Senior US District Judge Leon Jordan rules against FBI in PlayPen case
| Senior U.S. District Judge Leon Jordan ruled that the Federal | Bureau of Investigation violated both the US Constitution and | federal rules of criminal procedure when they hacked nearly | 1,300 users who accessed the PlayPen child porn site. https://www.deepdotweb.com/2016/10/26/knoxville-federal-judge-rules-fbi-play...
On Tue, 2016-10-25 at 21:18 -0600, Mirimir wrote:
| Senior U.S. District Judge Leon Jordan ruled that the Federal | Bureau of Investigation violated both the US Constitution and | federal rules of criminal procedure when they hacked nearly | 1,300 users who accessed the PlayPen child porn site.
https://www.deepdotweb.com/2016/10/26/knoxville-federal-judge-rules-fbi-play...
Hooray for small victories. I really don't like child porn, but those who enforce the law should be required to obey the law. -- Shawn K. Quinn <skquinn@rushpost.com>
On 10/25/2016 09:30 PM, Shawn K. Quinn wrote:
On Tue, 2016-10-25 at 21:18 -0600, Mirimir wrote:
| Senior U.S. District Judge Leon Jordan ruled that the Federal | Bureau of Investigation violated both the US Constitution and | federal rules of criminal procedure when they hacked nearly | 1,300 users who accessed the PlayPen child porn site.
https://www.deepdotweb.com/2016/10/26/knoxville-federal-judge-rules-fbi-play...
Hooray for small victories. I really don't like child porn, but those who enforce the law should be required to obey the law.
Well, he didn't go _that_ far. After all, the FBI was serving child porn to users. And they're allowed to do that, sell drugs, plot to have people killed, etc, etc. As long as they don't entrap ;) Funny. And in this case, the judge _did_ allow the evidence to be used ;) Even though it had been illegally collected. Because he considered that the FBI had made an "honest mistake". Still, he did rule that a state judge can't issue a warrant that's valid in other states. But maybe just a turf issue.
On Tue, 25 Oct 2016 21:18:07 -0600 Mirimir <mirimir@riseup.net> wrote:
| Senior U.S. District Judge Leon Jordan ruled that the Federal | Bureau of Investigation violated both the US Constitution and | federal rules of criminal procedure when they hacked nearly | 1,300 users who accessed the PlayPen child porn site.
https://www.deepdotweb.com/2016/10/26/knoxville-federal-judge-rules-fbi-play...
"Jordan allows the government to use the evidence gathered by the FBI" Plus, if the fbi has any sort of 'problems' they simply have to go to a different court of 'justice' which will finally 'agree' with them.
On 10/25/2016 09:46 PM, juan wrote:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2016 21:18:07 -0600 Mirimir <mirimir@riseup.net> wrote:
| Senior U.S. District Judge Leon Jordan ruled that the Federal | Bureau of Investigation violated both the US Constitution and | federal rules of criminal procedure when they hacked nearly | 1,300 users who accessed the PlayPen child porn site.
https://www.deepdotweb.com/2016/10/26/knoxville-federal-judge-rules-fbi-play...
"Jordan allows the government to use the evidence gathered by the FBI"
Plus, if the fbi has any sort of 'problems' they simply have to go to a different court of 'justice' which will finally 'agree' with them.
Yes, it's a narrow victory. But still, the FBI couldn't just shop for an agreeable judge. If they want a national investigation, his ruling means that they'd need a warrant from a federal judge. Which, I'm guessing, is harder to get. On the other hand, we know that the NSA does whatever it wants. And parallel construction. So truly a narrow victory. Arguably illusory.
On Tue, 25 Oct 2016 21:56:38 -0600 Mirimir <mirimir@riseup.net> wrote:
On 10/25/2016 09:46 PM, juan wrote:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2016 21:18:07 -0600 Mirimir <mirimir@riseup.net> wrote:
| Senior U.S. District Judge Leon Jordan ruled that the Federal | Bureau of Investigation violated both the US Constitution and | federal rules of criminal procedure when they hacked nearly | 1,300 users who accessed the PlayPen child porn site.
https://www.deepdotweb.com/2016/10/26/knoxville-federal-judge-rules-fbi-play...
"Jordan allows the government to use the evidence gathered by the FBI"
Plus, if the fbi has any sort of 'problems' they simply have to go to a different court of 'justice' which will finally 'agree' with them.
Yes, it's a narrow victory. But still, the FBI couldn't just shop for an agreeable judge. If they want a national investigation, his ruling means that they'd need a warrant from a federal judge. Which, I'm guessing, is harder to get.
I admitedly don't know the bureaucratic details. Yes, jurisdiction shopping isn't ther right term, my bad. But ultimately the case might end up in the so called supreme court? Anyway, has the government come up with any story as to how they found the server? Is it the usual tale : we can't find hidden services because tor is so great, so we easily hacked the server since the admins are retarded and were running php 1.3?
On the other hand, we know that the NSA does whatever it wants. And parallel construction. So truly a narrow victory. Arguably illusory.
On 10/25/2016 10:24 PM, juan wrote:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2016 21:56:38 -0600 Mirimir <mirimir@riseup.net> wrote:
On 10/25/2016 09:46 PM, juan wrote:
On Tue, 25 Oct 2016 21:18:07 -0600 Mirimir <mirimir@riseup.net> wrote:
| Senior U.S. District Judge Leon Jordan ruled that the Federal | Bureau of Investigation violated both the US Constitution and | federal rules of criminal procedure when they hacked nearly | 1,300 users who accessed the PlayPen child porn site.
https://www.deepdotweb.com/2016/10/26/knoxville-federal-judge-rules-fbi-play...
"Jordan allows the government to use the evidence gathered by the FBI"
Plus, if the fbi has any sort of 'problems' they simply have to go to a different court of 'justice' which will finally 'agree' with them.
Yes, it's a narrow victory. But still, the FBI couldn't just shop for an agreeable judge. If they want a national investigation, his ruling means that they'd need a warrant from a federal judge. Which, I'm guessing, is harder to get.
I admitedly don't know the bureaucratic details. Yes, jurisdiction shopping isn't ther right term, my bad. But ultimately the case might end up in the so called supreme court?
Possibly. There are over 1000 of cases from this investigation, and so there will probably be conflicting rulings in various courts. And so eventually it could go the Supremes. And they might even take it on.
Anyway, has the government come up with any story as to how they found the server? Is it the usual tale : we can't find hidden services because tor is so great, so we easily hacked the server since the admins are retarded and were running php 1.3?
I haven't seen anything definitive. I gather that they pwned Playpen in early 2015. The CMU attacks occurred in early-mid 2014. So they might have identified the Playpen server from CMU data. Or they might have found clues in the TorMail stuff from Freedom Hosting.
On the other hand, we know that the NSA does whatever it wants. And parallel construction. So truly a narrow victory. Arguably illusory.
participants (3)
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Mirimir -
Shawn K. Quinn