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From: Greg Newby <gbnewby@petascale.org>
Date: Sat, 23 Sep 2023 10:43:18 -0700
Message-ID: <CANLuyJaZQdu1cYAf_N-XS1R97hL8GdNvfJMZ88W=xXD4B2dLZA@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Your messages to cypherpunks
To: "Undescribed Horrific Abuse, One Victim & Survivor of Many" <gmkarl@gmail.com>
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Dear Karl,

It's not clear to me what you don't believe. Your gmail addresses will not
be seeing messages from other people who post to the list in a timely
manner, because of the throttling by gmail.

The message frequency from the cypherpunks list has triggered automatic
blocks by gmail since last Saturday (one week). The message from gmail
looks like this (in the "mailq" command output):
DB5E411C0EBC   13334 Tue Sep 19 16:39:57
cypherpunks-bounces@lists.cpunks.org
(host alt1.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com[74.125.193.26] said: 421-4.7.28
[69.55.231.143      15] Our system has detected an unusual rate of
421-4.7.28 unsolicited mail originating from your IP address. To protect
our 421-4.7.28 users from spam, mail sent from your IP address has been
temporarily 421-4.7.28 rate limited. Please visit 421-4.7.28
https://support.google.com/mail/?p=3DUnsolicitedRateLimitError to 421 4.7.2=
8
review our Bulk Email Senders Guidelines.
k4-20020a5d5184000000b0031431c82becsi3097476wrv.903 - gsmtp (in reply to
end of DATA command))

When you were sending fewer messages, things started to flow. Now that you
are again sending many messages, gmail is not accepting them. Gmail seems
to trickle the messages gradually. Here are how many messages are in the
queue right now, for each day of the past week:

Sun  0
Mon  2
Tue  11
Wed  39
Thu  10
Fri  59
Sat  56

Some of those are not due to you or the cypherpunks lists. There are 177
pending messages, and 158 are for the cypherpunks list. 142 of those are
due to Gmail throttling. Almost all of those 142 are from you.

You can see the preponderance of your messages, versus the others who post
to the list, in the archive:
  https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2023-September/author.html

Meanwhile, I have identified a way of limiting the number of messages that
an individual can post in a 24-hour period. This is an add-on to Mailman,
the list software we use. I would like to have the cypherpunks list discuss
what a reasonable and appropriate number of messages per day from each user
might be.

Is this all helpful for understanding what's going on?

Regards,
  Greg

On Fri, Sep 22, 2023 at 4:10=E2=80=AFPM Undescribed Horrific Abuse, One Vic=
tim &
Survivor of Many <gmkarl@gmail.com> wrote:

> [[I don't believe you yet; the log you pasted talked about IP
> addresses rather than senders, and you described many other messages
> being sent from the same IP address. Am I missing something?]]
>
> [[I don't imagine most of the subscribers are reading them anyway,
> even if they are delivered ...]]
>
> I think the priority here we should be focusing on is the future of
> the list. It has few posters, but has a really important history. It's
> hard for me to hold that.
>
> Portals like this can undergo some change and then fade away,
> painfully or quietly or both.
>
> I'm worried things could be painful. I guess maybe they already have been=
.
>
> It's sad there's controversy over the content of the history, and the
> content of the list.
>
> It's sad we almost all dropped end-to-end cryptography, and all that
> implies.
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Dear Karl,</div><div><br></div><div>It&#39;s not clea=
r to me what you don&#39;t believe. Your gmail addresses will not be seeing=
 messages from other people who post to the list in a timely manner, becaus=
e of the throttling by gmail. </div><div><br></div><div>The message frequen=
cy from the cypherpunks list has triggered automatic blocks by gmail since =
last Saturday (one week). The message from gmail looks like this (in the &q=
uot;mailq&quot; command output):<br>DB5E411C0EBC =C2=A0 13334 Tue Sep 19 16=
:39:57 =C2=A0<a href=3D"mailto:cypherpunks-bounces@lists.cpunks.org">cypher=
punks-bounces@lists.cpunks.org</a><br>(host <a href=3D"http://alt1.gmail-sm=
tp-in.l.google.com">alt1.gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com</a>[74.125.193.26] said=
: 421-4.7.28 [69.55.231.143 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A015] Our system has detected=
 an unusual rate of 421-4.7.28 unsolicited mail originating from your IP ad=
dress. To protect our 421-4.7.28 users from spam, mail sent from your IP ad=
dress has been temporarily 421-4.7.28 rate limited. Please visit 421-4.7.28=
 =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://support.google.com/mail/?p=3DUnsolicitedRateLimit=
Error">https://support.google.com/mail/?p=3DUnsolicitedRateLimitError</a> t=
o 421 4.7.28 review our Bulk Email Senders Guidelines. k4-20020a5d518400000=
0b0031431c82becsi3097476wrv.903 - gsmtp (in reply to end of DATA command))<=
/div><div><br></div><div>When you were sending fewer messages, things start=
ed to flow. Now that you are again sending many messages, gmail is not acce=
pting them. Gmail seems to trickle the messages gradually. Here are how man=
y messages are in the queue right now, for each day of the past week:<br></=
div><div><br></div><div>Sun =C2=A00<br>Mon =C2=A02<br>Tue =C2=A011<br>Wed =
=C2=A039<br>Thu =C2=A010<br>Fri =C2=A059<br>Sat =C2=A056</div><div><br></di=
v><div>Some of those are not due to you or the cypherpunks lists. There are=
 177 pending messages, and 158 are for the cypherpunks list. 142 of those a=
re due to Gmail throttling. