  Suspecting that
adding morse parsing to the deep structures of my brain would turn me into
a popular mechanic, I declined. Other alternatives existed -- one SW
solution was to type in ascii which was then translated into morse before
sending (and vice versa).  Seems several other would be Cap'n Blighs, had
the same problem.  Hence marine electronic stores started stocking SSB
transceivers, which I purchased in the form of a ham transceiver with
factory installed disabling for the US. I disabled that strap pronto, and
was able to enjoy both listening to the cruising ham tag hunters, and make
telephone calls from 5000 miles out in the Pacific (12,000 when calling
Bay of Islands net in New Zealand). I had no problem using it to discuss
work and to ship data.  Whether I was breaking the Federal Communist
Channels rules or not, I can't say.  Of course, not being a United
Socialists citizen makes this easier.  Where I come from you get the
license/call numbers when you purchase the equipment.

And while I've got your attention, on another thread entirely re:
renewable energy sources -- where I come from we use geothermal and
hydroelectric (think hoover dam), to power the country. A lot of
individuals who have steady flowing water with a good head, on their
properties, also power themselves this way.  We also use LPG and CNG to
power about 50% of our autos. I would expect that using all that
relatively cheap electricity to produce metal hydrides would make hydrogen
powered vehicles viable as well.

The Union of Socialist Americans tends to not have much in the way of
raging rivers, so there have been discussions about harnessing the moon's
energy by building tidal hydro generators.  Last I heard, the
environmentalists thought it might hurt the fishies (more than fishing for
agricultural fertilizer?), so nuclear it is.  I suspect there's more to it
than that, nuclear probably has more dick-stroking factor.

From sorens at workmail.com  Thu Sep 10 15:31:03 1998
From: sorens at workmail.com (Soren)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 06:31:03 +0800
Subject: Bits are Bits
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <35F90ADF.ED16F55B@workmail.com>

Tim May wrote:

> * Recorded music: OK to resell. OK to lend to private parties for
> noncommercial use. NOT OK to rent.

I've been to several public libraries which charge to borrow (rent?) music:
CDs, vinyl, tape, sheet.

How do they do that?  Is public the magic word?

From sorens at workmail.com  Thu Sep 10 15:44:38 1998
From: sorens at workmail.com (Soren)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 06:44:38 +0800
Subject: [Fwd: Course Ware Developer]
Message-ID: <35F90E95.BFF2B30A@workmail.com>

I'm busy,  anyone else want to make money educating people in London?

To: sorens at workmail.com
Subject: Course Ware Developer
From: Morven McLauchlan 
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 98 11:30:52 GMT
Reply-To: mm at elanguil.demon.co.uk

Dear Soren,
>
We are currently looking for a Course Ware Developer to produce all
documentation and slides etc for a data security course. This contract
position will involve 50 days of development split between 2 people. If
the presentation to the client is successful the successful candidates may
be required to conduct the actual training. They are looking to get someone
started as soon as possible and can interview very early next week.
>
The successful candidate will have  a proven track record of
his/her abilities and will need a very strong understanding of hardware /
software encryption. The training will be aimed at security and will be
formed around security standards already in place. A knowledge of NT, Unix
and Firewall would therefore be advantageous.
>
if you would be interested in hearing further details on this position,
please contact me on 01483 883315 or via E mail. Due to the deadline this
company are working to a speedy response is required. Don't forget you can
AIR MILES rewards by referring a friend or colleague to Elan.
>
I hope to hear from you shortly.
>

Morven McLauchlan
Elan Computing 01483 883308
Visit Elan's relaunched web site WWW.Elan.co.uk   

Morven McLauchlan
Elan Computing 01483 883308
Visit Elan's relaunched web site WWW.Elan.co.uk   

From rah at shipwright.com  Thu Sep 10 15:47:38 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 06:47:38 +0800
Subject: radio net
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 6:21 AM -0400 on 9/11/98, Somebody wrote:

> Actually, SSB is a modulation/broadcast *technique*.  Used by commercial
> and ham operators.

Yeah, but there are SSB radios, with the same range as ham radios, which
are, or should be, completely legal to do encryption on, among other
commercial things.

That was my point.
-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From sorens at workmail.com  Thu Sep 10 15:52:24 1998
From: sorens at workmail.com (Soren)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 06:52:24 +0800
Subject: Replay
Message-ID: <35F91060.1DA7BFC3@workmail.com>

Why isn't remailer at replay.com posting to cypherpunks?  I've sent several
and none have shown up -- rants up in smoke.

From sorens at homemail.com  Thu Sep 10 16:05:54 1998
From: sorens at homemail.com (S�ren)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 07:05:54 +0800
Subject: [Fwd: LFB Book News: EAT THE RICH]
Message-ID: <35F912F2.2C7536E@homemail.com>

This may be preaching to the choir,� but for anyone who doesn't know
about http://www.laissezfaire.org ...

To: booknews at laissezfaire.org
Subject: LFB Book News: EAT THE RICH
From: Russell Hanneken 
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 17:31:38 -0700

=================================================================
Laissez Faire Books  -  Book News  -  September 10, 1998
Please forward this message to anyone who might be interested.
=================================================================

First 350 with autographed bookplates!

A grand slam from P. J. O'Rourke, the best political humorist
since H. L. Mencken

			  EAT THE RICH
			by P. J. O'Rourke
		 (Atlantic Monthly Press, 1998)

		    HU7872 (hardcover) 246p.
		    Publisher's price: $24.00
		    Our price normally $16.95
	  SPECIAL SALE PRICE, LIMITED TIME ONLY: $14.41

(reviewed by Jim Powell)

Everything P. J. O'Rourke writes makes you smile, but I'd rate
EAT THE RICH as his best book, better even than his super-seller
PARLIAMENT OF WHORES.  The political content is very high, and
the book is loaded with great lines.  Open to a page, any page,
and you'll soon find something wonderful--not just wit, but
passion as well.

O'Rourke offers uproarious commentary about fashionable
politicians, intellectuals and dogmas in Albania, Sweden, Cuba,
Russia, Tanzania and Shanghai as well as the United States.  
A sampler:

    "I had one fundamental question about economics: Why are some
    places prosperous and thriving while others just suck?  It's
    not a matter of brains.  No part of the earth (with the
    possible exception of Brentwood) is dumber than Beverly
    Hills, and the residents are wading in gravy.  Meanwhile in
    Russia, where chess is a spectator sport, they're boiling
    stones for soup."

    "Microeconomics concerns things that economists are
    specifically wrong about, while macroeconomics concerns
    things economists are wrong about generally.  Or, to be more
    technical, microeconomics is about money you don't have, and
    macroeconomics is about money the government is out of."

    "Government does not cause affluence.  Citizens of
    totalitarian countries have plenty of government and nothing
    of anything else."

    "And technology provides no guarantee of creature comforts.
    The most wretched locales in the world are well-supplied with
    complex and up-to-date technology--in the form of weapons."

    "Nationalization does to goods and services what divorce does
    to male parents--suddenly they're absent most of the time and
    useless the rest."

    "Altruism towards strangers is mostly a sentimental and
    fleeting thing, a small check dashed off to Save the
    Children.  Twenty billion dollars worth of it is rare.  In
    the Cold War days, of course, we were giving money to
    Tanzania on the theory of: 'Pay them to be socialist so they
    won't be communist and figure out what the difference is
    later.'  But now, I'm afraid, the ugly truth is that we care
    about Tanzanians because they have cool animals."

    "The Russian stuff is no good.  Even the smallest, simplest
    items stink.  The way you use a Russian match is: After you
    strike it, you put it back in the matchbox.  It's as likely
    to work as any of the other matches in there.  In the old
    days the soda pop tasted like soap, the soap lathered like
    toilet paper, the toilet paper could be used to sand
    furniture, the furniture was as comfortable as a pile of
    canned goods, the canned goods had the flavor of a
    Solzhenitsyn novel, and a Solzhenitsyn novel got you arrested
    if you owned one."

    "How a peaceful, uncrowded place with ample wherewithal stays
    poor is hard to explain.  How a conflict-ridden, grossly
    over-populated place with no resources whatsoever gets rich
    is simple.  The British colonial government turned Hong Kong
    into an economic miracle by doing nothing."

    "So if wealth is not a world-wide round-robin of purse
    snatching, and if the thing that makes you rich doesn't make
    me poor, why should we care about fairness at all?  We
    shouldn't."

    "If we want the whole world to be rich, we need to start
    loving wealth.  In the difference between poverty and plenty,
    the problem is the poverty and not the difference.  Wealth is
    good."

As these delightful selections suggest, nobody today has a more
gifted pen than P. J. O'Rourke.  You'll love this book.

=================================================================

EAT THE RICH
HU7872 (hardcover) 246p.
Publisher's price: $24.00
Our price normally $16.95
SPECIAL SALE PRICE, LIMITED TIME ONLY: $14.41

=================================================================

How to order from Laissez Faire Books:

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If we are shipping your order to California, you must pay sales
tax.  To learn the applicable tax rate, contact us, or point your
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Russell Hanneken                              Laissez Faire Books
russell at laissezfaire.org                 http://laissezfaire.org/

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From ravage at einstein.ssz.com  Thu Sep 10 16:22:55 1998
From: ravage at einstein.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 07:22:55 +0800
Subject: Bits are Bits (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809111245.HAA10643@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:

> Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 00:47:03 -0700
> From: Tim May 
> Subject: Bits are Bits

> -- rental of software is no longer allowed (court case?)...it seems to have
> ended around 1984 or so, when the software rental place near me announced
> it could no longer rent software titles

Then I won't tell you folks about Star-Tek which rents and sells software
all around the country...

As to the other stuff...

If you really think it's ok to lend your budy your CD to listen to the
newest bands out there you should call your local musicians union.

As to books and such, call a book publisher and ask for their legal
department.

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From sorens at workmail.com  Thu Sep 10 17:02:51 1998
From: sorens at workmail.com (Soren)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 08:02:51 +0800
Subject: Freebies
Message-ID: <35F92098.F414B51E@workmail.com>

While I'm at it, here are some other entertaining and educational sites:

�Protocols
(this one is for all you conspiracy junkies)

�Revoking your SSN -or- the
proper use of form 1040

�...
and how it works in practise (usavlong)

�Want to put your money where
your mouth is?

�World's smallest political
quiz

�... and lets not
leave the whigs out of this ...

�Raisson d'etre

From ptrei at securitydynamics.com  Thu Sep 10 17:42:42 1998
From: ptrei at securitydynamics.com (Trei, Peter)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 08:42:42 +0800
Subject: [off topic] ANNOUNCE: Bay Area Cypherpunks, Sat. Sept. 12, 12-6, KPMG Mountain View
Message-ID: 

	Bill wrote:
	> KPMG is a relatively-unmarked building at the corner of
	> Middlefield Rd. and Ellis St. in Mountain View, surrounded by
Netscape.

	Reading this, I flashed on an alternate meaning for 
	a second --

	'Surrounded by netscape'... netscaping, the cyberspace
	equivalent of landscaping...

	Just an odd image.

	Peter Trei

From CTIA_Daily_News at um2.unitymail.com  Fri Sep 11 09:03:06 1998
From: CTIA_Daily_News at um2.unitymail.com (CTIA Daily News)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 09:03:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: CTIA Daily News from WOW-COM - September 11, 1998
Message-ID: <199809111559.KAA08514@mailstrom.revnet.com>

==========================================
Welcome to today's edition of the CTIA Daily News
from WOW-COM.  Please click on the icon / attachment
for the most important news in wireless communications today.

The future of your company will be announced
October 12 @ Wireless I.T.  Will you be there?

CLICK HERE NOW TO SIGN UP AND SAVE
http://www.wirelessit.com/portal.htm

Team WOW-COM
wowcom at ctia.org
===========================================
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Desc: "_CTIA_Daily_News_19980911a.htm"
URL: 

From rdl at MIT.EDU  Thu Sep 10 18:04:17 1998
From: rdl at MIT.EDU (Ryan Lackey)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 09:04:17 +0800
Subject: cypherpunks archive
Message-ID: 

(Looks like I left at about the right time...)

I'm definitely planning to bring the archive back now that it seems
worthwhile, but I'm highly tempted to move it outside the US.  I'm
giving somone a few more days trying to fix it, and if that fails,
I'll restore the drive physically.  (the problem is that my agent in
the US is being slow, and I'm a bit low on cash after moving hastily...)

Anyone have 1gb of disk space on a machine, optionally with root access,
on a machine with unmetered network access outside the US on which I
could put the archive?

I can put the archive here in AI, but I'll have to charge per megabyte,
as my t1 is metered-use :(  It would end up being something on the order of
$0.50/MB for total traffic, and unfortunately there are no good payment
systems for that kind of thing right now.
-- 
Ryan Lackey
rdl at mit.edu
http://sof.mit.edu/rdl/   <-- brought down by a flakey hd controller or drive

From nokia at mail.kmsp.com  Fri Sep 11 09:15:30 1998
From: nokia at mail.kmsp.com (nokia at mail.kmsp.com)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 09:15:30 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Eliminate your present phone bill......
Message-ID: <199809092110.CAA24580@shakti.ncst.ernet.in>

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From stuffed at stuffed.net  Fri Sep 11 09:35:23 1998
From: stuffed at stuffed.net (STUFFED NEWS DAILY)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 09:35:23 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: NEW MEGA FAST INTERFACE + 30 ULTRA HOT JPEGS AT LIGHTNING DOWNLOAD SPEED
Message-ID: <19980911071000.26675.qmail@eureka.abc-web.com>

In today's super-fast, totally revamped Stuffed
you'll find there's much more than ever before!

   IN TODAY'S ISSUE: X-RATED BASEBALL; ARMPIT
   ASS ATTRACTER; 10 BEST AND WORST THINGS A
     GUY CAN DO AFTER SEX; THE PERFECT BABE;
    THE PERFECT DUDE; BEST OF EUREKA; OCEAN
     LOVE POTION; CALIFORNIA COCK-TASTING
      PARTY; PUBLIC STRIPPING; ORGASM DRUG
                  DISCOVERED

       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/11/   <----

Welcome to  today's  issue of Stuffed. To read it you should
click on the URL above.  If it is not made clickable by your
email program  you will need to  use your mouse to highlight
the URL,  copy it and then paste it into your browser  (then
press Return).

This  email  is  never  sent  unsolicited.  Stuffed  is  the
supplement for the Eureka newsletter you subscribed to. Full
instructions on unsubscribing  are in every issue of Eureka!

       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/11/   <----

From petro at playboy.com  Thu Sep 10 18:44:33 1998
From: petro at playboy.com (Petro)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 09:44:33 +0800
Subject: Happy Fourth
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 6:11 PM -0500 9/10/98, Michael Motyka wrote:
>I'm -almost- ready to admit defeat and move on.
>
>> Did you see the part where I mention that I am (a) an ex-marine,
>IMHO Marines burn just like the rest of us wimps. They just don't scream
>as much.

	Yeah, but the part you cut was about being afraid of fire. I am
not, I respect it, but it doesn't frighten me.

>> You ever seen 3000 gallons of jet fuel burn,
>AOED the biggest fire I've seen was the fire here in CA last month. 6-8
>Million tires. Nobody had the balls to put that one out. At peak 1000X
>your jet fuel deal. Scary. Very.

	Yeah, but the 3000 gals. of waste fuel was deliberate, for training.

	Burning tires really suck. Almost impossible to get water, or any
coolant down into where the fire is burning, and the heating of the rubber
gives of some really noxious fumes.

>> 5 gals. of burning gasoline is NOT a problem.
>ISASI ( it sure as shit is ) if you're wearing it on your back.
>> 5 Gals. cooking off in a sealed container IS a problem.
>FYI 5 ounces mixed with compressed air in a metal container could easily
>be fatal.

	If you read my original post again, I talk about this very problem.

>> Fuck you.
>Yes, yes, PTMYT ( pleased to meet you too ).

	You suggested that I belong on AOL. I say again, Fuck You.

>Remember, shit draws flies. There'll just be more geniuses asking how to

	This is cypherpunks, we talk about what we want. Ask Tim.

>make noncryptographic devices. I would enjoy some crypto-tech talk.

	Ok, how about using fires as a source of entropy?

>Found any cool primitive polynomials lately? Got a good block cipher
>with a 4096 bit block size and an even bigger key space? Got some time
>to donate to actually put together some good HW/SW systems?

	Nope, not right now.

petro at playboy.com----for work related issues. I don't speak for Playboy.
petro at bounty.org-----for everthing else.      They wouldn't like that.
                                              They REALLY
Economic speech IS political speech.          wouldn't like that.

From ptrei at securitydynamics.com  Thu Sep 10 18:50:59 1998
From: ptrei at securitydynamics.com (Trei, Peter)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 09:50:59 +0800
Subject: A Cypherpunk Trial, Yes
Message-ID: 

	Graham-John Bullers [SMTP:real at EDMC.net] wrote:

	>As i'am one of persons mention in Toto's posts I
	>would just like to say I think the posts were a
	>joke.  With the help of of Vullis I was a pain to
	>the list and this was Toto's way of acknowledging
	>this To the government readers of this list,the
	>cigar was Cuban,will you put Bill in the cell with
	>Toto.

	I, too, was suprised to find myself mentioned in
	one of the postings John Young has highlighted.  I
	hadn't noticed this before, since Toto's rants
	were among the 50%+ of cpunks postings I marked as
	read without actually reading them.

	The Poster Currently Known As Toto mentioned an
	awful lot of people by name, purportedly engaged
	in all kinds of nefarious activities.  The same
	post also names Tim May, Adam Back, Declan
	McCullagh, Ulf Moller, Kent Crispen, and Blanc
	Weber. I'm let off easy, being characterized 
	as only a 'terroist [sic] InterNet forger'. 
	I think that this is because I once complained 
	when someone (possibly Toto) forged a message 
	in my name. To put it in the plainest possible
	terms: I have never in my life forged a message.

	Peter Trei

From sbryan at vendorsystems.com  Thu Sep 10 18:52:37 1998
From: sbryan at vendorsystems.com (Steve Bryan)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 09:52:37 +0800
Subject: Bits are Bits
In-Reply-To: <33CCFE438B9DD01192E800A024C84A1928463C@mossbay.chaffeyhomes.com>
Message-ID: 

>* Software: OK to resell if license allows it, if original is destroyed, if
>no copies are kept, blah blah blah. (Very complicated.) Not legal to rent
>software since around the mid-80s, when software rental stores stopped.
...
>-- rental of videos is allowed. (Why videos but not CDs? What about books
>on tape? What about books on CD, either audio or CD-ROM?)

Another weird twist in this topic is the "distinction" that is made between
video games for consoles and the same games for computers. It is legal to
rent a PSX title such as Tomb Raider but the same title ported to the PC is
not legal to rent. I read about this a few years ago in an article by Trip
Hawkins, CEO of 3DO, so maybe this information is out of date. But I have
not yet seen CD-ROMs for rent or even available to check out for home use
from the public library. I think this distinction is sometimes confused
because a publisher can choose to allow a CD-ROM title to be rentable but
has to explicitly sanction that. But a publisher of game console CD's
cannot prevent its products from being rented.

Steve Bryan
Vendorsystems International
email: sbryan at vendorsystems.com
icq: 5263678
pgp fingerprint: D758 183C 8B79 B28E 6D4C  2653 E476 82E6 DA7C 9AC5

From declan at well.com  Thu Sep 10 19:16:31 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:16:31 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
Message-ID: 

          http://cgi.pathfinder.com/netly/0,2326,201980911-14598,00.html

From ravage at einstein.ssz.com  Thu Sep 10 19:19:26 1998
From: ravage at einstein.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:19:26 +0800
Subject: Rental of PC software...
Message-ID: <199809111540.KAA11397@einstein.ssz.com>

Hi,

For those of you who believe it is completely illegal to rent PC software
should contact:

Star Techs
9222 Burnet Rd.
Austin, Tx.
512-719-4263

(sorry for the earlier mis-spelling of the name)

I'll also forward a reference regarding loaning copyrighted material and
who owns the rights to decide whether it is allowed or not.

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From whgiii at invweb.net  Thu Sep 10 19:20:20 1998
From: whgiii at invweb.net (William H. Geiger III)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:20:20 +0800
Subject: Replay
In-Reply-To: <35F91060.1DA7BFC3@workmail.com>
Message-ID: <199809111520.LAA13955@domains.invweb.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In <35F91060.1DA7BFC3 at workmail.com>, on 09/11/98 
   at 07:58 AM, Soren  said:

>Why isn't remailer at replay.com posting to cypherpunks?  I've sent several
>and none have shown up -- rants up in smoke.

So your this anonymous fellow we have been looking for. :)

- -- 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Geiger III  http://www.openpgp.net
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice
PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail.
OS/2 PGP 5.0 at: http://www.openpgp.net/pgp.html
- ---------------------------------------------------------------

Tag-O-Matic: OS/2: Your brain.  Windows: Your brain on drugs.

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From qacado1 at dallas.net  Fri Sep 11 10:37:32 1998
From: qacado1 at dallas.net (amz4 ent., inc.)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:37:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: <>
Message-ID: <199809112222GAA55723@abc.npn.net>

PROFESSIONAL CONSULTANTS

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consultants, markets a radical cutting edge  "DATA BASE"
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in turn, assisted these companies increase their sales
from 10 to 100 percent.

We are seeking a few select key individuals in specific 
geographic areas who will, in association with 
ourselves, offer our program to local companies.

A six figure income is possible in the first year, with
strong residual income in the future years.

There is an $8,250 investment.

To receive a complete package of printed information
by regular mail,  please call  our voice mail system
at:(214)984-3099 and leave your name and address.

Thank you for your time.

1-1998

From whgiii at invweb.net  Thu Sep 10 19:42:18 1998
From: whgiii at invweb.net (William H. Geiger III)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:42:18 +0800
Subject: Rental of PC software...
In-Reply-To: <199809111540.KAA11397@einstein.ssz.com>
Message-ID: <199809111542.LAA14230@domains.invweb.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In <199809111540.KAA11397 at einstein.ssz.com>, on 09/11/98 
   at 10:40 AM, Jim Choate  said:

>For those of you who believe it is completely illegal to rent PC software
>should contact:

>Star Techs
>9222 Burnet Rd.
>Austin, Tx.
>512-719-4263

>(sorry for the earlier mis-spelling of the name)

>I'll also forward a reference regarding loaning copyrighted material and
>who owns the rights to decide whether it is allowed or not.

We used to have a store here called AtoZ Software that opened up a couple
of years back. They were srtictly a software rental store and were doing
*very* good business from it. They ran into quite a bit of trouble (SPA et
al) over it. I didn't follow it too close but I don't think that they rent
software any more. :(

- -- 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Geiger III  http://www.openpgp.net
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice
PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail.
OS/2 PGP 5.0 at: http://www.openpgp.net/pgp.html
- ---------------------------------------------------------------

Tag-O-Matic: It's OS/2, Jim, but not OS/2 as we know it.

From ravage at einstein.ssz.com  Thu Sep 10 19:51:08 1998
From: ravage at einstein.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:51:08 +0800
Subject: Copyright - Who has the right to loan?
Message-ID: <199809111613.LAA11683@einstein.ssz.com>

From guy at panix.com  Thu Sep 10 19:51:21 1998
From: guy at panix.com (Information Security)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:51:21 +0800
Subject: A Cypherpunk Trial, Yes
Message-ID: <199809111551.LAA25938@panix7.panix.com>

   >   	Graham-John Bullers [SMTP:real at EDMC.net] wrote:
   >
   >   	>As i'am one of persons mention in Toto's posts I
   >   	>would just like to say I think the posts were a
   >   	>joke.  With the help of of Vullis I was a pain to
   >   	>the list and this was Toto's way of acknowledging
   >   	>this.
   >
   >    > To the government readers of this list...

Ah, yes, the good old days when Vulis was here.
---guy

*  Re: State Charges in Weaver Case
*
*  Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM (dlv at bwalk.dm.com)
*  Fri, 22 Aug 97 02:09:13 EDT
*
*  Mike Duvos  writes:
*  >
*  > Shouldn't it be ... involuntary
*  > manslaughter for using possibly excessive force against an armed
*  > attacker?
*
*  No, it should be a $100 reward for icing a motherfucking fed.
*
*  ---
*
*  Dr.Dimitri Vulis KOTM
*  Brighton Beach Boardwalk BBS, Forest Hills, N.Y.: +1-718-261-2013, 14.4Kbps

...and elsewhere in Usenet...

...soliciting funds for terrorist groups to kill a jewish couple:

#   Subject:      The final solution for the premature ejaculation problem
#   From:         shlomo at bwalk.dm.com (Rabbi Shlomo Ruthenberg)
#   Date:         1996/06/05
#   Organization: Young Israel of Red Hook
#   Newsgroups:   soc.culture.israel,soc.culture.jewish,alt.religion.islam,
#             alt.politics.white-Power,alt.2600,alt.revenge,alt.revisionism
#
#
#      As a religious Jew, I am shocked that none of: Hamas / Hizballah /
#      Party of God / Revolutionary Justice Organization / Organization
#      for the Oppressed on Earth / Islamic Jihad for the Liberation of
#      Palestine / Popular Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine
#      / Ansar Allah / Palestine Liberation Front / Followers of the
#      Prophet Muhammad / Revolutionary Organization of Socialist Muslims
#      / Fatah Revolutionary Council / Arab Revolutionary Brigades /
#      Islamic Resistance Movement / Vanguards of Conquest (whew!) have
#      gotten around porking the Jewish Fascist Yoni Kamens or his zonah
#      wife. You can help by mailing your donations (cash only) to:
#
#      Dr. Ramadan Abdullah Mohamed Shallah
#      Dr. Musa Abu-Marzuq
#      c/o Arab Republic of Palestine Mission to the United Nations
#      115 E 65 St, New York, NY 10023, tel: (212) 288-8500
#
#      Be sure to mark all envelopes "for the Yoni Kamens fund"!

From jya at pipeline.com  Thu Sep 10 19:56:22 1998
From: jya at pipeline.com (John Young)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:56:22 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <199809111556.LAA02877@dewdrop2.mindspring.com>

Good piece, Declan. Is Time getting access to the restricted
Congressional Web site which offers the Starr report early for
members only drooling? Or are the major mediums getting
preferential copies in concert with the deliberately under-provided
House/Thomas/GPO rigs?

These are the four public access sites given by the NYT today,
which notes that no one yet knows the digital format -- text,
word processor or PDF images:

    http://www.house.gov/icreport/ (House Information Resources) 

    http://www.house.gov/judiciary (House Judiciary Committee) 

    http://thomas.loc.gov/icreport/ (Library of Congress) 

    http://www.access.gpo.gov/congress/icreport/ (Government Printing Office) 

If its PDF then the delay is surely deliberately planned to favor
those with scratchback access.

From whgiii at invweb.net  Thu Sep 10 19:56:55 1998
From: whgiii at invweb.net (William H. Geiger III)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:56:55 +0800
Subject: SNET: [FP] Alaska: Nearly 93% of new parents choose Enumeration At Birth (EAB)
In-Reply-To: <199809110836.BAA11054@netcom13.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <199809111557.LAA14444@domains.invweb.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In <199809110836.BAA11054 at netcom13.netcom.com>, on 09/11/98 
   at 01:36 AM, "Vladimir Z. Nuri"  said:

>This program has proven to be so popular with new parents that
>nearly 93% of all births transmitted to the Bureau request a social
>security number.

Of all the evils governments have done over the years, by far the worst
was convincing the slaves that they were really free.

- -- 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Geiger III  http://www.openpgp.net
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice
PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail.
OS/2 PGP 5.0 at: http://www.openpgp.net/pgp.html
- ---------------------------------------------------------------

Tag-O-Matic: Dos: Venerable.  Windows: Vulnerable.  OS/2: Viable.

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From nobody at replay.com  Thu Sep 10 19:59:57 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 10:59:57 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
Message-ID: <199809111600.SAA12943@replay.com>

The annoying thing about Clinton's recent behavior is that he never
comes right out and apologizes, but the press always says he does.

Case in point:

> WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Saying ``I have sinned,'' a tearful President
> Clinton made an impassioned plea Friday for forgiveness from Monica
> Lewinsky and others and vowed to fight hard to keep his job.

But what did he say?

> ``I don't think there is a fancy way to say that I have sinned,''
> Clinton said, hours before independent counsel Kenneth Starr's report
> to Congress on his eight-month investigation into the Lewinsky scandal
> was to be made public.

He didn't say that he had sinned, he said that there wasn't a fancy way
to say that he had sinned.  He never came right out and said, "I have
sinned".

Another example:

> ``It is important to me that everybody who has been hurt know that the
> sorrow I feel is genuine -- first and most important my family, also my
> friends, my staff, my cabinet, Monica Lewinsky and her family, and the
> American people. I have asked all for their forgiveness,'' said Clinton.
> 
> It was the first time he had actually asked publicly for the forgiveness
> of Lewinsky...

But he didn't ask publicly for the forgiveness of Lewinsky.  He said that
he had already asked her for forgiveness.  Is this really true?  Has he
really spoken with her?  Or is it another lie?

Another example, from while Clinton was in Ireland:

> DUBLIN, Ireland (AP) - President Clinton said for the first time Friday
> ``I'm sorry'' about his affair with Monica Lewinsky, describing his
> behavior as indefensible as he sought to calm the growing storm that
> has shaken his presidency.

Here's what he actually said:

> ``I've already said that I made a bad mistake, it was indefensible and
> I'm sorry about it,'' Clinton said, questioned at a photo opportunity
> with Irish Prime Minister Bertie Ahern. It was the first time he had
> used the word ``sorry.''

The wording is not quite as obvious here, but in the video record it was
clear that he was saying that he had already said that his behavior was
indefensible and that he was sorry about it.  Of course, this is not true,
he had never said that.

Knowing Clinton's lawyerlike mind, we can only assume that his wording
is carefully chosen.  He could easily have said, "I don't think there is
a fancy way to say it, but I have sinned," or, with regard to Lewinsky
and company, "I ask here for forgiveness from them all."

No doubt he takes a measure of satisfaction in knowing that his calculated
public contriteness is carefully arranged to make it seem like he is
saying things which he actually is not.  Clinton loves lies, and it
must be thrilling to lie brazenly and to be praised for his openness
and honesty as he does so.  For a professional hypocrite like Clinton,
there can be no greater reward.

From whgiii at invweb.net  Thu Sep 10 20:02:23 1998
From: whgiii at invweb.net (William H. Geiger III)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 11:02:23 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: <199809111556.LAA02877@dewdrop2.mindspring.com>
Message-ID: <199809111602.MAA14549@domains.invweb.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In <199809111556.LAA02877 at dewdrop2.mindspring.com>, on 09/11/98 
   at 11:50 AM, John Young  said:

>If its PDF then the delay is surely deliberately planned to favor those
>with scratchback access.

Well, considering that congress is still debating how much of the report
(if any) will go public I doubt that there are any great backscratching
conspiracies afoot.

- -- 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Geiger III  http://www.openpgp.net
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice
PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail.
OS/2 PGP 5.0 at: http://www.openpgp.net/pgp.html
- ---------------------------------------------------------------

Tag-O-Matic: When DOS grows up it wants to be OS/2!

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From tcmay at got.net  Thu Sep 10 20:11:28 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 11:11:28 +0800
Subject: A Cypherpunk Trial, Yes
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 7:52 AM -0700 9/11/98, Trei, Peter wrote:

>	I, too, was suprised to find myself mentioned in
>	one of the postings John Young has highlighted.  I
>	hadn't noticed this before, since Toto's rants
>	were among the 50%+ of cpunks postings I marked as
>	read without actually reading them.

As I've said, I started deleting the posts from Toto, TruthMonger, Human
Gus-Peter, Linda Reed, and other totonyms about a year ago. I did this, "in
toto," one might say. As soon as I saw a long rant with a bunch of odd
stuff, mixtures of caps, references to Country Porn, Space Aliens,
Bienfait, etc., I hit the delete button.

But before this, I saw of course that we were playing starring roles in his
fantastical rants.

And Toto often forged our names on his rants and threats. I count this as a
kind of blessing, in that any attempt to prosecute us based on our posts
will run smack into this forgery issue...at least a speed bump in the
process of proving in court that some text fragment was actually written by
someone they claim it was written by.

>
>	The Poster Currently Known As Toto mentioned an
>	awful lot of people by name, purportedly engaged
>	in all kinds of nefarious activities.  The same
>	post also names Tim May, Adam Back, Declan
>	McCullagh, Ulf Moller, Kent Crispen, and Blanc
>	Weber. I'm let off easy, being characterized
>	as only a 'terroist [sic] InterNet forger'.
>	I think that this is because I once complained
>	when someone (possibly Toto) forged a message
>	in my name. To put it in the plainest possible
>	terms: I have never in my life forged a message.

Yep. I expect several of us may get subpoenas in this case. Either to
refute what is claimed, to support what is claimed, or just to clarify who
wrote what.

I plan to rely only on my memory. If they want me to try to reconstruct my
own e-mail archives, currently resident on several different disk drives,
some on CD-ROM, some in my gun safe, some in my safe deposit box, well,
this would require much work on my part. I presume they'll pay my
consulting fees for doing this work. Otherwise, it'll be just my memory.

"No, I have no direct recollection of the post you mention...."

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From declan at well.com  Thu Sep 10 20:31:11 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 11:31:11 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: <199809111556.LAA02877@dewdrop2.mindspring.com>
Message-ID: 

Well, let me just say this: We expect to have the document in electronic
form as early as possible. 

Also, while we're not relying on AP, the company is making the file
available on a passworded FTP site for its members. And FNS is promising
to OCR it if necessary and send it to its subscribers this evening for
$85. 

-Declan

On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, John Young wrote:

> Good piece, Declan. Is Time getting access to the restricted
> Congressional Web site which offers the Starr report early for
> members only drooling? Or are the major mediums getting
> preferential copies in concert with the deliberately under-provided
> House/Thomas/GPO rigs?
> 
> These are the four public access sites given by the NYT today,
> which notes that no one yet knows the digital format -- text,
> word processor or PDF images:
> 
>     http://www.house.gov/icreport/ (House Information Resources) 
> 
>     http://www.house.gov/judiciary (House Judiciary Committee) 
> 
>     http://thomas.loc.gov/icreport/ (Library of Congress) 
> 
>     http://www.access.gpo.gov/congress/icreport/ (Government Printing Office) 
> 
> If its PDF then the delay is surely deliberately planned to favor
> those with scratchback access.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

From mmotyka at lsil.com  Thu Sep 10 20:35:53 1998
From: mmotyka at lsil.com (Michael Motyka)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 11:35:53 +0800
Subject: radio net (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <33CCFE438B9DD01192E800A024C84A19284623@mossbay.chaffeyhomes.com>
Message-ID: <35F951FA.71B@lsil.com>

Hi Bill,

Bill Stewart wrote:

> Not per se, though there _is_ still one major restriction -
> the Defense Department gets a crack at patent applications,
> so if you try to patent a crypto algorithm or crypto phone,
> they can seize and classify your patent application and
> working materials, using the excuse of "national security".
>
I suppose we need more altruistic gestures placing good stuff into the
public domain.

> Sure there are - my $150 cordless phone uses spread-spectrum,
> partly for better sound quality, partly for better privacy,
> and partly because it's simpler than picking individual channels.
>
The security is only between the handset and the base unit. Once the
signal hits the POTS it's the same old story - open line.

ALSO - the channels and the hopping sequence used in the
"spread-spectrum" systems are predefined. Kind of like making a stream
cipher with a very short bitstream you got from the government printing
orifice. Using any other sequence is a crime.

The real purpose of the spread spectrum phones is to allow increased
signal levels. The security is not robust.

Try this one:

Not particularly original - I would guess that Tim's 3DES phone is
something like this.

Wal Mart Plastics for the housing ( ever tooled plastics? $$$ )
Custom board
	Dedicated DSP for voice compression/decompression
	Modem chipset for POTS connect ( direct or ISP )
	Fast microP for encryption/protocol
	Any encryption algorithm you desire
	Software Developer's Kit ( roll your own algorithm )

This will work very nicely at home or with any cell phone that has a
modem port. It's really nothing but a dedicated version of a PC based
PGP phone. It's just smaller and cheaper than a PC and has no MS DLLs on
it.

Regards,
Mike

From declan at well.com  Thu Sep 10 20:57:17 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 11:57:17 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809111600.SAA12943@replay.com>
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Anonymous wrote:

> The annoying thing about Clinton's recent behavior is that he never
> comes right out and apologizes, but the press always says he does.
> 
> Case in point:
> 
> > WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Saying ``I have sinned,'' a tearful President
> > Clinton made an impassioned plea Friday for forgiveness from Monica
> > Lewinsky and others and vowed to fight hard to keep his job.

Reuters' lede seems right:

	First, I want to say to all of you that, as you might imagine, I
have been on quite a journey these last few weeks to get to the end
of this, to the rock bottom truth of where I am and where we all are.
I agree with those who have said that in my first statement after I
testified I was not contrite enough.  I don't think there is a fancy
way to say that I have sinned.
	It is important to me that everybody who has been hurt know that
the sorrow I feel is genuine: first and most important, my family;
also my friends, my staff, my Cabinet, Monica Lewinsky and her
family, and the American people.  I have asked all for their
forgiveness.
	But I believe that to be forgiven, more than sorrow is required
-- at least two more things.  First, genuine repentance -- a
determination to change and to repair breaches of my own making.  I
have repented.  Second, what my bible calls a "broken spirit"; an
understanding that I must have God's help to be the person that I
want to be; a willingness to give the very forgiveness I seek; a
renunciation of the pride and the anger which cloud judgment, lead
people to excuse and compare and to blame and complain.
	Now, what does all this mean for me and for us?  First, I will
instruct my lawyers to mount a vigorous defense, using all available
appropriate arguments.  But legal language must not obscure the fact
that I have done wrong.  Second, I will continue on the path of
repentance, seeking pastoral support and that of other caring people
so that they can hold me accountable for my own commitment.
	Third, I will intensify my efforts to lead our country and the
world toward peace and freedom, prosperity and harmony, in the hope
that with a broken spirit and a still strong heart I can be used for
greater good, for we have many blessings and many challenges and so
much work to do.
	In this, I ask for your prayers and for your help in healing our
nation.  And though I cannot move beyond or forget this -- indeed, I
must always keep it as a caution light in my life -- it is very
important that our nation move forward.

From ptrei at securitydynamics.com  Thu Sep 10 21:07:54 1998
From: ptrei at securitydynamics.com (Trei, Peter)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 12:07:54 +0800
Subject: Bits are Bits
Message-ID: 

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Steve Bryan [SMTP:sbryan at vendorsystems.com]
	[...]
>  But I have not yet seen CD-ROMs for rent or even available to 
> check out for home use  from the public library. 
	[...]
	[forgive the lame quoting format - I'm using
	a Microsoft product.]

	I was in my town library yesterday, and they
	were loaning CDROMs. I was in a hurry, so did
	not check the details. At least one was made by
	National Geographic. (BTW: You can get the *entire*
	*run* of NG on CDROM, which I think is pretty neat.)

	Peter Trei

From sunder at brainlink.com  Thu Sep 10 21:12:34 1998
From: sunder at brainlink.com (Ray Arachelian)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 12:12:34 +0800
Subject: Fighting DMV clerical errors in NYC:
Message-ID: <35F9594E.6CCD7C2F@brainlink.com>

A friend of mine asked me to forward this question to you guys:

IMHO he needs a good lawyer, but maybe someone here knows more:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Any particular thing you want to fight @ the DMV or just in general?

They are preventing me from renewing my license due to a clerical error they 
made over a year ago. Since I did not respond to their letter (I didn't 
understand what they were talking about) they suspended my license. That 
caused my insurance company to drop me. When I renewed my insurance (a 
second error, if you have a suspension you can not get insurance) they told 
me it was cleared.

I need to talk to someone who can help me resolve this without me having to 
hand in my license and plate for the 90 day penalty

-- 

=====================================Kaos=Keraunos=Kybernetos==============
.+.^.+.|  Ray Arachelian    |Prying open my 3rd eye.  So good to see |./|\.
..\|/..|sunder at sundernet.com|you once again. I thought you were      |/\|/\
<--*-->| ------------------ |hiding, and you thought that I had run  |\/|\/
../|\..| "A toast to Odin,  |away chasing the tail of dogma. I opened|.\|/.
.+.v.+.|God of screwdrivers"|my eye and there we were....            |.....
======================= http://www.sundernet.com ==========================

From carolann at censored.org  Thu Sep 10 21:33:32 1998
From: carolann at censored.org (Carol Anne Cypherpunk)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 12:33:32 +0800
Subject: Fighting DMV clerical errors in NYC:
In-Reply-To: <35F9594E.6CCD7C2F@brainlink.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.19980911123006.006ddfc4@pop.primenet.com>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

As a former NYC cabbie, the best way to resolve a DMV dispute
is to take the train to Albany and deal with it there. This way you
can access higher and higher levels of the DMV until the problem
is fixed. Albany has no where near the level of hassle that NY has.

cab8

At 01:09 PM 9/11/98 -0400, you wrote:
>
>A friend of mine asked me to forward this question to you guys:
>
>IMHO he needs a good lawyer, but maybe someone here knows mor
Member Internet Society  - Certified Mining Co. Guide  -  Webmistress
***********************************************************************
Carol Anne Braddock (cab8)  carolann at censored.org   206.165.50.96
My Homepage
The Cyberdoc
***********************************************************************
Will lobby Congress for Food & Expenses!!!
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGP Personal Privacy 6.0
Comment: Totally uncensored from censored.org

iQA/AwUBNfleITiM2656VXArEQLc1wCeML7Kh1e0rQdCE/quIXcE9ge9RDAAn36+
znj/4ya+s8pHMj8tCl9o6tGy
=RdDc
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

From declan at well.com  Thu Sep 10 21:34:49 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 12:34:49 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

/cat:V/pri:U/sld:A/por:1/for:5/slu:BC-STARRREPORTTEXT Advisory -----
@TEXT
	BC-Starr Report Text, Advisory,0057
	MANAGING EDITORS:

	WIRE EDITORS:

	We are still awaiting the Starr report. We will advise immediately
when the report is available. Until then, please refrain from logging onto
the ftp sites. Otherwise, there is a danger of jamming the sites and
preventing us from posting the report.
	The AP
	APTV-09-11-98 1330EDT

From fisherm at tce.com  Thu Sep 10 22:10:43 1998
From: fisherm at tce.com (Fisher Mark)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:10:43 +0800
Subject: oil, greens, recycling, and poly-ticks.
Message-ID: <2C396693FBDED111AEF60000F84104A721BFAA@indyexch_fddi.indy.tce.com>

Ray Arachelian writes:
>Just out of curiosity what are prices around where you guys live?

Prices here range from .97-.99 for name brands (Shell, etc.) and around .89
for no-name brands right now.
==========================================================
Mark Leighton Fisher          Thomson Consumer Electronics
fisherm at indy.tce.com          Indianapolis, IN
"Their walls are built of cannon balls, their motto is
'Don't Tread on Me'"

> .
> 

From sbryan at vendorsystems.com  Thu Sep 10 22:37:09 1998
From: sbryan at vendorsystems.com (Steve Bryan)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:37:09 +0800
Subject: Bits are Bits
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

>> -----Original Message-----
>> From:	Steve Bryan [SMTP:sbryan at vendorsystems.com]
>	[...]
>>  But I have not yet seen CD-ROMs for rent or even available to
>> check out for home use  from the public library.
>	[...]
>	[forgive the lame quoting format - I'm using
>	a Microsoft product.]
>
>	I was in my town library yesterday, and they
>	were loaning CDROMs. I was in a hurry, so did
>	not check the details. At least one was made by
>	National Geographic. (BTW: You can get the *entire*
>	*run* of NG on CDROM, which I think is pretty neat.)
>
>	Peter Trei

They have CD-ROM's at our local public library but only for use at the
library. It isn't possible to check them out for use at home. I don't know
if this is a legal issue or just a matter of policy but it is annoying.

Steve Bryan
Vendorsystems International
email: sbryan at vendorsystems.com
icq: 5263678
pgp fingerprint: D758 183C 8B79 B28E 6D4C  2653 E476 82E6 DA7C 9AC5

From jvb at ssds.com  Thu Sep 10 22:39:02 1998
From: jvb at ssds.com (Jim Burnes)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:39:02 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Declan McCullagh wrote:

etc delete....

Declan:

Is there any effort underway to mirror the report to various
archives?  This is going to kill the DC internet corridor
otherwise.

jim burnes

From jmg123 at hotmail.com  Thu Sep 10 22:52:29 1998
From: jmg123 at hotmail.com (J. Michael)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:52:29 +0800
Subject: Starr report
Message-ID: <19980911185240.16578.qmail@hotmail.com>

http://www.cnn.com/starr.report/

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

From minow at pobox.com  Thu Sep 10 22:57:27 1998
From: minow at pobox.com (Martin Minow)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 13:57:27 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

>From Jim Burns:
>
>Is there any effort underway to mirror the report to various
>archives?  This is going to kill the DC internet corridor
>otherwise.
>
What I heard on the radio this morning was that the house
will press CD's that will be distributed to mirror servers
(presumably the major Internet news providers.)

Now, the real interesting question: will the files be
PGP-signed?

Martin Minow
minow at pobox.com

From tcmay at got.net  Thu Sep 10 23:11:00 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 14:11:00 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 11:42 AM -0700 9/11/98, Jim Burnes wrote:
>On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Declan McCullagh wrote:
>
>etc delete....
>
>Declan:
>
>Is there any effort underway to mirror the report to various
>archives?  This is going to kill the DC internet corridor
>otherwise.

