-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 10/05/2015 05:43 AM, Zenaan Harkness wrote: Good ideas in this thread so far. What I would add is, get the F away from population centers; they are very hungry machines that will start to fail in very bad ways whenever any of their major inputs are substantially reduced for more than a few weeks - even without panic and martial law factored in. On moving way out of town: Sooner is better, because as the industrial economy crumbles everyone will get the same bright idea and that land ain't empty. It's occupied by communities where it takes time to learn the human landscape and build trust relationships. On arrival start working to establish oneself in an economic role that will continue to pay off in the form of mutual aid and bartering of labor and commodities, as the value of Federal Reserve Notes spirals down. As for cash money, I like silver way more than gold: People will kill you much sooner for gold than silver, and the value of silver has been steadily rising due to industrial applications drawing down the world supply faster than mining is able to replace it. Another thing to think about is identifying technology that will stay relevant to the practical concerns of feeding and housing people in your local economy when international supply chains go sideways for months or years at a time. Learn what is and isn't important by getting involved in the actual work, and get on top of how to run and fix that stuff, /then/ stockpile spare parts and replacements. In short, start building the world of 2100 today. It's going to be built one way or another; early adopters will have more problems to solve and go down more blind alleys, but that's the price of coming out on top in the long run. :o) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJWElyHAAoJEDZ0Gg87KR0Lz3gP/3YxdQenXosirOr4KrKcSxO4 0bYORTFEYm3Hbv9Gj85GYH9wSOgmVT9HRLCKACemvl1HltkCvSW3gCYOb88/rd9A ibRkkuK36NYbqNJP+Ak+5RRpu9Sk699POvL8NQSf5QWoXHqjechiNsCd9bVLSzXA ujk1SCdD6WObj9YE4xsn0NrU+sg8iMAql0WwNlymy0+plHAVmYVluPQhx3Nwh8GA LPqYKR0pULdEgKKoEB9aFOp2zEa5rCw+N90MroMkKn4oeg9AAbJjxBcPgmcQKLVx kpD2xhB0bsfsemqYxzUJjoPhenMVQmelLVPqi41nYO4blfTBAnOrktAJSHTkGc57 zToOk5pJEk+eklHW7LXZ5FeIrm7HddwoOt7evzFD76aVXaJuna01ZZVsEKK1H1cT IrFLbLN/0AQeSI4IUX4JcZbx+fAscsClYBhK3+PSPyFpPKQ8jzixo+8DOG/0YBu8 N26L4w4HWsRkO9UcmuG/sSUDJiAW6+bQAgxU7BMdY/CYjTxJtnRjvxFIc6TARCyD bvU8Wmyi3+wFXkrnOwIWf2XRVKIGbL1gj17xJdkk2s5okB+I1LzbiwGPO4c74J/H Y/7qf7UoTp0v0RXeu/VXMHXdK9J3BmaTRb4AXhgrKRbji5QXmxPytXnvZS/XufUs vroIaAxcr6UT9S/0J6fc =PmoB -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 Hmm, well, since we are on this subject... http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sn3lqs Steve Kinney:

On 10/05/2015 05:43 AM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:

Good ideas in this thread so far. What I would add is, get the F away from population centers; they are very hungry machines that will start to fail in very bad ways whenever any of their major inputs are substantially reduced for more than a few weeks - even without panic and martial law factored in.

On moving way out of town: Sooner is better, because as the industrial economy crumbles everyone will get the same bright idea and that land ain't empty. It's occupied by communities where it takes time to learn the human landscape and build trust relationships. On arrival start working to establish oneself in an economic role that will continue to pay off in the form of mutual aid and bartering of labor and commodities, as the value of Federal Reserve Notes spirals down.

As for cash money, I like silver way more than gold: People will kill you much sooner for gold than silver, and the value of silver has been steadily rising due to industrial applications drawing down the world supply faster than mining is able to replace it.

Another thing to think about is identifying technology that will stay relevant to the practical concerns of feeding and housing people in your local economy when international supply chains go sideways for months or years at a time. Learn what is and isn't important by getting involved in the actual work, and get on top of how to run and fix that stuff, /then/ stockpile spare parts and replacements.

In short, start building the world of 2100 today. It's going to be built one way or another; early adopters will have more problems to solve and go down more blind alleys, but that's the price of coming out on top in the long run.

