Is America more or less free after fifty years, or is it the same? Have we learned from the Pike Committee? How can the ACLU and the EFF be so ineffective? Those two combined received fifty million dollars per year. The ACLU Foundation possesses a third of a billion dollars in assets. Yes. Snowden started a debate. And you lost. Each and every one of you.
On 04/02/2017 09:52 AM, Ryan Carboni wrote:
Is America more or less free after fifty years, or is it the same?
Have we learned from the Pike Committee?
How can the ACLU and the EFF be so ineffective? Those two combined received fifty million dollars per year. The ACLU Foundation possesses a third of a billion dollars in assets.
Because they're lobbying organizations primarily and not activist orgs. For instance, the ACLU comes into cases late after the NLG or CCR has done the hard work, files some briefs, and takes the highly media-publicized glory to use for more fundraising to lobby and hobnob with the people who ARE the problem.
Yes. Snowden started a debate.
And you lost.
Each and every one of you.
I had that 'debate' in 1970 when the NYPD's Red Squad, the "Bureau of Special Services", Capt Finnegan the "Silver Fox" and his thugs did some "File Cabinet Work" and got my name of a police blotter after a guerrilla Theater protest/disruption at a Ted Kennedy/Abe Ribicoff speaking event at NYU's Queens Campus. They used the info to attempt to dissuade me from my goals by threatening my father's, still an active duty US Army Colonel at the time, security clearance at NASA Huntsville (Mil NASA) I also had figured out long ago they can do it to anyone they want anytime they want now, and the accuracy! The Feds didn't note in their file cabinet work that I hadn't even seen my dad for 10 years and he had no influence over my actions. Now they'd know that. They'd also know what kind of coffee I like by the Starbucks card metadataz, where I hang out via my smartphone's GPS, etc. Rr Ps. You win by not giving a fuck if they know what you're doing or not. Revolutionaries are dead men on Furlough.
On 4/2/17, Razer <g2s@riseup.net> wrote:
On 04/02/2017 09:52 AM, Ryan Carboni wrote:
Is America more or less free after fifty years, or is it the same?
Have we learned from the Pike Committee?
How can the ACLU and the EFF be so ineffective? Those two combined received fifty million dollars per year. The ACLU Foundation possesses a third of a billion dollars in assets.
They, like the US GOV have been ineffective because of inadequate participation, lack of sufficient purpose/vision, and the general distraction caused by mass media, drugs, and basic demands to make ends meet.
Yes. Snowden started a debate.
Snoden didn't start the debate. People were suspicious of the gov't long before. The issue is the same one as given above.
Ps. You win by not giving a fuck if they know what you're doing or not. Revolutionaries are dead men on Furlough.
Or their regular people who have the moxy AND the righteousness, so they don't have to fear the incompetence of those with power. Perhaps you had to at the time (as I once did), but when it gets to the foundations of the law, they'll shake just as you -- they simply rely on you not knowing it. \0xd
On Sun, Apr 02, 2017 at 08:18:27PM -0400, \0xDynamite wrote:
They, like the US GOV have been ineffective
your are incredibly fucking idiot and the very cause of all our problemes.
Tell me how you really feel.
Now that's a cheeky response :D Let's hope you see the objection here - there is a fundamental assumption many have, that most/ all in the government have good intention and simply "fail, for one unfortunate reason or another, to be effective in their truly good and tending to utopian intentions." The evidence against this fundamental assumption is getting just slightly obvious to a few observers see? Carry on then :)
your are incredibly fucking idiot and the very cause of all our problemes.
Tell me how you really feel.
Now that's a cheeky response :D
Let's hope you see the objection here - there is a fundamental assumption many have, that most/ all in the government have good intention and simply "fail, for one unfortunate reason or another, to be effective in their truly good and tending to utopian intentions."
That is a good point. However, the problems of America, in my analysis cannot be explained by conspiracy of "bad humans". Greed and stupidity are not enough to explain the completely inhuman behavior of the State. The disconnect of the People is very large--akin to a farmer and a herd of cows. So the question, then, who is the farmer? And why to the cows never rebel? \0xd
On Sun, 2 Apr 2017 20:43:24 -0400 "\\0xDynamite" <dreamingforward@gmail.com> wrote:
your are incredibly fucking idiot and the very cause of all our problemes.
Tell me how you really feel.
Now that's a cheeky response :D
Let's hope you see the objection here - there is a fundamental assumption many have, that most/ all in the government have good intention and simply "fail, for one unfortunate reason or another, to be effective in their truly good and tending to utopian intentions."