Turn on the television. All of the networks and news stations are mirroring
it. The ones I've tried, cnn.com, foxnews.com, etc., are also swamped.
However, the talking heads--no pun intended--are all reading the sordid
details about Clinton's cigar being inserted into Monica's vagina, about
how Clinton talked with Congressional leaders while Monica was giving him a
blowjob, and how Clinton suborned perjury and tampered with evidence....

"The guy is going down...in more ways than one."

BTW, I had heard Matt Drudge on the cigar issue before Declan visited a few
weeks ago. I was able to "break" this story to Declan, no mean feat.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From mgering at ecosystems.net  Thu Sep 10 23:15:37 1998
From: mgering at ecosystems.net (Matthew James Gering)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 14:15:37 +0800
Subject: Rental of PC software...
Message-ID: <33CCFE438B9DD01192E800A024C84A19284646@mossbay.chaffeyhomes.com>

USC Title 17 � 109 subsec (b)(1)(A)

...unless authorized by the ...owner of copyright in a computer program
(including any tape, disk, or other medium embodying such program),
...[no] person in possession of a particular copy of a computer program
(including any tape, disk, or other medium embodying such program), may,
for the purposes of direct or indirect commercial advantage, dispose of,
or authorize the disposal of, the possession of that ...computer program
(including any tape, disk, or other medium embodying such program) by
rental, lease, or lending, or by any other act or practice in the nature
of rental, lease, or lending. ... The transfer of possession of a
lawfully made copy of a computer program by a nonprofit educational
institution to another nonprofit educational institution or to faculty,
staff, and students does not constitute rental, lease, or lending for
direct or indirect commercial purposes under this subsection. 
(B) This subsection does not apply to - 
(i) a computer program which is embodied in a machine or product and
which cannot be copied during the ordinary operation or use of the
machine or product; or 
(ii) a computer program embodied in or used in conjunction with a
limited purpose computer that is designed for playing video games and
may be designed for other purposes. 
...
(2)(A) Nothing in this subsection shall apply to the lending of a
computer program for nonprofit purposes by a nonprofit library, if each
copy of a computer program which is lent by such library has affixed to
the packaging containing the program a warning of copyright in
accordance with requirements that the Register of Copyrights shall
prescribe by regulation. 
(B) Not later than three years after the date of the enactment of the
Computer Software Rental Amendments Act of 1990, and at such times
thereafter as the Register of Copyright considers appropriate, the
Register of Copyrights, after consultation with representatives of
copyright owners and librarians, shall submit to the Congress a report
stating whether this paragraph has achieved its intended purpose of
maintaining the integrity of the copyright system while providing
nonprofit libraries the capability to fulfill their function. Such
report shall advise the Congress as to any information or
recommendations that the Register of Copyrights considers necessary to
carry out the purposes of this subsection. 

From CTIA_Daily_News at um2.unitymail.com  Fri Sep 11 15:12:38 1998
From: CTIA_Daily_News at um2.unitymail.com (CTIA Daily News)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 15:12:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: LATE BREAKING NEWS! - September 11, 1998 5:30PM EST
Message-ID: <199809112211.RAA20962@revnet4.revnet.com>

************************************************************

Late today, the FCC released its long-awaited
order extending the October 25, 1998, CALEA
compliance deadline 20 months to June 30, 2000.

The Commission will soon initiate a rulemaking
proceeding to consider whether modifications
to the core J-STD-025 standard may be necessary
to comply with CALEA.

Visit WOW-COM for more details.

http://www.wow-com.com/professional/

Specific News Story is:

http://www.wow-com.com/results/professional/news/frameindex.cfm?articlei
d=3410

************************************************************

From adam at homeport.org  Fri Sep 11 00:15:39 1998
From: adam at homeport.org (Adam Shostack)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 15:15:39 +0800
Subject: cypherpunks archive
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <19980911161107.A1444@weathership.homeport.org>

Rate limit it for the masses; sell access to an unlimited version of
the site?

Adam

| Anyone have 1gb of disk space on a machine, optionally with root access,
| on a machine with unmetered network access outside the US on which I
| could put the archive?
| 
| I can put the archive here in AI, but I'll have to charge per megabyte,
| as my t1 is metered-use :(  It would end up being something on the order of
| $0.50/MB for total traffic, and unfortunately there are no good payment
| systems for that kind of thing right now.

--
"I only work at Security Dynamics because of food poisoning." -- Anon

From vznuri at netcom.com  Fri Sep 11 01:14:55 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 16:14:55 +0800
Subject: SNET: Plans for internet banks in Australia, says Ernst & Young
Message-ID: <199809112115.OAA15341@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: jeremy.compton at stonebow.otago.ac.nz (Jeremy Compton)
Subject: SNET: Plans for internet banks in Australia, says Ernst & Young
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 03:04:23 +1200
To: snetnews at world.std.com

->  SNETNEWS  Mailing List

Plans for internet banks in Australia, says Ernst & Young

Sydney, Sept 9 AAP - Offshore and local companies have strategic plans to
establish stand alone
Internet banks in Australia to compete with the existing banking network,
financial services
consultants Ernst & Young said today.

Ernst & Young partner Andrew Keene, who specialises in technology strategy
for financial
institutions, said the international consulting firm was aware of both
overseas and domestic
companies with plans for internet banks.

"There are some plans that we are aware of," Mr Keene told reporters. "I
believe most of the plans
are formative."

He declined to name the companies.

Ernst & Young yesterday released its latest report on technology in banking
and financial services,
with more t0 of the world's largest financial institutions in 26 countries
participating in the seventh
global study.

Entitled Electronic Commerce and Connecting to the Customer, the report
analyses the technology
spending plans of banks, insurance companies, asset management and
brokerage institutions in the
United States, Europe, Asia and Australia.

The report found that technology spending priorities of Australia's
financial institutions to develop
new customer channels have been surpassed by the "more immediate issues" of
mergers and
acquisitions, the millennium bug and the Euro.

Kevin Hall, the national leader of Ernst & Young's Australian financial
services consulting group,
said that the new spending priorities "have meant that spending on the
critical area of improved
customer services has been delayed".

He said that the report found that financial institutions are "anticipating
heavy increases" in
technology spending, with technology budgets rising 14 percent in calendar
1998, tapering off to six
percent by 2001.

"But while spending rates will decline over time, the actual budget amounts
will continue to increase,
with actual budgets project to double between 1992 and 2000," he said.

However, technology budgets are predominantly being spent on mandated
projects such as computer
upgrades to avoid the Year 2000 software date problem.

The survey also found that only 12 percent of Australian institutions
believed that the internet will
help them retain customers and business, compared to 47 percent of US
respondents and 34 percent
of European respondents.

Russell Ives, a data warehouse specialist at the firm, said that Australian
banks view Internet services
such as electronic commerce or e-commerce as cost-saving devices whereas US
banks used it to
"focus on retaining customers".

"The great opportunity that exists for financial institutions in Australia
is to refocus their e-commerce
strategy towards customer retention," said Mr Hall, adding that some
institutions are "unsure how to
use" e-commerce.

Australian financial institutions are also behind their overseas
counterparts in integrating customer
data to develop sophisticated knowledge of customer needs to enhance the
cross-selling of products
and target services.

"Nobody has really integrated its completely," Mr Hall said of Australian
financial institutions.

Mr Ives said that banks have to advance data integration rapidly,
especially when it comes to
refocusing e-commerce strategies on customer retention.

Overseas banks such as Wells Fargo, Bank of Montreal and ING Bank are some
of the leaders in
e-commerce and internet.

"So our conclusion is that the most effective financial institutions will
develop alliances to deliver
electronic commerce," Mr Keene said.

AAP pjg 10/09/98 08-09NZ

� New Zealand Press Association

-> Send "subscribe   snetnews " to majordomo at world.std.com
->  Posted by: jeremy.compton at stonebow.otago.ac.nz (Jeremy Compton)

From vznuri at netcom.com  Fri Sep 11 01:15:07 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 16:15:07 +0800
Subject: IP: Web sites preparing for Starr report onslaught
Message-ID: <199809112115.OAA15319@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: believer at telepath.com
Subject: IP: Web sites preparing for Starr report onslaught
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 06:40:46 -0500
To: believer at telepath.com

Source:  Fox News - AP

Web sites preparing for Starr report onslaught
 2.42 a.m. ET (642 GMT) September 11, 1998

 By Chris Allbritton, Associated Press

 NEW YORK (AP) � Web surfers hoping to view portions of Independent Counsel
Kenneth Starr's report when it goes online today instead may need to wait
in line. 

 An expert in high-volume Web sites said millions of Web surfers �
clustered around Web sites like people used to cluster around teletype
machines waiting for the latest dispatches from news wire services �
probably will swamp the government's computers. 

 "I would imagine a lot of people getting a 'Site Not Available'
(message),'' said J.D. Zeeman, who coordinated IBM's Web site for the
Winter Olympics in Nagano, Japan, earlier this year. 

 At one point, the Olympics site was getting more than 110,000 hits a
minute, Zeeman said. 

 By Thursday afternoon, the crush of people visiting the House's Web site �
called Thomas � prompted this message: "The Library of Congress is aware of
public statements announcing the availability of the Independent Counsel's
report at this site. As yet, the House of Representatives has taken no
action regarding the public availability of this report.'' 

 A House vote on releasing the report was planned for today. 

 "The technology exists to handle this kind of load today, but it literally
takes months to get it in place,'' Zeeman said. "Unless they've done
something, I wouldn't imagine they would be adequately prepared.'' 

 A congressional source said the House is adequately prepared, posting the
report on government sites and distributing formatted copies to Web sites
of major newspapers, magazines, The Associated Press and other news
services, and online outlets such as America Online and Yahoo! 

 The Web has become a popular way to distribute government documents in the
past few years, but the last time a government body tried to release
red-hot documents on the Web, it was a disaster. It was the case of Louise
Woodward, the British au pair accused of murder. 

 In November 1997, Massachusetts Superior Court Judge Hiller B. Zobel said
he would release on the Web his decision to reduce Woodward's conviction to
manslaughter. Millions on both sides of the Atlantic who had followed the
story eagerly anticipated the first online release of a criminal court
ruling. 

 But a power outage delayed the ruling for hours, and heavy traffic at Web
sites made it almost impossible for people to read the decision once it was
online. 

 The foul-up with the Woodward decision, while embarrassing, was not
unique. News sites usually slow down, or even crash, when the always
increasing number of Web surfers rushes online for news. It happened during
the Woodward case, after the death of Princess Diana and during the recent
gyrations of the stock market. 

 The slowdowns are just the nature of news on the Internet. The parallel is
a newspaper that assigns many reporters to a major story such as the
Oklahoma City bombing, or printing a lengthy report by an independent
counsel. 

 "I guess when you think of throwing all sorts of reporters on a story,
you're straining resources,'' said Ruth Gersh, editor of AP's multimedia
services. "If you put up the report on the Web, it uses up resources which
we call bandwidth.'' 

 Congressional leaders expect the report to be available this afternoon
through these government Web addresses: 

 �http://thomas.loc.gov/icreport 

 �http://www.house.gov/icreport 

                  � 1998 Associated Press. All rights reserved.
-----------------------
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
-----------------------

**********************************************
To subscribe or unsubscribe, email:
     majordomo at majordomo.pobox.com
with the message:
     (un)subscribe ignition-point email at address
**********************************************
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**********************************************

From vznuri at netcom.com  Fri Sep 11 01:15:08 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 16:15:08 +0800
Subject: IP: Privacy: Companies admit spying on staff
Message-ID: <199809112115.OAA15330@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: believer at telepath.com
Subject: IP: Privacy: Companies admit spying on staff
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 12:14:18 -0500
To: believer at telepath.com

Source:  The Age (Australia)
http://www.theage.com.au:80/daily/980910/news/news19.html

Companies admit spying on staff 

By LEON GETTLER 

More than one in two of Australia's largest companies carry out
video surveillance of their employees and the general public, a
survey has found.

The survey revealed that 94 per cent of the companies also
monitored employees' phone conversations, electronic mail and
Internet usage although the focus appeared to be mostly on
volume and frequency rather than content.

For example, 16 per cent monitored phone usage while the
conversations themselves were only monitored by 2 per cent.
Similarly, email usage was monitored by 13 per cent while 6 per
cent of the companies were combing through the actual
messages. Scrutiny of Internet usage would also reveal the web
sites that employees had visited.

The PricewaterhouseCoopers survey found that 65 per cent of
companies regarded monitoring as a normal part of employment
and 85 per had informed their employees that they were being
watched. However, they were often not as forthcoming about
seemingly minor details, like time and place.

PricewaterhouseCoopers information and security partner Mr
Stephen Woolley said there was a better than 50-50 chance that
Australians would be filmed or recorded at some stage during
the day. In the case of the general public, it would be without
their consent.

``As is the practice of companies both here and overseas, this
information will probably go on file for some years,'' Mr
Woolley said.

About half the companies said information gathered in Australia
on customers, employees and the general public was sent
overseas for international data bases.

The study also revealed alarming gaps in the privacy guidelines
of some companies.

Only 35 per cent had formally documented privacy policies in
place and 38 per cent said they did not undertake any
monitoring to ensure compliance with in-house privacy
guidelines. Eight out of 10 organisations did not require staff to
undertake privacy training.

The survey covered 65 of Australia's largest companies spanning
across all major industries including utilities, telecommunications,
natural resources, retail, credit, banking and finance, insurance
and manufacturing.

Based on their total turnover and size of assets, the companies
that responded to the survey would represent more than half of
corporate Australia.

More than one in 10 companies did not inform staff that they
could be monitored.

Published by The Age Online Pty Ltd ACN 069 962 885
�1998 David Syme & Co Ltd 
-----------------------
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
-----------------------

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From whgiii at invweb.net  Fri Sep 11 01:19:29 1998
From: whgiii at invweb.net (William H. Geiger III)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 16:19:29 +0800
Subject: Starr Report on Openpgp.net
Message-ID: <199809112119.RAA19044@domains.invweb.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

Hi,

I have put a copy of the report on my website:

http://www.openpgp.net/starr

- -- 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Geiger III  http://www.openpgp.net
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice
PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail.
OS/2 PGP 5.0 at: http://www.openpgp.net/pgp.html
- ---------------------------------------------------------------

Tag-O-Matic: See the Future; See OS/2.  Be the Future; Run OS/2.

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From jimg at mentat.com  Fri Sep 11 01:27:30 1998
From: jimg at mentat.com (Jim Gillogly)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 16:27:30 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
Message-ID: <199809112128.OAA14441@zendia.mentat.com>

Yes, there's crypto content in this msg... a passing reference four
paragraphs down.

Somebody said:
> The annoying thing about Clinton's recent behavior is that he never
> comes right out and apologizes, but the press always says he does.
Somebody goes on to do the whole Apology Watch number in detail.

It doesn't matter.  One commentator a few weeks ago had a good line
for it: "All mea and no culpa."  But so what?  This whole apology watch
is totally meaningless.  We know he can perform sincere-looking speeches
on demand, and that's largely why we elected him.  If he gives another
one and says this time that he's really   sorry and he's
guilty as hell, I couldn't be more impressed.  Or less.  What he says
about it is irrelevant.

This whole "sex scandal" thing is ludicrous also -- we knew he was a
horn-dog when we elected him.  Yes, my sexual morality is considerably
higher than his, but so what?  Sexual abstinence has never been a
criterion for being President, and probably only one President in
living memory  have sex outside of wedlock... Peter Langston
published a "Know your Presidents" column in the last few days, a quiz
regarding which Presidents had done what to whom in the Oval Office.
Regarding covering up the sex -- so what?  When he said they weren't
having sex back in February, she was denying it at the time, so it'd
take a pretty sleazy character to say he was schtupping her and she was
lying about it.

The fact is that this sex between consenting adults thing is the best
Starr could do with his Whitewater investigation after umpteen years
and witnesses and millions of dollars, and I'm not impressed.  I'm
 more impressed with the kind of allegations Softwar digs up --
sweetheart deals for some company to send encryption to China while
sitting on the bulk of the domestic encryption industry, for example.
If he's really done something that involves treason or high crimes and
misdemeanors, let's hear about it and act on it.  But airing soiled
linen in public isn't germane.

If they  decide this is now a requirement for high office, I'd like
to see all the Congresscritters who've had sex out of wedlock and
concealed it take one step forward.  Shall we make hypocrisy in high
office impeachable also?

Today Dave Farber noted that if the CDA were constitutional (which it
isn't) Congress wouldn't have been allowed to drool over all these
salacious bits on the public networks.

	Jim

From mmotyka at lsil.com  Fri Sep 11 03:32:39 1998
From: mmotyka at lsil.com (Michael Motyka)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 18:32:39 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809112128.OAA14441@zendia.mentat.com>
Message-ID: <35F9B3BD.6DE6@lsil.com>

Jim Gillogly wrote:
>
> The fact is that this sex between consenting adults thing is the best
> Starr could do with his Whitewater investigation after umpteen years
> and witnesses and millions of dollars, and I'm not impressed.  I'm
>  more impressed with the kind of allegations Softwar digs up --
> sweetheart deals for some company to send encryption to China while
> sitting on the bulk of the domestic encryption industry, for example.
> If he's really done something that involves treason or high crimes and
> misdemeanors, let's hear about it and act on it.  But airing soiled
> linen in public isn't germane.
> 
It's worse than not impressive: it's PATHETIC. I thought we'd have 425
pages of real output relating to the last 6 years of "work" and 25 pages
of Monica. I'd rather finance $600 toilet seats and $1200 gold-plated
hammers with my tax money than Starr's brand of open political warfare.
It's simple, partisan, Rottweiler politics. The kind of stuff that makes
you leave your shoes outside the door when you get home at night.

> If they  decide this is now a requirement for high office, I'd like
> to see all the Congresscritters who've had sex out of wedlock and
> concealed it take one step forward.  Shall we make hypocrisy in high
> office impeachable also?
> 
I'd say hypocrisy is more of a hangin' offense, like horse thievin' or
cattle rustlin'. I seethe when I listen to an asshole like Arlin Spectre
or Jerry Falwell spouting off about Clinton. I'm no great fan of
Clinton's but the attackers in this particular shitstorm are lower than
pond scum. I can't wait till they crawl back to the cesspool they came
from.

Mike

From attila at hun.org  Fri Sep 11 04:15:21 1998
From: attila at hun.org (attila)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 19:15:21 +0800
Subject: Newspaper Ad Project
In-Reply-To: <199808261817.NAA04960@einstein.ssz.com>
Message-ID: 

    I think you'll find that you can buy multicolumn display ads
    cheaper than classifieds --where you can also get multi-column.
    display ad is almost always cheaper for one shot; and, you have
    a choice of position --and therefore cost

On Wed, 26 Aug 1998, Jim Choate wrote:

>Hi,
>
>I was wondering if we might go ahead and set a date for publishing across
>the country the 3-line Perl RSA. I would like to suggest something like
>Halloween, at least a month a way.
>
>The cpunks here in Austin believe we can handle Austin, Houston, Dallas, Ft.
>Worth, San Antonio, and El Paso.
>
>One issue is that the columns in the paper are pretty limited, so it won't
>be 3 lines in reality. Anybody know the standard paper column width? Who
>wants to reformat the Perl?
>

From mix at anon.lcs.mit.edu  Fri Sep 11 06:58:29 1998
From: mix at anon.lcs.mit.edu (lcs Mixmaster Remailer)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 21:58:29 +0800
Subject: CDA? What CDA?
Message-ID: <19980912030005.7730.qmail@nym.alias.net>

CNN. Pathfinder. Everybody and his dog with a website. The White
House. Posting "indecent material" on the web.

I mean, I'm impressed.

(A bit more seriously though: could this fact possibly help - in the
future - if the US gvt was again seeking to "curb indecency onm the
Net"?)

From Raymond at fbn.bc.ca  Fri Sep 11 07:02:49 1998
From: Raymond at fbn.bc.ca (Raymond D. Mereniuk)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 22:02:49 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <35F9B3BD.6DE6@lsil.com>
Message-ID: <199809120319.UAA20709@leroy.fbn.bc.ca>

Michael Motyka 

> It's worse than not impressive: it's PATHETIC. I thought we'd have 425
> pages of real output relating to the last 6 years of "work" and 25 pages
> of Monica. I'd rather finance $600 toilet seats and $1200 gold-plated
> hammers with my tax money than Starr's brand of open political warfare.
> It's simple, partisan, Rottweiler politics. The kind of stuff that makes
> you leave your shoes outside the door when you get home at night.

>From what I have read of Ken Starr's report Washington insider's all 
knew of Clinton's relationship with "That Woman".  Now if Law 
Enforcement (LA) knows Clinton has skeletons in his closet they can 
go to him and tell him he must support lets just say a total ban on 
strong encryption.  Clinton is inbetween a rock and a hard place, he 
must go along with proposals from LA, whether he supports the 
proposals in principle or not.

We have seen some of Clinton's dirty laundry in a segment of his 
life that his attorney wife was not able to advise him.  Now do you 
think Clinton's general standard of morality was any different in his 
life before this scandal in areas where his attorney wife was able to 
pull the strings?  I personally doubt it. 

I see the whole OIC crusade against Clinton as an attempt to bring 
honesty to government.  Ken Starr is just playing the game by the 
rules set out be the Clintons.  If the game looks too rough who do 
you blame? 

Virtually

Raymond D. Mereniuk
Raymond at fbn.bc.ca

From whgiii at invweb.net  Fri Sep 11 07:31:09 1998
From: whgiii at invweb.net (William H. Geiger III)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 22:31:09 +0800
Subject: CDA? What CDA?
In-Reply-To: <19980912030005.7730.qmail@nym.alias.net>
Message-ID: <199809120332.XAA24689@domains.invweb.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In <19980912030005.7730.qmail at nym.alias.net>, on 09/12/98 
   at 03:00 AM, lcs Mixmaster Remailer  said:

>CNN. Pathfinder. Everybody and his dog with a website. The White House.
>Posting "indecent material" on the web.

>I mean, I'm impressed.

>(A bit more seriously though: could this fact possibly help - in the
>future - if the US gvt was again seeking to "curb indecency onm the
>Net"?)

It sure will be a nice thing to throw in thier face next time they bring
CDA up. :)

- -- 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Geiger III  http://www.openpgp.net
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice
PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail.
OS/2 PGP 5.0 at: http://www.openpgp.net/pgp.html
- ---------------------------------------------------------------

Tag-O-Matic: Windows?  WINDOWS?!?  Hahahahahehehehehohohoho...

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From mgering at ecosystems.net  Fri Sep 11 08:43:31 1998
From: mgering at ecosystems.net (Matthew James Gering)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 23:43:31 +0800
Subject: Starr report and CDA
Message-ID: <33CCFE438B9DD01192E800A024C84A19284651@mossbay.chaffeyhomes.com>

The US government violates their own CDA by posting this graphically
detailed report to the Internet. Am I the only one that doesn't find
that ironic. Well it's good ammo (perhaps) for the next time the CDA
comes up.

	Matt

> 
> http://www.cnn.com/starr.report/

From bill.stewart at pobox.com  Fri Sep 11 08:53:23 1998
From: bill.stewart at pobox.com (Bill Stewart)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 23:53:23 +0800
Subject: oil, greens, recycling, and poly-ticks.
In-Reply-To: <35F7F329.E4836699@brainlink.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980911143828.00899c80@idiom.com>

Some whining Yankee wrote: 
>>What pisses me off is that in NYC the gas prices are ridiculous high...
>>$1.35/Gal is the regular gas, drive just a few miles over a tunnel or bridge 
>>to n NJ, it's $1.00 or $.99 depending on which pump you hit...  go a bit
>south,
>>say VA, and in some areas it drops as low as $0.87 a gallon!

Over in Europe, prices are mostly about $1 -- per liter.

Back here in California, prices have been varying a lot, and
are generally higher in areas with lots of people, lots of money,
or lots of restrictions on gas stations.   Here in San Francisco,
it's about $1.30, and down in Silicon Valley it's mostly about
$1.20, with some cheaper stations and some more expensive.
We have different gas - for environmental reasons, they add
chemicals designed to pollute water and irritate people's lungs
(while reducing smog a bit.)

Those New Jersey prices, while lower than New York, are still
articifially high, since they're "full-service".  The People's 
Republic of New Jersey *knows* that regular untrained citizens
can't be trusted to pump their own gasoline reliably -
otherwise you'd be having frequent explosions at gasoline
stations like you do in the rest of the country.
Any time the legislature begins to suggest legalizing
self-service gas, small gas station owners pretending to be
little old ladies write to all the newspapers protesting that
they'd have to pay a lot more money to have gas pumped for them
and how dare these politicians be so mean to YOUR grandmothers,
and the threat disappears again for a few years.
				Thanks! 
					Bill
Bill Stewart, bill.stewart at pobox.com
PGP Fingerprint D454 E202 CBC8 40BF  3C85 B884 0ABE 4639

From bill.stewart at pobox.com  Fri Sep 11 08:53:55 1998
From: bill.stewart at pobox.com (Bill Stewart)
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 23:53:55 +0800
Subject: Webs of Trust, Conspiracies, and Six Degrees of Cypherpunks
In-Reply-To: <199809091200.IAA18283@www.video-collage.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980911192912.00959c50@idiom.com>

At 12:47 AM 9/11/98 -0700, Vladimir Z. Nuri wrote:
>wow, a new site called sixdegrees.com, in which everyone
>registers and reveals who their friends are. the privacy
>implications are really incredible. yet supposedly
>close to 1 million people joined, with 900,000 of them
>connected!!

We've got a somewhat related Cypherpunks problem,
which is PGP key signatures.  The traditional software
likes chains of less than 4 deep, yet the last time
I checked the key servers, there were chains as deep as 
12-14, and most people seemed to be at least 6 signatures
away from Phil Zimmermann or Derek Atkins, who were the
centers of the list at the time.  (On the other hand, 
I suppose a lot of signatures between Joe Cypherpunk, 
Ivan Cypherpunk, T0T0M0nger, etc. could improve the averages :-)

The PGP Web of Trust key management tools have the
difficulty that they don't make it easy to decide which 
signatures on your key to export when giving someone
a key to sign or distributing a key to a key server.
You can manage this somewhat by creating different
name/key pairs for different uses, with your
	Phil Zimmermann, Respected Entrepreneur
key signed by venture capitalists and your
	Phil Zimmermann, Anti-Nuclear Activist
signed by your fellow activists, and trying to make
sure that people who attend meetings at the bank building
where you have your office digitally sign in with their
Respectable Software Developer or Free Speech Activist personnas,
and not with their
	Buddhist Temple Assault Rifle Shooting Club
personnas that seem to overlap with the Respected Entrepreneur web....

I'm not sure how solvable a problem this is - 
there are some parts that are easier to solve, like
- storing secret keyrings entirely in encrypted form
	This could be done using a disk encryptor instead,
	or could be done using an additional passphrase
	to unlock the keyring before determining whether
	the specific key you want it on it; both are annoying.
	The threat is the attack currently being used against T0T0,
	whose secret keyring had a key for a personna that signed a
	supposedly incriminating message.  In his case, it was probably
	just ranting or humor, but there are some PGP users who really
	_are_ trying to overthrow their governments.
and friendlier GUI tools (e.g. the current PGPkeys lets you
	add and delete signatures from a key in the keyring,
	but doesn't let you decide which ones to export except
	by deleting them (or by exporting to a separate keyring
	and using the GUI on that keyring, which is awkward.)

				Thanks! 
					Bill
Bill Stewart, bill.stewart at pobox.com
PGP Fingerprint D454 E202 CBC8 40BF  3C85 B884 0ABE 4639

From stuffed at stuffed.net  Sat Sep 12 01:22:06 1998
From: stuffed at stuffed.net (STUFFED NEWS DAILY)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 01:22:06 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/12/   <----
Message-ID: <19980912071001.29383.qmail@eureka.abc-web.com>

Welcome to  today's  issue of Stuffed. To read it you should
click on the URL above.  If it is not made clickable by your
email program  you will need to  use your mouse to highlight
the URL,  copy it and then paste it into your browser  (then
press Return).

This  email  is  never  sent  unsolicited.  Stuffed  is  the
supplement for the Eureka newsletter you subscribed to. Full
instructions on unsubscribing  are in every issue of Eureka!

       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/12/   <----

From export-control at qualcomm.com  Fri Sep 11 10:30:22 1998
From: export-control at qualcomm.com (Eudora Export Control Team)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 01:30:22 +0800
Subject: Access to Eudora Export Controlled Archives
Message-ID: <199809120616.XAA11486@ithilien.eudora.com>

You may access the Eudora/PGP archives at the following address.

Your username and password are given below.

        Username: guest51285
        Password: 4ChmcTZH

ABOUT YOUR PASSWORD

Most browsers allow you to paste passwords into the authentication
box.  If you have a problem with a username and password that we
supplied, please try copying the password from this message, reload 
the PGP download area page in your browser and paste the password into 
the password field of the authentication dialog box that pops up in 
front of the page.

Additionally, these passwords expire. If you are denied access 
to the PGP download area at a later date, please get a new password.

Be sure to keep this username and password to yourself.  If someone 
you know wants access to the archives, please send them to 

Thanks for your support!

The Eudora Export Control Team

From denverl at public.szonline.net  Sat Sep 12 05:13:26 1998
From: denverl at public.szonline.net (Denver Liu)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 05:13:26 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: unsubscribe
Message-ID: <199809121213.UAA10491@public.szonline.net>

unsubscribe

From frissell at panix.com  Fri Sep 11 16:19:43 1998
From: frissell at panix.com (Duncan Frissell)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 07:19:43 +0800
Subject: oil, greens, recycling, and poly-ticks.
In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.19980910205225.0096d7d0@alaska.net>
Message-ID: <199809121221.IAA15102@mail1.panix.com>

At 02:38 PM 9/11/98 -0700, Bill Stewart wrote:

>Those New Jersey prices, while lower than New York, are still
>articifially high, since they're "full-service".  The People's 
>Republic of New Jersey *knows* that regular untrained citizens
>can't be trusted to pump their own gasoline reliably -
>otherwise you'd be having frequent explosions at gasoline
>stations like you do in the rest of the country.

No.  The legislature knows that the citizens of the Garden State are otherwise unemployable so they have established a protected job category of gas jockey to keep them off the streets.

DCF

From frissell at panix.com  Fri Sep 11 16:35:48 1998
From: frissell at panix.com (Duncan Frissell)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 07:35:48 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809112128.OAA14441@zendia.mentat.com>
Message-ID: <199809121230.IAA15602@mail1.panix.com>

At 04:35 PM 9/11/98 -0700, Michael Motyka wrote:

>It's worse than not impressive: it's PATHETIC. I thought we'd have 425
>pages of real output relating to the last 6 years of "work" and 25 pages
>of Monica. I'd rather finance $600 toilet seats and $1200 gold-plated
>hammers with my tax money than Starr's brand of open political warfare.
>It's simple, partisan, Rottweiler politics. The kind of stuff that makes
>you leave your shoes outside the door when you get home at night.

Save that the impeachment of a president is not the main job of the OIC.  He is supposed to 1) Investigate, 2) Indict, and 3) Report to the AG and the 3-judge panel that appointed him.  If he stumbles across evidence of impeachable offenses he can send a report to the House but that is a SIDE job.

Starr took 8 months to go from zero to "evidence of impeachable offenses" in  Fornigate.  The rest of the investigation continues.  He has 5 different areas of responsibility.  He submitted Monica to the House because he had rock solid proof that Clinton is a lying sack of shit and a multiple felon.  Something we knew years ago but couldn't prove.  

With KKKlinton, you don't shoot unless you have an elephant gun.

DCF

From ulf at fitug.de  Fri Sep 11 16:48:06 1998
From: ulf at fitug.de (Ulf =?ISO-8859-1?Q?M=F6ller?=)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 07:48:06 +0800
Subject: A Cypherpunk Trial, Yes
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

> 	in all kinds of nefarious activities.  The same
> 	post also names Tim May, Adam Back, Declan
> 	McCullagh, Ulf Moller, Kent Crispen, and Blanc
> 	Weber. I'm let off easy, being characterized 
> 	as only a 'terroist [sic] InterNet forger'. 
> 	I think that this is because I once complained 
> 	when someone (possibly Toto) forged a message 
> 	in my name.

Hm. I hadn't seen that before.

I didn't forge any messages or complain about forgeries, and I haven't
claimed to have been working on proving the validity of the need for
legislation declaring the value of Pi to be 3.0, either. If there is
any truth in the Nutly News, it must be something else. :)

From ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com  Fri Sep 11 17:50:00 1998
From: ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 08:50:00 +0800
Subject: Governemnts should give up regulating Internet [CNN] (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809121414.JAA15432@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:
>From ravage at ssz.com Sat Sep 12 09:13:45 1998
From: Jim Choate 
Message-Id: <199809121413.JAA15418 at einstein.ssz.com>
Subject: Governemnts should give up regulating Internet [CNN]
To: users at ssz.com (SSZ User Mail List)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 09:13:39 -0500 (CDT)
Cc: friends at ssz.com (Ravage's Friends)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 2001      

Forwarded message:

> X-within-URL: http://www.cnn.com/TECH/computing/9809/11/govnet.idg/

>                GOVERNMENTS CAN'T HANDLE INTERNET, SAYS MAGAZINER

>    September 11, 1998
>    Web posted at 1:20 PM EDT
>    
>    by Jana Sanchez-Klein
>    
>    LONDON (IDG) -- European countries should cooperate with the U.S. to
>    create an Internet that is regulated by the industry rather than by
>    governments, said Ira Magaziner, senior adviser to U.S. President Bill
>    Clinton for Internet policy development, at The Wall Street Journal
>    Europe's Fifth Annual CEO Summit on Converging Technologies.
>    
>    "We are trying to come to an agreement with the European Union where
>    they recognize our approach," said Magaziner, a speaker at the
>    conference here today.
>    
>    He outlined the importance of the Internet to the U.S. and world
>    economies and said that it was not up to governments to attempt to
>    control Internet use and commerce. Magaziner attributed one-third of
>    all economic growth in the U.S. to the building of the Internet. But,
>    he warned, "if goods are overtaxed or overregulated, it's hard to do
>    business. The private sector should lead."
>    
>    Governments are ill-equipped to handle the Internet, because it
>    changes too rapidly, it's too decentralized and too international,
>    suggested Magaziner.
>    
>    "The digital age moves too quickly for government action," he said.

[text deleted]

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From declan at well.com  Fri Sep 11 19:03:59 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:03:59 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809112128.OAA14441@zendia.mentat.com>
Message-ID: 

On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Jim Gillogly wrote:
> 
> If they  decide this is now a requirement for high office, I'd like
> to see all the Congresscritters who've had sex out of wedlock and
> concealed it take one step forward.  Shall we make hypocrisy in high
> office impeachable also?

A better question is: If Clinton is guilty of perjury and other felonies,
should he be impeached? 

If you don't think about lying about sex and related issues under oath
should be a crime, well, then change the law. But right now any form of
lying under oath is perjury, whether you like it or not. 

-Declan

From ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com  Fri Sep 11 19:12:31 1998
From: ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:12:31 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809121536.KAA15651@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:

> Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 08:05:07 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Declan McCullagh 
> Subject: Re: Clinton's fake apologies

> On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Jim Gillogly wrote:
> > 
> > If they  decide this is now a requirement for high office, I'd like
> > to see all the Congresscritters who've had sex out of wedlock and
> > concealed it take one step forward.  Shall we make hypocrisy in high
> > office impeachable also?
> 
> A better question is: If Clinton is guilty of perjury and other felonies,
> should he be impeached? 
> 
> If you don't think about lying about sex and related issues under oath
> should be a crime, well, then change the law. But right now any form of
> lying under oath is perjury, whether you like it or not. 

As rare as it is, I agree with Declan here. If Clinton would lie under oath
about a non-crime (ie sex between consenting adults) what would he do if
faced with a real issue?

He should have said "Yeah, I had sex with her. What business is it of
yours?".

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From rah at shipwright.com  Fri Sep 11 19:44:16 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:44:16 +0800
Subject: IP: [Fwd: new threat to privacy]
Message-ID: 

--- begin forwarded text

Delivered-To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
X-ROUTED: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:35:58 -0500
X-TCP-IDENTITY: Bucsplace
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:30:29 -0400
From: oldbat 
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: IP 
Subject: IP: [Fwd: new threat to privacy]
Sender: owner-ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Precedence: list
Reply-To: oldbat 

From: "Bill Prince" 
Newsgroups: misc.survivalism
Subject: new threat to privacy
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 16:14:54 -0400
Organization: MindSpring Enterprises
Message-ID: <6t9bu9$spm$1 at camel15.mindspring.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: user-37kbbqr.dialup.mindspring.com
X-Server-Date: 10 Sep 1998 20:14:01 GMT
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.0518.4
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.0518.4
Path:
news.dx.net!news.accessus.net!news2.rdr.net!news-out.internetmci.com!news.intern
etMCI.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!4.1.16.34!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bb
nplanet.com!firehose.mindspring.com!not-for-mail

There is another powerful tool for surreptitiously intercepting
data, but it is only available to law enforcement and the
military. Called DIRT (Data Interception and Remote
Transmission), it was released in June by Codex Data Systems.
http://www.thecodex.com/dirt.html

Investigators need only know your e-mail address to secretly
install the program. Once they do, investigators can read your
documents, view your images, download your files and intercept
your encryption keys. DIRT was developed to assist law
enforcement in pedophilia investigations, but future uses could
include drug investigations, money laundering cases and
information warfare.

- -
Bill Prince | Orlando, Florida |
Linuxori te salutamus!
Take out the SPAM to email me!
- -

--- end forwarded text

-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From jya at pipeline.com  Fri Sep 11 19:46:58 1998
From: jya at pipeline.com (John Young)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:46:58 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809112128.OAA14441@zendia.mentat.com>
Message-ID: <199809121548.LAA14443@camel14.mindspring.com>

Declan, a few questions on the CDs of the Starr report: 

1. Did the press get the CDs, say, embargoed, before the House 
authorized release? 

2. Who handled the CD distribution, the House or Starr or 3rd 
party?

3. Do you know anything about how the CDs were made, by 
Starr's op or some other party, and when made?

4. Will there be pre-releases of press-only CDs of the remaining 
material, that is, is there a boxed-series prepared of the whole
wad for lobbing week by weekly?

This is a query about fake news, lying, perjuring, you know, to
the American People, whatever that junk-populace is cooked 
up to be.

From jimg at mentat.com  Fri Sep 11 19:49:06 1998
From: jimg at mentat.com (Jim Gillogly)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:49:06 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
Message-ID: <199809121549.IAA28683@zendia.mentat.com>

Declan wrote:
> On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Jim Gillogly wrote:
> > 
> > If they  decide this is now a requirement for high office, I'd like
> > to see all the Congresscritters who've had sex out of wedlock and
> > concealed it take one step forward.  Shall we make hypocrisy in high
> > office impeachable also?
> 
> A better question is: If Clinton is guilty of perjury and other felonies,
> should he be impeached?

IANAL (feel free to weigh in here, Unicorn), but I heard on one show or
another that lying under oath is perjury only if it's material to the
suit.  Since the Jones case was dismissed, it was argued that even if he
lied then, it wasn't material and thus wasn't perjury -- they claimed that
nobody had every been convicted of perjury for lying in a case that was
dismissed.  Of course he's saying he didn't even lie: like Kinky Friedman
and the Texas Jewboys, as espoused in their legal treatise "Waitret, please
waitret, come sit on my face", he believes that "Eatin' ain't cheatin'."
YMMV.

In any case, despite these legalisms, I'm not convinced that perjury in
any case should be considered treason or high crimes and misdemeanors.
The Founding Fathers could have been more specific about what was
impeachable, and they chose not to be, leaving it intentionally ambiguous.

Despite those arguments, this stuff really isn't about perjury: it's about
the Republicans' case of nixon envy... Clinton's peccadillos are a far cry
from Watergate (or Teapot Dome or Iran-Contra), but it's the best chance
they've had since the Crook was dumped.

> If you don't think about lying about sex and related issues under oath
> should be a crime, well, then change the law. But right now any form of
> lying under oath is perjury, whether you like it or not. 

If he did commit perjury, would that be an impeachable offense?  I claim
it's up to the House to interpret just what constitutes high crimes and
misdemeanors, since it isn't spelled out in the Constitution.

Disclaimer -- I'm not a Democrat, and I'm annoyed with Clinton's behavior
on crypto issues.  If I appear to be defending him, it's inadvertant -- I
just feel he should be attacked on material points rather than whatever
sleazy stuff Starr has found under his rocks.

	Jim 

From ravage at einstein.ssz.com  Fri Sep 11 20:02:29 1998
From: ravage at einstein.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 11:02:29 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809121625.LAA15937@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:

> Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 08:49:56 -0700
> From: jimg at mentat.com (Jim Gillogly)
> Subject: Re: Clinton's fake apologies

> In any case, despite these legalisms, I'm not convinced that perjury in
> any case should be considered treason or high crimes and misdemeanors.
> The Founding Fathers could have been more specific about what was
> impeachable, and they chose not to be, leaving it intentionally ambiguous.

What part of:

High crimes and misdemeanors don't you understand?

Oh, and it isn't 'high misdemeanors'...

I figure it's the fact that 'principles' are involved that is confusing
everybody, no room to move like there is with relativism. Bottem line, he
held a public office, while in that office he should commit *NO* crime or
else he should loose that office. There was no abmiguity there in the minds
of the founding fathers and there shouldn't be in yours either. If this
confuses you then take it as an indication that you have a axiomatic
contradiction in your world view and need to rethink things in a serious
way.

As Jefferson said, if you hold a public office your public property.

Nail the son of a bitch to the wall, he did the crime let him do the time.

It's a pitty he doesn't have this sort of empathy for all those people he's
put in jail for consensual crimes during his tenure. The man has a base
double standard, let him pay for it.

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From honig at sprynet.com  Fri Sep 11 20:18:21 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 11:18:21 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912091319.007cca60@m7.sprynet.com>

:: 
Anon-To: Tim May , Jim Burnes , Declan
McCullagh 

At 12:12 PM 9/11/98 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>details about Clinton's cigar being inserted into Monica's vagina, about
>how Clinton talked with Congressional leaders while Monica was giving him a
>blowjob, and how Clinton suborned perjury and tampered with evidence....

There's a footnote that mentions oral-anal sex.  Perhaps in DC this
is a crime?

From honig at sprynet.com  Fri Sep 11 20:18:35 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 11:18:35 +0800
Subject: CDA? What CDA?
In-Reply-To: <19980912030005.7730.qmail@nym.alias.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912091811.007c2750@m7.sprynet.com>

At 03:00 AM 9/12/98 -0000, lcs Mixmaster Remailer wrote:
>CNN. Pathfinder. Everybody and his dog with a website. The White
>House. Posting "indecent material" on the web.
>
>I mean, I'm impressed.
>

Given the number of times that cigars are mentioned, its a regular
advertisement.  And I thought the gov't was fighting tobacco,
not finding novel uses for it.

From nobody at anon.olymp.org  Fri Sep 11 20:23:04 1998
From: nobody at anon.olymp.org (Anonymous)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 11:23:04 +0800
Subject: If there's a trial will some of us be witnesses?
Message-ID: <2e7c5862e97aaec19ba22db438e362d3@anonymous>

Vladimir Z. Nuri wrote:
> at one time, kevin mitnick was on this list, rumor has
> it. probably many of the world's premiere hackers have been at one time or
> another.

L. Detweiler and Phiber Optik were concurrently subscribed in early '93.
But you know that, don't you?

From honig at sprynet.com  Fri Sep 11 20:37:43 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 11:37:43 +0800
Subject: CDA? What CDA?
In-Reply-To: <19980912030005.7730.qmail@nym.alias.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912092058.007c4ae0@m7.sprynet.com>

At 10:39 PM 9/11/98 -0500, William H. Geiger III wrote:
>It sure will be a nice thing to throw in thier face next time they bring
>CDA up. :)
>

It'll help remind those youngsters who never experienced Nixon
how much you can trust people in power... at least for the next
few days, until their memories fade again...

From honig at sprynet.com  Fri Sep 11 20:49:56 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 11:49:56 +0800
Subject: Altoids & email
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912094145.007c4ae0@m7.sprynet.com>

"o.(708) Ms. Lewinsky gave him an antique paperweight in the shape of the
White House.(709) She also showed him an email describing the effect of
chewing Altoid mints before performing oral sex. Ms. Lewinsky was chewing
Altoids at the time, but the President replied that he did not have enough
time for oral sex.(710) "

So she followed the circulating email neterotica.. too bad she didn't 
know about infosec...

"Some of Ms. Lewinsky's statements about the relationship were
contemporaneously memorialized. These include deleted email recovered from
her home computer and her Pentagon computer, email messages retained by two
of the recipients,"

From geeman at best.com  Fri Sep 11 21:08:13 1998
From: geeman at best.com (geeman at best.com)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 12:08:13 +0800
Subject: IP: [Fwd: new threat to privacy]
Message-ID: <3.0.32.19980912094344.006ba0ec@shell15.ba.best.com>

ummm ... not to sound skeptical, but were did -this- thing come from?
looks like a crock to me.  here, guys: have at it, here's my email address.

ps: can you spell "agent provocateur" ---- (I'm not sure *I* can...)