:o)

- -- http://abis.io ~ "a protocol concept to enable decentralization and expansion of a giving economy, and a new social good" https://keybase.io/odinn -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJWEytpAAoJEGxwq/inSG8CMpgIAJp2YgKdWkpCxIlGR/n2mBVj Pw8h6T7xI/zPWSrBEFBqi82uTftLz8zhEPmCMad0h9Ta7H+qnm/bjssSGFG2ONqJ x0oILUZ7HZ/G0AtpCd6SFAWYTJKvETlc/AUXvOjdw8qUWw7xPSz0doTxDnwZTT48 5vN28iJ5CWGnKEiHrgRrNO+H8Uara7697xxqL28jCLdp905Y2JVtbU/FYXSdQb2C 8QnX2T2fjYdHEiYxEe7bWIigw5zgzmge67U4pNApWOU5YxUZmDuVj1dJbMusGLA4 lne+c8ldMkZtwhXSWttqxWI0yatQps05lnt5keVo8ksKoRFb8htADQB3FhE5aPU= =XOgi -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

On 10/6/15, Georgi Guninski wrote:

On Tue, Oct 06, 2015 at 02:01:13AM +0000, odinn wrote:

...

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512

Hmm, well, since we are on this subject...

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sn3lqs

Interesting reading.

Are there marketing indications something is coming soon? Currency options, gold, silver?

Switzerland central bank's rate is _negative_ AFAICT.

I sure wish *I* could borrow $100million and have them pay me interest for the privilege of having lent me money. Who -gets- these rates? Just other banks I presume...

On Tue, Oct 06, 2015 at 09:26:53AM +0300, Georgi Guninski wrote:

Are there marketing indications something is coming soon? Currency options, gold, silver?

http://www.wsj.com/articles/once-the-biggest-buyer-china-starts-dumping-u-s-... ==== Oct. 7, 2015 1:34 a.m. ET Central banks around the world are selling U.S. government bonds at the fastest pace on record, the most dramatic shift in the $12.8 trillion Treasury market since the financial crisis. Sales by China, Russia, Brazil and Taiwan are the latest sign of an emerging-markets slowdown that is threatening to spill over into the U.S. economy. Previously, all four were large purchasers of U.S. debt. ==== AFAICT these 12.8T are just the top of the debt iceberg.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 The last update on the IMF's website regarding the currency amounts in the SDRs (changes in the relative weights of four currencies in the Special Drawing Rights (SDR) basket) was on December 30, 2010. Source: https://www.imf.org/external/np/tre/sdr/sdrbasket.htm It would seem it is time for an update, though as of Oct. 13, 2015 nothing remarkable seems to have been posted to their site. I would continue to check non-standard sources for information developing relating to SDRs (additions or changes in relative weights). Example: https://www.sovereignman.com/trends/three-obvious-signs-the-entire-syste m-is-changing-17525/ Also note as stated in my twitlonger post http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sn3lqs "The basket composition is reviewed every five years by the Executive Board, or earlier if the IMF finds changed circumstances warrant an earlier review, to ensure that it reflects the relative importance of currencies in the world’s trading and financial systems. In the most recent review (in November 2010), the weights of the currencies in the SDR basket were revised based on the value of the exports of goods and services, and the amount of reserves denominated in the respective currencies that were held by other members of the IMF. These changes became effective on January 1, 2011. In October 2011, the IMF Executive Board discussed possible options for broadening the SDR currency basket. Most directors held the view that the current criteria for SDR basket selection remained appropriate. The next review is currently scheduled to take place by the end of 2015." In other words, if something hasn't happened yet to the SDRs and/or the relative weight of currencies, it is likely to soon (even though there are currently no further published meetings of the World Bank Group and the International Monetary Fund before the end of this year as shown at https://www.imf.org/external/am/index.htm ) Georgi Guninski:

On Tue, Oct 06, 2015 at 02:01:13AM +0000, odinn wrote:

...

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Hmm, well, since we are on this subject...

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sn3lqs

This mentions IMF meeting October 9-11.

Did something of importance happen on this meeting?

Quickly browsing news didn't suggest so.

On IMF's page the last SDR rate is from October 9.

- -- http://abis.io ~ "a protocol concept to enable decentralization and expansion of a giving economy, and a new social good" https://keybase.io/odinn -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJWHXmHAAoJEGxwq/inSG8CEdQH/3oy3m7n6whXimyraX6eD8Lb Nrcow7z+WCf5OuzyaCgK3WJ8Pfu1ZZLbu/tImkZ0BmwEOFyXh1w5bgWm7uVayyEv WwRiMaT9mv3gLSjVU3nEArEWiIca0wiZZBl7izzgK5eTFLxBhDMuO3BlWwVvQiL8 gTnMmyq8lfzV6LvZ+i/HZ8F1WVPjODVQmPWuqcecNW8yHBg750cLkXQ+XtWCw6vM 6KVuIClze1bf3xgVgQzeIaL/6/IKgUUme3/qcONEItoplmbQTHlemPY0q15FaU/s B1DxtQZyF9OJH12k5h46gb7O1UiF8mcKbsnvs/4M4p6Hk9Xb4atDIWZzHXNWBjw= =KztH -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

On 10/05/2015 03:51 AM, Georgi Guninski wrote:

...