That is a good point. However, the problems of America, in my analysis cannot be explained by conspiracy of "bad humans". Greed and stupidity are not enough to explain the completely inhuman behavior of the State.
Not stupidity, just greed. And yes, that's enough to explain the nature of the state.
The disconnect of the People is very large--akin to a farmer and a herd of cows.
So the question, then, who is the farmer? And why to the cows never rebel?
because of many reasons, including the belief in 'representative' government, which you are trying to sell
\0xd
On Sun, Apr 2, 2017 at 12:52 PM, Ryan Carboni <ryacko@gmail.com> wrote:
Is America more or less free after fifty years, or is it the same?
Abject loss? Maybe not yet. Total surveillance and datamining preliminary to such, and even lots of little encroaching moves therein? Absolutely. The news headlines and political rhetoric on anything that matters on that over the last 10-20 years, what's the ratio there 10:1 bad? Ever seen any laws or regulations removed from the books? Any less official secrecy? Government cameras now recording forever on every street corner. Tools for The Fuckening are in place. When and will and who will throw the switch?
Have we learned from the Pike Committee?
In generational memory terms, that was 65+ years ago, if you're not that old you wouldn't remember, and if you are, you're too old to care. The elite powers don't care what was learned, only that you've forgotten it. Time was ripe for another meme for them to pipe out and Bin Laden was their godsend and [engineered] partner, on top of systems from Google, Facebook, Microsoft, Yahoo, credit, marketing, and every single other data miner / aggregator / seller, all of which they refused to even bring up any controls over, or announce. Sheeple never even had or stood a chance, now you don't either. See External Links https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pike_Committee Note "select" committees mean "constructed by, secret, and friendly to... government".
How can the ACLU and the EFF be so ineffective?
Like Washington DC, and news media... old dead fatcat Boards of Directors and Executives.
Those two combined received fifty million dollars per year. The ACLU Foundation possesses a third of a billion dollars in assets.
$50M/yr would pay for 2500 full time activists actually out on the streets reaching educating people who "vote" and bribe and petition sign and talk to politicians, instead of websites they click past and court cases that are hardly. That's at *least* 10+ full time activists per major city in the USA, complete with ops support, think about that. Privacy / freedom / crypto / etc needs to become a street activism just like gay / marijuana / guns / abortion are. And they need to start reaching out to all these groups to be seen as an indispensible partner offering needed privicy / freedom / crypto tools for their own campaigns and peoples. There is a lot of potential here.
Yes. Snowden started a debate. And you lost. Each and every one of you.
True, first mover advantage was totally and completely squandered and lost. Final proof evident that news media are in it for themselves, not active partners. Now you have to do it the hard old fashioned way... On the streets.
On Sun, 2 Apr 2017 14:01:20 -0400 grarpamp <grarpamp@gmail.com> wrote:
Yes. Snowden started a debate. And you lost. Each and every one of you.
True, first mover advantage was totally and completely squandered and lost.
Well, greenwald and accomplices got 250 millions. That may be bad for freedom but it's not bad for them! There's always a silver lining.
Final proof evident that news media are in it for themselves, not active partners. Now you have to do it the hard old fashioned way... On the streets.
On Sun, 2 Apr 2017 09:52:41 -0700 Ryan Carboni <ryacko@gmail.com> wrote:
Is America more or less free after fifty years, or is it the same?
Have we learned from the Pike Committee?
How can the ACLU and the EFF be so ineffective?
the EFF, a pentagon's spinoff is very effective. There's a term for that I can't recall... Ah, yes. Controlled opposition. Just like controlled demolition.
Those two combined received fifty million dollars per year.
What, you want those poor little lawyers to starve? How cruel.
The ACLU Foundation possesses a third of a billion dollars in assets.
Yes. Snowden started a debate.
And you lost.
Yep.
Each and every one of you.
On Sun, Apr 2, 2017 at 4:17 PM, juan <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:
What, you want those poor little lawyers to starve? How cruel.
Not when all current sides... prosecution, defense, and civil, serve at the discretion and pleasure of the single state. How to enter any argument or process to which the state does not approve of? And where are the great variety of independant fora and solicitors and judgeors and juris to which all parties accept proceedings under? Is the world yet still so Antique?
Well, greenwald and accomplices got 250 millions. That may be bad for freedom but it's not bad for them! There's always a silver lining.
Free Market [upon fools] at its best. Place your own entries upon the market, do better.
participants (6)
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\0xDynamite -
grarpamp -
juan -
Razer -
Ryan Carboni -
Zenaan Harkness