At 11:43 AM 9/12/98 -0400, Robert Hettinga wrote:
>
>
>--- begin forwarded text
>
>
>Delivered-To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
>X-ROUTED: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:35:58 -0500
>X-TCP-IDENTITY: Bucsplace
>Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 10:30:29 -0400
>From: oldbat 
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>To: IP 
>Subject: IP: [Fwd: new threat to privacy]
>Sender: owner-ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
>Precedence: list
>Reply-To: oldbat 
>
>
>
>From: "Bill Prince" 
>Newsgroups: misc.survivalism
>Subject: new threat to privacy
>Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 16:14:54 -0400
>Organization: MindSpring Enterprises
>Message-ID: <6t9bu9$spm$1 at camel15.mindspring.com>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: user-37kbbqr.dialup.mindspring.com
>X-Server-Date: 10 Sep 1998 20:14:01 GMT
>X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.0518.4
>X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.0518.4
>Path:
>news.dx.net!news.accessus.net!news2.rdr.net!news-out.internetmci.com!news.i
ntern
>etMCI.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!4.1.16.34!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!ne
ws.bb
>nplanet.com!firehose.mindspring.com!not-for-mail
>
>There is another powerful tool for surreptitiously intercepting
>data, but it is only available to law enforcement and the
>military. Called DIRT (Data Interception and Remote
>Transmission), it was released in June by Codex Data Systems.
>http://www.thecodex.com/dirt.html
>
>Investigators need only know your e-mail address to secretly
>install the program. Once they do, investigators can read your
>documents, view your images, download your files and intercept
>your encryption keys. DIRT was developed to assist law
>enforcement in pedophilia investigations, but future uses could
>include drug investigations, money laundering cases and
>information warfare.
>
>- -
>Bill Prince | Orlando, Florida |
>Linuxori te salutamus!
>Take out the SPAM to email me!
>- -
>
>--- end forwarded text
>
>
>-----------------
>Robert A. Hettinga 
>Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
>44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
>"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
>[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
>experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
>
>
>

From ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com  Fri Sep 11 21:34:35 1998
From: ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 12:34:35 +0800
Subject: Is cypherpunks-unedited@toad.com broken?...
Message-ID: <199809121757.MAA16968@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:

> From MAILER-DAEMON at telekom.de Sat Sep 12 12:50:46 1998
> Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 18:53:07 +0200
> From: Mail Delivery Subsystem 
> Subject: Returned mail: Unable to deliver mail
> Message-Id: <9809111653.AB07969 at fw9.telekom.de>
> To: owner-cypherpunks at einstein.ssz.com
> 
>    ----- Transcript of session follows -----
> 554 sendall: too many hops 19 (17 max): from , to owner-cypherpunks at ssz.com
> 
>    ----- Unsent message follows -----
> Received: by fw9.telekom.de; (5.65v3.2/1.3/10May95) id AA07969; Fri, 11 Sep 1998 18:53:07 +0200
> Received: from einstein.ssz.com by fw9.telekom.de (smtpxd); id XA05182
> Received: (from bin at localhost) by einstein.ssz.com (8.6.12/8.6.9) id LAA00752 for cypherpunks-outgoing; Thu, 10 Sep 1998 11:16:26 -0500
> Received: from somewhere by smtpxd
> Received: from somewhere by smtpxd
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> From: myemail at any.where.com
> Received: from somewhere by smtpxd
> Received: from somewhere by smtpxd
> Received: from somewhere by smtpxd
> Received: from somewhere by smtpxd
> Received: from somewhere by smtpxd
> Message-Id: <199809101721.DEK5253 at myserver.com>
> Date: ��, 10 ��� 1998 17:21:34
> Subject: Exhibitions in Russia
> X-Uidl: 870483789,239
> To: cypherpunks-unedited at toad.com
> X-Mailing-List: cypherpunks at algebra.com
> X-List-Admin: ichudov at algebra.com
> X-Loop: cypherpunks at algebra.com
> Sender: owner-cypherpunks at ssz.com
> Precedence: bulk
> X-Mailing-List: cypherpunks at ssz.com
> X-List-Admin: list at ssz.com
> X-Loop: ssz.com
> X-Language: English, Russian, German
> 
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> 
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> -----------------------------------------------------
> 

From wombat at mcfeely.bsfs.org  Fri Sep 11 21:41:05 1998
From: wombat at mcfeely.bsfs.org (Rabid Wombat)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 12:41:05 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980912091319.007cca60@m7.sprynet.com>
Message-ID: 

On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, David Honig wrote:

> :: 
> Anon-To: Tim May , Jim Burnes , Declan
> McCullagh 
> 
> At 12:12 PM 9/11/98 -0700, Tim May wrote:
> >details about Clinton's cigar being inserted into Monica's vagina, about
> >how Clinton talked with Congressional leaders while Monica was giving him a
> >blowjob, and how Clinton suborned perjury and tampered with evidence....
> 
> There's a footnote that mentions oral-anal sex.  Perhaps in DC this
> is a crime?
> 
> 

If kissing an asshole is a crime, they'd have to lock up the whole city.

Besides, where else can you get caught on tape smoking crack with a 
hooker, and still get re-elected mayor?

From declan at well.com  Fri Sep 11 21:53:22 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 12:53:22 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809121549.IAA28683@zendia.mentat.com>
Message-ID: 

1. it's tough to argue that clinton's apparent perjury in Jones was
immaterial

2. i know of no law saying perjury only a crime if it's "material"

3. perjury is certainly one of the "great offenses" that common law says
is impeachable.

4. besides, non-criminal activities can constitute impeachable offenses --
look at second and third articles of impeachment in Nixon's case

-Declan

On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, Jim Gillogly wrote:

> Declan wrote:
> > On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Jim Gillogly wrote:
> > > 
> > > If they  decide this is now a requirement for high office, I'd like
> > > to see all the Congresscritters who've had sex out of wedlock and
> > > concealed it take one step forward.  Shall we make hypocrisy in high
> > > office impeachable also?
> > 
> > A better question is: If Clinton is guilty of perjury and other felonies,
> > should he be impeached?
> 
> IANAL (feel free to weigh in here, Unicorn), but I heard on one show or
> another that lying under oath is perjury only if it's material to the
> suit.  Since the Jones case was dismissed, it was argued that even if he
> lied then, it wasn't material and thus wasn't perjury -- they claimed that
> nobody had every been convicted of perjury for lying in a case that was
> dismissed.  Of course he's saying he didn't even lie: like Kinky Friedman
> and the Texas Jewboys, as espoused in their legal treatise "Waitret, please
> waitret, come sit on my face", he believes that "Eatin' ain't cheatin'."
> YMMV.
> 
> In any case, despite these legalisms, I'm not convinced that perjury in
> any case should be considered treason or high crimes and misdemeanors.
> The Founding Fathers could have been more specific about what was
> impeachable, and they chose not to be, leaving it intentionally ambiguous.
> 
> Despite those arguments, this stuff really isn't about perjury: it's about
> the Republicans' case of nixon envy... Clinton's peccadillos are a far cry
> from Watergate (or Teapot Dome or Iran-Contra), but it's the best chance
> they've had since the Crook was dumped.
> 
> > If you don't think about lying about sex and related issues under oath
> > should be a crime, well, then change the law. But right now any form of
> > lying under oath is perjury, whether you like it or not. 
> 
> If he did commit perjury, would that be an impeachable offense?  I claim
> it's up to the House to interpret just what constitutes high crimes and
> misdemeanors, since it isn't spelled out in the Constitution.
> 
> Disclaimer -- I'm not a Democrat, and I'm annoyed with Clinton's behavior
> on crypto issues.  If I appear to be defending him, it's inadvertant -- I
> just feel he should be attacked on material points rather than whatever
> sleazy stuff Starr has found under his rocks.
> 
> 	Jim 
> 
> 

From declan at well.com  Fri Sep 11 21:57:04 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 12:57:04 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809121548.LAA14443@camel14.mindspring.com>
Message-ID: 

John, some of the press were relying on House sources to get the material
up as quickly as possible. Also AP provided it to its members on a
password-protected web site. I was the first in Time's DC bureau to get
the report; I'm not going to reveal my source save to say it wasn't
Starr's office. 

-Declan

On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, John Young wrote:

> Declan, a few questions on the CDs of the Starr report: 
> 
> 1. Did the press get the CDs, say, embargoed, before the House 
> authorized release? 
> 
> 2. Who handled the CD distribution, the House or Starr or 3rd 
> party?
> 
> 3. Do you know anything about how the CDs were made, by 
> Starr's op or some other party, and when made?
> 
> 4. Will there be pre-releases of press-only CDs of the remaining 
> material, that is, is there a boxed-series prepared of the whole
> wad for lobbing week by weekly?
> 
> This is a query about fake news, lying, perjuring, you know, to
> the American People, whatever that junk-populace is cooked 
> up to be.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

From nobody at replay.com  Fri Sep 11 22:24:17 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 13:24:17 +0800
Subject: Access to Eudora Export Controlled Archives
Message-ID: <199809121825.UAA20834@replay.com>

On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Eudora Export Control Team wrote:

> Be sure to keep this username and password to yourself.  If someone 

You know, this kind of crap never ceases to make me chuckle. Mail a list
with thousands of people, which is archived all over the place, and add in
"Be sure to keep this username and password to yourself."

This is very effective export control.

From ravage at einstein.ssz.com  Fri Sep 11 22:37:46 1998
From: ravage at einstein.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 13:37:46 +0800
Subject: Deletion test
Message-ID: <199809121851.NAA17371@einstein.ssz.com>

Deletion test

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From jya at pipeline.com  Fri Sep 11 23:10:00 1998
From: jya at pipeline.com (John Young)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 14:10:00 +0800
Subject: Investigating the Suspect Computer
Message-ID: <199809121910.PAA03207@camel14.mindspring.com>

Is there a PKZip-encryption cracker online for the 
following program which claims to offer a link to a 
couple of dozen shareware password crackers of
popular programs?  The exe-file is easily downloaded. 
There's a copy for testing for privacy protection:

   http://jya.com/pci-pack.exe (20K)

Investigating the Suspect Computer
PC Data Recovery for the Criminal Investigator
Law Enforcement Use Only

   http//www.forensicdynamics.com/pccrime.htm

WHAT EXACTLY, DOES THE SOFTWARE DO ? 

The software is designed to almost completely automate
the formidable task of extracting forensic data from
today's modern personal computers with large or multiple
hard drives. The program automatically examines startup
files for "booby traps", and searches the entire machine
for "bomb" programs which, if triggered, could destroy
valuable evidence on the machine. PC-Investigator runs
exclusively from diskette, at the DOS level, and does
NOT perform any write operations to the hard drive. This
insures that fragile data, or files that may be evidence
which have been deleted, or are resident in "slack
space", are not inadvertently overwritten. 

A unique feature of the software is the ability to construct
custom-tailored reports. The catalog function extracts
and organizes all the files on the hard drive, and sorts
them into order by type, date and time, according to
directory. During this process, all the readable (text) files
are extracted into a separate list, and are organized by
type in the report. Also available is an extracted report
listing of graphic (picture) files, and files that are 
typically used on the Internet, along with an extracted list 

of word processor files, backup files, ASCII text, and files 
that are recovered by CHKDSK or SCANDISK, which are
commonly overlooked as a source of forensic evidence. 

PC-Investigator has unique features that duplicate the
manual functions normally performed during such
forensic investigations. The most valuable feature is the
ability to search all the files on the disk for the presence
of up to 600 words or phrases called HotWords, that you
supply in an editable file. This function is the equivalent
of the manual process of "Find Files and Folders" / "Files
Containing" under Windows 95 , which typically takes
30 seconds to 3 minutes to do manually for each word or
phrase you are looking for. The function is performed
using words and phrases from the HotWord list,
hundreds of times per second.

A typical 2 Gigabyte hard drive may contain over 500
readable text files. A manual search for the occurrence of
a single word or phrase occurring in those files typically
takes 90 seconds. If you had to search for those 200
words manually, the time required would be  5 hours at
the keyboard. The HotWord search feature of PC-

Investigator performs this function on a 486/50 machine
in just under 45 minutes. If the number of files to be
searched is substantially higher, such as on today's large
hard drives (typically 2 to 4 Gigabytes, with 12 Gigabyte
drives available on top-end systems) the time required to
perform an exhaustive search would be proportionately
higher (500 to 1,000 man-hours). PC-Investigator
completely searches a 2 Gigabyte drive n a 486/120
machine in just under 24 hours. The faster the processor,

and hard disk controller, the faster the program will run to
completion. 

The best part is that each file containing any of the words
or phrases in your list is cataloged in the report, along
with the number of "hits" or HotWords found in the file.
After the program is started, and the desired options are
selected, the program will run un-attended, doing the
work that would normally not be done in such cases
because of the tremendous amount of time and effort
involved. Of course, files which do not contain "clear
text", or are DES or BLOWFISH / PGP encrypted will not
be flagged by the program. However, we have software
which addresses the problem of APPLICATION
encryption - that is - files which are encrypted by the
application which created them. For example, LOTUS
123, Quick Books, PFS Professional, and WordPerfect
are among the few programs which offer in-application
encryption of files. 

The program does NOT extract or examine the data from
"slack space". However, running the program is easy,
and can be done by almost anyone with a bit of computer
skills. The software is designed as a preliminary
investigative tool, to determine if a machine should be
examined by a professional. If this program indicates a
"HOT" machine, you can be certain that a more
extensive investigation is warranted. 

             -----

PCI-PACK.EXE 

Includes PC-Investigator software, manual and
Investigating The Suspect Computer 

THIS PACKAGE IS DISTRIBUTED TO LAW ENFORCEMENT AND 
PRIVATE INVESTIGATORS ONLY!!  THE ARCHIVE FILE IS [PKZip] 
ENCRYPTED, AND YOU WILL NEED A PASSWORD TO EXTRACT
THE ARCHIVE.  IF YOU ARE NOT WORKING IN LAW ENFORCEMENT, 
DON'T BOTHER TO DOWNLOAD THE FILE, WE WILL NOT DISTRIBUTE 
THE PASSWORD UNLESS WE CAN VERIFY YOUR CREDENTIALS. 

From atomic at odyssee.net  Sat Sep 12 14:21:09 1998
From: atomic at odyssee.net (Louis Archambault)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 14:21:09 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: ANNOUNCE: Bay Area Cypherpunks, Sat. Sept. 12, 12-6, KPMG  Mountain View
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980910170625.00cd8ec0@idiom.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19980912172144.02cf4948@10.0.0.1>

unsubscribe

From ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com  Sat Sep 12 00:29:19 1998
From: ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 15:29:19 +0800
Subject: 2A (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809122052.PAA17723@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:

> Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 22:00:12 -0400
> From: David Miller 
> Subject: 2A

> The thought I had (actually, it was explained to me), about the
> BoR is that, you know that in contracts/law, if there is a conflict
> within a text/body of law, that which was legally written last
> overrides the earlier statement.  (e.g. the fine print is always
> at *the bottom* of contracts).  Think:  a law is passed saying
> that something is legal, now another one is passed saying that it
> is illegal... Which law wins?  The second one, obviously, so long
> as it was legally passed.

Contract law is civil law, the Constitution isn't civil law it is the
charter defining how the government is supposed to work. If we accept this
then no part of the Constitution is safe because it could be over-ridden
this way, clearly not what the founding fathers intended in practice or
principle.

> Well, same with the BoR/Admendments.  As AMENDMENTS, they override
> the main body of the Constitution, if there is a conflict.  This
> is plain, simple, contractual law, and holds anywhere that people
> negotiate contracts.
> 
> Consider:  The main body of the C says that the Senate can ratify
> treaties, such as the UN resolution to confiscate privately-owned
> small arms.  Yet there is the 2A.  Which wins?  The 2A because it
> is the overriding law of the land, higher than the authority of
> the main body of the C to give the Senate that power when there is
> a conflict between parts of the law.
> 
> Conclusion:  The UN should get your guns and ammo one bullet at a
> time.

This is lawyer bullshit, the 10th states very clearly, as well as the
last sentence of the inter-state commerce clause, that the Constitution has
to be taken in toto. The legislators and courts don't get to pick and choose.

Furthermore, since the amendments dealing with prohabition were passed prior
to the 16th they set a precedence that requires that subsequent amendemnts
must specify what they are changing, the 16th doesn't do that. One could
argue on that alone that the 16th as currently worded is invalid since it
didn't meet prior precedence and by extension wasn't passed legaly.

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From honig at sprynet.com  Sat Sep 12 01:07:31 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 16:07:31 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <199809121625.LAA15937@einstein.ssz.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912140527.007d2ad0@m7.sprynet.com>

At 11:25 AM 9/12/98 -0500, Jim Choate wrote:
>Forwarded message:
>
>What part of:
>
>High crimes and misdemeanors don't you understand?
>
>Oh, and it isn't 'high misdemeanors'...

There is no evidence that Clinton actually *inhaled* on the
flavored cigar...

From ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com  Sat Sep 12 01:32:55 1998
From: ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 16:32:55 +0800
Subject: Ooops...16 is before 18th & 21st
Message-ID: <199809122156.QAA18031@einstein.ssz.com>

Ooops, guess I was in some sort of fugue and forgot how to count...

Clearly the 16th is before the 18th or 21st amendments.

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From brian at smarter.than.nu  Sat Sep 12 01:37:27 1998
From: brian at smarter.than.nu (Brian W. Buchanan)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 16:37:27 +0800
Subject: Investigating the Suspect Computer
In-Reply-To: <199809121910.PAA03207@camel14.mindspring.com>
Message-ID: 

> THIS PACKAGE IS DISTRIBUTED TO LAW ENFORCEMENT AND 
> PRIVATE INVESTIGATORS ONLY!!  THE ARCHIVE FILE IS [PKZip] 
> ENCRYPTED, AND YOU WILL NEED A PASSWORD TO EXTRACT
> THE ARCHIVE.  IF YOU ARE NOT WORKING IN LAW ENFORCEMENT, 
> DON'T BOTHER TO DOWNLOAD THE FILE, WE WILL NOT DISTRIBUTE 
> THE PASSWORD UNLESS WE CAN VERIFY YOUR CREDENTIALS. 

6161234432565677 possibilities for up to 8 printable-characters (roughly 2^52)

217180147133 poss. for up to 8 lowercase letters (roughly 2^38)

54507958502609 poss. for up to 8 lower/upper letters (roughly 2^46)

221919451578029 poss. for up to 8 alphanumeric chars. (roughly 2^48)

Apparently, the password can be up to 80 printable characters in length...

715934338421370680344382998236434541670979942120825502830105586745112050\
939906381266091474511676185877408805164512571770773165479768270778933665\
90119714237357 possibilities worst-case (roughly 2^524)

According to one of the READMEs that comes with a public domain
implementation of the PKZIP crypto algorithm, there is a known-plaintext
attack against it described at http://www.cryptography.com/.

If it's 8 or less lower-case letters, it would seem that it's probably
crackable in a reasonable amount of time on a high-end desktop PC or
workstation.  Anything more would probably require a distributed attack.

-- 
Brian Buchanan                                      brian at smarter.than.nu

Never believe that you know the whole story.

From brianbr at together.net  Sat Sep 12 01:45:54 1998
From: brianbr at together.net (Brian B. Riley)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 16:45:54 +0800
Subject: radio net
Message-ID: <199809122147.RAA23457@mx01.together.net>

On 9/8/98 2:29 PM, Ryan Lackey (ryan at systemics.ai)  passed this wisdom:

>Is anyone else interested in setting up a radio net (probably packet radio
>relay) to relay small quantities of data in the event the telecommunications
>infrastructure becomes unavailable (either technically or 
>legally/politically/militarily)?  There are existing packet relay nets, but 
>in my experience amateur radio people, especially in the US, are very 
>willing to roll over for the government at the slightest cause.

 you tar with too wide a brush ... one of the pioneers of ham packet 
radio is Phil Karn, who definitely isn't in to submissive roll overs! For 
that matter neither am I, though, sadly the greater number of hams do fit 
your description.

>I think the cost would be something like $1-5k per station, and it could
>be done in a fairly turnkey fashion.  Exactly how to handle routing and
>what protocol to use on the network is kind of an open question -- there
>are a lot of solutions, none of them optimal.

 so what are you interested in setting up????

Brian B. Riley --> http://members.macconnect.com/~brianbr
 For PGP Keys  

  "One of the deep mysteries to me is our logo, the symbol of lust
   and knowledge, bitten into, all crossed with in the colors of the
   rainbow in the wrong order. You couldn't dream of a more 
   appropriate logo: lust, knowledge, hope, and anarchy."
   -- Gassee - Apple Logo

From nobody at sind.hyperreal.art.pl  Sat Sep 12 01:53:42 1998
From: nobody at sind.hyperreal.art.pl (HyperReal-Anon)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 16:53:42 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies (fwd)
Message-ID: 

On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, David Honig wrote:

> There is no evidence that Clinton actually *inhaled* on the
> flavored cigar...

Something here is a little fishy...

From vznuri at netcom.com  Sat Sep 12 02:49:36 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 17:49:36 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809121549.IAA28683@zendia.mentat.com>
Message-ID: <199809122249.PAA03858@netcom13.netcom.com>

Jimmy: the "sockpuppets" (as Lucien Goldberg calls them) who
defend clinton on TV (and are probably paid to)
are trying to advance the case that
lying in a civil case is rarely prosecuted, which is true, 
but has nothing to do with the law. apparently clinton & his
slimy lawyer teammates would tend to reassure all the women, such 
as Gennifer Flowers as I recall, that they could lie without
consequence in a civil trial.  at least those women whom they
didn't threaten to "break their pretty legs". a capricious
bunch, hmm?

also, there
may be some legal precedent that unless the lying had
to do with the case, it is not relevant to the case
(a reasonable situation I wouldn't be surprised if some
judge ruled)

but there's just no laws, as I understand it, that ever
allow lying under any circumstances, particularly in sitations
such as court hearings, depositions, etc.  in fact it can be
argued our whole legal system breaks down if lying is ever
sanctioned in any way. that's the problem. weasel clinton 
will always be looking for a loophole. I'm surprised you
gave the slightest credibility to claims that lying is
ever sanctioned under the law. 

there are a lot of paid-lowlife tentacles making the television circuit
defending clinton, I suspect. you've fallen prey to one of their
arguments.  he would have been trashed
long ago if it weren't for their thick, odious & treacherous
smokescreens, imho. there are a lot more traitors in this
country than Clinton, for sure. they all hang out together,
but few sheeple will ever know.

From jmcc at hackwatch.com  Sat Sep 12 03:05:11 1998
From: jmcc at hackwatch.com (John McCormac)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 18:05:11 +0800
Subject: Investigating the Suspect Computer
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <35FAFEA3.D737AC1B@hackwatch.com>

Brian W. Buchanan wrote:
> 
> > THIS PACKAGE IS DISTRIBUTED TO LAW ENFORCEMENT AND
> > PRIVATE INVESTIGATORS ONLY!!  THE ARCHIVE FILE IS [PKZip]
> > ENCRYPTED, AND YOU WILL NEED A PASSWORD TO EXTRACT
> > THE ARCHIVE.  IF YOU ARE NOT WORKING IN LAW ENFORCEMENT,

> According to one of the READMEs that comes with a public domain
> implementation of the PKZIP crypto algorithm, there is a 

A few years ago the plaintext attack was implmented. One of the first
tests was on an encrypted file released in Europe that was supposed to
contain the source code and emulation of the Sky 0A smartcard. It
cracked it in about 3 hours I seem to recall.

The implementation worked exceedingly well and ran on Linux. The page
says that the w95 version is also available. 

http://www.unix-ag.uni-kl.de/~conrad/krypto/pkcrack.html

Regards...jmcc
-- 
********************************************
John McCormac            * Hack Watch News
jmcc at hackwatch.com       * 22 Viewmount, 
Voice:   +353-51-873640  * Waterford,
BBS&Fax: +353-51-850143  * Ireland
http://www.hackwatch.com/~kooltek
********************************************

-----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----
Version: 2.6

mQCNAzAYPNsAAAEEAPGTHaNyitUTNAwF8BU6mF5PcbLQXdeuHf3xT6UOL+/Od+z+
ZOCAx8Ka9LJBjuQYw8hlqvTV5kceLlrP2HPqmk7YPOw1fQWlpTJof+ZMCxEVd1Qz
TRet2vS/kiRQRYvKOaxoJhqIzUr1g3ovBnIdpKeo4KKULz9XKuxCgZsuLKkVAAUX
tCJKb2huIE1jQ29ybWFjIDxqbWNjQGhhY2t3YXRjaC5jb20+tBJqbWNjQGhhY2t3
YXRjaC5jb20=
=sTfy
-----END PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK-----

From brianbr at together.net  Sat Sep 12 04:05:14 1998
From: brianbr at together.net (Brian B. Riley)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 19:05:14 +0800
Subject: radio net (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809130003.UAA29856@mx01.together.net>

On 9/9/98 8:39 AM, Jim Choate (ravage at einstein.ssz.com)  passed this 
wisdom:

>Forwarded message:
>
>> Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 00:51:49 -0700
>> From: "William J. Hartwell" 
>> Subject: Re: radio net
>
>> I think a radio network linked to the Amateur networks sending secure
>> packets, 
>> using tunneling or maybe just encrypted traffic (There may be some FCC
>> rules regarding this.
>
>The FCC prohibits the transmission of encrypted data via analog or digital
>signals by amateurs.

 The FCC prohibits the use of transmissions encoded specifically to 
obscure the content of the traffic (which is exactly what our reason for 
using encryption would be), in essence they prohibit using encrypted 
transmisions. However, by wording the ruling that way they leave the door 
open for things like the ham radio satellite command channel uplinks 
being encrypted for security reasons ... but to do so they must, upon 
request, be able to provide the Friendly Chocolate Company with their 
keys.

Brian B. Riley --> http://members.macconnect.com/~brianbr
  For PGP Keys  

 "For every action, there is an equal and opposite criticism."

From ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com  Sat Sep 12 04:07:38 1998
From: ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 19:07:38 +0800
Subject: radio net (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809130029.TAA18636@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:

> Subject: Re: radio net (fwd)
> Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 20:03:56 -0400
> From: "Brian B. Riley" 

> open for things like the ham radio satellite command channel uplinks 
> being encrypted for security reasons ... but to do so they must, upon 

Actualy the control channel for satellites must be encrypted by
international law.

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From brianbr at together.net  Sat Sep 12 04:26:34 1998
From: brianbr at together.net (Brian B. Riley)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 19:26:34 +0800
Subject: radio net
Message-ID: <199809130024.UAA12462@mx02.together.net>

On 9/10/98 10:28 PM, Robert Hettinga (rah at shipwright.com)  passed this 
wisdom:

>Hey, guys,
>
>Someone here already said it, but nobody else got it, so I'll repeat it:
>SSB, or Single Sideband. It's commercial ham radio, if you will, and all
>the ships use it. I expect that you can shove anything down an SSB set that
>you want, including encrypted traffic.
>
>Ham radio is a government nerd subsidy, and as such, doesn't do much but
>make more government funded/sactioned/approved/whatever nerds. :-).
>
>SSB would do just fine. It's an international standard, after all, and
>probably not under the control of any one government, even.e

 Bob, I am afraid you are showing your ignorance here. SSB is just one of 
the many modes of emission standardized in radio communications, its used 
by the amateur radio service (ham) , the citizens radio service (cb), the 
military, etc ...

 The real problem is that to build any sort of network would require some 
fixed positions, which, if it were intended to be 'clandestine' would be 
compromised sooner or later ... either that or several poor shnooks would 
have full time jobs driving vans around and around to keep the RDF snoops 
guessing ...

 In general there would be a better chance of pulling it off if you 
stayed away from the ham radio bands. 'self-policing' is not a character 
of another bands except the commercial broadcast bands.

 Spread spectrum would have more promise as many stations could be on the 
air at once on the same frequency thus making life quite confusing for 
the T-hunters. 

Brian B. Riley --> http://members.macconnect.com/~brianbr
  For PGP Keys  

   "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too 
    much liberty than those attending too small a degree of it." 
      -- Thomas Jefferson

From jya at pipeline.com  Sat Sep 12 04:59:39 1998
From: jya at pipeline.com (John Young)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 19:59:39 +0800
Subject: Investigating the Suspect Computer
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <199809130056.UAA05048@camel8.mindspring.com>

There's a batch of PKZip and other program cracker tools at:

   http://www.theargon.com/tools.html

With links to other sites, which link to more, into the dark psychoses
of Trans-Ural and Andean regions -- some of the DNS's are off the
charts.

Even so, none seem to work on the pci-pack.exe I grabbed, at least
not for me. The file may not be complete, or it's a decoy, or all the
vile crackers I unzipped are DIRT-virii death-writhing in my unzapped 
prostate.

From frissell at panix.com  Sat Sep 12 05:52:33 1998
From: frissell at panix.com (Duncan Frissell)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 20:52:33 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809121549.IAA28683@zendia.mentat.com>
Message-ID: <199809130146.VAA08964@mail1.panix.com>

At 10:54 AM 9/12/98 -0700, Declan McCullagh wrote:
>1. it's tough to argue that clinton's apparent perjury in Jones was
>immaterial
>
>2. i know of no law saying perjury only a crime if it's "material"
>
>3. perjury is certainly one of the "great offenses" that common law says
>is impeachable.
>
>4. besides, non-criminal activities can constitute impeachable offenses --
>look at second and third articles of impeachment in Nixon's case
>
>-Declan

In addition, the last man impeached and convicted by Congress (circa 1988)
Judge Alcy Hastings (sp?) was convicted for perjury in a tax evasion case
in which he was acquitted of the original charges.  Hastings was later
elected to Congress from Florida and last week dissed Clinton by not
attending a fundraiser he held there for the Democrat candidate for
governor.  Hastings said that he has yet to make up his mind on Clinton and
wants to review the evidence.

DCF

From tcmay at got.net  Sat Sep 12 06:16:36 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 21:16:36 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: <199809121625.LAA15937@einstein.ssz.com>
Message-ID: 

I've seen several Cypherpunks express the opinion that can be summarized as
"We paid $40 million for _this_?" And "Ken Starr is on a witch hunt."

Indeed, a lot of money spend by the Independent Prosecutor. And Starr is
indeed a Grand Inquisitor.

But he is following the law, and Attorney General Janet Reno authorized his
latest venture.

I'm generally pleased with what's happening. Many points to make:

* What goes around, comes around. The Liberal puke Democrats who crucified
Bob Packwood, Clarence Thomas, and any number of corporate people charged
with "sexual harassment," are now reaping what they sowed. "If she says it
happened, it happened," the mantra of the feminazi left, is now apparently
forgotten by Patricia It's not our business" Ireland.

* And it was the Dems who pushed through the Independent Prosecutor Act (or
whatever the precise name is). They've reaped the whirlwind, as it were.

* Lawmaking is paralzyed, frozen, stillborne. This I count as a Good Thing.
Even better will be another 8-10 months of this nightly spectacle. No
Health Care Reform, no Communications Decency Act II, no Tobacco Act,
nothing.

(By the way, a danger will be having Republicans sweep into power in
November and then making mischief about morality, new laws about crypto and
terrorism, etc.)

* Clinton is of course shown to be a liar, a perjurer, a suborner of
perjury, an abuser of his office, and a duplicitous jerk who spouts NOW
mantras while doing what any CEO in America would be fired and sued over.
(Not that I support any such lawsuits.)

* This disgraces the Presidency, which I also count as a Good Thing. There
were hopes that Nixon's downfall would be the end of the Imperial
Presidency, but, alas, the pomp and circumstance continued unabated. It's
time we demystify this whole President thing and start asking why the fuck
we should let some tinhorn politician spend our money.

* Children will be taught that the President is a liar, adulterer, creep,
jerk, fool, pervert, and general scumbag. (A friend of mine has been
pointing out to his 10-year-old son that Clinton is a lying piece of dog
shit, a monster who professes to lead us all morally while poking cigars in
Monica's cunt and then going to church to piously opine about the need for
values....not that the cigar thing is ipso facto immoral, just at odds with
his "family values" nonsense.

* Let us all hope this "does not go to completion" (ha ha) for many, many
months. Let us hope all see that this nation of laws is built on lies and
perjurious talking points.

* I know that if I'm called to testify in court I'll be sorely tempted to
say: "As for telling the truth, I plan to follow the example of the
President."

Ironically, this situation is now so well known that such a statement would
almost certainly be taken by a judge today as contempt of court. And yet we
put up with having this lying sack of shit in the White House.

I am chortling.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From blancw at cnw.com  Sat Sep 12 06:56:21 1998
From: blancw at cnw.com (Blanc)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 21:56:21 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <000301bddec2$d088f460$238195cf@blanc>

>From Bill Clinton, via  WASHINGTON (Reuters):

: 	First, I want to say to all of you that, as you might imagine, I
: have been on quite a journey these last few weeks to get to the end
: of this, to the rock bottom truth of where I am and where we all are.

But we are not the ones whose direction (moral compass?) is in question, as we're not all
in this together.  We only found out about it in Jan/February.

: I agree with those who have said that in my first statement after I
: testified I was not contrite enough.  I don't think there is a fancy
: way to say that I have sinned.

i.e.:   Now that there was unavoidable evidence of a DNA match, and in view of 23 boxes of
a report distributed to everyone in Congress and everyone else in the whole world, it's
time to look more seriously repentant, in an off-hand sort of way.   (memory:  "I hope
things go well for her."  For HER ! )

: 	It is important to me that everybody who has been hurt know that
: the sorrow I feel is genuine: first and most important, my family;
: also my friends, my staff, my Cabinet, Monica Lewinsky and her
: family, and the American people.  I have asked all for their
: forgiveness.

He wasn't hurting in January.  Nor in February, March, April, May, June, July . . .

: 	But I believe that to be forgiven, more than sorrow is required
: -- at least two more things.  First, genuine repentance -- a
: determination to change and to repair breaches of my own making.  I
: have repented.

Since his sex life is personal, and nobody really cares as long as it doesn't affect his
Presidential duties, why would anybody care that he's repentant?  (don't tell me, I know.
. .)

:Second, what my bible calls a "broken spirit"; an
: understanding that I must have God's help to be the person that I
: want to be; a willingness to give the very forgiveness I seek; a
: renunciation of the pride and the anger which cloud judgment, lead
: people to excuse and compare and to blame and complain.

To excuse and compare and to blame who?  What makes him think anyone will be blaming him
for doing anything wrong?  He didn't think it was wrong for 3 or so years with Monica.
Nor for 10 or so years with Jennifer.  What would make it wrong now, at this "particular
moment in time. . . ."

: 	Now, what does all this mean for me and for us?  First, I will
: instruct my lawyers to mount a vigorous defense, using all available
: appropriate arguments.  But legal language must not obscure the fact
: that I have done wrong.

Legally defensible; morally indefensible.  Any relation?

:Second, I will continue on the path of
: repentance, seeking pastoral support and that of other caring people
: so that they can hold me accountable for my own commitment.

Because of his proven "pattern" of straying from the "path of righteousness".

: 	Third, I will intensify my efforts to lead our country and the
: world toward peace and freedom, prosperity and harmony, in the hope
: that with a broken spirit and a still strong heart I can be used for
: greater good, for we have many blessings and many challenges and so
: much work to do.
: 	In this, I ask for your prayers and for your help in healing our
: nation.

But it is not we need healing, being it not we, are sick.

:And though I cannot move beyond or forget this -- indeed, I
: must always keep it as a caution light in my life -- it is very
: important that our nation move forward.

He and his counsel keep saying this ("put it behind us", "move on", "move forward"), as
though trying to erase it from view - to obfuscate what has become apparent and continue
as though there was not something going on; something which seems to need "healing".  Yet
Starr keeps pressing on; on and onward.

It is ironic, in these times of absurd laws being created by both sides in government,
legislation advanced and supported by all manner of political interest groups, that lately
these creations of theirs come back to bite them.   Had there been no laws regarding
"sexual harrassment in the workplace", the Jones case would not have come up, Monica would
not have been brought into the picture, and Clinton would not have had to ever worry about
being revealed for his "not-illegal" behavior.

Contradictions abound in this situation:

.  everyone should have a private life -  but you're not supposed to do it in the
Whitehouse (that holy place of morally superior governing operations); in particular,
while you're discussing "matters of greater importance to the nation" on the phone

.  having sex is not illegal, when it's between consenting parties  -  but you're not
supposed to cheat on your spouse, in particular if you're a Christian (Baptist?) who goes
to Church every Sunday and worships the source of the 10 Commandments

.  people are saying that the sex acts were "horrible" and "nasty" and "disgusting"  -
like they themselves would *never* think of doing equally lascivious things to each other
(like, who are they kidding)

.  whose fault is it that Ken Starr was assigned to hound down Clinton, and that it took
so long to get to this point?  Who was stalling, who needed to tell the truth, why was
Clinton unavoidably *obligated* to tell the truth?   How paradoxical that an inveterate
liar (according to his reputation) would have put himself in a position where legally,
according to the law, the law of this Nation which he supports and leads into the Future,
he is required  to reveal the truth, even when decency would say that one should not be
coerced into self-incrimination over a personal, private matter, and should not have to
confess such things.

Deep irony, for times like these . . .

    ..
Blanc

From frissell at panix.com  Sat Sep 12 07:10:16 1998
From: frissell at panix.com (Duncan Frissell)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 22:10:16 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980912140527.007d2ad0@m7.sprynet.com>
Message-ID: <199809130309.XAA14731@mail1.panix.com>

At 07:18 PM 9/12/98 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>
>I've seen several Cypherpunks express the opinion that can be summarized as
>"We paid $40 million for _this_?" And "Ken Starr is on a witch hunt."

Ken Starr is investigating 5 separate Clinton criminal conspiracies.  Walsh
took 7 years and $60megs to investigate Iran/Contra (two criminal
conspiracies).

I like it when the rulers are consumed by their own creations.

DCF

Extra credit awarded for naming Starr's 5 investigations.

From tcmay at got.net  Sat Sep 12 07:39:33 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 22:39:33 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 8:11 PM -0700 9/12/98, Duncan Frissell wrote:
>At 07:18 PM 9/12/98 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>>
>>I've seen several Cypherpunks express the opinion that can be summarized as
>>"We paid $40 million for _this_?" And "Ken Starr is on a witch hunt."
>
>Ken Starr is investigating 5 separate Clinton criminal conspiracies.  Walsh
>took 7 years and $60megs to investigate Iran/Contra (two criminal
>conspiracies).
>
>I like it when the rulers are consumed by their own creations.
>
>DCF
>
>Extra credit awarded for naming Starr's 5 investigations.

Let's see:

-- Whitewater and Madison Guarantee (may be 2 separate investigations)

-- Filegate (White House had 1100 FBI files, overseen by Craig the Bar Bouncer)

-- Travelgate (replacing the old staff is kosher, but accusing them of
crimes is not)

-- Cigargate

And of course there were and are investigations of Ron Brown, Hazel
O'Leary, Ron Espe, Henry Cisneros, and nearly every one of the "rainbow
coalition" he installed...seems only the honkies are not being
investigated, which says either there's a coincidence, or the honkies are
getting a pass, or the minorities he put in were your basic political graft
appointees.

I'd say that a President who lives by the sword will die by the sword, but
this might get me a visit by one of his pimps, er, Secret Service stooges.
They grep for "President" and "die" in the same paragraph and have no
understanding of allusions.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From honig at sprynet.com  Sat Sep 12 08:25:05 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 23:25:05 +0800
Subject: radio net (fwd); RAND '64
In-Reply-To: <199809130029.TAA18636@einstein.ssz.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912212340.007c3670@m7.sprynet.com>

On a radio data network: 

See http://www.rand.org/publications/RM/RM3762/

In this Memorandum we consider something we have earlier referred to as
"poor-boy" microwave. The "poor-boy" designation resulted from an imposed
constraint on the design of an ensemble of microwave communications
equipments--namely, that the designer should have to pay for the system out
of his own pocket! Even so, a look at price tags for anything to do with
any large electronic or communications system would appear to render the
term "poor-boy" inappropriate. "Mini-cost," a contraction of
"minimum-cost," now seems more fitting.

Mini-cost microwave, therefore, is a minimum-cost, line-of-sight microwave
communications system designed to transmit digital information in as
inexpensive a manner as possible. It is one way of building the links for
the proposed Distributed Adaptive Message Block communications system with
which this series of Memoranda is concerned.

The distributed system itself is designed around digital modulation, using
redundant paths selected on an instant-by-instant basis. The communications
links for such a system can be built in a different manner than their
equivalents in today's systems, taking advantage of the system's less rigid
distortion level and tandem reliability requirements. The fundamental
objective for the system's links is that they permit formation of new
routes cheaply (a necessary survivability criterion), yet allow
transmission on the order of millions of bits per second (see ODC-I,
-VII[1]); system reliability and a low raw error rate are secondary. And,
since future networks conveying military traffic must be designed with the
expectation of heavy damage, powerful digital error detection and error
removal methods have been built into the system.

From alan at clueserver.org  Sat Sep 12 08:28:11 1998
From: alan at clueserver.org (Alan Olsen)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 23:28:11 +0800
Subject: Monica, slavegirl of Gor (fwd)
Message-ID: 

This was found on a different mailing lists.  names have been removed to
protect the guilty.

alan at ctrl-alt-del.com | Note to AOL users: for a quick shortcut to reply
Alan Olsen            | to my mail, just hit the ctrl, alt and del keys.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Subject: Re: Monica, slavegirl of Gor

The best opinion I've heard so far on this topic: "If the government's going to
spend $50 million on pornography, I'd rather it be by artists I support."

Carol

From honig at sprynet.com  Sat Sep 12 08:34:06 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 23:34:06 +0800
Subject: radio net (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <199809130029.TAA18636@einstein.ssz.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912213251.007cd230@m7.sprynet.com>

See also http://www.rand.org/publications/RM/RM3420/

In fact you may want to look at RAND's work On Distributed Communications
http://www.rand.org/publications/RM/RM3420/RM3420.list.html

Duck and cover your packets...

From alan at clueserver.org  Sat Sep 12 08:38:31 1998
From: alan at clueserver.org (Alan Olsen)
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 23:38:31 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, Tim May wrote:

> I've seen several Cypherpunks express the opinion that can be summarized as
> "We paid $40 million for _this_?" And "Ken Starr is on a witch hunt."
> 
> Indeed, a lot of money spend by the Independent Prosecutor. And Starr is
> indeed a Grand Inquisitor.

"Our weapons are Fear, Surprise, and our fanatical devotion to the
Demipublican party." 

> But he is following the law, and Attorney General Janet Reno authorized his
> latest venture.
> 
> I'm generally pleased with what's happening. Many points to make:

[snip]

Another that I think is relivant:

* He has been very anti-encryption for the American public, but is very
willing to use it to protect his own ass.  The hypocrasy of the situation
is glaring.

> Ironically, this situation is now so well known that such a statement would
> almost certainly be taken by a judge today as contempt of court. And yet we
> put up with having this lying sack of shit in the White House.
> 
> I am chortling.

"Now is the time on Sprockets when we dance!"

alan at ctrl-alt-del.com | Note to AOL users: for a quick shortcut to reply
Alan Olsen            | to my mail, just hit the ctrl, alt and del keys.

From honig at sprynet.com  Sat Sep 12 09:25:12 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 00:25:12 +0800
Subject: voice from the past
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912221213.007c9870@m7.sprynet.com>

On Secrecy of Secrecy

Without the freedom to expose the system proposal to widespread scrutiny'
by clever minds of diverse interests, is to increase the risk that
significant points of potential weakness have been overlooked. A frank and
open discussion here is to our advantage.

http://www.rand.org/publications/RM/RM3765/RM3765.chapter2.html

Chapter 3 has an excellent picture of a binary key on a hollerith card...
http://www.rand.org/publications/RM/RM3765/RM3765.chapter3.html

From honig at sprynet.com  Sat Sep 12 09:25:17 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 00:25:17 +0800
Subject: canadian cryptanalysis, eh?
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980912221243.007cf100@m7.sprynet.com>

http://watserv1.uwaterloo.ca/~brobinso/cryptan.html
also 
http://watserv1.uwaterloo.ca/~brobinso/rqmts.html

Suggested courses

�CA-105 - Introduction to Cryptography and Exploitation of Manual
Cryptosystems �CA-107 - Exploitation of Manual Cryptosystems �CA-123 -
Shift-Register Cryptology �CA-223 - Advanced Shift-Register Cryptology
�CA-247 - Vocoders for Cryptanalysts �MA-213 - PTAH �MA-246 -
Cryptomathematics for Mathematicians �MA-256 - Signal Processing
Mathematics[24] 

Knowledge of the following areas of Mathematics is required:

�Probability and Statistics including Stochastic and Markov Processes,
�Linear Algebra and Abstract Algebra including Finite Field Theory, Shift
Register and Polynomial Theory, �Communications, Information and Coding
Theory, �Sampling Theory, �Digital Filtering, �Numerical Methods, and �Fast
Transformation Algorithms. 

From stuffed at stuffed.net  Sun Sep 13 06:51:37 1998
From: stuffed at stuffed.net (STUFFED NEWS DAILY)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 06:51:37 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: COME & GET IT - HOTTEST ISSUE YET!
Message-ID: <19980913121914.16214.qmail@eureka.abc-web.com>

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       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/13/   <----

Welcome to  today's  issue of Stuffed. To read it you should
click on the URL above.  If it is not made clickable by your
email program  you will need to  use your mouse to highlight
the URL,  copy it and then paste it into your browser  (then
press Return).

This  email  is  never  sent  unsolicited.  Stuffed  is  the
supplement for the Eureka newsletter you subscribed to. Full
instructions on unsubscribing  are in every issue of Eureka!

       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/13/   <----

From rah at shipwright.com  Sat Sep 12 16:15:39 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 07:15:39 +0800
Subject: radio net
In-Reply-To: <199809130024.UAA12462@mx02.together.net>
Message-ID: 

At 8:24 PM -0400 on 9/12/98, Brian B. Riley wrote:

>  Bob, I am afraid you are showing your ignorance here.

I don't think so.

> SSB is just one of
> the many modes of emission standardized in radio communications, its used
> by the amateur radio service (ham) , the citizens radio service (cb), the
> military, etc ...

