Its just silly to say Hackers alone created the basis for AP I'm not interested in defending something that is obviously just a way to throw dirt on a community mostly unrelated to it..."  - Karl Jim didn't object violently when I called APster ' the social hack of the century ' .   So I'm not throwing dirt on any hackerspace community.  I thought it was obvious - I was throwing dirt on a traitor to the hacker cause. Mitnick was wild - until he went to work for Quantico. And many great discoveries are co-discoveries - even if Hanson's work was top-secret.