On Jan 28, 2017, at 11:31 PM, juan <juan.g71@gmail.com> wrote:




me:
  That's an outragous claim for people like you. LMAO at you. You
  are the poster child for circular 'reasoning'.


that children can't suffer from cognitive disabilities, etc.

  I never said that.


John:
Yes you did. In fact you called me a nazi after describing a young
girl whom my girlfriend was the caretaker of who was profoundly
disabled by asperger's syndrome. She couldn't talk, etc.. i'm not
getting into it again, please just leave it alone.

  So again, disagreeing with your stupid enviro propganda that
  comes straight out of your fucking americunt nazi state doesn't
  make me a bible thumper.



How ducking retarded are you? The us republican government DOES NOT
believe in anthropogenic climate change. You are right in line with
Trump and his cronies.


   OK. Allegedly, the trump mafia, which is a subset of
   the us gov't mafia, doesn't believe in global warming. I say
   'allegedly' because I would be hardly surprised if they
   flip-floped. But fine, for the time being they are on the
   payroll of the oil mafia (oops a 'conspiracy theory')

   However, other factions of the us gov't do believe in 'climate
   change'. So my claim "you get your  propaganda from the
   gov't" is still valid (more accurately, the source is a faction
   within the gov't) - If I'm in line with the repuglicans, then
   you are in line with the democrats. 
   But OK, I see how you can turn my argument around and say that
   I'm a shill for shell and exxon (and aramco I guess). Even if
   you do that, my general point still stands. The 'climate
   change' faction IS a faction. They are not honest and
   'objective' 'scientists'. They are playing a political game.
   And 'science' has always been manipulated by political
   interests. Something you seem to completely ignore.



I disagree, for the most part, on this particular issue. The factions seem to me to be a tiny percentage of scientists willing to stand with the "oil mafia", vs the vast majority who seem to me to be standing with the science. Even if the democrats at least profess belief in this existential issue, what did they ever really do about it? Anything of consequence? I don't think the factions break down like you imagine, and I don't give the democrats much credit simply for refusing to deny the issue.











Huge mistakes in medical sciences have most definitely been
made,

  Mistakes? Are you referring to the 'mistakes' of the
'medical' 'science' of psychiatry? As I explained above those are
not mistakes.

There have been mistakes besides atrocities like the lobotomy.

  Not mistakes. 'Curing' gays was not a mistake. And looks like
  you are an accomplice of the shitbags who did that kind of
  thing, by pretending they were not criminals but poor
  'mistaken' altruists or something.



I never said that or even implied it. Was "curing" gays ever accepted
as science by anyone, anywhere?


   So you actucally don't have a clue about what 'scientists'
   used to say? Here's ONE fucking datapoint for you.

   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_in_LGBT_rights

   "The World Health Organisation declassifies homosexuality as a
   mental illness in the latest edition of its list of diseases
   and health problems, the ICD-10."

   Now, was that 1992 BEFORE FUCKING CHRIST or after? I'm not
   goind to do more of your homework. You gaagle the rest.


Ok, I guess I shouldn't be surprised. Obviously this is a disgusting blemish on the history of "scientific inquiry" ;) ... I don't put much stock in psychology personally, despite what you may think.





Early
experimentation with radiation, heparin adulteration out of china,

  AH the evil chinese. What the fuck has that got to do with
  'science', fake or legitimate?




Maybe mistakes is the wrong word for some of those examples - you
love to pick at things with your pedantic little mind. The point is
there have been all sorts of fuck ups in the history of medicine, and
rational inquiry AKA science is how they get solved.


   Keep up with your bullshit. You are doing exactly what I say
   you are doing. You are making excuses for people who are
   corrupt to the bone. The 'mistakes' (your word) or now 'fuck
   ups' are not 'mistakes'.


Yes, many of them were criminal acts, no doubt, with financial pressure pushing legit science aside and causing atrocities. I won't bother with another list, you can gaagle it yourself ;) In any case, they were still mistakes.

   'Science' when done by people is not guaranteed at all to
   really be science. It obviously can be political propaganda.


I wouldn't argue with that.  I do figure there are a lot more principled scientists out there than you think, but I don't pretend to know the numbers.






exploding breast implants, all sorts of toxic shit before the FDA
came around, etc, etc.

  Before the FDA came around. Spoken like a True American
  Anarchist eh John. Tsk tsk. You seem to be showing your true
  statist colors.


Tsk tsk all you want dickhead, it's a fact. All sorts of toxic shit
was passed off prior to the fda (and after, for that matter).

   So you just contradicted yourself in two senteces? Can't
   you make up your mind? =) Does the american anarchist FDA
   'work' or not?


It certainly improved the chances of not being sold toxic snake oil. All your bullshit from here on out trying to paint me as a statist because I stated a fact is just that - so much bullshit.


My
anarchist utopia will have some sort of opt-in dope inspection line,
but I'm happy for you to die of arsenic poisoning in yours.

   'Alle Ding sind Gift und nichts ohn' Gift; allein die Dosis
   macht, das ein Ding kein Gift ist."



I'm an American, we only speak English, remember?  My point stands (I haven't bothered to translate your German yet, it was a long weekend, and my head is killing me ...)


  By the way, radioactive 'cures' were aproved by your
  Progressive Scientifc Anarchist FDA.




So what? Nobody said the FDA was perfect, or even close. It's called
progress.


   OK. So what you are saying is not only that statism works, but
   also that it is progressing towards perfection !!?


I knew you'd jump all over the progress line as soon as I sent it ;).  Poorly worded, but again my point stands. As I said before I would want some sort of opt in drugs inspection in whatever anarchist utopia I can imagine. Mentioning the FDA doesn't make me a statist. But I realize how much you love jumping all over such small minded pedantic bullshit and I'm happy you found something you think is such a powerful point ;)

   I don't think I can give you any more rope =) ...




Everything has to turn into a fucking insult fest with you Juan.
You're not an enjoyable person to discourse with. You aren't scum
like Zen and James Donald, but you have some fucking social issues.


   Thanks for the compliment.    




YW.




  Do you think that the people who run the US central bank (or
  any other central bank), and all the 'economists' from 'very
  important' universities who take central banks and money
  printing for granted, are 'scientists'? Are so called
  'keynesian' 'economists' 'scientists'?




No. It's a "field" that can be gamed and manipulated using analytical
techniques, but fundamentally it would fall more in line as a form of
sociology or some other study of people. Economic policy is dictated
by the barrel of the gun, rules and charters and guidelines written
out by corporate interests and enforced by the various governments in
a very transparent attempt at keeping the rich man (and nation) rich
and the poor man (and nation) poor.


   Indeed. The economic policy of the state and its cronies is
   completely self-serving. But the people in academia who pretend
   to provide 'academic' justifications for it are seen as the most
   capable and altruistic intellectuals engaging in some sort of
   objective and rational endeavor.

   Of course the economics of money printing are self-serving
   voodoo and there's a small group of 'dissenters' among
   economists who say so.

   I brought this uo because it is another (current) example of the
   established, reputable and academic sector getting away with
   murder. And even if mainstream economics isn't seen as hard
   science like physics, it is still regarded as legitimate
   discipline.



   

I have no deep understanding or
insights on this subject (nor much interest) but these are the
thoughts off the top of my head.