I know what Single Sideband means. As I've said before, and what you failed
to read later on in this thread, evidently, is that there are commercial
Single Sideband radios out there which have the range of ham sets. These
radios are used for commercial ship-to-shore traffic, and I expect that
encryption is legal on them. I expect that, because these frequencies are
subject to international convention rather than federal law, they have more
leeway (heh... nautical pun) on their use. Including, I bet, digital
packets and encryption.

>  The real problem is that to build any sort of network would require some
> fixed positions, which, if it were intended to be 'clandestine' would be
> compromised sooner or later ... either that or several poor shnooks would
> have full time jobs driving vans around and around to keep the RDF snoops
> guessing ...

My understanding is that Ryan's looking for some kind of post-infocalyptic
radio network for when it All Falls Down Sometime Soon (tm). I expect that
in that event, Ham would be fine, because there is no, as Mr. Gore likes to
say, controlling legal authority, to worry about. But, to put up and test a
network, commercial SSB would do just fine. And, of course, After The Big
One, what kind of long-distance shortwave radio you run it on will be
superfluous, ham, SSB or no.

>  In general there would be a better chance of pulling it off if you
> stayed away from the ham radio bands. 'self-policing' is not a character
> of another bands except the commercial broadcast bands.

Right, so (he says for the third time), why not just order a commerial
ship-to-shore SSB rig, something which costs within an order of magnitude,
plus or minus, of a Ham set, and go play?

>  Spread spectrum would have more promise as many stations could be on the
> air at once on the same frequency thus making life quite confusing for
> the T-hunters.

Right. If we had some, um, ham, we could have some ham and eggs. If we had
some eggs.

Cheers,
Bob Hettinga
-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From sorens at workmail.com  Sat Sep 12 17:02:27 1998
From: sorens at workmail.com (Soren)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 08:02:27 +0800
Subject: radio net
Message-ID: <35FBC34E.6B4F9127@workmail.com>

SSB xceivers cost <$700. Try any marine electronics store.  Best choice
is a ham xceiver with strap selectable SSB (actually a violation of FCC
dictate to enable SSB on a ham rig, but everyone does it anyway). This
would cost ~$1500, the Icom 7658 is a good one I know of. Go and get
your local equivalent of a VHF license, send in the extension to cover
SSB (~$50).   Then purchase a 'PacRat' from any ham hangout. I got mine
in Redwood City CA, on El Camino real - some years back now though.
This is a little box that hooks into the back of the ham/SSB set and
into a serial port of your PC.  It comes with some basic packet handling
software.  Last time I looked, PacRats were <$200.  Don't expect any
great xfr rates however.  Noise to signal requires many packet
retransmissions as the ionosphere is not a very good mirror.  Running
TCP/IP over it should be easily doable.  Basic use is to dial in the
frequency yourself on the SSB (this usually requires an auto-tuner ~$700
AND a manual tuner ~$100, for best results).  You need to get the best
antenna you can afford.  Unfortunately, antennas are frequency range
specific, so you'll probably need 3: one for 0-5000 miles, 5000-12000,
12000-?.  Its easy to rig the tuner to support 2-3 antennas, switch
selectable.  You need a Good Earth for anything to happen as expected.
By now it should be possible to get some extra SW to drive the freq
selection, so you could do spread spectrum.  This is not allowed of
course, as you are expected to do the call-sign exchange protocol on
each freq session.  There are freqs that are dedicated to digital
(ship-to-shore commercial).  You may have to get a commercial license
for this though.  One nasty thing about radio is that you share the
spectrum with others, so collisions tend to make a hash out of
reliability.  Store and forward at unpopular times such as 3:00 EST,
could be a good alternative.  The longer distance freqs (>12000), are
the most uncluttered, but suffer from the most noise to signal.  A
bounce across the pacific to the house next door, would be potentially
more reliable than a lower freq. Most of the ham sets also support FM,
so it would also be possible to piggyback on the ricochet freqs for line
of sight use. Or for a real adrenaline rush, piggyback the mil freqs.

If you really want to give the hams fits,  write a noise to morse engine
(or better yet, some captured call signs repeated endlessly) and swamp
the channels, where the old popular mechanics guys discuss their antenna
envy, at random intervals. 9:00 in the Ozarks is a fine time.  Sit back
and wait for the black vans to drive up.

"Educate, don't Agitate"

From frissell at panix.com  Sat Sep 12 17:13:59 1998
From: frissell at panix.com (Duncan Frissell)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 08:13:59 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
Message-ID: <199809131313.JAA12863@mail1.panix.com>

If nothing else, Clinton deserves his troubles because he is a very strong
supporter of the legal structures that caused them.

1)  He is a lawyer and a strong supporter of the trial lawyers who have
promoted extremely expansive civil discovery of the sort that allowed
Clinton to be questioned about Monica in the Jones case.

2)  He is a strong advocate of the sort of sexual harassment law that led
to the Jones case.  He thinks it should be punished harshly.  A real feminist.

3)  He is a strong advocate of the Ethics in Government Act and pushed its
renewal through Congress in 1994 when the Act was going to expire and when
the Dems controlled both houses of Congress.

4)  He is a law-and-order liberal who believes in executing retarded
murderers and jailing hospital execs who submit Medicare bills based on
misunderstandings of detailed and contradictory regulations.

5)  His wife (and presumably he) was a strong supporter of an expansive
definition of "high crimes and misdemeanors" during Watergate.

"Hoist on your own petard" (and I even know what a petard is).

DCF

From frissell at panix.com  Sat Sep 12 17:51:47 1998
From: frissell at panix.com (Duncan Frissell)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 08:51:47 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: <199809130309.XAA14731@mail1.panix.com>
Message-ID: <199809131351.JAA14866@mail1.panix.com>

At 08:41 PM 9/12/98 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>>Extra credit awarded for naming Starr's 5 investigations.
>
>Let's see:
>
>-- Whitewater and Madison Guarantee (may be 2 separate investigations)
>
>-- Filegate (White House had 1100 FBI files, overseen by Craig the Bar
Bouncer)
>
>-- Travelgate (replacing the old staff is kosher, but accusing them of
>crimes is not)
>
>-- Cigargate
>

1) Whitewater

2) Vince Foster

3) Travelgate

4) Filegate

5) Fornigate

DCF

From whgiii at invweb.net  Sat Sep 12 18:53:38 1998
From: whgiii at invweb.net (William H. Geiger III)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 09:53:38 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: <199809131351.JAA14866@mail1.panix.com>
Message-ID: <199809131451.KAA19264@domains.invweb.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In <199809131351.JAA14866 at mail1.panix.com>, on 09/13/98 
   at 09:53 AM, Duncan Frissell  said:

>At 08:41 PM 9/12/98 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>>>Extra credit awarded for naming Starr's 5 investigations.
>>
>>Let's see:
>>
>>-- Whitewater and Madison Guarantee (may be 2 separate investigations)
>>
>>-- Filegate (White House had 1100 FBI files, overseen by Craig the Bar
>Bouncer)
>>
>>-- Travelgate (replacing the old staff is kosher, but accusing them of
>>crimes is not)
>>
>>-- Cigargate
>>

>1) Whitewater

>2) Vince Foster

>3) Travelgate

>4) Filegate

>5) Fornigate

Unfortunately, there is still Chinagate that Reno is still stonewalling
the investigations on.

What ever happened with Cattlegate ($100,000 bribe payed to Hillary)?

- -- 
- ---------------------------------------------------------------
William H. Geiger III  http://www.openpgp.net
Geiger Consulting    Cooking With Warp 4.0

Author of E-Secure - PGP Front End for MR/2 Ice
PGP & MR/2 the only way for secure e-mail.
OS/2 PGP 5.0 at: http://www.openpgp.net/pgp.html
- ---------------------------------------------------------------

Tag-O-Matic: Windows: an Unrecoverable Acquisition Error!

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From nobody at earth.wazoo.com  Sat Sep 12 19:05:57 1998
From: nobody at earth.wazoo.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 10:05:57 +0800
Subject: No Subject
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <199809131506.PAA02152@earth.wazoo.com>

>>>>> "Bobby" == Robert Hettinga  writes:

  > My understanding is that Ryan's looking for some kind of
  > post-infocalyptic radio network for when it All Falls Down
  > Sometime Soon (tm). I expect that in that event, Ham would be
  > fine, because there is no, as Mr. Gore likes to say, controlling
  > legal authority, to worry about.

Worse, there may be any number of "controlling legal authorities".

You don't suppose that all the existing radio monitoring equipment is
going to stop working just because the infrastructure for managing it
is in disarray?

Or that people with access to that equipment are going to have any
problem getting fuel for their helicopters from government fuel dumps?

But your communication network is going to become a valuable resource,
and more than one tin-pot wannabe is going to want to get his hands on
it.

From frissell at panix.com  Sat Sep 12 19:07:13 1998
From: frissell at panix.com (Duncan Frissell)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 10:07:13 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: <199809131351.JAA14866@mail1.panix.com>
Message-ID: <199809131506.LAA19297@mail1.panix.com>

At 09:57 AM 9/13/98 -0500, William H. Geiger III wrote:

>What ever happened with Cattlegate ($100,000 bribe payed to Hillary)?

Statute of Lim had long passed.  Also, I'm not sure if an unemployed
hausfrau living in public housing in the District of Columbia is a "covered
person" under the Ethics in Government Act.

Ken *can* prosecute her for crimes uncovered in the course of his
investigation and she has no special privileges (other than spousal).

Chelsea too (Misprison of a Felony, probably).

Socks and Buddy are immune since animal prosecutions ended with the Middle
Ages.

DCF

From schear at lvcm.com  Sat Sep 12 19:55:46 1998
From: schear at lvcm.com (Steve Schear)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 10:55:46 +0800
Subject: Citizenship silliness.  Re: e$: crypto-expatriatism
In-Reply-To: <199809090418.AAA25605@domains.invweb.net>
Message-ID: 

>And it wouldn't have happened had the victorious superpowers decided the
>sand niggers in Palestine could be kicked off their land. (I have no beef
>with those Jews who peacefully bought land in Palestine prior to this mass
>resettlement.)

No doubt the Arabs were being given the shaft. First by the Ottomans
(western lackys that they were) and then by the superpowers themselves
after they could no longer hide behind a puppet regime.

The Arabs didn't make things any better by refusing to accept any Jewish
settlers, including those who had purchased land from first the Ottomans
and then the Palestinians. The Palestinians had been told no harm would
come to those of them who stood aside and warned if they fought or fled
their lands they wouldn't be welcomed back.

When it comes to nations, fairness has historically had little influence on
such outcomes. In the end, all property belongs to those who can keep it
(by whatever means are necessary).

--Steve

---------------------------------------------------------------------
		reply to schear - at - lvcm - dot - com ---

PGP mail preferred, see  	http://www.pgp.com and
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RSA fingerprint: FE90 1A95 9DEA 8D61  812E CCA9 A44A FBA9
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---------------------------------------------------------------------

From nobody at replay.com  Sat Sep 12 21:17:03 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 12:17:03 +0800
Subject: No Subject
Message-ID: <199809131705.TAA10263@replay.com>

son of gomez

From nobody at replay.com  Sat Sep 12 21:30:38 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 12:30:38 +0800
Subject: No Subject
Message-ID: <199809131728.TAA11651@replay.com>

Sunday, September 13, 1998 - 19:23:30 MET

Talk about unimaginable control. How many times 
did Monica provoke William Jefferson Clinton? 
Four or five, before he deigned that there should
be a denouement? And why? Because, deep in his 
heart, he knew it was just wrong!  Impeachment?  
Hardly.  Instead, Congress should award this Man,
our magnificent President, a new decoration, 
the �Presidential Blue Spheres of Steel�!  
Can one imagine any other person on Earth with 
such iron control?  Fortunately, yes! 
And who could this be?  You guessed it!  
None other than Will-O-Iron�s buddy and potential 
replacement, Ol Stiffy himself, Al.  
O blessed land.  O fortunate realm. This is one 
American who will sleep more soundly tonight, 
knowing that, whatever the provocation, there can 
be no accidental discharge of US weaponry, that 
the finger on the button is controlled by a 
Will-of-Iron.

From rah at shipwright.com  Sat Sep 12 22:18:35 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 13:18:35 +0800
Subject: The Empire Strikes Back (was IP: Army Tests Land Warrior for 21stCentury Soldiers)
Message-ID: 

--- begin forwarded text

Delivered-To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
X-Sender: believer at telepath.com
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 09:33:31 -0500
To: believer at telepath.com
From: believer at telepath.com
Subject: IP: Army Tests Land Warrior for 21st Century Soldiers
Mime-Version: 1.0
Sender: owner-ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Precedence: list
Reply-To: believer at telepath.com

Source:  Department of Defense
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Sep1998/n09111998_9809117.html

-------
NOTE: Website includes three photographs of device in use. No mention of
whether the computerized software in the device, of the GPS link and its
satellites are Y2K compliant.
-------

Army Tests Land Warrior for 21st Century Soldiers

 By Jim Garamone
 American Forces Press Service

FORT BELVOIR, Va. -- American soldiers and Marines are already among the
most deadly in the world, but a system called Land  Warrior will soon make
them unmatched.

 Land Warrior integrates small arms with high-tech equipment enabling
ground forces to deploy, fight and win on the battlefields of the 21st
century.

 "Land Warrior soldiers fight as a system, and the most important part of
the system is what's between his ears," said Army Lt. Col. Robert Serino,
Land Warrior product manager.

 Land Warrior came about in 1991 when an Army study group recommended the
service look at the soldier as a complete weapon system. The first priority
in Land Warrior is lethality. The second is survivability and the third,
command and control. The program will cost $2 billion when 45,000 sets of
the equipment are fielded between 2001-2014. The Marine Corps, Air Force
and many foreign countries are interested in the system.

 "First and foremost, Land Warrior is a fighting system," Serino said. Land
Warrior has several subsystems: the weapon, integrated helmet assembly,
protective clothing and individual equipment, computer/radio, and software.

 The weapon subsystem is built around the M-16/M-4 modular carbine. It has
a laser range finder/digital compass, a daylight video camera, a laser
aiming light and a thermal sight.

 "This system will allow infantrymen to operate in all types of weather and
at night," Serino said. In conjunction with other components, a soldier can
even shoot around corners without exposing himself to enemy fire.

 The integrated helmet assembly is lighter and more comfortable than
today's helmet, Serino said. It has a helmet-mounted monocular day display,
a night sensor with flat panel display, a laser detection module,
ballistic/laser eye protection, a microphone and a headset.

 The protective clothing and individual equipment subsystem incorporates
modular body armor and upgrade plates that can stop small-arms rounds fired
point-blank. It includes an integrated load-bearing frame,
chemical/biological protective garments and modular rucksack.

 The infantryman will attach the computer/radio subsystem to his
load-bearing frame. Over this goes the rucksack for personal gear. The
computer processor is fused with radios and a Global Positioning System
locator. A hand grip wired to the pack and attached to the soldier's chest
acts as a computer mouse and also allows the wearer to change screens, key
on the radio, change frequencies and send digital information.

 The subsystem comes in two flavors: The leader version has two radios and
a flat panel display/keyboard, and soldiers have one radio. With the
equipment, leaders and soldiers can exchange information. Soldiers using
their weapon-mounted camera, for example, can send videos to their leaders.

 Finally, the software subsystem includes tactical and mission support
modules, maps and tactical overlays, and the ability to capture and display
video images. The system also contains a power management module. Designers
set up the system so it can be updated as technology improves.

 The soldiers who will actually use Land Warrior have been consulted every
step of the way. Prime contractor Raytheon worked with experts at the U.S.
Army Infantry Center at Fort Benning, Ga., in designing the system. They
have taken the system to the users to ensure the system is headed in the
right direction.

 For instance, Serino said, "The rucksack has quick-release straps so an
infantryman can just drop it if the need arises. This is what our soldiers
asked for -- which is really great."

 One problem the Army must overcome before fielding is power. Current
batteries last about 150 minutes with all systems running. "Clearly
soldiers won't have all systems running all the time, but this is still not
acceptable," said Serino. Other batteries under development by the Army's
Communications-Electronics Command may push the time up to 30 hours.

 The Army plans to test the Land Warrior system with a platoon from the
82nd Airborne Division, Fort Campbell, Ky. Later, a battalion-sized test is
planned, Serino said.

 "Ultimately, soldiers will define the end state of Land Warrior -- and
we'll know more every time the soldiers employ the system," he said. "We'll
get the system up to a certain point, then the soldiers will be the people
who say how far it can really go."
 -----------------------
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
-----------------------

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with the message:
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**********************************************

--- end forwarded text

-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From rah at shipwright.com  Sat Sep 12 22:19:05 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 13:19:05 +0800
Subject: radio net
Message-ID: 

--- begin forwarded text

MIME-Version: 1.0
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 09:11:29 -0700
To: Robert Hettinga 
From: Somebody
Subject: Re: radio net

>
>I know what Single Sideband means. As I've said before, and what you failed
>to read later on in this thread, evidently, is that there are commercial
>Single Sideband radios out there which have the range of ham sets. These
>radios are used for commercial ship-to-shore traffic, and I expect that
>encryption is legal on them. I expect that, because these frequencies are
>subject to international convention rather than federal law, they have more
>leeway (heh... nautical pun) on their use. Including, I bet, digital
>packets and encryption.
>
>

If I remember correctly, this is escrowed encryption using code
books deposited with the appropriate authorities.

--- end forwarded text

*That* sucks... I wonder who the "appropriate authorities" are?

Cheers,
Bob Hettinga
-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From nobody at replay.com  Sat Sep 12 22:56:36 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 13:56:36 +0800
Subject: No Subject
Message-ID: <199809131855.UAA18056@replay.com>

How about a line-of-sight (LOS) infrared network, a neighbor-net?
Always thought this could be a method for a local technical
entrepreneur to fund and share their personal T-1 link or for
some small network enterprise to avoid local and US federal 
regulations and compete with the big cable and telephone 
companies. Appears that LOS infrared is currently unregulated
and could be encrypted.

Get enough people in a neighborhood to put LOS infrared 
relays on top of their houses, allow them to tap in, and feed this 
neighbor-net from some central point that is equipped with 
a more conventional link.

I dunno why infrared, which theoretically has much more 
capacity than a phone line or coax cable, seems currently so slow,
 i.e., less than 10 MB in many commercial offerings. I�ve no cost 
estimate for the roof top boxes. Heavy wet weather, fog, rain, 
snow obviously can affect LOS infrared, esp. low power.

Personally, I would like more choices than just the phone and cable 
lines, especially something that is locally controlled. However, I 
imagine that if any significant traffic was generated over such 
infrared or wireless neighbor-nets,  the Feds would eventually 
step in and regulate them.  They'd probably want to regulate the 
traffic over a taut string, between paper cups.

From declan at well.com  Sun Sep 13 00:19:54 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 15:19:54 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, Tim May wrote:

> * What goes around, comes around. The Liberal puke Democrats who crucified
> Bob Packwood, Clarence Thomas, and any number of corporate people charged
> with "sexual harassment," are now reaping what they sowed. "If she says it
> happened, it happened," the mantra of the feminazi left, is now apparently
> forgotten by Patricia It's not our business" Ireland.

There's also the idea popular in some gender feminist circles that the
imbalance of power in manager-employee relationships makes it impossible
for genuine consent to be given. Can there be any greater power imbalance
than the president of the United States and an intern? Where are the
feminist cries of outrage?

> * Lawmaking is paralzyed, frozen, stillborne. This I count as a Good Thing.
> Even better will be another 8-10 months of this nightly spectacle. No
> Health Care Reform, no Communications Decency Act II, no Tobacco Act,
> nothing.

In general you might be right. But for "noncontroversial" measures like
CDA II, well, it'll be in one of the appropriations bills that will be
approved in the next three weeks.

> * This disgraces the Presidency, which I also count as a Good Thing. There
> were hopes that Nixon's downfall would be the end of the Imperial
> Presidency, but, alas, the pomp and circumstance continued unabated. It's

The balance of power in the U.S. government is too tilted in favor of the
executive and federal agencies; I think more should be returned to
Congress and the states but don't think we're going to see that happen. To
do that Congress needs to be willing to seize it; they're not. If we get
Al Gore in the Oval Office we'll have business as usual.

-Declan

From alan at clueserver.org  Sun Sep 13 00:33:18 1998
From: alan at clueserver.org (Alan Olsen)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 15:33:18 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

On Sun, 13 Sep 1998, Declan McCullagh wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, Tim May wrote:
> 
> > * What goes around, comes around. The Liberal puke Democrats who crucified
> > Bob Packwood, Clarence Thomas, and any number of corporate people charged
> > with "sexual harassment," are now reaping what they sowed. "If she says it
> > happened, it happened," the mantra of the feminazi left, is now apparently
> > forgotten by Patricia It's not our business" Ireland.
> 
> There's also the idea popular in some gender feminist circles that the
> imbalance of power in manager-employee relationships makes it impossible
> for genuine consent to be given. Can there be any greater power imbalance
> than the president of the United States and an intern? Where are the
> feminist cries of outrage?

"But Clinton is on their side!"

I think the gender feminists are being quiet because they supported
Clinton.  It all comes down to politics.  There are other feminists I know
(of the non-politically correct variety) that have very unkind things to
say about the man.

> > * Lawmaking is paralzyed, frozen, stillborne. This I count as a Good Thing.
> > Even better will be another 8-10 months of this nightly spectacle. No
> > Health Care Reform, no Communications Decency Act II, no Tobacco Act,
> > nothing.
> 
> In general you might be right. But for "noncontroversial" measures like
> CDA II, well, it'll be in one of the appropriations bills that will be
> approved in the next three weeks.

Actually this is *JUST* the time for moralistic political posturing.
Expect to see a great deal of "holier than thou" legislation put through
under "bringing back morality to America". (And anyone who tries to fight
such lunacy will be labeled a hedonistic scum.)

It is scandals just like this that fuel the fires of the anti-sex league.

> > * This disgraces the Presidency, which I also count as a Good Thing. There
> > were hopes that Nixon's downfall would be the end of the Imperial
> > Presidency, but, alas, the pomp and circumstance continued unabated. It's
> 
> The balance of power in the U.S. government is too tilted in favor of the
> executive and federal agencies; I think more should be returned to
> Congress and the states but don't think we're going to see that happen. To
> do that Congress needs to be willing to seize it; they're not. If we get
> Al Gore in the Oval Office we'll have business as usual.

And remember that Tipper is part of that baggage.  Expect a moralistic
crusade or two from the first lady if that happens.

alan at ctrl-alt-del.com | Note to AOL users: for a quick shortcut to reply
Alan Olsen            | to my mail, just hit the ctrl, alt and del keys.

From honig at sprynet.com  Sun Sep 13 01:27:39 1998
From: honig at sprynet.com (David Honig)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 16:27:39 +0800
Subject: radio net
In-Reply-To: <35FBC34E.6B4F9127@workmail.com>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980913142530.007d1bc0@m7.sprynet.com>

At 09:06 AM 9/13/98 -0400, Soren wrote:
>If you really want to give the hams fits,  write a noise to morse engine
>(or better yet, some captured call signs repeated endlessly) and swamp
>the channels, where the old popular mechanics guys discuss their antenna
>envy, at random intervals. 9:00 in the Ozarks is a fine time.  Sit back
>and wait for the black vans to drive up.

Performance art: solar-powered low-power, low-freq modulators 
(Hams get off designing this stuff) with
digitized true noise inputs, scattered about the desert.    Maybe scattered in
a big smiley face pattern. Extra points for burst transmissions.

Too subtle for SRL but amusing nonetheless....

From ryan at michonline.com  Sun Sep 13 01:31:01 1998
From: ryan at michonline.com (Ryan Anderson)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 16:31:01 +0800
Subject: Revenge of the AOLHoles
In-Reply-To: <199809110152.DAA09397@replay.com>
Message-ID: 

> The problem is that most of the AOL users who publish to the net seem to
> be morons. They use some annoying Russo-Germanic quoting style, they can't
> use English, they're clueless, they post off-topic, or something else. 

In all fairness, many of the users on AOL *know* that the AOL quoting
style is utterly horrible.  Unofrtunatley, they don't have much choice in
what they use.

Ryan Anderson 
PGP fp: 7E 8E C6 54 96 AC D9 57  E4 F8 AE 9C 10 7E 78 C9

From nobody at replay.com  Sun Sep 13 01:49:12 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 16:49:12 +0800
Subject: No Subject
Message-ID: <199809132148.XAA29865@replay.com>

Found this: http://offshorehaven.nu/banking/index.html
no idea whether a trap or a jewel.

From mix at anon.lcs.mit.edu  Sun Sep 13 03:10:34 1998
From: mix at anon.lcs.mit.edu (lcs Mixmaster Remailer)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 18:10:34 +0800
Subject: MISTY encryption algorithm source code
Message-ID: <19980913230004.14914.qmail@nym.alias.net>

Nobuki Nakatuji wrote:

> MISTY source code posted by me at long ago had many mistake.
> Attachment file are revised MISTY source code and revised readme.
> Thanks.
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

BRAIN used by you always since at long ago have many insect. Attachment
brain not here because was exhausted in decypher you message. You go back
at Hotmail now and stop spam Cypherpunks list. Chop chop. 

From nobody at replay.com  Sun Sep 13 03:12:25 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 18:12:25 +0800
Subject: Revenge of the AOLHoles
Message-ID: <199809132311.BAA03065@replay.com>

On Sun, 13 Sep 1998, Ryan Anderson wrote:

> 
> > The problem is that most of the AOL users who publish to the net seem to
> > be morons. They use some annoying Russo-Germanic quoting style, they can't
> > use English, they're clueless, they post off-topic, or something else. 
> 
> In all fairness, many of the users on AOL *know* that the AOL quoting
> style is utterly horrible.  Unofrtunatley, they don't have much choice in
> what they use.

Sure they do. They can use a different mail reader. (After all, 32-bit AOL
allows AOL users to use all the TCP/IP protocols...) They can cut and
paste manually, or, probably best, they can go to another ISP. 

I understand what you're saying, Ryan, and I understand what they're
saying, but there all alternatives out there; they just don't want to use
them. In fact, they've installed proprietary packages that do this. There
are plenty of free alternatives out there which don't have this problem.

If my ISP pushed a bunch of proprietary software down my throat, I'd find
another ISP. That goes double if the proprietary software sucks. That goes
triple if the software sucks and the ISP is trying to get every idiot they
can to use it. (I got a "100 hours free network abuse" disk in the mail
recently from AOL.) 

Another AnonMonger

From nobody at replay.com  Sun Sep 13 03:15:52 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 18:15:52 +0800
Subject: No Subject
Message-ID: <199809132309.BAA02915@replay.com>

"It has been claimed, for example, that free application of cryptography
enables drug traffickers and terrorists to communicate in secret, without
the law enforcement officials being able to intercept their messages. In
some countries, strong encryption has been banned or the keys have to be
escrowed for government officials. With invisibility readily available to
anyone with moderate programming skills, it is obvious that any such
measures are ineffective. "

This from the most recent online 
National Counterintelligence Center
Counterintelligence News and Developments
Volume 2
June 1998

http://www.nacic.gov/cind/june98.htm#rtoc4

"In some countries" indeed.

From jamesd at echeque.com  Sun Sep 13 03:37:47 1998
From: jamesd at echeque.com (James A. Donald)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 18:37:47 +0800
Subject: Offshore Banking In Latvia
In-Reply-To: <199809132148.XAA29865@replay.com>
Message-ID: <199809132336.QAA12214@proxy3.ba.best.com>

    --
At 11:48 PM 9/13/98 +0200, Anonymous wrote:
> Found this: http://offshorehaven.nu/banking/index.html no
> idea whether a trap or a jewel.

Looks a whole lot more promising than the EUB (which turned
out to be a classic take the money and run operation)

The web site is not in the US, which shows that they are
serious.  Latvia is a pro capitalist, anti communist
government.  (I regard the US government as anti capitalist
and soft on communism),  The government sees itself as
presiding over an economy that is still basically socialist,
even though they have transformed far more rapidly and
radically than most of the former Soviet Union, in
particularly they have transformed far more radically than
Russia.

On the other hand, many of the facts that one would need to
know in order to know how safe your money is are simply not
made available.  In particular the web site does not mention
the banks name. 

Oh wow.  That does not inspire confidence.

They write:
       Q. What is the name of the Bank? 
       A. This is the typical question asked by "wannabes"
            and competitors.   Our firm does not disclose the
            name of the Bank until confirmation of the
            payment of our fees is received. The Bank only
            wants to deal with people interested in opening
            and operating such accounts. If the information
            provided by our firm does not satisfy you, then
            it definitely means that you are not interested
            in opening an offshore bank account. 

Well actually it means that any sane person would regret
handing over their money as soon as they discover the name of
the bank.

Some time ago a bank in Russia opened.  Its name was "Fuck
you" in Russian, spelt backwards.  The bank soon disappeared,
with the depositors money.

What is "fuck you" in Latvian? 

    --digsig
         James A. Donald
     6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG
     5f1OaRdJKerB2Mx0HCiBWPBIAzs9ziDsmpdrl/m1
     4cfQ2P6hHFL6HZHebpSnhsUfLL4PwuUmFSRu6dP+9

>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
> 

-----------------------------------------------------
We have the right to defend ourselves and our property, because 
of the kind of animals that we are. True law derives from this 
right, not from the arbitrary power of the omnipotent state.

http://www.jim.com/jamesd/����� James A. Donald

From jamesd at echeque.com  Sun Sep 13 03:52:09 1998
From: jamesd at echeque.com (James A. Donald)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 18:52:09 +0800
Subject: Offshore Banking In Latvia
Message-ID: <199809132350.QAA02796@proxy4.ba.best.com>

    --
> > Found this: http://offshorehaven.nu/banking
> > noidea whether a trap or a jewel.

Just in case my first message was unclear:

Offshore banking in Latvia looks good.

The above website looks like a con.

    --digsig
         James A. Donald
     6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG
     JXDMmaEyma+jN7wyVhvlYcOrLB7iNaWSDaDfE2dl
     4B2lFoTKEej/7263gNwJ8CpUWXMXIdco2pG0PzcFL
-----------------------------------------------------
We have the right to defend ourselves and our property, because 
of the kind of animals that we are. True law derives from this 
right, not from the arbitrary power of the omnipotent state.

http://www.jim.com/jamesd/����� James A. Donald

From xenedra at hotmail.com  Sun Sep 13 05:37:44 1998
From: xenedra at hotmail.com (Well now I am a Mommy!)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 20:37:44 +0800
Subject: sixdegrees
Message-ID: <19980914012729.12617.qmail@hotmail.com>

hi,

I see you added me as a friend..... just wondering who you are.  :)

Christy

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

From tcmay at got.net  Sun Sep 13 06:23:05 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 21:23:05 +0800
Subject: sixdegrees
In-Reply-To: <19980914012729.12617.qmail@hotmail.com>
Message-ID: 

At 6:27 PM -0700 9/13/98, Well now I am a Mommy! wrote:
>hi,
>
>I see you added me as a friend..... just wondering who you are.  :)
>
>Christy
>

Hi Christy,

Got your name from the Stalker's R Us group. Please post more details about
your personal fantasies. Send us nude pictures, too.

You say you're a Mommy. Hope there are no stretch marks.

Oh, and your children can join our group too. Got any photos?

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From nnburk at cobain.hdc.net  Sun Sep 13 06:54:56 1998
From: nnburk at cobain.hdc.net (nnburk)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 21:54:56 +0800
Subject: Remailers
Message-ID: <35FCA076.6F15@yankton.com>

Are _any_ of the remailers working?

From bv7b5063 at auto.sixdegrees.com  Sun Sep 13 07:12:38 1998
From: bv7b5063 at auto.sixdegrees.com (sixdegrees)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 22:12:38 +0800
Subject: Your new password
Message-ID: <199809140305.UAA16429@toad.com>

Name: Joe Cypherpunk
sixdegrees Password: kindread

In response to your request for a new sixdegrees(tm) password, 
we have sent you the following temporary password: kindread. 

As soon as you come to the site, http://www.sixdegrees.com , and use 
it to log-in on the home page, it will become your official 
password, and your old password will be deactivated. 

(If you end up remembering your old password and use that to 
log-in at the site before using this new temporary password, 
the temporary password will be deactivated.)

This may seem wacky, but it's for your security. And, either 
way, once you successfully log-in at the site, you can go to 
your personal profile and choose whatever password you like - 
in fact, we encourage you to do so.

If you never requested a new password and got this message in 
error, just continue using your old password and e-mail us at 
issues at sixdegrees.com. 

====================================================================
PLEASE NOTE: All replies to this address are processed by a computer.
If you have any problems, questions or requests send an e-mail to 
issues at sixdegrees.com and someone will get back to you as soon as 
possible.
====================================================================

E.SI.REQPW.1

From ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com  Sun Sep 13 07:13:05 1998
From: ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 22:13:05 +0800
Subject: Remailers (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809140335.WAA23282@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:

> Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 21:49:58 -0700
> From: nnburk 
> Subject: Remailers

> 
> Are _any_ of the remailers working?
> 

Which remailers? The CDR members or the anonymous remailers?

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From vznuri at netcom.com  Sun Sep 13 07:30:03 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 22:30:03 +0800
Subject: IP: British Openly Prepare for Y2K Martial Law
Message-ID: <199809140329.UAA27171@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: believer at telepath.com
Subject: IP: British Openly Prepare for Y2K Martial Law
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 22:26:39 -0500
To: believer at telepath.com

Source:  http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2553

Category:  Martial_Law
Date:  1998-09-11 13:47:42
Subject:  British Openly Prepare for Y2K Martial Law
Link:  http://www.independent.co.uk/stories/A1109820.html

 Comment: 

 The British government is way ahead of every other nation in facing up to
the implications of y2k. 

 It is obvious the the U.S. military is preparing for martial law in late
1999, but no official publicly admits that this is the case. 

 The British are more forthright. 

 This is from THE INDEPENDENT (Sept. 11). [The link was dead within hours.] 

 * * * * * * * * 

 TROOPS may be on the streets in the year 2000 under emergency Home Office
plans to maintain vital services which could be crippled by the millennium
computer bug. 

 Armed forces will be on standby to help councils and police provide
disaster relief if key infrastructures such as hospitals, water supplies
and roads are hit by the electronic change. 

 The Home Office confirmed yesterday that local authorities are being
encouraged to draw up contingency plans to deal with the "nightmare
scenario" of failed traffic lights, disabled water pumping stations, fuel
shortages and other disrupted services. 

 The bug, which represents the inability of most computers and electronic
systems to deal with the change of date from 1999 to 2000, could also hit
vital equipment in hospitals, lifts, benefits payments and phone lines. 

 Most computer experts believe that major failures are unlikely, but
councils, which have a statutory duty to provide emergency relief, have
been told to prepare for the worst. They will be allowed to use the Armed
Forces Military Aid to Civil Authorities Act to call in emergency help. . . . 

 Rail, telecommunications, gas and electricity regulators were joined by
BT, Shell, Transco and Trailtrack to agree ways to reassure the public that
their computers were being adapted to avoid the bug. . . . 

 In one key sanction, BT and Cable and Wireless have been told they will be
given the power to disconnect firms that corrupt phone connections. . . . 

 Home Secretary Jack Straw is ultimately responsible for emergency planning
as chairman of a body called the Civil Contingencies Committee. The Home
Office Emergency Planning Division will meet this month to firm its own
proposals. 
-----------------------
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
-----------------------

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From vznuri at netcom.com  Sun Sep 13 07:30:22 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 22:30:22 +0800
Subject: IP: Y2K: 316,862 Reasons Why FedReserve Won't Make It
Message-ID: <199809140329.UAA27154@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: believer at telepath.com
Subject: IP: Y2K: 316,862 Reasons Why FedReserve Won't Make It
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 22:24:39 -0500
To: believer at telepath.com

North's Comments about Article Below:

 In June, 1998, a pair of experts -- one is a y2k optimist -- produced a
report on the likelihood of system-wide failures based on the number of
external exchanges of data an organization has. It is called the
Beach/Oleson Pain Index. (Oleson is the optimist; Beach edits CIO
MAGAZINE.) BUSINESS TODAY reported: 

 "The Beach/Oleson Pain Index illustrates how the Y2K software glitch is
further compounded by connectivity to external organizations, such as
suppliers, customers, banks and other business partners." 

 There is a 10.4% likelihood of catastrophic failure for any organization
with over 1,000 external connections. It is only 0.5% for 50 connections,
1.1% for 100, 5.4% for 500. 

 The Federal Reserve System, the most important of all central banks, has
316,862. 

 This is from a July 1, 1998 report of the General Accounting Office of the
U.S. Congress. 

 The report outlines what every organization must do to protect itself from
importing noncompliant data. This list is long, and the task is gigantic.
Congressional committees should insist on receiving detailed quarterly
progress reports on these procedures from the Federal Reserve. Of course,
no elected official would be so bold or so impolite as to ask, let alone
demand. To ask such questions, the questioner would have to assume that
Congress has effective authority over the Federal Reserve, as the law says.
No Congressman who has served over one term is so naive as to believe that. 

 * * * * * * * * * 

 Federal agencies reported that they have a total of almost 500,000 data
exchanges with other federal agencies, states, local governments, and the
private sector for their mission-critical systems. Almost 90 percent of the
exchanges were reported by the Federal Reserve and the Department of
Housing and Urban Development (HUD) which reported having 316,862 and
133,567, respectively. The Federal Reserve exchanges data with federal
agencies and the private sector using software it provides to these
entities. . . . 

 As part of their Year 2000 correction efforts, organizations must identify
the date formats used in their data exchanges, develop a strategy for
dealing with exchanges that do not use 4-digit year formats, and implement
the strategy. These efforts generally involve the following steps. 

 -- Assess information systems to identify data exchanges that are not Year
2000 compliant. 

 -- Contact the exchange partner and reach agreement on the date format to
be used in the exchange. 

 -- Determine if data bridges and filters are needed. 

 -- Determine if validation processes are needed for incoming data. 

 -- Set dates for testing and implementing new exchange formats. 

 -- Develop and test bridges and filters to handle nonconforming data. 

 -- Develop contingency plans and procedures for data exchanges and
incorporate into overall agency contingency plans. 

 -- Implement the validation process for incoming data. 

 -- Test and implement new exchange formats. 

 The testing and implementation of new data exchanges must be closely
coordinated with exchange partners to be completed effectively. In addition
to an agency testing its data exchange software, effective testing involves
end-to-end testing--initiation of the exchange by the sending computer,
transmission through intermediate communications software and hardware, and
receipt and acceptance by receiving computer(s), thus completing the
exchange process. . . . 

 The Federal Reserve has 2-digit and 4-digit year formats in its data
exchanges. It plans to use 4-digit formats for all exchanges in the future,
but will continue using the 2-digit year format for some exchanges and have
exchange partners bridge to these if necessary. Federal Reserve's Year 2000
officials estimated that 20 percent of their data exchanges have 2-digit
year formats. They also told us that they have not set a target date for
the conversion to 4-digit year formats. . . .
----------------------------------
Source:  Business Today
http://www.businesstoday.com/techpages/y2kindex03.htm

BT EXCLUSIVE: Local researchers predict Y2K pain 

Wednesday, June 3, 1998

by Bill Burke/BusinessToday staff 

A team of technology researchers has come up with an index that they say
can tell a business just how bad its Year 2000 computer problem is going to
be.

The "Beach/Oleson Pain Index" is a chart of Y2K probabilities and
predictions based on a formula developed by team leaders Gary Beach,
publisher of CIO magazine, and International Data Corp. analyst Tom Oleson.

The index determines the "degree of pain" companies are likely to
experience when the Millennium Bug strikes.

The Beach/Oleson Pain Index illustrates how the Y2K software glitch is
further compounded by connectivity to external organizations, such as
suppliers, customers, banks and other business partners.

The pair will unveil the index today at a Year 2000 conference in Omaha.

In the end, Beach says, no one is going to make it through the Millennium
threshold untouched.

"Realistically, no connected company can expect to survive the Year 2000
unscathed," Beach said. 

He said the formula answers the fifty-thousand dollar question: 'Just how
bad is it going to be?'

The index works by taking a company's number of connected applications and
plugging that figure into the index. 

"A company can determine the severity of its Year 2000 problem and create
an appropriate contingency plan," Beach said.

The index can help companies plan for the deadline, and develop contingency
plans, say the designers.

"Companies implementing various Year 2000 compliance projects must come to
the realization that the Year 2000 problem is not 100 percent solvable,"
Oleson said.

The index uses the number of applications a company has connected to
external partners, vendors and customers to determine the severity of the
Y2K situation. The probability of experiencing a Year 2000 problem is
broken down into four degrees of severity: Annoying; Disruptive; Business
Critical and Catastrophic. 

                "0">

                  Number of
                 Connected
                 Applications
                            Probability:
                            Catastrophic
                                        Probability:
                                        Business
                                        Critical
                                                   Probability:
                                                   Disruptive
                                                              Probability:
                                                              Annoying
                 5
                             0.1%
                                        1.0%
                                                   3.7%
                                                              7.4%
                 10
                            0.1%
                                        2.1%
                                                   7.3%
                                                              14.3%
                 20 
                            0.2%
                                        4.1%
                                                   14.0%
                                                              26.5%
                 50 
                            0.5%
                                        10.0%
                                                   31.4%
                                                              53.7%
                 100 
                            1.1%
                                        19.0%
                                                   52.9%
                                                              78.6%
                 500 
                            5.4%
                                        65.0%
                                                   97.7%
                                                              100.0%
                 1000 
                            10.4%
                                        87.8%
                                                   99.9%
                                                              100.0%

-----------------------
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
-----------------------

**********************************************
To subscribe or unsubscribe, email:
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**********************************************
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**********************************************

From vznuri at netcom.com  Sun Sep 13 07:30:25 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 22:30:25 +0800
Subject: IP: Two Reporters Attacked at Governor's Rally*
Message-ID: <199809140329.UAA27203@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: vols-fan at juno.com (Football Fan)
Subject: IP: Two Reporters Attacked at Governor's Rally*
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 10:55:22 -0500
To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com

Alex at 989kjfk.com

**********************************************
Quantum Reality News 
Two Reporters Attacked at Governor's Rally*
***********************************************

	This morning two Free Press Reporters at Governor George
Bush's Rally at the Du Pont Factory in Round Rock Texas were
assaulted and silenced from questioning Gov. Bush, while asking
pertinent questions.  Questions specifically about the CFR and
Federal Reserve involvement in Texas and the US.  No response was
given and orders were immediately given to the Secret Service and
Texas DPS, to remove the reporters.

 Alex Jones Alex at 989kjfk.com "Talk Radio Show Host for KJFK 98.9
FM" [www.989kjfk.com] Austin and Central Texas and "Republic National
Radio Broadcasting System" and his Producer Mike Hansen of the Austin
Access TV Show "Exposing Corruption" Channel 10 ACTV were grabbed and
roughed up and removed from the rally by force.  Alex Jones was
forceably arrested and taken away and later released by a radio call
to the police unit.  The radio transmission instructed the officers
to release Alex Jones.  Governor Bush had ordered his release
stating, they had nothing to hold him on.  Mike Hansen while filming
the incident was hit from behind in an attempt to break his camera. 
The blow thrown from behind nearly knocked Hansen off his feet.  Mike
Hansen was not near the scuffle or in the area, he was filming from a
distance.  Both men received injuries.

	Not only were their 1st Amendment rights trampled and
forceable abridged by the Secret Service and DPS agents but their
questions were ignored, questions that are very important to voters. 
Evidentially these questions, that many of Governor Bush's
constituents are asking, were not address by our Governor, and
possible President hopeful.  The Question were about the Federal
Reserve control of our currency and it's role in the perpetuation of
oppressive debt in our country.  The active part the CFR (Council on
Foreign Relations) are playing in the take over and control of our
Country and their role in movement toward the New World Order.

	People expect the same accountability from the Governor, that
Governor Bush has been talking about in his campaign advertisements. 
Why were these citizens attacked?  Why were these questions so
offensive?  A Public Servant should be able to stay cool and have an
interest in all of his constituents and all their concerns.  If our
leadership will not calmly answer honest questions, it leads us as
responsible informed voters to ask questions of ourselves.  Why
aren't all of Governor Bush's constituents concerns and views
addressed?  Are special interest views and concerns, more valid or
more important than the majority of people and voters?  Is our
leadership truly representing "We the People" if they have someone
removed that asks a controversial question?

reporter: Randy Clark/Quantum Reality

---
You are currently subscribed to tuac-alerts as: [vols-fan at juno.com]
To unsubscribe, forward this message to leave-tuac-alerts-184675B at XC.Org

--------- End forwarded message ----------

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From vznuri at netcom.com  Sun Sep 13 07:30:40 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 22:30:40 +0800
Subject: IP: Germ sabotage scare empties city buildings-Australia
Message-ID: <199809140329.UAA27192@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: believer at telepath.com
Subject: IP: Germ sabotage scare empties city buildings-Australia
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 08:49:10 -0500
To: believer at telepath.com

Source:  The Australian	
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/webie.asp?URL=/state/4366234.htm>http://www.
theaustralian.com.au/webie.asp?URL=/state/4366234.htm

Germ sabotage scare empties city buildings
 The Courier-Mail - 12sep98

POLICE are investigating a possible attempt to sabotage a Brisbane city
building by putting the potentially deadly legionella bacteria in the
air-conditioner.

A canister suspected of containing the bacteria was found in the water
cooling system for the Mercantile Mutual building's air- conditioning unit
on Thursday.

Police suspect the canister was placed there deliberately because recent
routine tests on the Edward Street building's air-conditioning showed no
sign of the deadly bacteria in its system.

Det Snr-Sgt Bryan Paton said the maintenance company responsible for the
unit had not seen the canister when it previously checked the water cooling
tower.

"There is an indication that the device has been put in the water
deliberately and there is a concern there may have been some legionella
bacteria in the device and we have to wait for those results," Sgt Paton said.

