Correct. Any method for killing humans is fatally! flawed unless it includes simultaneous killing the author, supporters and/or applicator of the method. Untold millions have been slaughtered by those who expect to avoid what they preach others to do. Truly courageous killers kill themselves and nobody else to satisfy their lust to be god. Still, the killing industry and homicidal faiths persist by promising the killers they will be honored by their cowardly manipulators. At 01:38 PM 11/16/2019, you wrote:

‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ On Saturday, November 16, 2019 6:16 PM, jim bell wrote: ...

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Not clear who says this, but let's remember that "murder" is simply a killing that the government declares is illegal. If the attackers at Waco (the Feds) had fired first, which we know happened, the Branch Davidians who shot back in self-defense...would have been labelled as guilty of murder! Merely for self-defense.

a false dichotomy; it would be better if no one was killed at all!