On Mon, Jan 06, 2020 at 06:56:42PM +0100, Tom Busby wrote:
> can i confirm that this is the Venona archive merged with the 2000-2016
> archive from this post:
>
> https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2018-July/042515.html
Yes, exactly. There are some notes about sources, linked in via the listinfo page.
> i.e. that we don't have a new, overlapping archive of the 90s period? I'm
> assuming venona is still the only game in town for the 90s period.
Correct. The venona .zip contents I used are dated 2003. Cryptome has a copy dated 2010 that is only different by a few bytes.
We have not heard of other archives covering 1992-1998. All the other online archives seem to trace back to the same source.
Something that is unfortunate about this is that, at the time, there were a bunch of different remailers (the number varied over time, but seems to have typically been around a half-dozen). Each CDR's archive would have been different: different spam, different headers and slight variations in time stamps.
It seems that none of the other CDR archives are available, at least publicly. Only the venona one. This is part of why Jim has been reaching out to some of those CDR operators, and also long-time list subscribers. Any other archive would be expected to have material differences, at least with headers & spam.
BTW, I joined the list in 2001, at the tail of the period above (and was on a couple of different CDRs over time). In the quest for archives from the 1990s I am an interested party, but not a source of any original materials.
- Greg
> On Mon, 6 Jan 2020 at 18:54, Tom Busby <tom@busby.ninja> wrote:
>
> > oh fantastic, thank you very much. looks great.
> >
> > On Sun, 5 Jan 2020 at 04:00, Greg Newby <gbnewby@pglaf.org> wrote:
> >
> >> Dear Tom,
> >>
> >> You might be interested to see that I recently merged the archives. (I am
> >> the current list operator.) You can find it browsable and a few other
> >> formats. This spans September 1992-July 2013 in the cypherpunks-legacy
> >> collection.
> >>
> >> The current (ongoing) list is in the main cypherpunks collection, from
> >> 2013-present. They are both here:
> >>
> >> https://lists.cpunks.org/mailman/listinfo
> >>
> >> Announcement/description:
> >>
> >> https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2019-December/078230.html
> >>
> >> Best,
> >> Greg
> >>
> >> On Sat, Jan 04, 2020 at 09:41:57PM +0100, Tom Busby wrote:
> >> > I'm just a guy with a website. Believe me, it saddens me that so much is
> >> > lost, that's why I originally started trying to piece it all together,
> >> but
> >> > my leads ran cold, and if you go look at the commit logs for crypto
> >> > anarchy.wiki you'll see how little time I've had to work on it lately.
> >> >
> >> > In terms of whether this is deliberate forgery or just lost data, I
> >> have no
> >> > way of finding out because I don't have other copies of the archive to
> >> > compare with. That's the only way to do it. And even then I can only
> >> detect
> >> > tampering, not innocent loss of data. I was under ten years old during
> >> this
> >> > period so I'm flying blind in terms of what it should look like.
> >> >
> >> > I'm not a player in this drama, I'm just a guy who is mirroring what's
> >> > available so that isn't lost too.
> >> >
> >> > I simply don't have the time to help you at the moment. I have too many
> >> > other commitments. I haven't even found time to merge the 1999-onwards
> >> > archive.
> >> >
> >> > If you find a lead on any of it, let me know. As far as I can tell, Ryan
> >> > Lackey is the only one who can help you. This archive originates on
> >> Venona.
> >> > That I'm pretty sure about. If he won't respond to you, I don't know
> >> what
> >> > can be done. I really hope someone else finds an archive of this era,
> >> > because it's the most important era for sure.
> >> >
> >> > But other than that, please bear in mind that I'm on your side. We both
> >> > have the same goal: a complete, accurate archive. I've done what I can
> >> so
> >> > far. I won't have time to work on this actively in the near future.
> >> >
> >> > On Fri, 3 Jan 2020, 20:27 jim bell, <jdb10987@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > On Friday, January 3, 2020, 02:16:28 AM PST, Tom Busby
> >> <tom@busby.ninja>
> >> > > wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > >>And John Gilmore, Ryan Lackey, Tom Busby, and Declan McCullagh don't
> >> > > seem to care
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > >It's not that I don't care, I just don't know what I can do about it.
> >> > > This appears to be the only copy of the archive available.
> >> > >
> >> > > >If anyone else has a more complete archive, send it to me and I'll
> >> merge
> >> > > it.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > You are thinking solely in terms of correcting the archive. That's a
> >> > > limited view. I'm thinking of finding out who is responsible for the
> >> > > well-planned omissions in the archive. From where was the data
> >> obtained?
> >> > > When was the faking of the data done? Who did it? Why?
> >> > > Who had control of the Cypherpunks list during the 1995-2003 time
> >> frame?
> >> > > Was the data stored elsewhere, such as the Wayback Machine?
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Jim Bell
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > On Fri, 20 Dec 2019 at 08:25, jim bell <jdb10987@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > Jeffrey Epstein: Surveillance Video From First Suicide Attempt
> >> Missinghttps://
> >> www.yahoo.com/entertainment/jeffrey-epstein-surveillance-video-first-184510141.html
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > Jim Bell's comment:
> >> > >
> >> > > Missing, just like a few thousand postings to me, from me, about me,
> >> and
> >> > > any mentioning Assassination Politics in the 1995 Cypherpunks archive.
> >> > >
> >> > > And John Gilmore, Ryan Lackey, Tom Busby, and Declan McCullagh don't
> >> seem
> >> > > to care. Neither does Brian Merchant nor Will Stephenson.
> >> > >
> >> > > Concealing the past by erasing the evidence is an old story.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >>
> >