"It wasn't a threat to the public or anybody and the air-conditioning
system has since been decontaminated but the concern is that someone has
done it deliberately. 

"At this stage we are treating it very seriously."

Police also are investigating how someone got access to the
air-conditioning unit. The canister sparked a mass evacuation of another
city building yesterday when it was delivered there by mistake. 

Maintenance workers delivered the canister to the Mercantile Mutual
building managers, whose offices are in the MLC building. 

The MLC building, in George Street, was evacuated about 2pm yesterday when
the canister, sealed in a metal container, was discovered by office staff.

Police and fire and ambulance crews were called to the scene and two
Queensland Fire Service officers wearing protective clothing removed the
canister.

The building was declared safe 90 minutes later and staff returned to work.
Insp John Flanagan said the evacuations were a precautionary measure and
the canister had been taken to the Government Chemical Laboratory for
analysis.

The company responsible for managing the MLC building refused to comment,
but a staff member said the scare had been blown out of proportion.

The bacteria needs a moist environment to develop into the water-borne
legionnaires' disease which can cause pneumonia, fever and death.

The disease is contracted by inhaling air contaminated by air-conditioning
cooling towers, or through whirlpool spas and showers containing
contaminated water.

The Australian upper limit for legionella bacteria in air- conditioning is
a colony count of 10,000. The Mercantile Mutual building had a colony count
of 2000. 

Sgt Paton said police did not know the reason for the possible sabotage and
no demands or threats had been made. "People maintaining the
air-conditioning units in other buildings should be aware of this and
ensure all proper precautions are made," Sgt Paton said.

Brisbane Southside Public Health Unit medical officer Brad McCall said
legionella was a very common bacterium found in creeks, ponds,
air-conditioning cooling towers and hot and cold water taps.

� News Limited 1998
-----------------------
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
-----------------------

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From vznuri at netcom.com  Sun Sep 13 07:30:45 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 22:30:45 +0800
Subject: IP: Vote on Clinton
Message-ID: <199809140329.UAA27214@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: vols-fan at juno.com (Football Fan)
Subject: IP: Vote on Clinton
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 19:24:26 -0500
To: baldmccoy at prodigy.net, PiercedEar at juno.com, TTMCCOY at juno.com, psm127_dad at mailcity.com, phmitch at mindspring.com, stringtickler at hotmail.com, Jimjean5013 at juno.com, laney at arkansas.net, JESSICA.HARDAGE at charleston.af.mil, teyze-barbi at juno.com, rjohnson at bstream.com, iarthuriarthur at juno.com, w-t-14 at juno.com, Bripowell at nidlink.com, supertrician at juno.com, barsotti at bstream.com

Dear Friends:
      MSNBC has a poll asking whether Clinton should go!  Right now its
70%
yes and 30% No.  Please go and vote.  Lets tell Clinton where he gets
off!
There was  117904 responses.

http://www.msnbc.com/news/default.asp

http://www.msnbc.com/news/default.asp 

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From kriek at bigfoot.com  Sun Sep 13 07:37:47 1998
From: kriek at bigfoot.com (Neels Kriek)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 22:37:47 +0800
Subject: Offshore Banking In Latvia
Message-ID: <001b01bddf90$ffbb6dc0$95060cd1@alien>

I have had dealings with the Paritate bank in Latvia.  Good bank and no con.

http://www.paritate.lv

Lots of different types of accounts.  
Regards

From vznuri at netcom.com  Sun Sep 13 08:06:56 1998
From: vznuri at netcom.com (Vladimir Z. Nuri)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 23:06:56 +0800
Subject: IP: Impeachment Petition
Message-ID: <199809140329.UAA27182@netcom13.netcom.com>

From: vols-fan at juno.com (Football Fan)
Subject: IP: Impeachment Petition
Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 22:59:15 -0500
To: baldmccoy at prodigy.net, PiercedEar at juno.com, TTMCCOY at juno.com, psm127_dad at mailcity.com, phmitch at mindspring.com, stringtickler at hotmail.com, Jimjean5013 at juno.com, laney at arkansas.net, JESSICA.HARDAGE at charleston.af.mil, teyze-barbi at juno.com, rjohnson at bstream.com, iarthuriarthur at juno.com, w-t-14 at juno.com, Bripowell at nidlink.com, supertrician at juno.com, barsotti at bstream.com

http://congress.nw.dc.us/impeach/petition.html

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From nobody at replay.com  Sun Sep 13 08:46:48 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Sun, 13 Sep 1998 23:46:48 +0800
Subject: The Empire Strikes Back (was IP: Army Tests Land Warrior for 21st
Message-ID: <199809140446.GAA23564@replay.com>

On Sun, 13 Sep 1998, Robert Hettinga wrote:

>  "First and foremost, Land Warrior is a fighting system," Serino said. Land
> Warrior has several subsystems: the weapon, integrated helmet assembly,
> protective clothing and individual equipment, computer/radio, and software.
> 
>  The weapon subsystem is built around the M-16/M-4 modular carbine. It has
> a laser range finder/digital compass, a daylight video camera, a laser
> aiming light and a thermal sight.

Great. So now instead of having ninjas come through our windows, we will
have Borg coming through our windows.

"Citizen-unit, we are Government. Resistance is futile. You will be
assimilated. Your personality will conform to our specifications.
Resistance is futile."

All they need to do now is employ nanotechnology and get some cool "whir
whir" sound effects, a big cube-shaped HQ, and maybe a cutting beam to
carve your house and car up like roasts when they seize them.

From declan at well.com  Sun Sep 13 09:30:11 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 00:30:11 +0800
Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT: DC cypherpunks meeting this Saturday, Sep 19
Message-ID: 

There will be a cypherpunks meeting and party this Saturday, September 19
starting at 5 pm in Adams Morgan, Washington, DC.

Our two out-of-town guests are Doug McGowan from HP (who will speak about
his company's encryption products that became controversial early this
year) and David Burt of filteringfacts.org (who's here for a Christian
Coalition conference and may or may not feel like speaking about his
position on some of the anti-porn legislation likely to pass Congress).

Interested in coming? RSVP and I'll send directions.

-Declan

From schear at lvcm.com  Sun Sep 13 10:14:05 1998
From: schear at lvcm.com (Steve Schear)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 01:14:05 +0800
Subject: radio net
In-Reply-To: <199809130024.UAA12462@mx02.together.net>
Message-ID: 

> Spread spectrum would have more promise as many stations could be on the
>air at once on the same frequency thus making life quite confusing for
>the T-hunters.

I investigated this application several years back and see two practical
approaches: one adapt a commercial SSB or Ham transciever to use frequency
hopping spread spectrum, or two build a pirate spread spectrum satellite
ground station.

Until recently most SSB gear didn't have the RF characteristics to use FH.
Now there are a number of inexpensive sets which use direct frequency
synthesis (as opposed to the older, and much slower, phase-locked loop
approach) and can be driven at hundreds or even thousands of hops per
second. FH helps solve two problems: first it provides privacy, second it
can mitigate or eliminate fading (which is highly time-frequency
correlated). Also, the higher the hop rate, the higher the process gain,
jam resistance and the lower the probablity of intecept (all other things
being equal).

It think it was Phil Karn (Qualcomm) who once mused that it would be rather
straightforward to masquarade a high process gain SS signal on a commercial
satellite transponder. To it's owners the SS signal would be almost
invisible, making itself known as only a very slight depression in the
transponder's gain. Effectively, this could offer an inexpensive covert
channel for tunneling packets and thwarting traffic analysis.

After the Captain Midnight episode I discussed this possibility with a very
technically knowledgeable staffer at the FCC and was assured that discovery
of such signals were beyond (at that time) the ability of commercial and
national technical (e.g., Lacrosse) means.

There's much more, but this should give you the general idea.

--Steve

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From k9bb50g7 at auto.sixdegrees.com  Sun Sep 13 10:57:46 1998
From: k9bb50g7 at auto.sixdegrees.com (sixdegrees)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 01:57:46 +0800
Subject: Larry Gilbert
Message-ID: <199809140644.XAA17608@toad.com>

Just a quick update from sixdegrees(tm). Unfortunately Larry 
Gilbert (irving at pobox.com) asked not to be listed as your 
contact with sixdegrees.

We also wanted to make sure you were aware that you currently 
have no other confirmed contacts, so it will be hard for you to
have a productive sixdegrees experience. As you probably know, 
without any confirmed contacts, you won't get any results from our 
networking searches. 

So, we just wanted to recommend that you head over to 
http://www.sixdegrees.com , log-in, and go to MY CONTACTS 
to list additional relationships. 

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If you have any problems, questions or requests send an e-mail to 
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E.DB.BRESP.3

From stuffed at stuffed.net  Mon Sep 14 02:00:10 1998
From: stuffed at stuffed.net (STUFFED NEWS DAILY)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 02:00:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: HOTTEST ISSUE OF THE SUMMER TO KEEP YOU WARM IF FALL IS HEADING YOUR WAY!
Message-ID: <19980914071000.22081.qmail@eureka.abc-web.com>

IN TODAY'S ISSUE:

 30 NEW EXTRA HOT JPEGS!
 5 NEW SIZZLING STORIES
 LISTEN TO GET LAID
 BAYWATCH CONFESSIONAL
 DOING THE DRAG KING THING
 PREGO BY PLEASURE
 SEX DRUGS AND ARACHNIDS
 THE BARON OF BALLS
 THE BEST OF EUREKA
 NUCLEAR HARD-ON
 MILLION DOLLAR SHEIK SHAG

       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/14/   <----

Welcome to  today's  issue of Stuffed. To read it you should
click on the URL above.  If it is not made clickable by your
email program  you will need to  use your mouse to highlight
the URL,  copy it and then paste it into your browser  (then
press Return).

This  email  is  never  sent  unsolicited.  Stuffed  is  the
supplement for the Eureka newsletter you subscribed to. Full
instructions on unsubscribing  are in every issue of Eureka!

       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/14/   <----

From lharrison at dueprocess.com  Sun Sep 13 11:20:04 1998
From: lharrison at dueprocess.com (Lynne L. Harrison)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 02:20:04 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980914032054.007d3b40@pop.mhv.net>

> On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, Tim May wrote:
> 
> There's also the idea popular in some gender feminist circles that the
> imbalance of power in manager-employee relationships makes it impossible
> for genuine consent to be given. Can there be any greater power imbalance
> than the president of the United States and an intern? Where are the
> feminist cries of outrage?

Could be because, at least from what I read in the report and from other
sources, Monica came onto Clinton.  One could make the argument that the
imbalance of power was the other way around ;)

On another note, instead of the report, it may be extremely more
interesting to read:
http://www.reagan.com/HotTopics.main/document-9.1.1998.1.html

I can't vouch for the veracity of all of those listed.  Of those
individuals, however, with whom I am familiar by way of the media, it is
accurate - and eerie, to say the least.

***************************************************************************
Lynne L. Harrison, Esq.         |  "If we are all here,
Poughkeepsie, New York          |   then we are not
mailto:lharrison at dueprocess.com |   all there."
http://www.dueprocess.com       |      - old Zen saying
*************************************************************************

DISCLAIMER:  I am not your attorney; you are not my client.
             Accordingly, the above is *NOT* legal advice.

From update at annex.liveupdate.com  Sun Sep 13 11:57:03 1998
From: update at annex.liveupdate.com (LiveUpdate News)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 02:57:03 +0800
Subject: Crescendo News - September 1998
Message-ID: <039975445070e98ANNEX@annex.liveupdate.com>

CRESCENDO NEWS - September 1998

Well, it's almost fall here in New England - we're looking 
forward to the foliage turning color and the snow starting to 
fall.  The leaves up North aren't the only things that are 
about to change - we're working harder than ever to deliver the 
best music products on the Internet.  You're receiving this 
email because you downloaded Crescendo in the past, and we want 
to keep you up to date with some of the exciting things that 
are happening at LiveUpdate.  We hope you are enjoying Crescendo!

These are some of the items included in this newsletter:

* Crescendo Forte Showcase is now open
* Crescendo PLUS version 4.0 Beta 2 now includes LiveSynth 
* Crescendo Forte featured on RealNetworks Music Showcase
* Crescendo Forte featured in Keyboard Magazine's "net smarts"
* Re-enabling Crescendo after installing other plugins
* Controlling Crescendo using JavaScript
* What would you like to see in future versions of Crescendo?
* Subscribing / Unsubscribing

----------------------------------

CRESCENDO FORTE SHOWCASE IS NOW OPEN

On September 10th, 1998, the long awaited Crescendo Forte 
Showcase publicly opened its doors.  Crescendo Forte is an 
add-on to RealNetworks' RealPlayer G2, and allows MIDI music 
to be synchronized with other media types such as RealAudio, 
video, animation, and text.  Rob Glaser, CEO of RealNetworks 
sums Crescendo Forte up best by saying "Crescendo Forte Rocks!".  
Crescendo Forte has been called "unbelievable", and it has been 
said to be "Music the way it was meant to be heard." See (and 
hear) for yourself what all the excitement is about 
at the Crescendo Forte Showcase, found at 
http://www.liveupdate.com/cforte/showcase.html.  

After you've heard the difference Crescendo Forte makes to 
music on the Internet, get Crescendo PLUS version 4.0 Beta 2 
for an upgrade to LiveSynth that makes the music sound even 
better!  (Keep reading for more details...)

----------------------------------

CRESCENDO PLUS VERSION 4.0 BETA 2 NOW INCLUDES LIVESYNTH

It's finally here!  Crescendo PLUS version 4.0 Beta 2 is 
now available, and includes streaming, a software wavetable 
synthesizer (for more realistic instrument sounds), and more.  
If you have purchased a Crescendo PLUS subscription within the 
past year, you should have already received an email giving 
you instructions on how to download version 4.0 Beta 2.  If 
you haven't experienced Crescendo PLUS yet, now is the time to 
do so.  LiveSynth uses the processing power of your PC to play 
MIDI music using real instrument samples.  Therefore a Pentium 
processor is required to take advantage of LiveSynth.  If you 
don't have a Pentium processor, you will still be able to take 
advantage of streaming and the other features found in Crescendo 
PLUS.  For a short time, the Crescendo PLUS subscription which 
entitles you to both the shipping 3.0 version of Crescendo and 
4.0 Beta 2 including LiveSynth is available for $19.95 at our 
on-line store, https://secure.liveupdate.com.  

----------------------------------

CRESCENDO FORTE FEATURED ON REALNETWORKS MUSIC SHOWCASE

Atlantic Records, Polygram, Capitol Records, Warner Brothers, 
Sony Music, Maverick, Virgin Records can all be found on the G2 
Music Showcase area on the RealNetworks web site.  And who should 
be featured among these titans of the music industry?  LiveUpdate, 
of course!  Visit the G2 music showcase at 
http://www.real.com/showcase/realplayer/music.html 
and hear how the combination of RealPlayer G2 and Crescendo Forte 
are redefining the way music is heard on the Internet.

----------------------------------

CRESCENDO FORTE FEATURED IN KEYBOARD MAGAZINE'S NET SMARTS

Are you hungry for more information on creating content for
Crescendo Forte?  Would you like to know what Dan Barrett, author
of "net smarts" for Keyboard Magazine has to say about Crescendo 
Forte?  Read the rave artice in the October issue of Keyboard 
magazine, where Dan Barrett says, "It's so satisfying to encounter 
a product that just plain works" and "The pre-beta version of 
Crescendo Forte installed easily on my PC and ran transparently 
inside of RealPlayer G2, keeping the audio and MIDI streams (to 
my ears) in perfect sync.  It's definitely worth a look."  Get it 
at your local newsstand, or check out Keyboard Magazine online 
at http://www.keyboardmag.com.

----------------------------------

RE-ENABLING CRESCENDO AFTER INSTALLING OTHER PLUGINS

Probably the most common question our on-line helpdesk 
(helpdesk at liveupdate.com) looks something this:

"I have been using Crescendo to play MIDI on-line for over two
years now, and I love it.  I just installed QuickTime 
to play a movie, but now when I go to a web site that has MIDI, 
Crescendo doesn't load any more.  I want my Crescendo back!"

If this looks familiar to you, we have good news - you can
have your QuickTime and Crescendo too!  Netscape decides which
plugin will be used for a given media type based on their
position on your Netscape/program/plugins directory.  If you
go to the Help/About Plugins from the Navigator window, you
will probably see "LiveUpdate Crescendo" listed, but one or
more of the MIME types listed there will most likely be listed
as disabled.  To cure this problem, we have created a page
which outlines how to re-arrange your plugins directory so
that Crescendo will be enabled for all MIDI MIME types, while
co-existing with other plugins such as QuickTime.  Surf to
http://www.liveupdate.com/atlashelp.html for more details!

----------------------------------

CONTROLLING CRESCENDO USING JAVASCRIPT

Are you a JavaScript programmer?  Would you like to see how
Crescendo can be controlled using JavaScript?  We have created
a page that demonstrates Crescendo being controlled by
JavaScript methods and standard HTML buttons.  See it in
action at http://www.liveupdate.com/wiretest.html.  To
look "under the hood," just view the page's source to see how
simple it is to control Crescendo through JavaScript.

----------------------------------

WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO SEE IN FUTURE VERSIONS OF CRESCENDO?

We are still looking for new ideas to be included in future
versions of the Crescendo player.  If you have any cool features
you would like to see added to Crescendo, send them to 
feedback at liveupdate.com.  Who knows - maybe your suggestion will
makes its way into the next version of Crescendo!

----------------------------------

SUBSCRIBING / UNSUBSCRIBING

Note: Messages from LiveUpdate to this list will not be sent any 
more frequently than once a month, and your information has not, and 
will not, be given to others or sold.  If you wish to unsubscribe 
from this list, or if this message has been forwarded to you by a 
friend and you would like to subscribe to our newsletter, please 
send a message to newsletter at liveupdate.com.

*******************************************

Spread the Music!

From joswald at rpkusa.com  Mon Sep 14 04:31:09 1998
From: joswald at rpkusa.com (Jack Oswald / CEO / RPK Security)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 04:31:09 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: ANNOUNCEMENT: RPK InvisiMail NOW DISTRIBUTED THROUGH ONLINE RESELLERS
Message-ID: <199809141123.EAA22441@proxy3.ba.best.com>

You have received this message because at some time in the past your name was submitted to our e-mail mailing list database.  If you do not wish (or no longer wish) to receive announcements, updates and news concerning the RPK Encryptonite Engine or the RPK InvisiMail e-mail security products, please forward this message to remove at rpkusa.com

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

CONTACT
Paula Miller				Lyn Oswald
Nadel Phelan, Inc.			RPK Security, Inc.
408-439-5570 x277			212-488-9891
paulam at nadelphelan.com		lynoswald at rpkusa.com

RPK InvisiMail NOW DISTRIBUTED THROUGH ONLINE RESELLERS

Alexa Internet, Parsons Technology and Buyonet International Partner with InvisiMail International Ltd.

SAN FRANCISCO, CA. August 31, 1998 - InvisiMail International Ltd., a specialist in Internet commerce and communications systems, announced today the completion of joint marketing agreements with Alexa Internet, Parsons Technology Inc. and Buyonet International for the RPK InvisiMail e-mail security software product.

	RPK InvisiMail is a standards-based e-mail security add-in for POP3/SMTP Internet e-mail software and Internet gateway servers. RPK InvisiMail is completely transparent, allowing users to easily send and receive private e-mail messages securely over the Internet, without having to learn about cryptography.  RPK InvisiMail was developed using RPK Security Inc.'s core technology, the RPK Encryptonite Engine.

	Alexa, a free Web navigation service, Parsons Technology, a catalog marketer of high quality computing solutions, and Buyonet International, an online software reseller with sales in more than 110 countries, will market and resell RPK InvisiMail products to customers through multiple distribution channels. Alexa's core marketing efforts for InvisiMail include advertising InvisiMail through banner ads and e-mail announcements to Alexa's customers.

	"We are delighted to have established a mutually profitable marketing partnership with RPK Security in support of InvisiMail," said Darian Patchin, director of media and distribution for Alexa Internet. "This partnership brings many benefits and is complementary to our Web navigation tool. RPK InvisiMail offers customers a flexible, easy to use and configurable secure e-mail add-in."

 more
RPK InvisiMail PARTNERS WITH ONLINE RESELLERS	PG. 2 OF 2

	As part of the licensing deal with Parsons Technology, a Broderbund Company, InvisiMail will be branded to reflect the Parsons name.  Parsons� RPK InvisiMail will be offered through Parsons Technology direct to consumers, with marketing efforts focusing on catalog exposure, electronic mailings, Parsons' website and other on-line channels. 

	"Parsons Technology has always stood for high quality software at affordable prices.  InvisiMail is no exception.  We are excited to bring this level of protection and ease of use to our customers," said Brian Kristiansen of Parsons Technology.
Buyonet will distribute RPK InvisiMail Intro on the freeware/shareware portion of their online store and will sell RPK InvisiMail Deluxe online.  

	"This new agreement gives us an even larger assortment of e-mail tools," said Buyonet Chairman Tore Helgeson.

ABOUT InvisiMail INTERNATIONAL LTD.
InvisiMail International Ltd., founded in 1997, specializes in secure Internet commerce and communications solutions for a wide range of applications.  An adherence to open communication standards, using a distinctive Proxy Architecture, makes the InvisiMail International approach to security the most flexible available.  Developed using RPK Security, Inc.'s core technology, the RPK Encryptonite Engine, the InvisiMail range of products supports secure message-based applications including Client Services, E-Commerce, EDI and others that require absolute confidentiality and the highest security levels.  This allows the simplest e-mail systems to become the most powerful business and commerce tools.  Contact InvisiMail at www.InvisiMail.com or call +44 1624 611 003.

ABOUT RPK SECURITY
Founded in 1995, RPK Security, Inc. is a technology leader in fast public key cryptography.  Its flagship RPK Encryptonite Engine, a uniquely fast and strong public key encryption technology, is available worldwide in custom hardware and software toolkits on multiple platforms.  Developed from widely accepted security mathematics and techniques, the RPK Encryptonite Engine is easily embedded into new and existing hardware and software applications.  RPK's cryptographic research and product development is based in New Zealand, Switzerland and the U.K, with worldwide sales and marketing operations in San Francisco, CA.  Visit RPK's website at www.rpkusa.com or call (212) 488-9891.

From demona at demona.doldrums.dyn.ml.org  Sun Sep 13 14:25:42 1998
From: demona at demona.doldrums.dyn.ml.org (the scent of old bones and fresh blood)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 05:25:42 +0800
Subject: 023026.htm
Message-ID: <199809140625.CAA00774@demona.doldrums.dyn.ml.org>

                             [1]That's Racin' 

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   Posted at 12:54 a.m. PDT Sunday, September 13, 1998 

Net Security Takes Key Step

   BY JAMES J. MITCHELL
   Mercury News Staff Writer

   TriStrata Security Inc. of Redwood Shores isn't your usual Internet
   start-up. Its chief executive recently gave up the reins of a $2
   billion subsidiary to run it. The company's founder and chairman is
   the man who invented the personal identification number (PIN).
   America's largest accounting firm is already endorsing it. And its
   promise lured some of the best-connected executives onto its board.

   Three months ago, Paul Wahl was running German software maker SAP AG's
   U.S. operations, which has 5,000 employees and first-half 1998 sales
   of nearly $1 billion. Last week he became chief executive of
   TriStrata, a 35-person start-up that makes Internet security software.

   The reason for Wahl's sudden career change and move from Philadelphia
   is a tremendous opportunity . . .to make Internet history by changing
   the way the world keeps information secure on the Internet, says Wahl,
   46.

   That same dream brought John Atalla out of retirement in 1993 to form
   TriStrata. Atalla, now 74, decades ago created the PIN system and the
   security used today in 80 percent of the world's automatic-teller
   machines. He was enjoying the beaches of the world when friends in the
   banking industry asked him to work on the problem of Internet
   security.

   Both men believe TriStrata's software -- which works efficiently with
   voice and video as well as with data -- will revolutionize electronic
   commerce, enabling companies to create virtual private networks and
   permitting, for example, the secure and inexpensive sale of software,
   music and videos over the Internet.

   Some outside observers agree.

   PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP, which is the largest of the Big Five
   accounting firms and has 2,200 employees devoted to Internet security,
   believes this could be the de facto standard for encryption
   technology, says Jim Coriston, a PWC managing partner. TriStrata
   software is being implemented throughout the firm, which is also
   offering the product to its clients.

   It's a whole different approach to cryptography, says Larry Dietz,
   director of information security and legal strategies for Current
   Analysis, a market research firm. Its key principles make a lot of
   sense. But some critics question whether TriStrata's product is as
   secure as the company claims.

   And the company faces tough competition from established security
   companies such as Network Associates Inc. of Santa Clara and Secure
   Computing Corp. of San Jose, as well as from computer vendors like IBM
   and Hewlett-Packard Co., which include security in their products.

   Atalla rejected the traditional approach for enterprise security using
   public key encryption, a system that uses two keys, both controlled by
   the user: a private key, which must be kept secret, and a public key,
   which can be freely distributed. Such systems can be broken, have
   performance limitations and have restrictions on the strength of the
   key that can be exported.

   Instead, he turned to the one-time pad approach invented in 1917 by
   Gilbert Vernam. It uses randomly generated numbers that are never
   replicated in the exact same sequence. The one-time pad is
   theoretically unbreakable, cryptographers agree. But it hasn't been
   useful because it requires so much computing and telecommunications
   power.

   Atalla decided that the great advances in computer memory and
   processing technology and today's powerful and relatively inexpensive
   communications capability made the Vernam cipher practical, and he
   built his security system around it. As a result, each encrypted
   document has a different code.

   The system is so fast, so inexpensive and provides such a good audit
   trail that it will lead companies to make encrypted transmissions the
   rule instead of the exception, Atalla and Wahl say.

   The federal government, including the National Security Agency and the
   FBI, has cleared it for export because the system allows access to
   specific documents for which an appropriate court order has been
   issued. The company expects the product to be received warmly
   overseas, since the U.S. government cannot decode information at will.
   But it's unclear whether this feature will diminish foreign concerns
   about U.S. security products.

   Skeptics wonder whether the company has created a sufficiently large
   string of random numbers to approximate randomness, Dietz says.

   And TriStrata's approach is so different it won't be an easy sell. It
   requires companies to transform their security systems, a decision
   likely to be made by the chief executive and chief information
   officers, Dietz says, not the people who normally purchase security
   software.

   Here the many contacts of Atalla, Wahl and TriStrata's directors
   should prove useful.

   Atalla is well known in the high-tech community. At Bell Laboratories
   his research resulted in his patents for the metal oxide semiconductor
   (MOS), a key component of modern electronic devices. Then he
   co-founded Hewlett-Packard Associates and Hewlett-Packard Laboratories
   and directed the company's solid-state division. He founded Atalla
   Corp. in 1973 and sold it to Tandem Computers Inc. in 1987.

   Atalla was able to attract to TriStrata a star-studded board that
   includes John Young, former chief executive of HP; Tom Perkins,
   partner in the venture capital firm of Kleiner Perkins Caufield &
   Byers; and William Zuendt, retired president of Wells Fargo & Co. and
   former chairman of MasterCard.

   The company released its first product last November. As it prepared
   to move from R&D to large-scale sales, it added as a director David
   Beirne, a general partner of venture capital firm Benchmark Capital.
   Beirne, who had made his mark as one of the most successful executive
   recruiters before joining Benchmark last year, approached Wahl about
   the CEO job two months ago.

   Wahl, quite content at SAP, was negotiating a move back to Europe with
   the company when Beirne called and persuaded him to fly here to take a
   look at TriStrata. After a second quick visit, Wahl and his wife
   decided to come west.

   TriStrata is unlikely to become a huge employer; Wahl expects the
   workforce to perhaps double to 70 in the next year or two and reach
   200 over five years.

   But it's impact on the Internet could be quite dramatic. And Wahl
   found that attraction irresistible.
     _________________________________________________________________

   Write James J. Mitchell at the Mercury News, 750 Ridder Park Drive,
   San Jose, Calif. 95190; phone (408) 920-5544; fax (408) 920-5917; or
   e-mail to [48]JMitchell at sjmercury.com .

   [INLINE]
   [INLINE]
   [49]Return to top [50][ISMAP]-[51]This image allows you to access site
   resources

   [INLINE]
   [52]That's Racin' 
   �1997 - 1998 Mercury Center. The information you receive online from
   Mercury Center is protected by the copyright laws of the United
   States. The copyright laws prohibit any copying, redistributing,
   retransmitting, or repurposing of any copyright-protected material.

References

   1. http://www.mercurycenter.com/event.ng/Type=click&ProfileID=442&RunID=1618&AdID=1530&GroupID=1&FamilyID=1&TagValues=154.197.298.414&Redirect=http:%2F%2Fwww.thatsracin.com
   2. http://www.mercurycenter.com/
   3. http://www.mercurycenter.com/graphics/toolbar.map
   4. LYNXIMGMAP:http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/top/023026.htm#toolbar
   5. http://www.passport.realcities.com/osform/AuthenticateService?osform_template=/sjm/frame.oft&content=benefits.html&final_template=
   6. http://www.mercurycenter.com/front/
   7. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/
   8. http://www.mercurycenter.com/gmsv/
   9. http://www.mercurycenter.com/sports/
  10. http://www.mercurycenter.com/opinion/
  11. http://www.mercurycenter.com/svlife/
  12. http://www.mercurycenter.com/weather/
  13. http://www.talentscout.com/
  14. http://www.homehunter.com/siliconvalley/
  15. http://enterprise.sjmercury.com/products/carhunter/
  16. http://www.justgo.com/bayarea/
  17. http://www.zip2.com/bayarea/
  18. http://classifieds.sjmercury.com/classifieds/indexnojava.html
  19. http://www.mercurycenter.com/resources/search/search_archive.shtml
  20. http://www.newshound.com/
  21. http://www.passport.realcities.com/osform/AuthenticateService?osform_template=/sjm/frame.oft&content=benefits.html&final_template=
  22. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/
  23. http://www.mercurycenter.com/today/today_business.shtml
  24. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/tech/
  25. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/business_section.shtml
  26. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/apple/
  27. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/asia/
  28. http://www.mercurycenter.com/breaking/
  29. http://www.mercurycenter.com/compute/
  30. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/business_getahead.shtml
  31. http://www.mercurycenter.com/gmsv/
  32. http://www.mercurycenter.com/realestate/
  33. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/intel/
  34. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/microsoft/
  35. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/moneytree/
  36. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/sv15098/150home.htm
  37. http://www.mercurycenter.com/realestate/mortgage/
  38. http://www.mercurycenter.com/stocks/motleyfool/
  39. http://www.mercurycenter.com/stocks/
  40. http://www.mercurycenter.com/talentscout/
  41. http://www.mercurycenter.com/columnists/carpluk/
  42. http://www.mercurycenter.com/columnists/gillmor/
  43. http://www.mercurycenter.com/columnists/lashinsky/
  44. http://www.mercurycenter.com/columnists/nolan/
  45. http://www.mercurycenter.com/columnists/shavers/
  46. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/business_feedback.shtml
  47. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/business_help.shtml
  48. mailto:JMitchell at sjmercury.com
  49. http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/top/023026.htm#backtotop
  50. http://www.mercurycenter.com/graphics/toolbar.map
  51. LYNXIMGMAP:http://www.mercurycenter.com/business/top/023026.htm#toolbar
  52. http://www.mercurycenter.com/event.ng/Type=click&ProfileID=442&RunID=1618&AdID=1530&GroupID=1&FamilyID=1&TagValues=154.197.298.414&Redirect=http:%2F%2Fwww.thatsracin.com

From nobody at sind.hyperreal.art.pl  Sun Sep 13 15:23:58 1998
From: nobody at sind.hyperreal.art.pl (HyperReal-Anon)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 06:23:58 +0800
Subject: Remailers
Message-ID: <3472f166e843de1880a781de2ecd3050@anonymous>

On  nnburk  wrote:

>Are _any_ of the remailers working?

Take a look at the remailer stats.

http://anon.efga.org/~rlist/rlist.html
http://anon.efga.org/~rlist/mlist.html

Kinda obvious really huh?

 -+DiGiTaL+-

Greets to AOHell 3l33T HaCkerz - the badest dudes ever!
 (yeah, they probably have root on your machine now!)

From sorens at workmail.com  Sun Sep 13 15:50:28 1998
From: sorens at workmail.com (Soren)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 06:50:28 +0800
Subject: MISTY encryption algorithm source code
In-Reply-To: <19980913230004.14914.qmail@nym.alias.net>
Message-ID: <35FD02A6.6473F7D0@workmail.com>

�

lcs Mixmaster Remailer wrote:
Nobuki Nakatuji wrote:

> MISTY source code posted by me at long ago had many mistake.
> Attachment file are revised MISTY source code and revised readme.
> Thanks.
>
>
> ______________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

BRAIN used by you always since at long ago have many insect. Attachment
brain not here because was exhausted in decypher you message. You go
back
at Hotmail now and stop spam Cypherpunks list. Chop chop.
And of course we know that this list should be the exclusive province of
white-boys-who-speak-american-english.� Give us all a laugh, and attempt
saying that in Japanese.� BTW, get the culture for your cultural slurs
correct.� The etymology of chop chop is Shanghai, late 19th century.�
A chop is an engraved ideogram representing a non-forgeable signature -
sort of a smartcard.� Hence chop chop, translates as "sign on the
dotted line and get on with the deal". Taking this a little further, chopsticks
are so-called because they usually bear the 'chop' of the eating house
from whence you stole them.� Needless to say, the chinese don't call
them that. This is akin to messages to you, being in spanish because your
neighbors to the south speak it.� I suspect Nakatuji-san is entirely
'misty'fied by your random cultural references. Unless you haven't realized,
the internet actually exists outside of the Union of Shortsighted Assholes.�
Perhaps you'd be happier returning to your nakama on Assholes On-Line?��
Here's a self-study course,
on asian anatomical and cultural differences, for your perusal.

"Educate, don't agitate"
�

From dejanews at list.emailpub.com  Mon Sep 14 07:16:15 1998
From: dejanews at list.emailpub.com (Deja News Members)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 07:16:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: What's New at Deja News
Message-ID: <19980914081041.000172@mulder.emailpub.com>

____________________________________________________________

WHAT'S NEW AT DEJA NEWS!                         09/14/1998
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Greetings from Deja News! This monthly newsletter is
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From ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com  Sun Sep 13 16:28:12 1998
From: ravage at EINSTEIN.ssz.com (Jim Choate)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 07:28:12 +0800
Subject: McDougal denied medical aid prior to death [CNN] (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809141249.HAA24512@einstein.ssz.com>

Forwarded message:
>From ravage at ssz.com Mon Sep 14 07:49:25 1998
From: Jim Choate 
Message-Id: <199809141249.HAA24500 at einstein.ssz.com>
Subject: McDougal denied medical aid prior to death [CNN]
To: users at ssz.com (SSZ User Mail List)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 07:49:23 -0500 (CDT)
Cc: friends at ssz.com (Ravage's Friends)
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 2034      

Forwarded message:

> X-within-URL: http://www.cnn.com/US/9809/14/mcdougal.report.ap/

>    McDougal September 14, 1998
>    Web posted at: 2:21 a.m. EDT (0621 GMT)
>    
>    FORT WORTH, Texas (AP) -- Whitewater witness James McDougal did not
>    have access to his heart medication in the hours before he died in
>    prison, a federal government report revealed.
>    
>    McDougal, a former business partner of President Clinton who later
>    agreed to testify for Independent Counsel Ken Starr, also was not seen
>    by a doctor although he complained of feeling ill the day before his
>    death, according to a report obtained by the Fort Worth Star-Telegram
>    under the Freedom of Information Act.
>    
>    McDougal was moved from his regular cell to solitary confinement at
>    the Federal Medical Center prison in Fort Worth a day before his death
>    as punishment for failing to provide a urine sample for a drug test.
>    
>    McDougal had complained of being unable to provide urine for drug
>    tests because of the medications he took for a variety of ailments.
>    
>    During the move, guards did not find McDougal's heart medication
>    because they did not want to search McDougal's regular cell and
>    disturb his sleeping cell mate, the report said.
>    
>    One of the medicines, nitroglycerin, could have bought McDougal some
>    time after he suffered a heart attack, a prison official who asked not
>    to be identified said in the Sunday paper.

[text deleted]

    ____________________________________________________________________

                            The seeker is a finder.

                                     Ancient Persian Proverb

       The Armadillo Group       ,::////;::-.          James Choate
       Austin, Tx               /:'///// ``::>/|/      ravage at ssz.com
       www.ssz.com            .',  ||||    `/( e\      512-451-7087
                           -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'-
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

From declan at well.com  Sun Sep 13 17:34:48 1998
From: declan at well.com (Declan McCullagh)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 08:34:48 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980914032054.007d3b40@pop.mhv.net>
Message-ID: 

Careful with your attributions. I don't believe Tim wrote what you said he
did.

As for Monica-Clinton, what appears to be the case doesn't matter in some
ideologies. Can meaningful consent be given with such a power imbalance?

-Declan

On Mon, 14 Sep 1998, Lynne L. Harrison wrote:

> > On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, Tim May wrote:
> > 
> > There's also the idea popular in some gender feminist circles that the
> > imbalance of power in manager-employee relationships makes it impossible
> > for genuine consent to be given. Can there be any greater power imbalance
> > than the president of the United States and an intern? Where are the
> > feminist cries of outrage?
> 
> Could be because, at least from what I read in the report and from other
> sources, Monica came onto Clinton.  One could make the argument that the
> imbalance of power was the other way around ;)
> 
> On another note, instead of the report, it may be extremely more
> interesting to read:
> http://www.reagan.com/HotTopics.main/document-9.1.1998.1.html
> 
> I can't vouch for the veracity of all of those listed.  Of those
> individuals, however, with whom I am familiar by way of the media, it is
> accurate - and eerie, to say the least.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ***************************************************************************
> Lynne L. Harrison, Esq.         |  "If we are all here,
> Poughkeepsie, New York          |   then we are not
> mailto:lharrison at dueprocess.com |   all there."
> http://www.dueprocess.com       |      - old Zen saying
> *************************************************************************
> 
> DISCLAIMER:  I am not your attorney; you are not my client.
>              Accordingly, the above is *NOT* legal advice.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 

From tcmay at got.net  Sun Sep 13 18:30:36 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 09:30:36 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980914032054.007d3b40@pop.mhv.net>
Message-ID: 

At 12:20 AM -0700 9/14/98, Lynne L. Harrison wrote:
>> On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, Tim May wrote:
>>
>> There's also the idea popular in some gender feminist circles that the
>> imbalance of power in manager-employee relationships makes it impossible
>> for genuine consent to be given. Can there be any greater power imbalance
>> than the president of the United States and an intern? Where are the
>> feminist cries of outrage?
>

Just to be clear, I didn't write any of the above that was attributed to
me. Declan wrote it.

I don't even know what a "gender feminist" is.  Some kind of typical
feminazi or feminista screwball, I assume.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From mok-kong.shen at stud.uni-muenchen.de  Sun Sep 13 18:35:21 1998
From: mok-kong.shen at stud.uni-muenchen.de (Mok-Kong Shen)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 09:35:21 +0800
Subject: IP: [Fwd: new threat to privacy]
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <35FD2950.98C77B4D@stud.uni-muenchen.de>

Robert Hettinga wrote:
> 

> Investigators need only know your e-mail address to secretly
> install the program. Once they do, investigators can read your
> documents, view your images, download your files and intercept
> your encryption keys. DIRT was developed to assist law
> enforcement in pedophilia investigations, but future uses could
> include drug investigations, money laundering cases and
> information warfare.

Does downloading of files includes files without public read permit?

From petro at playboy.com  Sun Sep 13 19:15:15 1998
From: petro at playboy.com (Petro)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 10:15:15 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809121549.IAA28683@zendia.mentat.com>
Message-ID: 

At 10:49 AM -0500 9/12/98, Jim Gillogly wrote:
>Declan wrote:
>> On Fri, 11 Sep 1998, Jim Gillogly wrote:
>> >
>> > If they  decide this is now a requirement for high office, I'd like
>> > to see all the Congresscritters who've had sex out of wedlock and
>> > concealed it take one step forward.  Shall we make hypocrisy in high
>> > office impeachable also?
>>
>> A better question is: If Clinton is guilty of perjury and other felonies,
>> should he be impeached?
>
>IANAL (feel free to weigh in here, Unicorn), but I heard on one show or
>another that lying under oath is perjury only if it's material to the
>suit.  Since the Jones case was dismissed, it was argued that even if he
>lied then, it wasn't material and thus wasn't perjury -- they claimed that
>nobody had every been convicted of perjury for lying in a case that was
>dismissed.  Of course he's saying he didn't even lie: like Kinky Friedman

	Whether anyone was convicted or not, he still LIED UNDER OATH
(Allegedly, allegedly allegedly). It doesn't matter whether the case was
dismissed or not.

>In any case, despite these legalisms, I'm not convinced that perjury in
>any case should be considered treason or high crimes and misdemeanors.

	He VIOLATED HIS OATH OF OFFICE.

>The Founding Fathers could have been more specific about what was
>impeachable, and they chose not to be, leaving it intentionally ambiguous.
>
>Despite those arguments, this stuff really isn't about perjury: it's about
>the Republicans' case of nixon envy... Clinton's peccadillos are a far cry
>from Watergate (or Teapot Dome or Iran-Contra), but it's the best chance
>they've had since the Crook was dumped.

	Yeah, Nixon only worked to conceal the actions of others,
attempting to protect himself, and the people who worked for him. He did
this concerning a crime he did not know was going to be committed.

	Clinton on the other hand LIED UNDER OATH about something HE DID,
lied to PROTECT HIMSELF, and ONLY HIMSELF. At least Nixon worried about
more than his historical legacy, and his wee-willy.

>> If you don't think about lying about sex and related issues under oath
>> should be a crime, well, then change the law. But right now any form of
>> lying under oath is perjury, whether you like it or not.
>If he did commit perjury, would that be an impeachable offense?  I claim
>it's up to the House to interpret just what constitutes high crimes and
>misdemeanors, since it isn't spelled out in the Constitution.
>
>Disclaimer -- I'm not a Democrat, and I'm annoyed with Clinton's behavior
>on crypto issues.  If I appear to be defending him, it's inadvertant -- I
>just feel he should be attacked on material points rather than whatever
>sleazy stuff Starr has found under his rocks.

	As it's been said before, if he'll lie UNDER OATH about this, what
about other things?

--
petro at playboy.com----for work related issues. I don't speak for Playboy.
petro at bounty.org-----for everthing else.      They wouldn't like that.
                                              They REALLY
Economic speech IS political speech.          wouldn't like that.

From xasper8d at lobo.net  Sun Sep 13 19:28:16 1998
From: xasper8d at lobo.net (X)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 10:28:16 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <000101bddff3$d5e14840$9f2580d0@ibm>

What chance is there that the Paula Jones case was dismissed BECAUSE Wild
Bill lied under oath?

Remember OJ?

X

-----Original Message-----
From:	owner-cypherpunks at minder.net [mailto:owner-cypherpunks at minder.net] On
Behalf Of Petro
Sent:	Monday, September 14, 1998 9:03 AM
To:	Jim Gillogly; declan at well.com
Cc:	cypherpunks at cyberpass.net
Subject:	Re: Clinton's fake apologies

At 10:49 AM -0500 9/12/98, Jim Gillogly wrote:
>IANAL (feel free to weigh in here, Unicorn), but I heard on one show or
>another that lying under oath is perjury only if it's material to the
>suit.  Since the Jones case was dismissed, it was argued that even if he
>lied then, it wasn't material and thus wasn't perjury -- they claimed that
>nobody had every been convicted of perjury for lying in a case that was
>dismissed.

From sunder at brainlink.com  Sun Sep 13 19:59:32 1998
From: sunder at brainlink.com (Ray Arachelian)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 10:59:32 +0800
Subject: IP: Impeachment Petition -- NOT!
In-Reply-To: <199809140329.UAA27182@netcom13.netcom.com>
Message-ID: <35FD3C3C.EC8102E6@brainlink.com>

So much for this being a working thing:

Anyone else get a bounce?

Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 11:20:14 -0400
From: System Administrator 
To: sunder at sundernet.com
Subject: Undeliverable: Impeach Clinton Now!

Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients.

      To:       tmanton at mail.house.gov
      Subject:  Impeach Clinton Now!
      Sent:     9/14/98 11:20:14 AM

The following recipient(s) could not be reached:

      tmanton at mail.house.gov on 9/14/98 11:20:14 AM
            Recipient Not Found
            MSEXCH:IMC:U.S. House of Representatives:U.S. House:MSG05

Vladimir Z. Nuri wrote:
> 
> From: vols-fan at juno.com (Football Fan)
> Subject: IP: Impeachment Petition
> Date: Sat, 12 Sep 1998 22:59:15 -0500
> To: baldmccoy at prodigy.net, PiercedEar at juno.com, TTMCCOY at juno.com, psm127_dad at mailcity.com, phmitch at mindspring.com, stringtickler at hotmail.com, Jimjean5013 at juno.com, laney at arkansas.net, JESSICA.HARDAGE at charleston.af.mil, teyze-barbi at juno.com, rjohnson at bstream.com, iarthuriarthur at juno.com, w-t-14 at juno.com, Bripowell at nidlink.com, supertrician at juno.com, barsotti at bstream.com
> 
> http://congress.nw.dc.us/impeach/petition.html
> 
> **********************************************
> To subscribe or unsubscribe, email:
>      majordomo at majordomo.pobox.com
> with the message:
>      (un)subscribe ignition-point email at address
> **********************************************
> www.telepath.com/believer
> **********************************************

-- 

=====================================Kaos=Keraunos=Kybernetos==============
.+.^.+.|  Ray Arachelian    |Prying open my 3rd eye.  So good to see |./|\.
..\|/..|sunder at sundernet.com|you once again. I thought you were      |/\|/\
<--*-->| ------------------ |hiding, and you thought that I had run  |\/|\/
../|\..| "A toast to Odin,  |away chasing the tail of dogma. I opened|.\|/.
.+.v.+.|God of screwdrivers"|my eye and there we were....            |.....
======================= http://www.sundernet.com ==========================

From mmotyka at lsil.com  Sun Sep 13 20:05:35 1998
From: mmotyka at lsil.com (Michael Motyka)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 11:05:35 +0800
Subject: Clinton's fake apologies
In-Reply-To: <199809120319.UAA20709@leroy.fbn.bc.ca>
Message-ID: <35FD3C1F.514C@lsil.com>

>If the game looks too rough who do you blame?
>
Nice point. 