The financial situation in the usa is quite grave.

Assume very severe financial crisis hits the usa relatively soon causing hyperinflation there and possibly in other countries.

I am interested: How to minimize one's damage in this situation?

Some suspicions: Banks/exchanges are known Ponzi schemes, so how much the banking system will remain intact is unclear to me.

Some possibilities real estate outside usa gold (is gold certificate secure enough?) bitcoins (some people got burnt, security of bitcoins not clear to me) ???

Please post political rants in other thread.

On 10/11/15, Douglas Lucas wrote:

Reviving this thread. Where's the altruism in "how to minimize one's damage"? Why's the model here for resisting economic oppression a survivalist hiding in an encrypted bunker, rather than the people of Burkina Faso using sticks and rocks (not cryptography) to force oligarchs out of their country? In Mexico they were recently burning polling stations, but we were discussing hoarding Bitcoin to ensure our self-interest? Where's the idealism in such selfishness?

Basically I agree, please feel free to make suggestions :)

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On 10/12/2015 12:43 AM, Cari Machet wrote:

Belief is cowardice

I dont believe in belief

Suggestion: go outside of what you have been told is the capacity of your identity by the parasitic state and ask questions of how many ways you can create shift every second of your life in a direct action and place ... just asking the questions changes conciousness levels

To remain in willful disconnect from questioning self is the state apparatus inside each

This reinforces my own advice, to build trust relationships and a base of relevant skills and experience in the real world. Altruism, mentioned earlier, is hard wired into that; otherwise, you don't get the trust relationships or the assistance necessary to get relevant skills and experience. Natural selection has given humans a strong predisposition for sharing and mutual aid; it takes generations to beat it out of a population, and even then it just keeps popping right back up. Everyone's a politician on the make; the more honest ones call themselves anarchists. :o) -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iQIcBAEBAgAGBQJWHnRvAAoJEDZ0Gg87KR0LBmIQALG++SIaE2LfPOEy3aRabLjE D38jLMl/lKiStqkvcKQOPaghUoLVTlCgP8q17ByfOkWlBp3yzGvD/ALtitEm2MJi jIkDcKQxYud3VJ9s5XJoNgFcfz4aSy50DWjtv5RuVLDME/gArtW5N4ITAQup6ZXd qpL8yu3jU0cAyNSCgst/RR5MpUoY56rb3OsH9v4PWm8nLd/UxVWGqvZrJWoL2dpA jWrq524v1xKq2PUYLz39E3oUmH4cirL67FU0QDBI/NYsEDlmbg7eGv5xXzP/RKWk kMsZ5awjAm4xh+t4qE5PAFuTMvzCqSLc1g5FrKNy7Xw5V+6xKE8XmcAPvxnnlW3y 5H8RWPtmrr38O3iBgOwQlYwuzuXUyxXN/Ii0FwCWua7wTKzjzqqv6Gcj3w3oZZQE aVuXYLM2t8FXhLlD8Mdv+cMn1g9omZisZ7434I3siSdVhz9t5QE/WsnUK2cG5P9n ToqqJCYmtNH4EoKgxOUfT8GbW1GirHl5HIFLoGvjpFwvX6XTskzYp5CxXrfCShS7 yx0kryB9VcViCoGhOJRnaRd2wqytGx6vG4t5soo8cAmlQnSDP1utfInZLKEN94X8 RYgy8vOt3RQYd1Q3hXwN72eOWMvKS9EjSwALUZ89a23kgP5BCoTVVnn+DgBnsxmP n2UMS7v/JDlWRsX/1F3K =zu32 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

On 10/11/2015 08:02 PM, Zenaan Harkness wrote:

On 10/11/15, Douglas Lucas wrote:

...

Reviving this thread. Where's the altruism in "how to minimize one's damage"? Why's the model here for resisting economic oppression a survivalist hiding in an encrypted bunker, rather than the people of Burkina Faso using sticks and rocks (not cryptography) to force oligarchs out of their country? In Mexico they were recently burning polling stations, but we were discussing hoarding Bitcoin to ensure our self-interest? Where's the idealism in such selfishness?

Basically I agree, please feel free to make suggestions :)

There are specific ops I could promote (#OpDeathEaters, for example), but I think maybe this question should be answered in a more general way. And I think what we should often do is, help the victims of whichever injustice attain the goals they're trying to reach. In other words, let the victims choose and lead toward the objectives. So, to take a current example, Doctors Without Borders, having had their Kunduz hospital just bombed, wants an IHFFC investigation. How can we help with that? And so on for other injustices. A caveat being that most people, in the US anyway, can't think outside the box of capitalism, but trying to reform capitalism isn't the answer.