> I see the whole OIC crusade against Clinton as an attempt to bring
> honesty to government.  Ken Starr is just playing the game by the
> rules set out be the Clintons.  
>
But I guess I can't quite buy into it because I see no first order
differences between the Republocrats and the Demicans. The whole thing
looks to me like a redefinition of the rules of engagement in the same
old power struggle. Hardly Control vs. Kaos.

Mike

From lharrison at dueprocess.com  Sun Sep 13 20:22:48 1998
From: lharrison at dueprocess.com (Lynne L. Harrison)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 11:22:48 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980914032054.007d3b40@pop.mhv.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980914122452.0086a750@pop.mhv.net>

At 06:32 AM 9/14/98 -0700, Declan McCullagh wrote:
>Careful with your attributions. I don't believe Tim wrote what you said he
>did.

And at 07:31 AM 9/14/98 -0700, Tim May wrote:
>Just to be clear, I didn't write any of the above that was attributed to
>me. Declan wrote it.
>I don't even know what a "gender feminist" is.  Some kind of typical
>feminazi or feminista screwball, I assume.

My mistake.  Sometimes when you're reading a post that's been re-quoted
several times, it gets confusing as to who posted what.

>As for Monica-Clinton, what appears to be the case doesn't matter in some
>ideologies. Can meaningful consent be given with such a power imbalance?
>-Declan

I don't see a power imbalance here.  If a young woman in her 20's
invitingly flashes her thong panties at a man, I don't see how she can be
portrayed as the victim.  The only way that the issue of power arises is
that Monica was not overwhelmed by someone in power - she was attracted to
the power.

On another but connected note, explain why Monica saved that dress!  I
found this little tidbit to be the "yuck" factor...

***********************************************************
Lynne L. Harrison, Esq.           |    "The key to life:
Poughkeepsie, New York            |     - Get up;
mailto:lharrison at dueprocess.com   |     - Survive;
http://www.dueprocess.com         |     - Go to bed."
***********************************************************

DISCLAIMER:  I am not your attorney; you are not my client.
             Accordingly, the above is *NOT* legal advice.

From harald.fragner at idg.se  Sun Sep 13 21:02:16 1998
From: harald.fragner at idg.se (harald.fragner at idg.se)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:02:16 +0800
Subject: Hi!
Message-ID: 

Do I know you?

Harald

------------------
Harald Fragner
IT-avdelningen, IDG
Tel: 08-453 60 10
Fax: 08-453 60 05
Email: harald.fragner at idg.se

From nobody at replay.com  Sun Sep 13 21:06:29 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:06:29 +0800
Subject: No Subject
Message-ID: <199809141658.SAA03123@replay.com>

I think a more appropriate question might be who we aren't.  Believe me,
you'll have an acute understanding of who we are soon enough.
MUWAHAHAHAHA!

Was that sinister enough?

At 06:27 PM 9/13/98 -0700, Well now I am a Mommy! wrote:
>hi,
>
>I see you added me as a friend..... just wondering who you are.  :)
>
>Christy
>
>______________________________________________________
>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
> 

From rah at shipwright.com  Sun Sep 13 21:12:15 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:12:15 +0800
Subject: All Fall Down...
Message-ID: 

--- begin forwarded text

Delivered-To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
X-Sender: believer at telepath.com
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 09:40:16 -0500
To: believer at telepath.com
From: believer at telepath.com
Subject: IP: Whitewater Probe Continues
Mime-Version: 1.0
Sender: owner-ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Precedence: list
Reply-To: believer at telepath.com

Source:  Washington Times
http://www.WashTimes.com/news/news2.html#link

Starr continues Whitewater investigation

 By Jerry Seper
 THE WASHINGTON TIMES

Kenneth W. Starr's case for impeaching President Clinton
 is only the first public accounting in a massive ongoing
 investigation --contrary to White House claims that the
 Whitewater probe is dead.

"All phases of the investigation are now nearing
 completion," the 445-page report says.

The independent counsel "will soon make final decisions
 about what steps to take, if any, with respect to the other
 information it has gathered."

While it was Mr. Starr's "strong desire" to complete the
 entire Whitewater inquiry before giving any information to
 Congress, the report said, it "became apparent" there was
 "substantial and credible information" of impeachable offenses
 and he was required under the law to refer the information to
 Congress as soon as possible.

"It also became apparent that a delay of this referral until the
 evidence from all phases of the investigation had been
 evaluated would be unwise," the report said.

Mr. Starr will soon make decisions on final reports to a
 three-judge panel of the U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals for the
 D.C. Circuit and possible indictments, the report added.

Mr. Clinton's personal attorney, David E. Kendall, attacked
 the Monica Lewinsky report this week as a
 "hit-and-run smear campaign," saying it was nothing but an
 attempt to damage the president with "irrelevant and
 unnecessary graphic and salacious allegations." He asked,
 "Where's Whitewater?"

But the report's introduction notes that Mr. Starr's four-year
 Whitewater probe, all but forgotten in the crush of sordid
 public revelations of Mr. Clinton's sexual dalliances with the
 former White House intern, continues to target a number of
 areas:

Legal representation of a failed Arkansas thrift, Madison
Guaranty Savings and Loan Association, and a real
estate project, Castle Grande, by first lady Hillary
Rodham Clinton and former Rose Law Firm partner
Webster L. Hubbell, the ex-associate attorney general
who resigned in disgrace.

The firing of seven White House travel office employees
to make room for Clinton cronies, and the role Mrs.
Clinton may have played in the decision.

The delivery to the White House of more than 1,000
secret FBI files on Reagan and Bush administration
aides, and efforts to shield White House officials,
including Mrs. Clinton, from a public accounting on how
the files were obtained and used.

The misuse of personnel records of Pentagon employee
Linda R. Tripp, whose secret recordings of
conversations with Miss Lewinsky began the grand jury
investigation.

Possible perjury and obstruction of justice concerning an
incident involving former White House volunteer
Kathleen E. Willey. Mrs. Willey said in August 1997
that Mr. Clinton made sexual advances in the Oval
Office in November 1993.

The Starr report to Congress said Miss Lewinsky told the
 president Newsweek was working on an article about Mrs.
 Willey. Mr. Clinton dismissed the accusations as "ludicrous,
 because he would never approach a small-breasted woman
 like Mrs. Willey." Later he asked Miss Lewinsky if she had
 heard about the Newsweek inquiry from Mrs. Tripp, to which
 she replied "yes."

The former intern said Mr. Clinton asked if Mrs. Tripp
 could be trusted and then told her to persuade Mrs. Tripp to
 call White House Deputy Counsel Bruce R. Lindsey about the
 matter. Newsweek published the Willey story on Aug. 11,
 1997. In his Jan. 17 deposition in the Paula Jones case, Mr.
 Clinton denied the Willey accusation.

The Starr probe also is looking into accusations that efforts
 were made to silence Mrs. Willey. Among those drawing
 attention is Democratic fund-raiser Nathan Landow.
 Investigators want to know if he urged Mrs. Willey to deny she
 was groped by the president. Mrs. Willey has since testified
 before the Lewinsky grand jury as a cooperating witness.

Mr. Landow testified before the grand jury, later telling
 reporters he took the Fifth Amendment. His daughter, former
 White House volunteer Harolyn Cardozo, who worked with
 Mrs. Willey, also testified.

In "Travelgate" and "Filegate," papers filed earlier this month
 in federal court in Washington show the investigations "are
 continuing and in extremely sensitive stages." Deputy
 independent counsel Robert Bittman told the court the probes
 had reached to the "highest level of the federal government"
 and involved "issues of singular constitutional and historic
 importance."

The Whitewater probe also is examining whether Mr.
 Hubbell hid his involvement and that of Mrs. Clinton with
 Castle Grande, a real estate project south of Little Rock, Ark.

In September 1996, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp.
 said Mrs. Clinton and Mr. Hubbell drafted legal papers that
 Madison used to deceive bank examiners and divert $300,000
 to Mr. Hubbell's father-in-law, Seth Ward. The report said the
 papers "facilitated the payment of substantial commissions to
 Mr. Ward, who acted as a straw buyer" in Castle Grande. A
 straw buyer is one who owns property in name only, having
 never put up any money or assumed any risk.

The FDIC said the Ward payments were in violation of
 federal regulations. The report did not accuse Mrs. Clinton or
 Mr. Hubbell of criminal wrongdoing, although it raised serious
 questions about their involvement in a deal that ultimately cost
 taxpayers $3.8 million when Castle Grande failed.

Prosecutors, the report to Congress said, immediately
 recognized parallels between the job help provided to Miss
 Lewinsky by Washington lawyer Vernon E. Jordan Jr., a
 longtime Clinton friend, and "his earlier relationship" with Mr.
 Hubbell, sentenced in 1994 to prison for stealing $420,000
 from his Rose Law Firm partners. By late 1997, Mr. Starr had
 evidence Mr. Jordan helped Mr. Hubbell obtain consulting
 contracts after he agreed to cooperate in the Whitewater
 probe.

In 1994, Mr. Hubbell was paid $450,010 by 17 different
 persons or entities as a consultant and $91,750 in 1995,
 despite beginning a 28-month prison term in August of that
 year. He has yet to explain what work he did for the cash.

Some of the payments came from MacAndrews & Forbes
 Holding Co. in New York after he was introduced to the firm's
 executives by Mr. Jordan, a director of Revlon Inc. The
 cosmetics firm, controlled by MacAndrews & Forbes, also
 offered a job to Miss Lewinsky based on Mr. Jordan's
 recommendations.

With regard to Mrs. Tripp's personnel records, Mr. Starr
 has been investigating if they were illegally released in an effort
 to tarnish her reputation in the Lewinsky probe. Assistant
 Defense Secretary Kenneth Bacon approved the release to a
 reporter for the New Yorker magazine. The records show
 Mrs. Tripp was detained by police as a teen-ager 29 years ago
 and had not noted the arrest in her 1987 security clearance
 form.

The arrest later was shown to have been a teen-age prank,
 in which she pleaded guilty to a reduced charge of loitering.

Former White House Deputy Chief of Staff Harold Ickes
 was questioned about the documents by the grand jury. Mr.
 Bacon also testified in the case.

 In our Investigative Section, a history of the Whitewater
 investigation.

Copyright � 1998 News World Communications, Inc.
-----------------------
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
-----------------------

**********************************************
To subscribe or unsubscribe, email:
     majordomo at majordomo.pobox.com
with the message:
     (un)subscribe ignition-point email at address
**********************************************
www.telepath.com/believer
**********************************************

--- end forwarded text

-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From jya at pipeline.com  Sun Sep 13 21:15:48 1998
From: jya at pipeline.com (John Young)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:15:48 +0800
Subject: Digital Wiretap Delayed
Message-ID: <199809141717.NAA24367@camel14.mindspring.com>

We offer John Markoff's report today on the FCC decision to 
delay implementation of the FBI's digital wiretap requirements
under CALEA, along with the text of the decision:

   http://jya.com/calea-delay.htm  (93K)

The decision has a good review of the technical issues,
and explains why telco appeals of the requirements justified the 
postponement.

CTIA posted here a notice of this on Friday.

From tcmay at got.net  Sun Sep 13 21:16:19 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:16:19 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 9:24 AM -0700 9/14/98, Lynne L. Harrison wrote:

>I don't see a power imbalance here.  If a young woman in her 20's
>invitingly flashes her thong panties at a man, I don't see how she can be
>portrayed as the victim.  The only way that the issue of power arises is
>that Monica was not overwhelmed by someone in power - she was attracted to
>the power.

I agree, in principle. But, then, I think _most_ so-called sexual
harassment cases are based on an inappropriate use of state power to
intervene in birds and the bees issues.

Of course, the Lewinsky stuff surfaced as a result of a civil action filed
by Paula Jones, claiming Clinton dropped his pants in front of her, invited
her to do things to him, etc., etc., blah blah. Did Jones invite this? Was
she attracted to power? Who knows? This is what the trial was presumably
about. And Clinton lied about the Lewinsky matter, and probably has lied
about a great many other matters.

(IANAL, as a few of you are, but I assumed the Lewinsky stuff was coming in
to support allegations of a pattern of such behaviors. If Jones alone had
made the case, it might have been a "she said, he said" case, but when
strikingly parallel behavior turns up with several other women....)

And did Kathleen Willey invite Clinton to rub up against her and suggest an
afternoon quickie in his office? She claimed on "60 Minutes" not to have
invited his behavior.

I'm as bothered as the next person that a taxpayer-funded prosecutor is
asking questions about sex lives. However, this is what comes of having
"sexual harassment" laws, with "if she said it happened, it _happened_"
standards of proof.

Like I said, I'm chortling. What goes around, come around.

And I'm happy that lying sack of shit of a President may escape being
removed from office. Having him around is a useful reminder, the next best
thing to the useful policy of letting a corpse hang from the gallows for a
couple of months.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From tcmay at got.net  Sun Sep 13 21:38:36 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:38:36 +0800
Subject: "If a woman says it happened, it _happened_"
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

...unless of course that woman is not politically correct.

At 8:24 AM -0700 9/14/98, X wrote:
>What chance is there that the Paula Jones case was dismissed BECAUSE Wild
>Bill lied under oath?
>
>Remember OJ?
>

You mean you think if Clinton had told the truth when he raised his hand
and swore to tell the truth it might have made a difference?

"Well, huh, like, I used to bring these young thangs in, invite them in to
meet the Governor, and then give them a chance to look at General Lee as he
stands up to attention. Ya know, this was why I ran for Governor, to get
some of that government-approved nookie. And when I moved up to
Washtington, whoooo-wheeeeeeee! Let's see, I "interviewed" Kathleen Willey
for that intern job, the same day her husband offed himself, so, like, she
wouldn't put out. But I told her my fly was alway open for her. And then
there was that little intern with the beret...don't quite recollect her
name. Mona, I think, and boy did she ever moan..."

Think the truth might have made Paula Jones' tale of Clinton dropping trou
on her just a little more plausible?

Apparently most Americans now believe her, and they didn't before. The last
8 months has established a clear-cut pattern.

But, as I said, having Clinton hanging around is good for the process of
disgracing our government officials. Think of how many world leaders will
burst into laughter, or disgust, when he offers them a cigar?

And it will make it awfully tough for the next round of feministas
screaming that some CEO must go because he had a fling with his secretary.
And maybe Mitsubishi of America will cancel the multimillion dollar
settlement reached with a bunch of women who claimed to have been offended
by the sexist jokes of Mitsubishi's Japanese managers. If Clinton can get
blowjobs from his underlings, and use government money to set up
assignations and to run cover for him, where's the fun in zapping Japanese
execs for making hooters jokes?

Kind of reminds me of the disconnect between one batch of lesbos screaming
that a male only college must be opened to all womyn while another batch of
bald-headed dykes in Calfornia screams that Mills College must remain a
wimmin-only haven for sistas and queers. Some of these baldies chained
themselves to the gates...hey, why weren't they just left chained up? The
shriveled corpses might have served as a reminder to others.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From nobody at replay.com  Sun Sep 13 21:39:26 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:39:26 +0800
Subject: No Subject
Message-ID: <199809141729.TAA05465@replay.com>

Why yes, yes you do.  Don't you recognize the black robe, the scythe,
the bony hand, the less-than-cheerful disposition?

See if you can figure it out.  And please hold still for a moment.  Let me
just wind up here with this thing....

At 06:43 PM 9/14/98 +0100, harald.fragner at idg.se wrote:
>Do I know you?
>
>Harald
>
>------------------
>Harald Fragner
>IT-avdelningen, IDG
>Tel: 08-453 60 10
>Fax: 08-453 60 05
>Email: harald.fragner at idg.se
> 

From mmotyka at lsil.com  Sun Sep 13 21:48:09 1998
From: mmotyka at lsil.com (Michael Motyka)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:48:09 +0800
Subject: 023026.htm
In-Reply-To: <199809140625.CAA00774@demona.doldrums.dyn.ml.org>
Message-ID: <35FD539C.75BD@lsil.com>

>    FBI, has cleared it for export because the system allows access to
>    specific documents for which an appropriate court order has been
>    issued. The company expects the product to be received warmly
>    overseas, since the U.S. government cannot decode information at 
>    will.
Pardon me if I'm a bit slow here but isn't this just a less
space-efficient form of key escrow? Shouldn't you keep the pad secret
and then trash it after use? 

And if a pad is distributed using a traditional encryption system isn't
the security of the "OTP" then the same as the method used to send it? 
Don't you need secret agents handcuffed to briefcases to distribute real
OTPs?

Mike

From mmotyka at lsil.com  Sun Sep 13 21:54:34 1998
From: mmotyka at lsil.com (Michael Motyka)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 12:54:34 +0800
Subject: 
In-Reply-To: <199809131855.UAA18056@replay.com>
Message-ID: <35FD554C.7E00@lsil.com>

Anonymous wrote:
> 
> How about a line-of-sight (LOS) infrared network, a neighbor-net?
> ...
> They'd probably want to regulate the
> traffic over a taut string, between paper cups.
>
I think we should add separate keys to drivers licenses that authorize
one to purchase plumbing components, red meat, optical components,
electronics devices, ammo, porno...just add it to a 2D barcode. It would
not be any inconvenience at all.

It looks like to get any significant distance you would want substantial
power. Then a possible downfall would be "unsafe use of a laser." I
think this is what was used some years back when people started playing
around with laser eavesdropping devices. It makes no difference whether
or not the power levels or use are actually dangerous: in the minds of
most :

#define LASER \
( Spectre + evil_conspiracy + guys_in_labcoats + flash_fried )

Call lots of optics guys who would show how misalignment could cause
stray reflections, eye specialists to talk about retinas etc...still a
good idea for *local* neighborhood. Have you got any specific info on
what is already commercially available? 

BTW - It would probably be easy to map one of these nets using an
appropriate imaging device because there would be a number of sources of
stray light. Turn on the right camera and the spiderweb shows up. I see
a plane going overhead at night, a little upwind, dispersing a fine,
*harmless* dust, storing away a few frames of data as the dust drifts
across the landscape...

You could easily cut a coax into the turf bewteen two houses. The
hardest thing to track or shut down would be a distributed system that
had some unpredictable bridges in it. Build a FrankenNet - sewn together
from all sorts of obscure pieces. 

Mike

From bill.stewart at pobox.com  Sun Sep 13 22:54:12 1998
From: bill.stewart at pobox.com (bill.stewart at pobox.com)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 13:54:12 +0800
Subject: [NYT] FCC Extends CALEA Deadline
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980914104107.0089f220@idiom.com>

>From the New Yawk Times, probably Friday or Saturday:
WIRETAP DELAYED � [New York Times, C14.] In a setback for the F.B.I., 
the Federal Communications Commission has given the telecommunications 
industry an additional 20 months to comply with a 
Federal law meant to bring law-enforcement surveillance into the
digital age. But in extending the deadline the commission deferred 
action on some of the most disputed facets of the issue, which has pitted
law-enforcement officials against telephone-equipment manufacturers, 
network-service providers and privacy-rights advocates. 
The Communications Assistance for Law Enforcement Act was intended to 
address complaints by the F.B.I. and local law-enforcement agencies
that were rapidly losing their ability to conduct wiretaps and other 
forms of electronic surveillance in the face of modern digital and 
wireless communications networks. But industry groups had long warned 
that they would be unable to meet the approaching deadline for complying
with the law by installing the software and hardware that would allow 
for court-authorized surveillance on modern networks. 
The F.C.C. extended the deadline to June 30, 2000. 
"This ruling is really a prelude to the privacy fight," said James X. Dempsey, 
a telecommunications expert. "For now the commission has given itself 
and the industry some breathing room. They've said, 
'Don't rush into these additional surveillance areas.'" 
The decision came in response to a request for a deadline extension 
that was filed in March in a joint petition by AT&T
Wireless Services, Lucent Technologies and Ericsson. 

From harald.fragner at idg.se  Sun Sep 13 23:27:19 1998
From: harald.fragner at idg.se (harald.fragner at idg.se)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 14:27:19 +0800
Subject: 
Message-ID: 

> Why yes, yes you do.  Don't you recognize the black robe, the scythe,
> the bony hand, the less-than-cheerful disposition?
> 
> See if you can figure it out.  And please hold still for a moment.  Let 
> me just wind up here with this thing....

Ultima Online?

------------------
Harald Fragner
IT-avdelningen, IDG
Tel: 08-453 60 10
Fax: 08-453 60 05
Email: harald.fragner at idg.se

From apf2 at apf2.com  Sun Sep 13 23:34:50 1998
From: apf2 at apf2.com (Albert P. Franco, II)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 14:34:50 +0800
Subject: IP: Impeachment Petition -- NOT!
Message-ID: <3.0.3.32.19980915213638.006a471c@apf2.com>

>Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 11:54:36 -0400
>From: Ray Arachelian 
>Organization: SunderNET
>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (WinNT; I)
>To: "Vladimir Z. Nuri" 
>CC: cypherpunks at cyberpass.net
>Subject: Re: IP: Impeachment Petition -- NOT!
>Sender: owner-cypherpunks at cyberpass.net
>Reply-To: Ray Arachelian 
>X-Loop: cypherpunks at cyberpass.net
>
>So much for this being a working thing:
>
>Anyone else get a bounce?
>
>Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 11:20:14 -0400
>From: System Administrator 
>To: sunder at sundernet.com
>Subject: Undeliverable: Impeach Clinton Now!
>
>
I sent mine to Vic Fazio (D-CA) about six hours ago and no bounce yet.
Maybe it's your rep's system that's down.

:)

From CTIA_Daily_News at um2.unitymail.com  Mon Sep 14 14:55:39 1998
From: CTIA_Daily_News at um2.unitymail.com (CTIA Daily News)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 14:55:39 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: CTIA Daily News from WOW-COM - September 14, 1998
Message-ID: <199809142145.QAA20445@mailstrom.revnet.com>

==========================================
Welcome to today's edition of the CTIA Daily News
from WOW-COM.� Please click on the icon / attachment
for the most important news in wireless communications today.

Your company just formed a partnership in a country you
never heard of.� Are you worried about international roaming
fraud?� You should be.�

CTIA's Wireless Security '98 - It's Just Smart Business.
Orlando, Florida � November 9 - 11, 1998 
http://www.wow-com.com/professional�

Team WOW-COM
wowcom at ctia.org
===========================================

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From nobody at usbullionexchange.com  Mon Sep 14 00:00:02 1998
From: nobody at usbullionexchange.com (Nobody)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 15:00:02 +0800
Subject: Dallas Gold & Silver Exchange Registration
Message-ID: <199809141958.OAA04229@usbullionexchange.com>

this is your account information for the dallas gold and silver exchange

please save this message and put it in a safe place.

user name: cypherpunks
password:  5t9vd7

expires:   Wed Oct 14 14:58:25 1998

Thank you for requesting your 30 day free trial online metals spot trading
from Dallas Gold and Silver. You may use your account as often as you wish
for 30 days. You may want to activate your account by calling 1-800-527-5307
and registering for only  per month.  

Your username is: cypherpunksYour temporary account password is: 5t9vd7

If you have any problems entering your password be sure to look for alpha-numerical similarities ie: the letter O and the number 0, the letter l and the number 1 etc.... Please try these combinations before contacting us for technical support. Thank You.

From tcmay at got.net  Mon Sep 14 00:57:08 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 15:57:08 +0800
Subject: Deadly Spice or Seventh Seal?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 1:08 PM -0700 9/14/98, harald.fragner at idg.se wrote:
>> Why yes, yes you do.  Don't you recognize the black robe, the scythe,
>> the bony hand, the less-than-cheerful disposition?
>>
>> See if you can figure it out.  And please hold still for a moment.  Let
>> me just wind up here with this thing....
>
>Ultima Online?
>

No, but here are some other choices:

#1: The long lost Power Ranger.

#2: The latest member of the Spice Girls, "Deadly Spice."

#3: The character played by your own countryman in a famouns Ingmar Bergman
film.

All the hints you'll get today.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From attila at hun.org  Mon Sep 14 01:19:47 1998
From: attila at hun.org (attila)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 16:19:47 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

On Mon, 14 Sep 1998, Tim May wrote:

>
>[snip the whatever]
>
>Like I said, I'm chortling. What goes around, come around.
>
>And I'm happy that lying sack of shit of a President may escape being
>removed from office. Having him around is a useful reminder, the next best
>thing to the useful policy of letting a corpse hang from the gallows for a
>couple of months.
>
>--Tim May
>
    as much as I think Clinton is a scurrilous excuse for a human being,
    I could not agree with you more.  besides, Al Bore is worse.

    let Clinton hang, pecker and all.

__________________________________________________________________________

    To be a ruler of men, you need at least 12 inches.... 
_________________________________________________________________ attila__

From webmaster at acm.org  Mon Sep 14 01:35:21 1998
From: webmaster at acm.org (webmaster at acm.org)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 16:35:21 +0800
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From billp at nmol.com  Mon Sep 14 01:53:35 1998
From: billp at nmol.com (bill payne)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 16:53:35 +0800
Subject: emission test, Black and White Test of Cryptographic Algorithms, & settlement
Message-ID: <35FD8CF1.4532@nmol.com>

Monday 9/14/98 2:33 PM

Don

When I drove back from Pullman in about 9/96 I realized the valve seals
were
leaking in my VW Rabbit. Blue smoke coming out the exhaust pipe. 

Passing the low speed carbon monoxide test is the hardest.

On 09/06/96 the emission test showed

	Standard	Current Reading	Result
	1.20		2.88		FAIL	

You showed me your tool to change seals.  But I needed to work on other
projects.

After spending about $400 to get the seals replaced, I got another
test on 09/10/96

        Standard	Current Reading	Result
	1.20		1.31		FAIL	

In DESPERATION I used Berryman�s B-12, changed oil, etc and
REMOVED THE AIR FILTER for the test on 09/11/96

	Standard	Current Reading	Result
	1.20		1.19		PASS

Talk about squeaking by!

If your vehicle continues to FAIL emissions test, your life will be made
extremely
disrupted by the VEHICLE POLLUTION MANAGEMENT DIVISION.

The Rabbit had its 1998 emission test due in September 1998.  

I was totally prepared for failure.

I ordered about $500 in parts from JC Whitney in preparation for a
DISRUPTIVE
engine rebuild.

And, of course, I ordered for the fun of it the NAFTA [Mexico] exhaust
headers.

I could not wait to see the effect of exhaust headers on performance, so
I installed
them immediately.  WOW!  I estimate about a 20-30% performance
improvement.
Rpms up the ying-yang.

Patty kept putting the 1998 emissions notice on my dinner plate.

On Saturday I took a FAST ride to Oro Guay peak and hiked.  I took a
FAST 
return trip.

I drove into EXPRESS EMISSION operated by Dung Nguyen.  I wanted to see
how badly my grey rabbit, R2, would fail.

R2 is how the grey rabbit is denoted in my repair log.

I couldn�t stand to personally watch R2 fail, so I went outside while it
was tested.

On my return the two operators were smiling both and had their thumbs
pointed up!

R2 PASSED!!!!

	Standard	Current Reading	Result
	1.20		00.13		PASS

!Viva NAFTA exhaust headers!

ANOTHER disruption out of the way so that I can concentrate on
completing the digital FX!

My HUGE FEAR what that I would have to spend time getting R2 into shape
to POSSIBLY
PASS the emissions test.  TRYING to get a car which failed the emissions
test is a nightmare!

Sandia colleague Ron Pate had to have a rebuilt engine installed in his
bronco so that it would pass.

  Black and White Test of Cryptographic Algorithms, by William H. Payne

advertised at 

  http://www.aci.net/kalliste/ /

and presented at

  http://zolatimes.com

will hopefully AID in getting my other distraction settled.  

Then, too, of course, are the JUSTIFIABLY upset MUSLIMS who are reading
my zolatimes article.

Sandia president C. Paul Robinson observed at 
http://www.jya.com/its-us.htm wrote

  A quick walk around the globe: other emerging threat nations ...

  What is perhaps most frightening is the apparent increase in the flow
of technology, hardware, and a "barter system" in dangerous materials.  
We must understand "What are their motives?"

Simple, in one case.  Settlement.  

WE WANT OUR MONEY!  This is on Internet at http://www.jya.com/crypto.htm

  DoE: Pay Bill Payne  

Thought about you guys at the fun Metriguard Monday corporate lunch.

The Acer scsi Scan Prisa I ordered just arrived by UPS.

Now I can scan in my schematics.  And bash the Great Satan EVEN HARDER.

But let's all hope for settlement before matters get WORSE.

Later
bill

From nobody at base.xs4all.nl  Mon Sep 14 02:10:46 1998
From: nobody at base.xs4all.nl (Anonymous)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 17:10:46 +0800
Subject: Is nym.alas.net down?
Message-ID: <2f1b7f6c4bcb1557a6c4409be67a9c36@base.xs4all.nl>

Is nym.alias.net down? I've sent a request twice using
a different remailer chain each time yet it still doesn't
reply. It's been about two days since I sent it in.

I did however create a nym with dongco.hyperreal.art.pl.
Is this service reliable? or will it disppear quickly?

From tzeruch at ceddec.com  Mon Sep 14 02:48:42 1998
From: tzeruch at ceddec.com (tzeruch at ceddec.com)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 17:48:42 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <98Sep14.184802edt.43010@brickwall.ceddec.com>

On Sun, 13 Sep 1998, Declan McCullagh wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Sep 1998, Tim May wrote:
> 
> > * What goes around, comes around. The Liberal puke Democrats who crucified
> > Bob Packwood, Clarence Thomas, and any number of corporate people charged
> > with "sexual harassment," are now reaping what they sowed. "If she says it
> > happened, it happened," the mantra of the feminazi left, is now apparently
> > forgotten by Patricia It's not our business" Ireland.
> 
> There's also the idea popular in some gender feminist circles that the
> imbalance of power in manager-employee relationships makes it impossible
> for genuine consent to be given. Can there be any greater power imbalance
> than the president of the United States and an intern? Where are the
> feminist cries of outrage?

I think they have abandon Aristotelian (or any other phylum of) Logic,
replacing it with something called post structuralist thinking.  Since it
lacks a structure, it is hard to figure out how to explain it.  Apparently
it is a system where "Male Lesbians" exist.  So because Clinton does what
the GFs want, maybe he isn't really powerful at all (name anyone who is
both powerful and submits to GFs, at least in contexts not included in the
Starr report).  No, it doesn't really make sense, but I don't think it is
supposed to.

> > * Lawmaking is paralzyed, frozen, stillborne. This I count as a Good Thing.
> > Even better will be another 8-10 months of this nightly spectacle. No
> > Health Care Reform, no Communications Decency Act II, no Tobacco Act,
> > nothing.
> 
> In general you might be right. But for "noncontroversial" measures like
> CDA II, well, it'll be in one of the appropriations bills that will be
> approved in the next three weeks.

Do libraries now ban minors' access to MSNBC, CNN, ... The House of
Representatives, and the Library of Congress?  And things like NetNanny
and SurfWatch?

Clinton can still veto the omnibus appropriations bill or threaten to
"shut down the government" (= shut down government spending instead of
leaving it running while nothing else gets done).

From rah at shipwright.com  Mon Sep 14 03:06:09 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 18:06:09 +0800
Subject: IP: A CLINTON DIRTY BOOK STORY
Message-ID: 

--- begin forwarded text

Delivered-To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Subject: IP: A CLINTON DIRTY BOOK STORY
Date: Mon, 7 Sep 1998 14:04:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: softwar at us.net (CharlesSmith)
To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Sender: owner-ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Precedence: list
Reply-To: softwar at us.net (CharlesSmith)

In late 1994 the U.S. State Department denied Phil Karn his
request to export a PC disk.  Mr. Karn already had sold the
book, APPLIED CRYPTOGRAPHY written by Bruce Schneier, without
restriction.  Mr. Karn also included a disk of text source code
(in human readable format) that was also printed in the book.

The book and the disk were freely sold, with no checks, in
retail American bookstores.  According to the Clinton
administration, Karn's disk was a threat to national security.
Newly released documents from the State Department, written in
November 1994, shows the White House National Security Council
(NSC) directly approved the decision to deny Karn's request
while allowing the export of military encryption to China.

The document, a letter written by Wendy Sherman, State
Department Assistant Secretary of Legislative Affairs, to then
Congresswoman Maria Cantwell (D WA) was provided to Bill
Clements of the NSC for White House approval.  In addition, the
document includes a fax on Karn's export problem titled "TO:
Pres. Clinton".  Ordie Kittrie, the State Department Attorney
for Political-Military Affairs, wrote "Attached is draft
response to Rep. Cantwell ie Karn encryption disk...  Please
provide me with any comments by noon Friday, November 18."

"The decision that controls should continue was based on several
consideration," wrote Ms. Sherman.  "The administration will
continue to restrict export of sophisticated encryption devices,
both to preserve our own foreign intelligence gathering
capability and because of the concerns of our allies who fear
that strong encryption technology would inhibit their law
enforcement capabilities.  One result of the interagency review
of Mr. Karn's disk was a determination that the source code on
it is of such a strategic level as to warrant continued State
Department licensing."

Of course, any criminal or terrorist could simply purchase the
book and key the code in.  A slightly richer criminal could even
use an Optical Scanner (OCR) and convert the pages directly into
readable source code in less time.  Even a secret Commerce
briefing document from a 1996 meeting with Janet Reno openly
admits the futile nature of trying to restrict PC diskette or
software export.  "Lost in the debate," states the secret 1996
Commerce Department document.  "But not irrelevant, is the fact
that it is virtually impossible to enforce export control's
against them when they can be exported by phone and modem or/in
someone's pocket."

At first the Clinton encryption policy seems absurd or simply
driven by bureaucratic red tape.  Alas, nothing is further from
the truth.  The policy was used as a means to extort donations
for the DNC or by Clinton insiders bent on making big bucks.

The Chinese Army was not interested in PC programs or diskettes
their agents could buy openly in a retail bookstore.  The PLA
under the Clinton administration has been in the business of
acquiring commercial applications of "Defense" technology.  For
example, in November 1994 Motorola employee and former Clinton
White House NSC member Richard Barth began his successful
request to sell encrypted radios and cellular phones to the
Chinese Police.

Motorola's Barth wrote to Theodore McNamara Assistant Secretary
of State on November 23, 1994.  "This is to request that your
office initiate action to obtain a waiver from requirement for
individual export license notifications to Congress for wireless
mobile communications systems containing encryption for China.
Such a waiver was issued by the President in September of this
year for civilian satellite systems and encrypted products for
use by American firms operating in China."

According to Barth, a high-tech trade war had erupted between
the U.S. and Britain.  "European firms," wrote Barth.
"Including Nokia, Ericsson, Alcatel and Siemens, have for a
number of months been able to market and sell GSM cellular
systems with A5-2 encryption in China as a result of a decision
taken by the UK intelligence agency, GCHQ."

By July 1995, the CEO of Motorola, Gary Tooker, wrote a personal
note to Ron Brown, expressing his gratitude for Clinton's
signature approving encryption exports.  "I am writing to thank
you," wrote Tooker to Brown.  "And some key members of the
Commerce Department for your assistance in obtaining the
Presidential waiver for encryption export sales to China."

The Motorola saga of Barth is not the only example of Bill
Clinton's two-faced policy on high-tech exports.  In fact,
President Clinton personally authorized the transfer of an
encrypted air traffic control system to the Chinese Air Force.
It is this particular export which illustrates the difference
between military encryption and civilian, such as Karn's disk of
PC programs.

The Chinese Air Force runs the civilian air control in their
country.  The U.S. built air traffic system is not only run by
PLAAF officers but it is also plugged directly into their air
defense.  According to the recent GAO testimony on Clinton
waivers "Waivers were also granted to permit the export of
encryption equipment controlled on the Munitions List.  One case
involved a $4.3-million communications export to China's Air
Force."

Not only are Chinese fighters and missiles more effective thanks
to Bill Clinton but China has also exported a modified version
of the U.S. system to Iraq.  The Chinese version, called "Tiger
Song", includes U.S. and French made parts.  The Tiger Song
system allows Iraq to track and target U.S. fighters using a
high speed, secure, fiber optic command network.

All radars in Iraq, civilian and military, are now linked
together into Tiger Song.  Iraqi missiles and military radars
are also now playing a giant shell game with U.S. air forces,
using pre-built camouflaged sites wired with hidden fiber optic
cables, scattered all over the country.

Another military example of Clinton crypto export controls is
the sales of Hughes, Motorola, and Loral satellites to the
Chinese military.  The satellites were sold complete with
on-board secure telemetry systems hardened to absorb the intense
radiation of space - something that can be directly applied to
nuclear weapons.  The satellites exported to China in question
were so classified that whole sections of Federal law, the U.S.
Munitions List, were deleted or waived by Bill Clinton.

The claims made by Bernard Schwartz and Loral that they did not
knowingly export military technology to China contradicts the
official briefing documents given to Ron Brown in 1994.  One
Loral document obtained from the files of Ron Brown, labeled
"for Secy. Brown", has a page titled "Commercial Applications Of
DoD Technology".  This document lists "Intelsat", "Cellular -
Globalstar" and "Direct Broadcast Satellite" technology along
with a variety of other products developed from "DoD" projects.
Thus, Loral knowingly exported systems they developed for the
U.S. military to China.

Did Mr. Clinton consult with U.S. allies prior to allowing top
DNC donors export rights to military gear?  According to
Motorola, the staunchest U.S. ally, Great Britain, was an
economic adversary.  Clearly, the strategic concerns of South
Korea, Japan and the Philippines were never considered.  Under
Bill Clinton our allies from the Cold War were competitors in a
economic war for money.

Furthermore, in September 1998 FBI Director Freeh testified
before the Senate Committee on Terrorism.  As predicted, Freeh
pushed the "Bin Ladden" terrorism button while requesting a ban
on domestic PC encryption programs.  The use of encryption by so
called terrorist organizations is balanced by the use of the
same technology by law abiding citizens to protect themselves
from criminals.  The fact that Bin Ladden is armed with
encryption comes as no surprise since he was, after all, trained
by the CIA to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan.  Once a freedom
fighter and now a terrorist.

One similar historic example to Bin Ladden is "VULA".  In the
1980s the South African National Congress (ANC) used encryption
in a project called "VULA" to defeat the apartheid government.
Vula included illegal exports from europe, Soviet training and
home built software.  Vula was successful and the ANC ultimately
won their long war.  Once a terrorist now a freedom fighter.

These facts are not unknown to the Clinton administration.  In
November 1993 TOP Secret document prepared for President Clinton
openly admitted the futility of any government-imposed ban.
According to "IMPACTS OF TELECOMMUNICATIONS AND ENCRYPTION
TECHNOLOGY ON LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE COLLECTION:
ASSESSMENT, OPTIONS, AND RECOMMENDATIONS" a ban would "either
(1) discourage criminals from using encryption because they
realized that most products did not provide protection from
wiretaps, or (2) encourage criminals to acquire strong
encryption technology, whether commercial or home made."

Obviously, the administration will not start banning books so
the "home made" option will always apply.  The FBI Director
seems to have forgotten common sense along with the law.  He
certainly has remained silent while the Chinese Army purchased
military encryption systems from his boss.  Freeh, however, has
also remained adamant that crack-pot export restrictions on
printed text must remain.

Mr. Freeh also overlooked one final historical example of a so
called revolutionary type group using encryption and the FBI
Director can thank his job for it.  In April 1775 Paul Revere
read a coded light signal from a Church tower and rode into
history.  The King's men did not intercept nor decode that
message.  The battle of Concord took place and the first shots
of our own revolution were fired.

================================================================
source documents  -

http://www.softwar.net/karn.html
Clinton NSC/State Crypto Book Disk Export

http://www.softwar.net/loral.html
LORAL Commercial Applications of DOD Tech

http://www.softwar.net/inpact.html
TOP SECRET "Impacts of Encryption"

http://www.softwar.net/vula.html
ANC Operation VULA - Freedom Fighers Use Crypto

http://www.softwar.net/moto4.html
1995 MOTOROLA Tooker To Warren Christopher For Crypto To China

http://www.softwar.net/tooker1.html
July 1995 MOTOROLA Thank You For Encryption Export To Ron Brown

http://www.softwar.net/tooker2.html
Feb. 1995 MOTOROLA To Ron Brown - Human Rights and Crypto

http://www.softwar.net/barth95.html
March 1995 MOTOROLA - Encrypted Radios/Iridium For China

http://www.softwar.net/barth94.html
Richard Barth 1994 Secret Letters Email

http://www.softwar.net/barth93.html
Richard Barth 1993 Secret White House Email

http://www.softwar.net/gao176.html
GAO REPORT - ARMS FOR CHINA - CRYPTO FOR CHINA
================================================================
1 if by land, 2 if by sea.  Paul Revere - encryption 1775

Charles R. Smith
SOFTWAR         http://www.softwar.net      softwar at softwar.net
Pcyphered SIGNATURE:
4CE66EF8168673DBB980C519E94FB51027FA5FF001D1BB63298A4E5E28906370
1B9713F09BEEF599003431629914FB78B8704B2BB0DDB22DCA21DB900065CA07
5E32CB3CE742D7C6
================================================================
SOFTWAR EMAIL NEWSLETTER                            09/07/1998
***  to unsubscribe reply with "unsubscribe" as subject    ***
================================================================

**COPYRIGHT NOTICE** In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, any
copyrighted work in this message is distributed under fair use without
profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior interest in
receiving the included information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only.
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--- end forwarded text

-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From tcmay at got.net  Mon Sep 14 03:40:12 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 18:40:12 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 3:49 PM -0700 9/14/98, tzeruch at ceddec.com wrote:

>
>Clinton can still veto the omnibus appropriations bill or threaten to
>"shut down the government" (= shut down government spending instead of
>leaving it running while nothing else gets done).

Hey, don't rule this out. Clinton may welcome shutting down the
government...after all, it was during the 1995 shutdown that Clinton got in
touch with his horndog self. To wit, normal employees were all sent home,
and the delivery girl role was played by Monica Lewinsky, who delivered
some pie to Clinton one quiet evening.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From tcmay at got.net  Mon Sep 14 03:46:08 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 18:46:08 +0800
Subject: Deadly Spice or Seventh Seal?
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

At 1:48 PM -0700 9/14/98, Tim May wrote:
>At 1:08 PM -0700 9/14/98, harald.fragner at idg.se wrote:
>>> Why yes, yes you do.  Don't you recognize the black robe, the scythe,
>>> the bony hand, the less-than-cheerful disposition?
>>>
>>> See if you can figure it out.  And please hold still for a moment.  Let
>>> me just wind up here with this thing....
>>
>>Ultima Online?
>>

>No, but here are some other choices:
>
>#1: The long lost Power Ranger.
>
>#2: The latest member of the Spice Girls, "Deadly Spice."
>
>#3: The character played by your own countryman in a famouns Ingmar Bergman
>film.
>
>All the hints you'll get today.

Actually, I misspoke. The famous Swedish actor played the _knight_ who
faced this character, not the character itself. (Hint: This actor also
played the exorcist of Regan.)

And the character itself made a guest appearance in one of Bill and Ted's
Excellent Adventures.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From wombat at mcfeely.bsfs.org  Mon Sep 14 03:50:41 1998
From: wombat at mcfeely.bsfs.org (Rabid Wombat)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 18:50:41 +0800
Subject: 
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: 

bork bork bork

On Mon, 14 Sep 1998 harald.fragner at idg.se wrote:

> > Why yes, yes you do.  Don't you recognize the black robe, the scythe,
> > the bony hand, the less-than-cheerful disposition?
> > 
> > See if you can figure it out.  And please hold still for a moment.  Let 
> > me just wind up here with this thing....
> 
> Ultima Online?
> 
> 
> ------------------
> Harald Fragner
> IT-avdelningen, IDG
> Tel: 08-453 60 10
> Fax: 08-453 60 05
> Email: harald.fragner at idg.se
> 
> 

From nobody at sind.hyperreal.art.pl  Mon Sep 14 04:04:46 1998
From: nobody at sind.hyperreal.art.pl (HyperReal-Anon)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 19:04:46 +0800
Subject: Larry Gilbert
Message-ID: <7b77428acf328c029db809968e76c70d@anonymous>

On Mon, 14 Sep 1998, sixdegrees wrote:

> 
> Just a quick update from sixdegrees(tm). Unfortunately Larry 
> Gilbert (irving at pobox.com) asked not to be listed as your 
> contact with sixdegrees.
> 
> We also wanted to make sure you were aware that you currently 
> have no other confirmed contacts, so it will be hard for you to
> have a productive sixdegrees experience. As you probably know, 
> without any confirmed contacts, you won't get any results from our 
> networking searches. 
> 
> So, we just wanted to recommend that you head over to 
> http://www.sixdegrees.com , log-in, and go to MY CONTACTS 
> to list additional relationships. 
> 
> 
> ====================================================================
> PLEASE NOTE: All replies to this address are processed by a computer.
> If you have any problems, questions or requests send an e-mail to 
> issues at sixdegrees.com and someone will get back to you as soon as 
> possible.
> ====================================================================

Since you seem so intent on continuing to spam the Cypherpunks list like
some AOL luser-wannabe, I have a better idea. Follow this procedure
exactly to reach enlightenment: 

1) Open the cases for all your computers.
2) Drop your pants.
3) Whip it out. In the case of a woman, just squat.
4) Spray all your machines.
5) If any machines are still working, pour large amounts of concentrated
nitric acid solution on them. Inhale the resulting vapors.
6) Close the door, activate the halon system, sit down, and inhale deeply.
7) You will pass out. Within a few minutes, you will see the Grand Poobah
himself.
8) If you do not have a halon system, inhale heavy gasses such as freon.

We're glad to be of service to clueless AOLholes and clueless
AOLhole-wannabes everywhere. Have a nice day.

From nnburk at cobain.HDC.NET  Mon Sep 14 04:36:11 1998
From: nnburk at cobain.HDC.NET (nnburk)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 19:36:11 +0800
Subject: Predictions: Crime and Criminal Justice in the 21st Century
Message-ID: <35FDD227.4C7D@yankton.com>

Predictions: Crime and Criminal Justice in the 21st Century

1.      The United States will experience a significant economic 
recession/crisis very close to the turn of the Century.

2.      As the large pool of young people born in the early 1990s 
become teenagers and young adults, there will be a dramatic 
increase in violent crime around the year 2005-2010.

3.      America will experience sporadic civil disorders/riots in 
many of its urban areas during the next 10-15 years -- much of it 
related to racial/ethnic problems.

4.      Terrorist acts by "fringe"/special issue groups will 
increase at a significant rate -- becoming a major law enforcement 
and security problem.

5.      As faith in the criminal justice system declines, there 
will be a rise in vigilante-based incidents where citizens take 
the enforcement of crime problems into their own hands.

6.      Much of middle- and upper-class America will take a 
"retreatist" attitude and move into private high-security 
communities located in suburban or rural areas. Because of 
technological advances, many companies and corporations will also 
move out of the urban environments as well.

7.      Due to many of the predictions listed above, much of law 
enforcement and security in the 21st Century will become 
privatized and contractual. Traditional law enforcement agencies 
will primarily serve urban and rural communities.

8.      Law enforcement will evolve into two major and divergent 
roles: traditional law enforcement and a more specialized 
military tactical role to deal with the growing urban violance 
and terrorist incidents.

9.      Significant violence and unrest will plague our nation's 
prisons. Major prison riots will become a regular occurrence.

10.     With the decrease of the possibility of major global 
warfare, the United States military will take on an increased 
domestic "peace-keeping" role with America's law enforcement 
agencies.

John Young wrote:
> 
> Tim asks:
> 
> >Freeh and Company continue to mumble about "meeting
> >the legitmate needs of law enforcement." What can they
> >be speaking of?
> ...
> >Obviously his side is contemplating domestic crypto restrictions.
> 
> Threat of terrorism will be the impetus for applying national security
> restrictions domestically, for relaxing cold war limitations on spying
> on Americans, for dissolving barriers between law enforcement
> and military/intelligence agencies.
> 
> Technical means for access to encrypted data will probably
> come first in communications, then to stored material. There
> will be an agreement for increased CALEA wiretap funding, which
> is what the two cellular and wired suits against the FBI intend,
> (paralleling what the hardware and software industries want from
> federal buyers of security products).
> 
> This will provide the infrastructural regime for the gov to monitor
> and store domestic traffic as NSA does for the global, using the
> same technology (NSA may provide service to domestic
> LEA as it now does for other gov customers for intel).
> 
> Other access will come through hardware and software for
> computers, paralleling technology developed for telecomm tapping,
> tracking and monitoring.
> 
> Most probably through overt/covert features of microprocessors
> and OS's, as reported recently of Wintel and others, but also
> probably with special chips for DSP and software for modular
> design -- why build from scratch when these handy kits are
> available.
> 
> As noted here, the features will appear first as optional, in response
> to demand from commerce, from parents, from responsible
> institutions, to meet public calls for protection, for privacy, for
> combating threats to the American people.
> 
> Like wiretap law, use of the features for preventative snooping will
> initially require a court order, as provided in several of the crypto
> legislative proposals.
> 
> Like the wiretap orders, gradually there will be no secret court refusals
> for requests to use the technology in the national interest.
> 
> A publicity campain will proclaims that citizens with nothing to hide
> will have nothing to fear. Assurance of safety will be transparent,
> no clicks on the line. In a digital world, home-office devices will send
> lifestyle data to the device manufacturers over the always monitoring
> transparental Net.
> 
> Personal privacy will evaporate almost unnoticeably, as with the tv
> remote control, cp/defcon/bar brag, telephone, fax and forever-lovers
> pillowtalk.

From attila at hun.org  Mon Sep 14 04:45:59 1998
From: attila at hun.org (attila)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 19:45:59 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling (fwd)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980914122452.0086a750@pop.mhv.net>
Message-ID: 

,,,...On Mon, 14 Sep 1998, Lynne L. Harrison wrote:

>
>I don't see a power imbalance here.  If a young woman in her 20's
>invitingly flashes her thong panties at a man, I don't see how she can be
>portrayed as the victim.  The only way that the issue of power arises is
>that Monica was not overwhelmed by someone in power - she was attracted to
>the power.
>
    I suspect _you_ can handle the power imbalance. Monica is not exactly
    what I would call a collected, stable example of the female species.

    she was scrambled from her parents divorce, was anxious to be both
    liked and approved, and she told the high school teacher she had
    been babysitter for _and_ rolling (sounds like a Kennedy doesn't it)
    that she was in Washington earning her "knee pads" with Clinton.  

    now, that's an unstable freak who is attracted to father figures 
    (Electra complex, if you will) and absolute power over her.

    I dont think as a woman you can understand the fear a male boss
    feels; even if there is a genuine love interest, you crap in your
    own hat, it will be served up to you some day. or as it is sometimes
    stated: "...dont get your meat where you earn your bread...."

    it doesnt matter whether Monica hiked her dress, or Clinton dropped
    his trou (which is more likely given his track record)

    even if Monica was "a willing, consenting adult", any man in a
    position of power who takes advantage of a star-struck female
    30 years his junior is guilty of an abuse of power (personal) and
    in this case using the position of "The President of the United
    States" as his instrument of power --end of story.

    to be a "consensual act", the woman certainly needs to not be
    an emotional disaster --and not be preyed upon by a raging
    psychopath who has no more common sense than a drunken fraternity
    brat who says: "Hi, my name is Bill Clinton, let's fuck!"

>On another but connected note, explain why Monica saved that dress!  I
>found this little tidbit to be the "yuck" factor...
>
    she's sick...  simple as that. apparently she was not exactly
    monogamous; 

    probably saved used prophylactics from the rest of them. 
>
>
    note one of her last snivels to Clinton was that she wanted 
    to do the "horizontal bop" --just once. 

    the whole thing is sick.

    stupid Americans only vote with their wallet.

    the American bread and circus mentality does not care... 

    if the economy had already fallen, they would howl Clinton out of
    office faster than a school principal accused by some mother who 
    misunderstood her 5 year old.

    however, leave the scurrilous bag of camel dung in office; the
    government bogged down and consumed with its own evil is a 
    government which is too preoccupied to maximize the damage they
    are doing to the country and the world. maybe they will leave
    us alone.

    like I said before: leave Clinton alone --Al Bore is worse; and,
    I'll even put up with the bitch over Tipper.

__________________________________________________________________________

    To be a ruler of men, you need at least 12 inches....
_________________________________________________________________ attila__

From paulmerrill at acm.org  Mon Sep 14 04:47:17 1998
From: paulmerrill at acm.org (Paul H. Merrill)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 19:47:17 +0800
Subject: Larry Gilbert
In-Reply-To: <7b77428acf328c029db809968e76c70d@anonymous>
Message-ID: <35FDE268.79F4FF46@acm.org>

I love this to death.  Some asshole sends crap data to sixdegrees
including dredged up real email addresses, then when sixdegrees and the
contacts given react in a totally appropriate manner other (?) assholes
berate them for living.  And this one even manages to toss in an
anti-AOL rant where AOL plays no part.

Such witticisms I haven't seen since my kids turned 7.

PHM

HyperReal-Anon wrote:
> 
> On Mon, 14 Sep 1998, sixdegrees wrote:
> 
> >
> > Just a quick update from sixdegrees(tm). Unfortunately Larry
> > Gilbert (irving at pobox.com) asked not to be listed as your
> > contact with sixdegrees.
> >
> > We also wanted to make sure you were aware that you currently
> > have no other confirmed contacts, so it will be hard for you to
> > have a productive sixdegrees experience. As you probably know,
> > without any confirmed contacts, you won't get any results from our
> > networking searches.
> >
> > So, we just wanted to recommend that you head over to
> > http://www.sixdegrees.com , log-in, and go to MY CONTACTS
> > to list additional relationships.
> >
> >
> > ====================================================================
> > PLEASE NOTE: All replies to this address are processed by a computer.
> > If you have any problems, questions or requests send an e-mail to
> > issues at sixdegrees.com and someone will get back to you as soon as
> > possible.
> > ====================================================================
> 
> Since you seem so intent on continuing to spam the Cypherpunks list like
> some AOL luser-wannabe, I have a better idea. Follow this procedure
> exactly to reach enlightenment:
> 
> 1) Open the cases for all your computers.
> 2) Drop your pants.
> 3) Whip it out. In the case of a woman, just squat.
> 4) Spray all your machines.
> 5) If any machines are still working, pour large amounts of concentrated
> nitric acid solution on them. Inhale the resulting vapors.
> 6) Close the door, activate the halon system, sit down, and inhale deeply.
> 7) You will pass out. Within a few minutes, you will see the Grand Poobah
> himself.
> 8) If you do not have a halon system, inhale heavy gasses such as freon.
> 
> We're glad to be of service to clueless AOLholes and clueless
> AOLhole-wannabes everywhere. Have a nice day.

From attila at hun.org  Mon Sep 14 04:50:28 1998
From: attila at hun.org (attila)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 19:50:28 +0800
Subject: Clinton still doesnt get it
Message-ID: 

    25 years of Clinton's raging pscyhopathic, oversexed behavior:
    Hillary has been a willing partner.

    nothing but control freaques and obscene power trippers. there
    is only amorality in that house --and power by any means.

New York Times
September 13, 1998 
IN AMERICA/By BOB HERBERT 
Still Doesn't Get It 

David Maraniss, in his biography of Bill Clinton, "First in His Class," 
writes about an "intense relationship" that Mr. Clinton had with a 
young woman who had volunteered to work in his first campaign for 
public office. Mr. Clinton was running for Congress and the woman was a 
student at the University of Arkansas. 

A campaign aide, quoted in the book, said, "The staff tried to ignore it as 
long as it didn't interfere with the campaign." But it did interfere, because 
Mr. Clinton was also intensely involved with Hillary Rodham. 

Mr. Maraniss writes: "The tension at campaign headquarters increased 
considerably when Rodham arrived as people there tried to deal with the 
situation. Both women seemed on edge. The Arkansas girlfriend would ask 
people about Hillary: what she was like, and whether Clinton was going to 
marry her. When she was at headquarters, someone would sneak her out 
the back door if Rodham was spotted pulling into the driveway." 

It was all there more than two decades ago at the very beginning of Bill 
Clinton's political journey: the thoughtlessness, the recklessness, the 
wanton use of friends and associates to cover up his ugly behavior, the 
willingness to jeopardize the hopes and dreams of people who were 
working for him and trusted him, the betrayal of those closest to him. 

There is nothing new in Kenneth Starr's report, just confirmation in 
extreme and at times lurid detail of the type of person Mr. Clinton has 
always been. 

In 1992, when he was running for President and people across the nation 
were investing their time, money and even their careers in him, he 
rewarded them with the Gennifer Flowers scandal. He carried his 
psychodrama onto national television when he went on "60 Minutes" and, 
with Mrs. Clinton at his side, called Ms. Flowers a liar. 

He told Steve Kroft and 30 million viewers: "It was only when money came 
up, when the tabloid went down there offering people money to say that 
they had been involved with me, that she changed her story. There's a 
recession on, times are tough, and I think you can expect more and more 
of these stories as long as they're down there handing out money." 

In other words, it was the economy, stupid. 

But even as he was denying that he had had a sexual relationship with 
Gennifer Flowers, Mr. Clinton was going out of his way on "60 Minutes" to 
convey to the public that he had learned a lesson, that he had matured 
and that his irresponsible behavior would not be a problem if he were 
elected President. 

"I have absolutely leveled with the American people," he said. 

In fact, his comments were about as level as the Himalayas. We now know 
that he was willing to risk everything, his family, his Presidency, the 
welfare of the nation, on a dangerous fling with a White House intern. For 
him, it must have been great fun. He got to play so many people for fools. 
He got to chat on the phone with Congressmen while engaging in sex. He 
got to play hide and seek with the Secret Service. 

Very mature behavior. 

Now the Clinton psychodrama has much of the Government paralyzed 
and the Democratic Party in a state of panic. But Mr. Clinton still doesn't 
get it. On Thursday he met with the members of his Cabinet, who had 
been duped and lied to like so many others. He went into his emotional 
routine and said he was oh-so-sorry, etc. He begged for forgiveness. 

But he got upset when the Secretary of Health and Human Services, 
Donna Shalala, said that she was appalled by his behavior. Ms. Shalala 
complained that the President seemed to believe that pursuing his 
policies and programs was more important than providing moral 
leadership. 

A story in The Washington Post said Mr. Clinton responded sharply to Ms. 
Shalala, rebuking her. My understanding is that his response was critical 
but not harsh. Either way, it's clear that Mr. Clinton has not learned the 
requisite lessons. He lied to Ms. Shalala months ago and sent her out to lie 
to the public, and now he's criticizing her. The President is not sorry. He's 
apologizing because there's a gun at his head. He's not changing what he 
now describes as his sinful ways. He's trying to manipulate public opinion 
so he can survive to sin again. The psychodrama remains as long as he 
remains. 

There are no surprises here. With Bill Clinton, it was ever thus. 

From nobody at sind.hyperreal.art.pl  Mon Sep 14 04:51:21 1998
From: nobody at sind.hyperreal.art.pl (HyperReal-Anon)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 19:51:21 +0800
Subject: Hi!
Message-ID: <1de8e2f402710b06525c5f67b59f70bb@anonymous>

On Mon, 14 Sep 1998 harald.fragner at idg.se wrote:

> 
> Do I know you?
> 
> Harald
> 
> ------------------
> Harald Fragner
> IT-avdelningen, IDG
> Tel: 08-453 60 10
> Fax: 08-453 60 05
> Email: harald.fragner at idg.se
> 
> 

No, but we know you! You're a very evil man, Mr. Fragner, at least by the
standards of the Hired Government Ninjas. Under our standards, everyone is
evil...except government leaders.

Expect black helicopters to be targetting your house in the next few days. 
Do not be surprised if unguided rockets are shot into it. If ninjas are
coming through your windows at 2AM, just remember: We're from the
government and we're here to help you. Just bend over and grip the towel
rack.

Your phone will be ringing off the hook in the middle of the night for the
next two or three years. 

Oh, wait, maybe I'm looking into the future again. I really must stop
doing that. That's the bad part about being involved with the Hired
Government Ninjas. We mysteriously know how people will be harassed before
it happens. Imagine that. 

Sincerely,

Hired Government Ninjas, Inc.
Remember, our motto is: "Do what we say, that's the way we kick it."

From attila at hun.org  Mon Sep 14 04:56:02 1998
From: attila at hun.org (attila)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 19:56:02 +0800
Subject: a few facts on Presidential peccadillos (fwd)
Message-ID: 

    power trippers attract willing victims.

    enjoy...
__________________________________________________________________________

1. Which president smoked marijuana with a nude playgirl while he joked
about being too wasted to "push the button" in case of nuclear attack?

2. Which president allegedly had affairs with both a winner AND a
finalist in the Miss America pageant?

3. Which president had sex with one of his secretaries stretched out
atop a desk in the oval office?

4. Which president allegedly had an affair (as well as children) with a
slave who was his wife's half sister?

5. Which president called his mistress "Pookie"?

6. Which president married a woman who hadn't yet divorced her first
husband, and was branded an "adulterer" during his re-election campaign?

7. Which future president wrote love letters to his neighbor's wife
while he was engaged to someone else?

8. Which president had a torrid affair with the first lady's personal
secretary?

9. Which president had sex with a young woman in a White House coat
closet - at one point, while a secret service agent prevented the
hysterical first lady from attacking them?

10. Which president had sex in a closet while telling his partner about
the *other* president who did the same in a closet? (The one from
Question 9)?

11. Which vice president was ticked off because he felt that HIS record
of sexual conquests was much more "impressive" (i.e. numerous) than the
President's?

12. Which future president, while a college student, enjoyed showing off
his penis (which he named Jumbo)?

ANSWERS

1.  John F. Kennedy
2.  Bill Clinton
3.  Lyndon B. Johnson
4.  Thomas Jefferson
5.  Bill Clinton
6.  Andrew Jackson
7.  Lyndon B. Johnson
8.  Franklin D. Roosevelt, John F. Kennedy
9.  Warren G. Harding
10. John F. Kennedy
11. Lyndon B. Johnson
12. Lyndon B. Johnson

From mmotyka at lsil.com  Mon Sep 14 05:12:57 1998
From: mmotyka at lsil.com (Michael Motyka)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 20:12:57 +0800
Subject: IP: A CLINTON DIRTY BOOK STORY
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <35FDBFDA.4CE5@lsil.com>

> The claims made by Bernard Schwartz and Loral that they did not
> knowingly export military technology to China contradicts the
> official briefing documents given to Ron Brown in 1994.  One
> Loral document obtained from the files of Ron Brown, labeled
> "for Secy. Brown", has a page titled "Commercial Applications Of
> DoD Technology".  This document lists "Intelsat", "Cellular -
> Globalstar" and "Direct Broadcast Satellite" technology along
> with a variety of other products developed from "DoD" projects.
> Thus, Loral knowingly exported systems they developed for the
> U.S. military to China.
> 
I can think of several versions of this:

a. simple money and politics - company wants big $ deal, contributes to
right politicians. ( |$| > |USA| ) --> fast track for deal

b. round 2 of crypto-AG - they want to listen to the Chinese so they had
better be the equipment vendor. Who operates the satellites that the
Chinese radios use?

You might say that to meet US Intelligence needs the range of products
available outside the US should be minimized and those that are shipped
should come from companies that cooperate with the NSA. It makes some
*small* amount of sense but certainly plays hell with what an
entrepreneurial type might want to accomplish. Pretty unfair in that
regard. Especially since they have no visible control over
extraterritorial ventures anyway. Civilian interest and capability in
crypto must piss these guys off beyond belief. Stupid Constitution!

Mike

From tcmay at got.net  Mon Sep 14 05:15:41 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 20:15:41 +0800
Subject: Predictions: Crime and Criminal Justice in the 21st Century
In-Reply-To: <35FDD227.4C7D@yankton.com>
Message-ID: 

Good post. The war is about to be joined.

At 7:34 PM -0700 9/14/98, nnburk wrote:
>Predictions: Crime and Criminal Justice in the 21st Century
>
>1.      The United States will experience a significant economic
>recession/crisis very close to the turn of the Century.
>

Agreed. The chickens are coming home to roost. America will get what it
deserves. I figure the Y2K problem will be the most significant trigger
event.

>2.      As the large pool of young people born in the early 1990s
>become teenagers and young adults, there will be a dramatic
>increase in violent crime around the year 2005-2010.

See "A Clockwork Orange" for details. Today's Ebonics kids will be
tomorrow's Droogs.

>3.      America will experience sporadic civil disorders/riots in
>many of its urban areas during the next 10-15 years -- much of it
>related to racial/ethnic problems.

The inner cities will burn. 10 million ethnics will wipe themselves out.
White America (and Asian America, who are honorary whites, by the
University of California's admissions standards) will cluck, but will watch
the inner cities burn themselves out with only a "I told you so" attitude.
Miami, Chicago, Washington, LA, New York, Atlanta, New Orleans, and a dozen
other cities will be like Berlin after the war.

>
>4.      Terrorist acts by "fringe"/special issue groups will
>increase at a significant rate -- becoming a major law enforcement
>and security problem.

Freedom fighters, not terrorists.

>5.      As faith in the criminal justice system declines, there
>will be a rise in vigilante-based incidents where citizens take
>the enforcement of crime problems into their own hands.

Local justice, not vigilantism. OJ and You Know Who hanged side by side.
Several million welfare thieves given  the choice of hard labor for 20 or
so years, to repay the money they stole, or a bullet to the head. Their
choice.

>6.      Much of middle- and upper-class America will take a
>"retreatist" attitude and move into private high-security
>communities located in suburban or rural areas. Because of
>technological advances, many companies and corporations will also
>move out of the urban environments as well.

Yes, more and more of my wealthy friends are doing this. Most of them are
moving to the country, where defenses are more naturally provided, and not
necessarily moving to gate communities (which are actually quite
indefensible when the welfare addicts and gangbangers start rioting and
dancing.)

>7.      Due to many of the predictions listed above, much of law
>enforcement and security in the 21st Century will become
>privatized and contractual. Traditional law enforcement agencies
>will primarily serve urban and rural communities.

"Snow Crash."

>
>8.      Law enforcement will evolve into two major and divergent
>roles: traditional law enforcement and a more specialized
>military tactical role to deal with the growing urban violance
>and terrorist incidents.

Has already happened. The National Police Force is already mobilized
against religious groups which are deemed unacceptable, pace the Branch
Davidians.

>9.      Significant violence and unrest will plague our nation's
>prisons. Major prison riots will become a regular occurrence.

Burn the prisons with the inmates locked inside. Then simply execute those
who commit the most serious crimes.

>10.     With the decrease of the possibility of major global
>warfare, the United States military will take on an increased
>domestic "peace-keeping" role with America's law enforcement
>agencies.

Posse comitatus is already becoming a moot point. The Army will be
patrolling the streets within a few years, probably coterminous with Y2K
problems and the resulting martial law.

Militias and freedom fighters will have to start hitting U.S. military
installations. Many will die. Eventually the military will abandon the
Washington elite and will join the freedom fighters.

Ten million politicians and welfare thieves will be put up against the wall.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From guy at panix.com  Mon Sep 14 05:17:32 1998
From: guy at panix.com (Information Security)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 20:17:32 +0800
Subject: a few facts on Presidential peccadillos (fwd)
Message-ID: <199809150119.VAA08631@panix7.panix.com>

   >   From: attila 
   >
   >       power trippers attract willing victims.
   >
   >
   >   ANSWERS
   >
   >   1.  John F. Kennedy
   >   2.  Bill Clinton
   >   3.  Lyndon B. Johnson
   >   4.  Thomas Jefferson
   >   5.  Bill Clinton
   >   6.  Andrew Jackson
   >   7.  Lyndon B. Johnson
   >   8.  Franklin D. Roosevelt, John F. Kennedy
   >   9.  Warren G. Harding
   >   10. John F. Kennedy
   >   11. Lyndon B. Johnson
   >   12. Lyndon B. Johnson

Clinton is normal?

Cool!
---guy

From tcmay at got.net  Mon Sep 14 05:43:59 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 20:43:59 +0800
Subject: Harald to be hit with U.S. cruise missiles
Message-ID: 

At 5:45 PM -0700 9/14/98, HyperReal-Anon wrote:
>On Mon, 14 Sep 1998 harald.fragner at idg.se wrote:
>
>>
>> Do I know you?
>>
>> Harald

>No, but we know you! You're a very evil man, Mr. Fragner, at least by the
>standards of the Hired Government Ninjas. Under our standards, everyone is
>evil...except government leaders.
>
>Expect black helicopters to be targetting your house in the next few days.
>Do not be surprised if unguided rockets are shot into it. If ninjas are
>coming through your windows at 2AM, just remember: We're from the
>government and we're here to help you. Just bend over and grip the towel
>rack.

This is reprehensibile!

HyperReal-Anon is alerting a Confirmed Net Terrorist to a planned U.S.
cruise missile attack on Harald. Harald's crimes are not important. What is
important is that the U.S. Muffdiver William Jefferson Clinton has orded
the Northern Fleet to strike Harald's home and hometown and to report that
Harald was a known associate of both Asama bin Laden and Phillip
Zimmermann, known freedom fighters.

Harald will learn that Six Degrees is monitoring all thoughtcrimes.

Besides, Harald apparently used Roundup in his garden, the same nerve gas
precursor found at the Baby Milk and Marzipan Factory in Khartoum. This
means that Harald was manufacturing nerve gas in his Swedish home.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From guy at panix.com  Mon Sep 14 05:52:58 1998
From: guy at panix.com (Information Security)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 20:52:58 +0800
Subject: Predictions: Crime and Criminal Justice in the 21st Century
Message-ID: <199809150153.VAA08803@panix7.panix.com>

>   From: Tim "I have a LOT of gold in my house" May
>
>   America will get what it deserves.
>
>   The inner cities will burn. 10 million ethnics will wipe themselves out.
>   Miami, Chicago, Washington, LA, New York, Atlanta, New Orleans, and a dozen
>   other cities will be like Berlin after the war.
>
>   See "A Clockwork Orange" for details. Today's Ebonics kids will be
>   tomorrow's Droogs.
>
>   Burn the prisons with the inmates locked inside.
>   Then simply execute those who commit the most serious crimes.
>
>   Militias and freedom fighters will have to start hitting U.S. military
>   installations. Many will die. Eventually the military will abandon the
>   Washington elite and will join the freedom fighters.
>
>   Ten million politicians and welfare thieves will be put up against the wall.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Who woulda thunk Toto was the sane one on the cypherpunks list?

---guy

   Assuming Toto had his Soma supply.

From awestrop at dimensional.com  Mon Sep 14 06:14:51 1998
From: awestrop at dimensional.com (Alan Westrope)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 21:14:51 +0800
Subject: FBI's valiant fight against Marxism
Message-ID: 

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For comic relief, see

http://www.nytimes.com/yr/mo/day/news/arts/groucho-fbi-file.html and

http://www.thenation.com/issue/980928/0928WIEN.HTM

regarding Hoover's investigation of a famed Marxist comic.

(BTW, Obergruppenfuehrer Freeh's characterization of Declan as a
"radical" reminded me of the mathematical quip by that obscure Marxist
comic, Karl:  "To be radical is to go to the root of the equation!")

Cigar jokes are left as an exercise for the reader.

__
Alan Westrope                      PGP    http://www.dim.com/~awestrop
                public  http://www.nyx.net/~awestrop
                 key:   also via keyservers & finger
PGP RSA 0xB8359639:  D6 89 74 03 77 C8 2D 43   7C CA 6D 57 29 25 69 23

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From nobody at replay.com  Mon Sep 14 06:35:53 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 21:35:53 +0800
Subject: Larry Gilbert, AOLers, and the Hyper-real flamer
Message-ID: <199809150228.EAA19097@replay.com>

On Mon, 14 Sep 1998, Paul H. Merrill wrote:

> 
> I love this to death.  Some asshole sends crap data to sixdegrees
> including dredged up real email addresses, then when sixdegrees and the
> contacts given react in a totally appropriate manner other (?) assholes
> berate them for living.  And this one even manages to toss in an
> anti-AOL rant where AOL plays no part.
> 
> Such witticisms I haven't seen since my kids turned 7.
> 
> PHM

I know of several people in addition to myself who have complained to
Sixdegrees about this. I've personally given up sending complaints back to
them, and I lost count at 5. Sixdegrees simply ignores them. I've sent
them to their upstream sites, and they either ignore them or tell me that
they've forwarded them to Sixdegrees. My complaints, at least, were very
civil. One explained exactly what a mailing list was, for crying out loud. 
I can't speak for Hyper-real's (if he sent any) and the others. You may be
able to use that defense if Sixdegrees didn't know, but they do. 

Sixdegrees could avoid these problems very easily by adding a domain
verification so that somebody from Netcom can't specify some address at
toad.com and have it work. They haven't. They haven't because they don't
care. Saying that some sites have screwed up rDNS and mail domains isn't a
valid excuse. They can insert exemptions for Hotmail, MSN, Juno, and other
sites like that if they want. Oh, maybe they have a "phobia" of this, just
like AOLers apparently have a "phobia" of even making an attempt to use
English properly, so it's okay. 

I don't think the parallel between the AOL users spamming the list and
organizations like Sixdegrees spamming the list is that uncalled for
either. Maybe you find any drawing of parallels offensive, Paul, and maybe
you'll denounce it as "propoganda" because I might use an example in this
message, and maybe you just really like AOL and think its cluelessness and
broken software is the best thing since sliced bread, but that doesn't
change the fact that Sixdegrees and friends are doing the same thing AOL
is and that it's abuse of the network. They fire a salvo, and somebody
else fires one back at their expense.

By this logic, I'd next expect to read a claim that since the AOLers are
getting the Cypherpunks address from somewhere, we should welcome their
requests for band stickers and things like "how u do that." After all,
they're the victims, and are probably the kind of people who go to look up
the word "gullible" when somebody tells them it isn't in the dictionary.

It's a long-established tradition to flame people like this. Some flames
are better than others. Maybe if the Hyper-real user insults them enough
they'll finally add Cypherpunks to their block list. 

I've personally grown real sick of seeing bullshit passwords, welcome
messages, new password messages, updates, and other junk on this list from
sites which don't bother to verify domain names. I can give them that, but
I start to get pissed when they refuse to block the address. For that
reason I don't mind the person or persons who are flaming these idiots and
in fact, like Mr. May, I cheer them on. Personally, I *WANT* them to pour
nitric acid into their computers to destroy them, so they get the hell off
the net. 

Maybe they're scared of block lists. After all, they're similar to kill
files which we all know are lists of people who need killing and since
murder is illegal and immoral kill files must be too.

Paul, maybe you don't mind somebody pouring grass killer on your lawn if
they were submitted your address over the phone and made an "honest"
mistake and fell victim to a prank, but I mind if they do it to mine,
particularly since all they have to do is perform cursory checks to
realize it's suspect. Oops, I made an example using a different subject
matter. We're in the "blatant propoganda" stage now, I suppose. 

Now, since you're all for niceness in the world, you can go jump on Tim
since he's doing this too.

  From: Tim May 
  To: Well now I am a Mommy! , cypherpunks at toad.com
  Subject: Re: sixdegrees

  At 6:27 PM -0700 9/13/98, Well now I am a Mommy! wrote:
  >hi,
  >
  >I see you added me as a friend..... just wondering who you are.  :)
  >
  >Christy
  >

  Hi Christy,

  Got your name from the Stalker's R Us group. Please post more details
  about your personal fantasies. Send us nude pictures, too. 

  You say you're a Mommy. Hope there are no stretch marks.

  Oh, and your children can join our group too. Got any photos?

  --Tim May

And:

  From: Tim May 
  Subject: Re: News for class

  At 5:58 AM -0700 8/30/98, sboyd wrote:
  >Please inform me how I can get the news each day by e-mail at
  >flashboyd at aol.com.  This information will be used in my comm class.

  Hey, "flashboyd at aol.com," why are you asking _us_?

  According to AOL, "AOL _is_ the Internet."

  (Personally, I'm cheered by the news that a net.stalker is tracking down
  clueless AOLers and Webbers and eviscerating them.)

  --Tim May

SignalMonger

From jpenrod at sihope.com  Mon Sep 14 07:12:05 1998
From: jpenrod at sihope.com (Jeff Penrod)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 22:12:05 +0800
Subject: Joe Farah 9/14
Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.19980914230008.007fb830@mailhost.IntNet.net>

Americans get what they deserve 	

I love America. 

I love the spacious skies. I love the amber waves of grain, the purple
mountains' majesties and the fruited plains. But what I love most about
America is the God-breathed revolutionary spirit that led its founders to
risk everything in a desperate fight for freedom and a noble effort to
write the greatest Constitution the world has ever known. 

But something dreadful has happened to that spirit. It's gone. Oh, there's
a small remnant of people who still have it, understand it and live by it.
But, apparently, the vast majority of Americans are clueless about it. They
have no sense of history. They have no connection with their revolutionary
past. They have no idea of how blessed they are to live with the fleeting
legacy of freedom they inherited from George Washington, Thomas Jefferson,
James Madison and our other forefathers who staked their lives, their
fortunes and their sacred honor in a quest for liberty. 
Americans have
grown fat and lazy, content with their material blessings and ignorant of
their far more important endowment of freedom. 

It's enough to make you sick. 

Oh, sure, Americans have lots of scapegoats for their ignorance. They've
been deliberately dumbed down for 30 or more years by government schools
determined to turn them into mindless robots. They have been the victims of
media propaganda designed to deceive them and lead them astray. And for a
generation or more they have been seduced by government plans to instill in
them an ever-greater sense of dependency. 

But those are excuses. The truth is out there. It's more readily available
to Americans who choose to seek it out than any other people in history.
Americans are just too busy, blind or comfortable to bother searching for
it. Most don't even comprehend the way they are being manipulated -- or
just don't care. In other words, ultimately, they have no one to blame but
themselves. 

As an example of what I'm talking about, take the latest polls conducted
after the release of the Starr report. Most Americans say President Clinton
is doing a good job and should not resign or be impeached. A CNN/Gallup
poll released the day the report went public on the Internet placed the
president's job approval rating at 62 percent, about where it was before
the report was released. More than half, 58 percent, said Congress should
vote to censure the president for behavior that has eroded the public's
respect for his ethics and truthfulness -- a thoroughly meaningless
gesture, a slap on the wrist with no consequences, the kind of punishment
Bill Clinton awaits more eagerly than the next class of White House interns. 

Almost 60 percent of those polled said they thought Clinton was fit to be
president. By what standard? That's the trouble. Americans have no
standards -- no unchangeable yardsticks by which they measure right and
wrong, truth from fiction. 

Now, I don't put much stock in public opinion surveys. They are often
conducted by the same corporate media interests whose agenda is
inextricably tied to bigger and more intrusive government. Nevertheless,
these surveys are at least an indication that our nation is in grave
trouble. 

What do they tell us? 

We've lost our moorings -- just as surely as Bill Clinton has. America is
morally, politically, intellectually, spiritually adrift. There are no
anchors aboard. No compasses. The USS America is at the mercy of the winds
and currents, and most on board don't care. As long as the crew is serving
them fine food and entertaining them, the passengers don't give a second
thought to their fate or their ultimate destination. 

In a way, Americans are getting just what they deserve. Their choice of
leaders reflects their own inadequacies and shortcomings -- their own
cowardice. 

No wonder they look at Bill Clinton without judgment. To hold him
accountable would mean holding themselves to a standard of accountability.
They like looking up to see a leader who is every bit as dysfunctional,
soulless and lost as themselves. It's comforting, in a perverse way. 
And
psychic and material comfort is the only standard by which Americans today
measure their lives, their liberty and their pursuit of happiness. It's not
an easy observation or admission to make, my fellow Americans. But somebody
has to say it. 	

A daily radio broadcast adaptation of Joseph Farah's commentaries can be
heard at http://www.ktkz.com/ 	

From tcmay at got.net  Mon Sep 14 07:12:47 1998
From: tcmay at got.net (Tim May)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 22:12:47 +0800
Subject: Larry Gilbert, AOLers, and the Hyper-real flamer
In-Reply-To: <199809150228.EAA19097@replay.com>
Message-ID: 

At 7:28 PM -0700 9/14/98, Anonymous wrote:

>Sixdegrees could avoid these problems very easily by adding a domain
>verification so that somebody from Netcom can't specify some address at
>toad.com and have it work. They haven't. They haven't because they don't
>care. Saying that some sites have screwed up rDNS and mail domains isn't a
>valid excuse. They can insert exemptions for Hotmail, MSN, Juno, and other
>sites like that if they want. Oh, maybe they have a "phobia" of this, just
>like AOLers apparently have a "phobia" of even making an attempt to use
>English properly, so it's okay.

This is why I have been responding to "sixdedegrees" contacts with threats,
death threats, threats to put them on my spam list, promises to contact
their children, and other such delightful things.

They have become an Internet bomb, exploding in our midst.

Respond to them in kind.

--Tim May

P.S., Anonymous goes on to write:

>Now, since you're all for niceness in the world, you can go jump on Tim
>since he's doing this too.
>
>  From: Tim May 
>  To: Well now I am a Mommy! , cypherpunks at toad.com
>  Subject: Re: sixdegrees
...

That's right. I say death to Sixdegrees and death to those who spam us.

Kill the fuckers dead. Let Frodo sort them out.

Wiping out the corporate monstrosity that is "Sixdegrees" will be sweet.

--Tim May

(This space left blank pending determ. of acceptability to the gov't.)
---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:---------:----
Timothy C. May              | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money,
ComSec 3DES:   831-728-0152 | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero
W.A.S.T.E.: Corralitos, CA  | knowledge, reputations, information markets,
Licensed Ontologist         | black markets, collapse of governments.

From jya at pipeline.com  Mon Sep 14 07:56:48 1998
From: jya at pipeline.com (John Young)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 22:56:48 +0800
Subject: DoD on Crypto, Echelon, Secrets
Message-ID: <199809150349.XAA28692@dewdrop2.mindspring.com>

We attended Defense Secretary Cohen's talk today at the Council on 
Foreign Relations in New York City on "Security in a Grave World."

While not included in the prepared text, Secretary Cohen remarked 
in the Q&A on terrorism and encryption policy that Americans will 
have to decide how much privacy they will be willing to give up for 
protection against terrorism, and cited the FBI's similar views on 
the threat of encryption use by terrorists. 

Afterwards I had an informative chat with Kenneth Bacon, 
Assistant Secretary of Defense for Public Affairs, to ask about 
interviewing Secretary Cohen on Echelon, the global electronic 
intercept and surveillance system operated by the National Security 
Agency. 

Mr. Bacon said the Department will not comment on such matters. I 
acknowledged that was the case heretofore, but with intense European 
interest in Echelon, I asked if would it be possible for Secretary 
Cohen to give a statement on the topic.

I noted that Secretary Cohen in his talk today had listed international 
cooperation as a principal need of US defense policy, and that Echelon 
had raised considerable suspicion of US interception and surveillance 
prowess which could inhibit international trust and cooperation. 

I also asked Mr. Bacon if Secretary Cohen could discuss as well the 
possibility of further declassification of secret technology, as with 
the Skipjack encryption algorithm, to enhance US economic security and 
for protection against information espionage. 

Mr. Bacon said that others in the Department would be more appropriate 
to discuss such topics in detail then Secretary Cohen. I asked if anyone 
except the Secretary had authority to discuss Echelon and declassification 
of secret technology. Mr. Bacon would not answer that but suggested I 
send a letter proposing such topics for discussion and the Department 
will respond.

From messiah at jps.net  Mon Sep 14 08:52:55 1998
From: messiah at jps.net (TM)
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 23:52:55 +0800
Subject: Joe Farah 9/14 (Pppbbbttt)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.32.19980914230008.007fb830@mailhost.IntNet.net>
Message-ID: <199809150446.VAA18561@smtp1.jps.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

[ I know this'll never get read by Joe Farah, but what the hell. Gotta
speak up, right? ]

At 08:00 PM 9/14/1998 , Jeff Penrod wrote:
>Americans get what they deserve 	
>
>I love America. 
>
>I love the spacious skies. I love the amber waves of grain, the purple
>mountains' majesties and the fruited plains. But what I love most about
>America is the God-breathed revolutionary spirit that led its founders to
>risk everything in a desperate fight for freedom and a noble effort to
>write the greatest Constitution the world has ever known. 

Yeah right. The Constitution and the Revolution were perpetrated by two
different groups. The Constitution had no revolution behind it. It was
created because the Articles of Confederation provided no central
government, and the republic was floundering. The rich were feeling
threatened by uprisings (like Shay's Rebellion). Alexander Hamilton
(conspicuously missing from your list of ppl who staked their lives), the
*father of the Constitution*, favored a monarchy.

>But something dreadful has happened to that spirit. It's gone. Oh, there's
>a small remnant of people who still have it, understand it and live by it.
>But, apparently, the vast majority of Americans are clueless about it. They
>have no sense of history. They have no connection with their revolutionary
>past. They have no idea of how blessed they are to live with the fleeting
>legacy of freedom they inherited from George Washington, Thomas Jefferson,
>James Madison and our other forefathers who staked their lives, their
>fortunes and their sacred honor in a quest for liberty.

Actually, the Framers of the Constitution made damn sure their fortunes
were covered. Article VI clearly states...

"All Debts contracted and Engagements entered into, before the Adoption of
this Constitution, shall be as valid against the United States under this
Constitution, as under the Confederation."

A large majority of the Framers were owed money by the government under the
Confederation.

Also, Thomas Jefferson was in Paris when the Constitution was written. He
was responsible for the Declaration of Independence (a beautiful piece of
writing, BTW), but not the Constitution.

>Americans have
>grown fat and lazy, content with their material blessings and ignorant of
>their far more important endowment of freedom. 

Americans have growns fat and lazy, content with their material blessings
and ignorant of their exploitation by the captialist society in which they
live.

>It's enough to make you sick. 

Amen.

>Oh, sure, Americans have lots of scapegoats for their ignorance. They've
>been deliberately dumbed down for 30 or more years by government schools
>determined to turn them into mindless robots. They have been the victims of
>media propaganda designed to deceive them and lead them astray. And for a
>generation or more they have been seduced by government plans to instill in
>them an ever-greater sense of dependency. 

They've been preyed upon by monopolies, they've been exploited by
management, and they've been fucked up the ass by big business. Meanwhile,
the largest rift between rich and poor in modern industrialized countries
steadily grows wider... 1% of the population controls 90% of the wealth,
and my future has been leased by old rich white men.

>But those are excuses. The truth is out there. It's more readily available
>to Americans who choose to seek it out than any other people in history.
>Americans are just too busy, blind or comfortable to bother searching for
>it. Most don't even comprehend the way they are being manipulated -- or
>just don't care. In other words, ultimately, they have no one to blame but
>themselves. 

In other words, listen to you, because you have the Truth (c)(r)(tm).

>As an example of what I'm talking about, take the latest polls conducted
>after the release of the Starr report. Most Americans say President Clinton
>is doing a good job and should not resign or be impeached. A CNN/Gallup
>poll released the day the report went public on the Internet placed the
>president's job approval rating at 62 percent, about where it was before
>the report was released. More than half, 58 percent, said Congress should
>vote to censure the president for behavior that has eroded the public's
>respect for his ethics and truthfulness -- a thoroughly meaningless
>gesture, a slap on the wrist with no consequences, the kind of punishment
>Bill Clinton awaits more eagerly than the next class of White House interns. 

So... you would rather go against the people's sovereignty and impose your
own personal political agenda on the public, simply because you don't think
Americans are fit to rule themselves? Hah! Americans will run America, for
good or bad. That's the way the Framers intended it. In fact, I think
they'd be rather pleased to see how political and economic elites have
monopolized this country. The Framers were never big on majority rule.

>Almost 60 percent of those polled said they thought Clinton was fit to be
>president. By what standard? That's the trouble. Americans have no
>standards -- no unchangeable yardsticks by which they measure right and
>wrong, truth from fiction. 

By *their* standard, by their own personal judgement. There's no moral
yardstick, and God help us if there is in the future. Who makes the
yardstick? Who sits down and says, "This is the moral standard in this
country, abide by it or suffer the consequences"?

>Now, I don't put much stock in public opinion surveys. They are often
>conducted by the same corporate media interests whose agenda is
>inextricably tied to bigger and more intrusive government. Nevertheless,
>these surveys are at least an indication that our nation is in grave
>trouble. 

These surveys are an indication that you are outnumbered. America no longer
abides by your wishes... DANG. Cry me a river, Joe.

>What do they tell us? 

People's rating of Pres. Clinton? Some people's rating of Pres. Clinton?

>We've lost our moorings -- just as surely as Bill Clinton has. America is
>morally, politically, intellectually, spiritually adrift. There are no
>anchors aboard. No compasses. The USS America is at the mercy of the winds
>and currents, and most on board don't care. As long as the crew is serving
>them fine food and entertaining them, the passengers don't give a second
>thought to their fate or their ultimate destination. 

Wow.. you manage to turn FORGIVENESS into a total lack of morals in this
country. Bummer if everyone in America doesn't think the way you do.

>In a way, Americans are getting just what they deserve. Their choice of
>leaders reflects their own inadequacies and shortcomings -- their own
>cowardice. 

Yeah... we should go back to REAL presidents... like Harding or Grant, two
worthless sacks of shit voted in by an apathetic public. Or Jefferson, who
was so morally upright he fathered a child or two with his maid. Or
Coolidge, who was a puppet for 19th century monopolies. This country has
been fraught with stupid leaders, from post-Revolutionary times to modern.

>No wonder they look at Bill Clinton without judgment. To hold him
>accountable would mean holding themselves to a standard of accountability.
>They like looking up to see a leader who is every bit as dysfunctional,
>soulless and lost as themselves. It's comforting, in a perverse way.

Would you rather the lies be hidden? Would you rather the massive
coverups... the back-office political wheelings and dealings? Would you
rather the lies and deceit that has plagued humanity since history began be
hidden from view so you can strut around like an over-inflated rooster and
crow to the world "No corruption here! We're the leaders of the free world!
Our fathers would be proud"?

>And
>psychic and material comfort is the only standard by which Americans today
>measure their lives, their liberty and their pursuit of happiness. It's not
>an easy observation or admission to make, my fellow Americans. But somebody
>has to say it. 	

As opposed to what... you think people in the past sat down and thought
"Well, gee, how free am I this year as compared to last year?" Hell no!
They sat down and thought "Goddamnit, I don't have nothin' ta eat and the
corn done died! Damn lawyers!" For most people, it simply didn't matter who
was in office - the laws didn't affect them in the least.

>A daily radio broadcast adaptation of Joseph Farah's commentaries can be
>heard at http://www.ktkz.com/ 	

Yay.

I simply hate it when ppl wax nostalgic about the Framers. They were a
bunch of white guys all trying to cover their own asses, and in the
process, they came up with a government which is stable because it pits
self-interest against self-interest. I will admit that the government they
created was really pretty cool, but people get so damn sloppy about the
*motives* of the Framers it's disgusting! They weren't guardian angels
carrying out the mandate of God, they were businessmen and lawyers - some
of whom had some brilliant political theories.

Also, the Framers were *not* (repeat, NOT) in favor of majority rule. Only
1/6th of the original government was elected by the ppl (the House of
Representatives). In fact, if you read the minutes of the meetings, ppl
pointed to the abuse of Quakers in PA by a majority.

Right then. I feel better now.

What do other ppl think about this?

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--
TM(independent software)
http://www.sinnerz.com/tmessiah
PGP Key ID: 4096/1024/0x14C4FDE6
PGP Fingerprint: 1263 DBFD F2C4 77C6 87F2
                 A94A 0759 7C7E 14C4 FDE6

     -export-a-crypto-system-sig -RSA-3-lines-PERL
#!/bin/perl -sp0777i

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From emc at wire.insync.net  Mon Sep 14 09:18:56 1998
From: emc at wire.insync.net (Eric Cordian)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 00:18:56 +0800
Subject: The DES Analytic Crack Project
Message-ID: <199809150520.AAA13045@wire.insync.net>

As some of you may have noticed, a new attempt to crack the Data
Encryption Standard has been started, with a descriptive FAQ located
at the following URL

        http://www.cyberspace.org/~enoch/crakfaq.html

A while back, after the first DES challenge was announced, a number of
us made the observation that a known plaintext attack on DES,
expressed as a system of a few thousand boolean variables with
constraints in 3-conjunctive normal form, was not too far from the
size and complexity of problems that could be directly solved by
bleeding edge combinatorial algorithms, albeit with signficant CPU and
memory consumption.

We thought this would be an interesting result, and generated a number
of problems of various numbers of DES rounds based on the DES
Challenge data, and some not particularly optimized S-Box
representations, and set about the task of solving them, smaller
problems first.  We wrote a lot of code, learned a lot about arbitrary
systems of boolean variables, and after breaking 2-round and 4-round
problems, the first almost instantly, and the second with very
reasonable amounts of resources, set about the task of seeing if we
could break the higher round problems, and immortalize ourselves by
beating DESCHALL to the key.

To our very great regret, we did not manage to do this, and once the
$10k prize was claimed, we figured the game was over and returned to
working on other things.  We still thought DES was a problem of
approximately the right size to demonstrate the existence of an
analytical solution which would beat a well-tuned exhaustive search on
a problem of practical interest.

Since that time, DES has been broken twice more by exhaustive search,
once by distributed.net, and again by a hardware DES cracking machine
designed by Net legend John Gilmore and the EFF for a non-trivial
amount of money.

Remarkably, although most agree DES is dead for new applications, with
Moore's Law and additional hardware crackers being possible today for
much less than the cost of the prototype, it still seems to enjoy a
reputation amongst the public as a cipher that takes 20,000 pentiums
running for half a month or a hardware box with $100k of chips running
for several days to break, neither of which seems to have thrown the
Fear of God into its current users, most notably the Banking Industry.

With other analytic attacks like differential and linear cryptanalysis
being really practical only for reduced round DES, and all current
high-profile cracks on production ciphers employing key trial, the
press has latched onto keysize as a synonym for strength, and has made
numerous statements which have reinforced this questionable paradigm
in the minds of the public.

We have therefore been taking another look at our idea of a
combinatorial crack of DES, and decided that even with DES having been
cracked three times by key trial, it is definitely a project worth
doing.  This time, rather than working frantically in an unsuccessful
attempt to beat other teams on a public challenge, we wish to finish
up our original efforts, and repeat the three cracks previously done,
this time using our algorithms, and distribute working code
continuously as the project progresses, to sponsors who have donated
some money to defray our costs.  This will offer people the
opportunity to participate vicariously in a fun project which has the
potential to be a genuine paradigm shift in the way the world thinks
about codebreaking.

Sometimes, promising areas of research are not followed because of
knowlege of some well-known result which suggests that such
exploration will be unfruitful.  Years ago, for instance, suggestions
that programs could be checked by software for proper behavior, and
run without using protected memory regions, were usually met with
snide comments about the "computer halting problem" and various
adjunct results.  Today, there are many variants of "safe execution"
technology, from prove and carry schemes, to Java bytecode, with a
sound theoretical basis behind them.  None of these is a violation of
the "computer halting problem" results, of course.

Similarly, after a large burst of activity decades ago, which resulted
in the notion of NP-Completeness, and various results in computational
complexity theory, suggestions that an analytic solution exists for
some large combinatorial problem of practical interest conjure up
visions of exponential resource utilization, speaker cluenessless, and
the lack of progress on NP=P.

For this reason, we feel this project is definitely a Schnelling
Point.  If it works, even badly, people will begin to look at lots of
problems in ways they would not have considered before, and much new
code which improves upon what we have done will be created.  This will
be an irreversible change in the Order of Things.

In the several days since we put up our FAQ, we have gotten quite a
few comments, and some concerns.

The comments have mostly been along the lines that it is an
interesting, even intriguing project.  The concerns are generally that
we will experience an unexpected "combinatoric explosion" in the
higher round problems, and that no one in their right mind would send
money to a nym, because it might just vanish and be used by the nym to
live in perpetual ecstasy in some place warm and tropical, without the
possiblility of the nym being sued for fraud.

We hope the close coupling between the sponsors and the project
members will eliminate this latter concern, with weekly progress
reports and working code being distributed to permit the sponsors to
reproduce our results as they occur.  If three people are willing to
sponsor and give us the go-ahead to begin, without wanting their money
back if other sponsors do not join, we can probably get through the
minimal S-Box representations and their proof-of-correctness as well
as some cleaned up code for the 2-round problem.  Hopefully we will
then have a reputation with these people which will encourage others
to join in the effort.

Clearly, we're after speculative capital, rather than widow and orphan
money, and hope a few of the wealthy older retired (and perhaps even
crusty) engineer types might find this a productive thing to support.
After all, if you've just blown $220,000 on a DES Cracker, making it
$220,500 and getting your very own Schnelling Point in return is
probably a reasonable amount of fun for your money.

I'll stop ranting now. :)

--
Sponsor the DES Analytic Crack Project
http://www.cyberspace.org/~enoch/crakfaq.html

From mb2657b at enterprise.powerup.com.au  Tue Sep 15 01:22:28 1998
From: mb2657b at enterprise.powerup.com.au (Scott Balson)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 01:22:28 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Globalisation: Demise of the Australian nation
Message-ID: <001301bde082$20436560$f81c64cb@QU.fox.uq.net.ai>

New book: 'GLOBALISATION: DEMISE OF THE AUSTRALIAN NATION'. 
�
This is Graham Strachan's follow-up to his controversial sellout success, 
'Economic Rationalism: a Disaster for Australia'. (See articles at: http://www.gwb.com.au/gwb/news/economic)
�
We recommend it to those who are concerned about where Australia will be, 
and has been going under the Laboral factions (Labor and Coalition parties) for 
the last 20 PLUS years.
�
Globalisation is no longer a conspiracy theory: it is official Government 
(and Opposition) policy! The only secret now is just what 'globalisation' 
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and that's it. In fact it goes far beyond that, and includes political and 
social globalisation as well. This book explains how it is all being engineered 
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concentrates on economic deceit, this book goes on to uncover the complete 
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you!At $15 plus $2.50 postage (with discounts on both book and postage 
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Graham's website: http://www.overflow.net.au/~bizbrief.
�
GWB
�
�
Scott Balson
Pauline Hanson's One Nation 
webmaster

From stuffed at stuffed.net  Tue Sep 15 02:05:46 1998
From: stuffed at stuffed.net (STUFFED NEWS DAILY)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 02:05:46 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: READ THE FULL EXPLICIT CONTENTS OF THE STARR REPORT TODAY/PLUS CLINTON'S REBUTTAL!
Message-ID: <19980915071000.5544.qmail@eureka.abc-web.com>

IN TODAY'S ISSUE:

 30 NEW EXTRA HOT JPEGS!
 5 NEW SIZZLING STORIES
 HOW TO PEEL A PORN STAR'S PANTIES
 THE STAR REPORT IN FULL
 VIRGIN PENIS POLISHING
 BEER BASHING BOOBS
 STUFFED SPINS MTV'S 98 VID AWARDS
 ORGASMATRON
 THE BEST OF EUREKA
 CAMP CLINTON
 FERTILITY FINGERS FINGERED
 CLOSING THE DEAL
 THE ART OF LUST

       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/15/   <----

Welcome to  today's  issue of Stuffed. To read it you should
click on the URL above.  If it is not made clickable by your
email program  you will need to  use your mouse to highlight
the URL,  copy it and then paste it into your browser  (then
press Return).

This  email  is  never  sent  unsolicited.  Stuffed  is  the
supplement for the Eureka newsletter you subscribed to. Full
instructions on unsubscribing  are in every issue of Eureka!

       ---->   http://stuffed.net/98/9/15/   <----

From bill.stewart at pobox.com  Mon Sep 14 11:07:01 1998
From: bill.stewart at pobox.com (Bill Stewart)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 02:07:01 +0800
Subject: U.S. House only has a T-1
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980914115857.008a9820@idiom.com>

At 11:55 AM 9/11/98 -0700, Martin Minow wrote:
>>From Jim Burns:
>>Is there any effort underway to mirror the report to various
>>archives?  This is going to kill the DC internet corridor
>>otherwise.
>>
>What I heard on the radio this morning was that the house
>will press CD's that will be distributed to mirror servers
>(presumably the major Internet news providers.)

Sigh.  These folks don't understand the web technology
(though I suppose sneakernetting CDs to Washington press corps
may actually be the fastest way for some things,
but the press corps and the press companies' webmasters
aren't the same folks.)
It'd be simpler for them to distribute the report,
and similar high-popularity information in the future,
using electronic distribution to the various press agencies
and other high-volume web sites, as long as they
coordinate it well.  It might also make sense for them to have a
"press-only" subnet for insiders and major caching proxy servers to get 
distributions from.

>Now, the real interesting question: will the files be
>PGP-signed?

What?  And make it hard to change them later?  :-)

				Thanks! 
					Bill
Bill Stewart, bill.stewart at pobox.com
PGP Fingerprint D454 E202 CBC8 40BF  3C85 B884 0ABE 4639

From bill.stewart at pobox.com  Mon Sep 14 11:13:53 1998
From: bill.stewart at pobox.com (Bill Stewart)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 02:13:53 +0800
Subject: Fwd: WHITE HOUSE MULLS NEW INTERNET TAX PROPOSAL  from edupage
Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980915001432.008abb40@idiom.com>

Forwarded from Dave Farber's List
-----------------------------------
I think the something at the WH has pushed them off the edge. How much you want to bet that it gives a lot more information than just the item costs. It will be used to police obscenity laws and censorship laws before it is done.

Dave

Ira Magaziner, President Clinton's senior Internet advisor, has proposed a 
new plan for tracking and taxing goods sold over the Internet that would use 
electronic "resident cards" and private-sector escrow agents around the 
world. Consumers would obtain digital cash at banks that would allow 
merchants to identify which country the buyer is in, but would reveal no 
other personal information. Consumption taxes would then be calculated, 
collected, and placed with an escrow agent who would then funnel the money 
to the appropriate government. "Governments would get their money more 
quickly... they would get a higher compliance rate... and the system would 
be easier to police," says Mr. Magaziner. (Wall Street Journal 11 Sep 98)

==================================

				Thanks! 
					Bill
Bill Stewart, bill.stewart at pobox.com
PGP Fingerprint D454 E202 CBC8 40BF  3C85 B884 0ABE 4639

From tom at cat.ping.deThomasAdams  Mon Sep 14 11:36:32 1998
From: tom at cat.ping.deThomasAdams (Thomas Adams)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 02:36:32 +0800
Subject: Starr report zipped and prepared for offline reading somewhere?
Message-ID: 

You are all writing about Clinton and Monica et al. Dunno what this does here 
but anyway, let me add to the noise:

Is it possible to download the Starr report somewhere, zipped and prepared for 
offline reading?

From CTIA_Daily_News at um2.unitymail.com  Tue Sep 15 02:37:10 1998
From: CTIA_Daily_News at um2.unitymail.com (CTIA Daily News)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 02:37:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: CTIA Daily News from WOW-COM - September 14, 1998
Message-ID: <199809150937.CAA04662@toad.com>

==========================================
Welcome to today's edition of the CTIA Daily News
from WOW-COM.  Please click on the icon / attachment
for the most important news in wireless communications today.

Your company just formed a partnership in a country you
never heard of.  Are you worried about international roaming
fraud?  You should be.  

CTIA's Wireless Security '98 - It's Just Smart Business.
Orlando, Florida � November 9 - 11, 1998 
http://www.wow-com.com/professional  

Team WOW-COM
wowcom at ctia.org
===========================================

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From Richard.Bragg at ssa.co.uk  Mon Sep 14 14:47:08 1998
From: Richard.Bragg at ssa.co.uk (Richard.Bragg at ssa.co.uk)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 05:47:08 +0800
Subject: Joe Farah 9/14 (Pppbbbttt)
Message-ID: <80256680.003A249A.00@seunt002e.ssa.co.uk>

>>Almost 60 percent of those polled said they thought Clinton was fit to be
>>president. By what standard? That's the trouble. Americans have no
>>standards -- no unchangeable yardsticks by which they measure right and
>>wrong, truth from fiction.

>By *their* standard, by their own personal judgement. There's no moral
>yardstick, and God help us if there is in the future. Who makes the
>yardstick? Who sits down and says, "This is the moral standard in this
>country, abide by it or suffer the consequences"?

Sorry but there are absolutes and there is a moral yardstick.  Whether this
 is accepted or not is beside the point.

There has to be absolutes otherwise any action can be excused (or damned).
  The real cry should be
"God help us to instigate Your yardstick".  God doesn't change and neither
does His measure.

1)Love the Lord, with all your heart, with all you soul with all your mind
and all your strength
2)Love you neibour as yourself.

Everything else hangs on these.

From rah at shipwright.com  Mon Sep 14 15:30:26 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 06:30:26 +0800
Subject: IP: Critics Pick Apart Study on Internet and Depression
Message-ID: 

--- begin forwarded text

Delivered-To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
X-Sender: believer at telepath.com
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 1998 21:18:32 -0500
To: believer at telepath.com
From: believer at telepath.com
Subject: IP: Critics Pick Apart Study on Internet and Depression
Mime-Version: 1.0
Sender: owner-ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Precedence: list
Reply-To: believer at telepath.com

Source:  New York Times
http://www.nytimes.com/library/tech/98/09/biztech/articles/14digicom.html

September 14, 1998

TECHNOLOGY COLUMN

Critics Pick Apart Study on Internet and Depression

By DENISE CARUSO

Robert Kraut, co-author of a new study linking depression with Internet
use, sounded a bit depressed himself last week.

"I thought I was finished with this," Kraut, a professor of social
psychology and human-computer interaction at Carnegie Mellon University,
said with a sigh. He was alluding to the flood of attention -- and
criticism -- that his study, titled "Home Net," had received since it was
published two weeks ago.

Starting in 1995, "Home Net" researchers gave PCs and free Internet
accounts to 169 people in 73 families in the Pittsburgh area. After
monitoring their online behavior, in some cases for more than two years,
the researchers concluded that spending time on the Internet was associated
with statistically significant increases in depression and loneliness.

Critics assert that the study has fatal flaws that neutralize its findings
and that they are appalled at the authors' far-reaching conclusions about
the impact the findings might have on Internet policy and technology
development.

Donna Hoffman, a Vanderbilt University professor and outspoken critic of
Internet research design, was unequivocal about the "Home Net" study.

"Speaking as an editor, if this had crossed my desk, I would have rejected
it," said Ms. Hoffman, who edits the journal Marketing Science. "The
mistakes are so bad that they render the results fairly close to
meaningless."

Among those mistakes, she said, were the absence of two standard
safeguards: a control group and random selection of subjects.

"With 'Home Net,' we don't know for sure what led to their results," Ms.
Hoffman said of the lack of a control group, "because we don't know what
happened to people who weren't using the Internet."

In addition, the study recruited people from high schools and community
service organizations, instead of selecting people randomly from a large
area. Random selection is crucial to building a truly representative sample
of a population -- in this case, residents of the United States.

The study found that one hour a week online led to small but measurable
increases in depression and loneliness and loss of friendships. While those
measurements might well be statistically significant, critics assert that
without a random sample, they are meaningless outside the group that was
studied.

"The assertions have no statistical relevance to any population of Internet
users beyond those in the study population -- even in principle," declared
Charles Brownstein, a former director at the National Science Foundation,
now an executive director at the Corporation for National Research
Initiatives in Reston, Va.

Although research studies do not always have to use control groups or
randomly chosen participants to be valid, Ms. Hoffman said, those
safeguards become imperative "when you're doing a study that claims causal
relationships and that these relationships hold in the larger population."

The "Home Net" team clearly made such claims. For example, the news release
stated that "Carnegie Mellon Study Reveals Negative Potential of Heavy
Internet Use on Emotional Well Being," and even suggested that
parents move PCs out of teen-agers' bedrooms and into shared family rooms.

Kraut was quoted extensively in the release, with such statements as, "We
were surprised to find that what is a social technology has such
anti-social consequences." Also: "Our results have clear implications for
further research on personal Internet use. As we understand the reasons for
the declines in social involvement, there will be implications for social
policies and for the design of Internet technology."

Last week, Kraut wearily defended his study. "In 1995, we did start with a
control group, but it was very hard to keep it, with little in the way of
incentives for them to continue to fill out questionnaires," he said. "And
we couldn't use a random sample because of the nature of the study's design
-- we wanted to be able to include groups who already had social
connections with each other so we could observe some shifting, if it was
going to occur, between existing social relationships."

And despite criticism of the researchers' methods, he said that the study
was widely applicable.

"We have changes big enough that they aren't likely to have occurred on the
basis of chance," Kraut said. "There is something here to explain."

But critics like Ms. Hoffman look askance at such results, given her
experience debunking other Internet studies, including one from Neilsen
Media Research in which she participated in 1996 and another in 1995 in
which Marty Rimm, a graduate student in Carnegie Mellon's College of
Engineering, published a study purporting to show that the Internet was
overrun with pornography.

The impact of Rimm's study, though based on false premises and quickly
discredited, was profound. The resulting furor in the media and in Congress
helped bring about the Communications Decency Act, which the Supreme Court
ruled was a violation of the First Amendment.  Critics fear that the "Home
Net" study might end up having a similar effect.

"It's easy to imagine the results of this study being used to influence
policy decisions about Internet access, especially in controversial funding
decisions for schools and libraries," Ms. Hoffman said.

But in the end, Ms. Hoffman said, protecting the Internet itself is not the
point.

"We're trying to protect the standard of research," she said. "This isn't
obscure ivory-tower stuff that never sees the light of day. It has an
impact on people's lives. If we're going to the trouble to study the
Internet, at least we should make sure we're doing it right."

 Copyright 1998 The New York Times Company
-----------------------
NOTE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. section 107, this material is
distributed without profit or payment to those who have expressed a prior
interest in receiving this information for non-profit research and
educational purposes only. For more information go to:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml
-----------------------

**********************************************
To subscribe or unsubscribe, email:
     majordomo at majordomo.pobox.com
with the message:
     (un)subscribe ignition-point email at address
**********************************************
www.telepath.com/believer
**********************************************

--- end forwarded text

-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From AIMSX at aol.com  Mon Sep 14 16:16:32 1998
From: AIMSX at aol.com (AIMSX at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 07:16:32 +0800
Subject: Larry Gilbert, AOLers, and the Hyper-real flamer
Message-ID: <33ec7cbb.35fe5849@aol.com>

Obviously you have a very high opinion of yourself and a low opinion of people
who use AOL.  Contrary to popular belief, there are a few intelligent people
on AOL, but it looks as if you are too egotistical to realize that.

Have you ever thought to look at your own mistakes before you publicize
everyone else's to the world?  Are you just suffering from some sort of
dillusion of grandeur - thinking you are better than everyone else.  Things
like this are what many wars were started over, I am so happy the internet
(hopefully) won't start a war in the real world.

From edsmith at IntNet.net  Mon Sep 14 16:21:11 1998
From: edsmith at IntNet.net (Edwin E. Smith)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 07:21:11 +0800
Subject: Joe Farah 9/14 (Pppbbbttt)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.32.19980914230008.007fb830@mailhost.IntNet.net>
Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.19980915080355.007f52a0@mailhost.IntNet.net>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Thank you for your comments. Now you can go back to reading Marx.

Edwin
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.0
Charset: noconv

iQA/AwUBNf5XqkmNf6b56PAtEQKlXwCfQX0DbpcjXrXl9UkxAIASKkfoAd8AoKRm
2rlzasDKGgnw+GiE2Cy1HuC+
=iz6y
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

When freedom is outlawed.......Only outlaws will be free!

If cryptography is outlawed, pomz pvumbxt xjmm ibwf dszquphsbqiz.

Fun! Fast! Revealing! Try "The World's Smallest Political Quiz" at:
   http://www.self-gov.org/quiz.html

IS AIDS A GOVERNMENT/DRUG COMPANY HOAX?
   http://www.virusmyth.com/aids/index.htm

When you blame others, you give up your power to change.
Dr. Robert Anthony

Libertarian Party of Hillsborough County, FL
   http://home.tampabay.rr.com/lphc

When a place gets crowded enough to require ID's, social collapse is not far
away. It is time to go elsewhere. The best thing about space travel is that
it made it possible to go elsewhere.

Lazarus Long

From sunder at brainlink.com  Mon Sep 14 17:24:10 1998
From: sunder at brainlink.com (Sunder)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 08:24:10 +0800
Subject: Larry Gilbert, AOLers, and the Hyper-real flamer
In-Reply-To: <33ec7cbb.35fe5849@aol.com>
Message-ID: <35FE67CA.F1CCCB14@brainlink.com>

AIMSX at aol.com wrote:
> 
> Obviously you have a very high opinion of yourself and a low opinion of people
> who use AOL.  Contrary to popular belief, there are a few intelligent people
> on AOL, but it looks as if you are too egotistical to realize that.
> 
> Have you ever thought to look at your own mistakes before you publicize
> everyone else's to the world?  Are you just suffering from some sort of
> dillusion of grandeur - thinking you are better than everyone else.  Things
> like this are what many wars were started over, I am so happy the internet
> (hopefully) won't start a war in the real world.

Right.  Considering the scum that have drifted on here from AOL, I'd say
there's a distinct pattern.  As an EX-AOL user I can attest to the fact that
AOL is prime grade USRDA shit.  At the time I got nothing but busy signals and
crashes, when I logged back in, I was told I was already logged on and had to
call the customer unsupport people to get credit for my hours used by a ghost
connection.  Further, in the last few weeks I had my account, I received
hundreds of spams, the "You've Got Mail" soundbite caused me to twitch every
time I heard it.

Paying $20/month for shit service with a shit browser and shit connectivity
isn't my idea of a good ISP.  A few weeks after, I found a local ISP that gave
me a shell account for $10/month and I got no busy signals and no bullshit
software and no craploads of downloads of images ("artwork") or fifty ads
popping in my face upon connecting.

So yeah, maybe there are "smart" people on AOL, but they're clueless when it
comes to ISP since they're using the worst of the worst.

I don't speak for that "nobody" but I will speak for myself and will speak from
PERSONAL experience.  Aol is shit.  Anyone who is stupid enough to put up with
shit service is either masochistic or isn't aware they're getting shit service,
no matter how intelligent they may otherwise be.  besides, from the cluless
fuckwads that have indeed drifted here, I'd sooner hug the hotmail users, even
the single celled one who spews about Misty than see an AOL luser's email
address in a post!

If you're so smart, find a local ISP who will give you better service and costs
less.  Shit, if you insist on paying $20/month and $5 hour, tell you what,
switch to a cheaper ISP and send me the extra $5/hour you are now wasting, I
sure could use the money!

Just my $0.02 worth of flames.

-- 

=====================================Kaos=Keraunos=Kybernetos==============
.+.^.+.|       Sunder       |Prying open my 3rd eye.  So good to see |./|\.
..\|/..|sunder at sundernet.com|you once again. I thought you were      |/\|/\
<--*-->| ------------------ |hiding, and you thought that I had run  |\/|\/
../|\..| "A toast to Odin,  |away chasing the tail of dogma. I opened|.\|/.
.+.v.+.|God of screwdrivers"|my eye and there we were....            |.....
======================= http://www.sundernet.com ==========================

From jamesd at echeque.com  Mon Sep 14 17:42:13 1998
From: jamesd at echeque.com (James A. Donald)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 08:42:13 +0800
Subject: Clinton--Why I am Chortling
In-Reply-To: 
Message-ID: <199809151339.GAA02542@proxy4.ba.best.com>

    --
At 12:24 PM 9/14/98 -0400, Lynne L. Harrison wrote:
> I don't see a power imbalance here.  If a young woman in 
> her 20's invitingly flashes her thong panties at a man, I 
> don't see how she can be portrayed as the victim.  

According to the law applied to normal people, Monica was the
victim.  Also according to the law applied to normal people,
Clinton was required to spill his guts about all of his sex
life, because some women sued him, whereas the women suing
was completely protected against any questions concerning her
sex life.

These laws are flagrantly unjust, but the Democrats introduced
them and applied them.  Feminists supported and continue to
support Clinton precisely because he supported and supports
laws that he flagrantly broke.  If these laws are to be
repealed for politicians, they should be repealed for normal
people as well.

    --digsig
         James A. Donald
     6YeGpsZR+nOTh/cGwvITnSR3TdzclVpR0+pr3YYQdkG
     Bx5t8xgN8K1uoUuifbh23snXHu5I2qNBvzwQk6pb
     4qwHCwWse7ErTTfZyYyUUnpKfLU8yjt0ak2jmSKBA
-----------------------------------------------------
We have the right to defend ourselves and our property, because 
of the kind of animals that we are. True law derives from this 
right, not from the arbitrary power of the omnipotent state.

http://www.jim.com/jamesd/����� James A. Donald

From tubc50u4 at auto.sixdegrees.com  Mon Sep 14 17:57:40 1998
From: tubc50u4 at auto.sixdegrees.com (sixdegrees)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 08:57:40 +0800
Subject: Harald Fragner
Message-ID: <199809151350.GAA08886@toad.com>

Just a quick update from sixdegrees(tm). Unfortunately Harald 
Fragner (harald at fragner.net) asked not to be listed as your 
contact with sixdegrees.

We also wanted to make sure you were aware that you currently 
have no other confirmed contacts, so it will be hard for you to
have a productive sixdegrees experience. As you probably know, 
without any confirmed contacts, you won't get any results from our 
networking searches. 

So, we just wanted to recommend that you head over to 
http://www.sixdegrees.com , log-in, and go to MY CONTACTS 
to list additional relationships. 

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From rah at shipwright.com  Mon Sep 14 18:03:44 1998
From: rah at shipwright.com (Robert Hettinga)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 09:03:44 +0800
Subject: IP: VP GORE'S CHINA SCANDAL
Message-ID: 

--- begin forwarded text

Delivered-To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 05:33:46 -0400 (EDT)
To: ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
From: softwar at us.net (CharlesSmith)
Subject: IP: VP GORE'S CHINA SCANDAL
Sender: owner-ignition-point at majordomo.pobox.com
Precedence: list
Reply-To: softwar at us.net (CharlesSmith)

http://www.worldnetdaily.com

According to Chinese General Sun Tzu "All war is based on
deception."  Tzu wrote those words over 2,000 years ago and his
first rule of war still applies today.

For example, a hidden November 1994 letter written by DNC donor
Sanford Robertson to President Clinton that clearly details the
sale of Commerce trade trips for campaign donations.  Robertson
was so bold as to include a telling "P.S." where he notes for
Clinton that "Bob Rubin" turned out the "Silicon Valley" at a
Robertson sponsored fundraiser that took in "$100,000" for
California Senator Feinstein.  Of course, neither Robertson nor
current Treasury Secretary Rubin expected that letter to be
revealed.

In November 1995, Vice President Gore called Sanford Robertson
from the White House and asked for a $100,000 donation.  In
January 1996 Robertson obliged and kicked in $80,000 soft and
$20,000 in so-called "hard" donations to the Clinton/Gore
campaign.  The fact that Gore made the call from inside the
White House is the least of his legal problems.

In 1993 Clinton named Gore to head U.S. export policy for
encryption technology in a TOP SECRET order written by National
Security advisor Anthony Lake.  A 1996 secret memo on a secret
meeting of DCIA Deutch, FBI Director Freeh and Attorney General
Janet Reno states "The Vice President chairs the senior group
that set the Administration's encryption policy; since Februarcy
1994 it has been supported by a working group co-chaired by NSC,
and OMB, composed of NSA, CIA, FBI, State, Commerce (BXA, NIST),
and Justice."

In 1995 Sanford Robertson also had a big financial interest in
the U.S. computer security industry.  Robertson's investment
firm had hundreds of millions of dollars tied up in a
Massachusetts based computer company named Security Dynamics
Inc. (SDI).  Thus, in 1995 Gore had direct control of policy
that also affected Robertson financially.

Security Dynamics was able to import computer security hardware
manufactured in China.  SDI secured Hong Kong electronics maker
RJP Industries to produce electronic computer security cards for
sale in America.  The Chinese manufactured cards are sold to
major defense contractors, medical institutions and the U.S.
government.

Hong Kong millionaire Raymond Hung also owns RJP.  Hung
manufactured the security cards in two factories leased directly
from the China National Electronics Import/Export Company
(CNEIEC), a business owned by the People's Liberation Army.
Thus, the computer security cards imported and sold here in the
U.S. were built on a Chinese Army assembly line.

Hung also owned a U.S. based company called Quorum International
that went bankrupt in 1996.  The company left millions in bad
debt in Arizona and California.  Yet, Hung was able to donate
over a million dollars to the Special Olympics, donate a temple
to communist China, and have his photo taken with Arnold
Schwarzenegger all only days before declaring bankruptcy.

Hung is also reported to have set up dozens of shell "front
companies" offshore.  These companies allegedly sell cheap
Chinese products imported by Hung who declares bankruptcy,
citing Chinese taxes on the imports.  Hung, of course, splits
the "taxes" with the Chinese government, and returns to America
to purchase hard assets such as real estate.  Despite all this
Hung remains un-investigated by the Clinton administration.

Hung's close working relationship with China and the Clinton
administration raises another question...  Could there be a
"secret" back door embedded in imported hardware or software,
waiting like a TROJAN HORSE, brought safely inside the secure
walls by a paying customer?  Could a hidden SNIFFER be hunting
down passwords, code keys and sensitive data?

"Absolutely," stated Info-warfare expert Winn Schwartau.  "I
call it 'pro-active' defense - you'll find it referenced in my
original book (Information Warfare)."

"Chips are made of silicon," explained Schwartau.  "If you buy
hardware the only way to tell exactly how it works is with a
destructive test.  You tear the chip apart, layer by layer.
This is not only difficult but expensive.  Can it happen?  Just
look at the multitude of hardware and software products
maintained outside of the United States.  How many of them are
'proprietary' designs that have never been viewed inside the
U.S.?"

"It is possible," agreed Forrest Mimms, a leader in the U.S.
electronics engineering and well-known author.  Mimms is best
known to electronics hobbyists worldwide for his series of books
that populate Radio Shack.

"I would not be surprised to find a back door put in by the
Chinese government," stated Mimms.  "Go to Wal-Mart and you'll
find hundreds of commercial electronics products made by Chinese
government factories.  In fact, I would not be surprised to find
a back door put in by an independent [rouge or criminal]
operation."

"Yes.  It is always possible to slip a Trojan horse into
cryptography products, both hardware and software," stated Bruce
Schneier, President of Counterpane Systems and author of the
best selling book on computer security APPLIED CRYPTOGRAPHY.

"Unless the user takes the time to reverse-engineer the product
- - much easier to do in software than in hardware - - he is
essentially trusting that the manufacturer is behaving
honestly," stated Schneier.  "The NSA has been rumored to have
convinced several cryptography hardware companies world-wide to
install Trojan horses that effectively 'leak' secrets as the
hardware is used."

The Chinese Army, Sanford Robertson, Al Gore and Ron Brown
shared an interest in computer security technology.  California
based RSA Inc. is the only U.S. company that has ever been able
to secure any export deal on encryption with China.
Documentation held by the Commerce Department and taken by
former DNC fundraiser Ira Sockowitz shows that RSA was able to
obtain a trade deal with the Chinese government through a
Commerce sponsored trade conference to Beijing in October 1995.
In fact, both the Chairman of RSA, Jim Bidzos, and Ron Brown met
in October of 1995 with Madam Wu Yi, head of China's MOFTEC
(Ministry of Foreign Trade and Economic Cooperation).

Al Gore also had previous legal contact with RSA Inc. in 1994.
According RSA CEO James Bidzos, in March 1994 Gore sent
government lawyers to RSA in a failed effort to purchase patents
on encryption technology held by his company.  Curiously, the
envoy Gore selected to send was John Huang's boss, Commerce
Counsel Ginger Lew.  Even more curious is the fact that Lew
claimed to know nothing about encryption in her deposition for
Judicial Watch.

Her lack of computer security knowledge is puzzling because Lew
also possessed a 1994 document detailing penetrations of U.S.
government computers using "back-door" and "SNIFFER" programs
installed by unknown hackers.  The document was returned in
response to a Freedom of Information Request.  Ms. Lew currently
works at the Small Business Administration and has refused my
request for an interview.

In February 1996, only days after Robertson had kicked in his
$100,000 to the Clinton/Gore campaign, RSA announced the China
encryption export deal.  In April 1996, Robertson's Security
Dynamics Inc. bought RSA for $296 million above the stock value.
Robertson's investment firm was paid $2 million just to write
the merger document.  Thus, Robertson financially benefited from
the same company that Gore had previously engaged in secret
government negotiations.  Robertson gained $2 million for a
$100,000 investment in less than 90 days.

How deeply involved was Robertson with party officials?
Perhaps, the real question is which party?  Democrat or
Communist?  In an April 1994 letter Robertson reminded Brown of
scheduled money-raising events for the DNC and of his efforts
for DNC candidates.  "P.S." Robertson wrote to Brown.  "It has
been fund raising season out here for the Senate and we've had
events at our home for Feinstein, Lieberman, and Cooper.  I wish
you were still head of the DNC for the December elections, but
you are obviously doing a great job at Commerce."

In the same letter Robertson also noted his influence in the
Chinese communist party.  In April 1994 Robertson informed
Brown of his successful effort to hire the son of a major
Chinese Communist leader.  "We have recently hired Bo Feng the
son of Feng Zhijun the vice chairman of the China Democratic
League and a member of the Standing Committee of the National
People's Congress."

On August 18, 1998 this author filed suit in Federal Court
against the Clinton administration for illegally withholding
documents.  The documents in question were discovered at the
Commerce Department in response to a Freedom of Information
Request on Loral CEO Bernard Schwartz and DNC donor Sanford
Robertson.

At first, the Commerce Department refused to release the "22"
documents because they were being withheld by unspecified "other
agencies" for "consultation".  On May 18, 1998 the Commerce
Department released one of the 22 documents.  The single
document returned was the bio of W. Bowman Cutter, Deputy
Assistant to the President for Economic Policy, written by the
White House.

"Bo" Cutter, "Bob" Rubin, Al Gore and Ron Brown were all tasked
to encryption export policy in the 1993 Top Secret order from
Bill Clinton written by Tony Lake.  Bo, Bob, Al and Ron were
part of the encryption task force detailed in the 1996
CIA/FBI/DOJ meeting.  "Bo" Cutter's boss, now Treasury Secretary
"Bob" Rubin, raised the 1994 $100,000 from Sanford Robertson
while working inside the White House - just like Al Gore in
1995.  All of these fine gentlemen were also making secret
export policy... including Sanford Robertson.

In addition, according to the Commerce Department FOIA officer,
the remaining 21 documents were being withheld by the White
House.  However, the White House is NOT an agency.  My source on
this legal "Catch-22" is the White House legal counsel for Vice
President Al Gore.  In response to a 1997 FOIA request Vice
President Gore's Deputy Counsel Elizabeth Brown wrote "Please be
advised that FOIA applies to only records maintained by
'agencies' with in the Executive Branch.  The Office of the
President and the Vice President ... are not 'agencies' for the
purposes of this law.  Therefore, your request must be denied."

The Clinton administration caved instead of facing embarrassment
in court.  The remaining documents withheld by the White House
have been released.

Both Bernard Schwartz and Sanford Robertson were given the
detailed dossiers of the Chinese leadership from President Jiang
Zemin, and MOFTEC's Madam Wu Yi - down to the local communist
mayor of Shanghi.  The new documents include information on such
communist officials as Hu Qili - Minister of Electronics
Industry - a former radical Red Guard member of the Chinese
Youth movement.  According to the hidden documents, Qili argues
"that military electronics are a key technology necessary for
winning modern warfare."

According to Sun Tzu, all war is based on deception.  War,
according to Von Clausewitz, is also merely an extension of
politics.  The war of Clinton deception continues to this day.
The administration and its agencies are continuing to withhold
documents from this author, the House National Security
Committee, and the House Government Oversight Committee.  The
White House is engaged in a cover-up of illegal activities.
Evidence hidden in a deliberate and planned scheme to conceal
crimes by officials currently in power.

==============================================================
source documents * = new

- Robertson letters to Brown & Clinton

http://www.softwar.net/rscot.html  <--- text version
http://www.softwar.net/rsco.html   <--- jpeg version

- SECRET 1993 order on encryption by Anthony Lake

http://www.softwar.net/not4u2c.html

- Secret 1996 DCIA Deutch/FBI Freeh /AG Reno meeting

http://www.softwar.net/docciat.html  <--- text version
http://www.softwar.net/doccia.html   <--- jpeg version

- * Snips from the SEC - official RSA/SDI merger document
RJP, China, MFN treaty & $2,000,000 payment to Robertson
& Stephens for writing merger document.

http://www.softwar.net/sdi.html

- * Raymond Hung with Arnie, wife with $1,000,000 check, wife
with Shriver, temple donated to PRC and article ref.

http://www.softwar.net/quorum.html

- Interview of RSA CEO James Bidzos

http://www.softwar.net/bidzos.html

- * Documents held by Ginger Lew on back-doors and sniffers

http://www.softwar.net/lew.html

- * Documents on encryption written by Al Gore & 1997 FOIA
rejection by Gore's legal counsel

http://www.softwar.net/al2000.html

http://www.softwar.net/gore.html

http://www.softwar.net/vp.html

- * Ron at CHINA WORLD - Oct. 1995 JCCT meeting with Wu Yi

http://www.softwar.net/ron.html

- * White House Bio of "Bo" Cutter

http://www.softwar.net/boknows.html

- * snips from White House documents & SOFTWAR action, bios
of Jiang Zemin, Wu Yi, Hu Qili, and Huang Ju (mayor of Shanghi)

http://www.softwar.net/white.html

================================================================
1 if by land, 2 if by sea.  Paul Revere - encryption 1775
Charles R. Smith
SOFTWAR         http://www.softwar.net      softwar at softwar.net
Pcyphered SIGNATURE:
5A7061066259AAE7F805238B655FF97BB1EAE42FB1C6F167AFD9964D21E2BD4A
BABA05AC8A30EFA7B576D199F6F01DEA3460074026CD09F27A36919487341214
57401400416BC39E
================================================================
SOFTWAR EMAIL NEWSLETTER                            09/15/1998
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--- end forwarded text

-----------------
Robert A. Hettinga 
Philodox Financial Technology Evangelism 
44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA
"... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity,
[predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to
experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

From frissell at panix.com  Mon Sep 14 18:36:02 1998
From: frissell at panix.com (Duncan Frissell)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 09:36:02 +0800
Subject: Fwd: WHITE HOUSE MULLS NEW INTERNET TAX PROPOSAL  from edupage
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980915001432.008abb40@idiom.com>
Message-ID: <199809151435.KAA25939@mail1.panix.com>

At 12:14 AM 9/15/98 -0700, Bill Stewart wrote:

>Ira Magaziner, President Clinton's senior Internet advisor, has proposed a 
>new plan for tracking and taxing goods sold over the Internet that would use 
>electronic "resident cards" and private-sector escrow agents around the 
>world. Consumers would obtain digital cash at banks that would allow 
>merchants to identify which country the buyer is in, 

And I thought "Monica was having sex with Clinton but Clinton wasn't having
sex with Monica" was the best the joke  meisters at the White House could
come up with.

Does Ira say how the OECD countries were going to mandate a monopoly
payment system?  Seems to me the number of payment systems is rising
towards infinity rather than falling towards unity.

The Ottawa conference is going to be a laugh riot.

DCF

From brownrk1 at texaco.com  Mon Sep 14 18:43:40 1998
From: brownrk1 at texaco.com (Brown, R Ken)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 09:43:40 +0800
Subject: Predictions: Crime and Criminal Justice in the 21st Century
Message-ID: <896C7C3540C3D111AB9F00805FA78CE2013F8418@MSX11002>

> nnburk[SMTP:nnburk at cobain.HDC.NET] posted 10 predictions
about life in the USA  for the next 10 or 15 years.

They are, of course, nothing but descriptions of what's been going
on for the last  30-40 years. This isn't prediction, it's extrapolation!

As so often the people will always win when playing
"cheat the prophet". Whatever really  happens next year 
the chances are it won't be  exactly the same as what happened 
last year.

Ken 

From jya at pipeline.com  Mon Sep 14 18:55:31 1998
From: jya at pipeline.com (John Young)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 09:55:31 +0800
Subject: Request to DoD for InfoSec
Message-ID: <199809151446.KAA14702@camel7.mindspring.com>

To: kbacon at pagate.pa.osd.mil
From: jya at pipeline.com
Date: Tues 15 September 1998, 09:51 AM
Subject: Interview Request

Kenneth H. Bacon
Assistant Secretary of Defense for Public Affairs
OASD (PA)
1400 Defense Pentagon
Washington D.C. 20301-1400

Dear Mr. Bacon,

Three points of Secretary Cohen's informative talk[*] at the 
Council on Foreign Relations last evening would benefit
by amplification, and I ask your assistance in arranging an
interview with the Secretary to focus on the Department's
policy on information security technology.

1. The first concerns his view on the interdependency of military
and economic affairs for assurance of national security.

1.1 What does he see as the prospect for further declassification 
of restricted defense technology for use by industry for protection 
of information against economic espionage, as exemplified in the 
declassification of the Skipjack encryption algorithm. 

1.2 And what other services and/or technology the defense supply
and intelligence agencies may provide non-governmental customers 
in competition with other nations where closer cooperation between 
such agencies and industry is more common.

2. The second concerns the need for international cooperation
for US defense policy and how that is impacted by publicity and 
criticism of the Echelon electronic intercept program and other
national technical means not customarily discussed in public by 
the Department.

2.1 What are Secretary Cohen's views of programs such as Echelon 
political and international trust issues and what he is his view of European 
calls for investigation of Echelon.

2.2 What are Secretary Cohen's views as a constructive response to 
charges that Echelon and other national technical means are 
offensive military and economic espionage against those from 
whom the US desires defense cooperation.

3. In the Q&A on the topic of terrorism and encryption, Secretary 
Cohen remarked that the American people will have to decide how 
much privacy they are willing to give up in order to be protected from
terrorist threats.

3.1 What are the Secretary's views on how disputes on encryption
policy could be resolved in light of his calls for closer connection
between military and economic interests and for international 
cooperation for defense policy.

Your office has always been exemplary in responding to requests
for information. Thank you very much.

Sincerely,

John Young
JYA/Urban Deadline
251 West 89th Street, Suite 6E
New York, NY 10024

E-mail: jya at pipeline.com
Tel: 212-873-8700
Fax: 212-799-4003

* See: http://jya.com/dod091498.htm

From nobody at replay.com  Mon Sep 14 18:59:32 1998
From: nobody at replay.com (Anonymous)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 09:59:32 +0800
Subject: The DES Analytic Crack Project
Message-ID: <199809151500.RAA31305@replay.com>

Eric Michael Cordian, emc at wire.insync.net, writes:

> The concerns are generally that
> we will experience an unexpected "combinatoric explosion" in the
> higher round problems

Unexpected by you, perhaps, but expected by everyone else.  The complexity
of the expressions should increase exponentially with the number of
rounds.  Extrapolating from two and four round results to eight and
sixteen is the wrong model.  (You can artificially suppress this by
introducing new variables for each round, but that doesn't change the
underlying complexity of the problem.)

Can't you come up with a back-of-the-envelope estimate for the number of
terms in your sixteen round expression?  Even without fully optimized
S-box expressions this information would be useful.  If it is greater than
the number of atoms on Earth then it would be a strong hint that this
approach won't work.

If you really want to attract money you need some kind of numbers to show
that the approach has a prayer of working.  Show the size of the problem
you will get, estimate how much improvement you'll get with your improved
S-box representations, compare it with the problems tackled by available
combinatorial algorithms.  You should be able to do this with a few hours
of work, at least to show that the basic concept is sound (or unsound).

From emc at wire.insync.net  Mon Sep 14 19:21:46 1998
From: emc at wire.insync.net (Eric Cordian)
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:21:46 +0800
Subject: The DES Analytic Crack Project
Message-ID: <199809151523.KAA13785@wire.insync.net>

As some of you may have noticed, a new attempt to crack the Data
Encryption Standard has been started, with a descriptive FAQ located
at the following URL

        http://www.cyberspace.org/~enoch/crakfaq.html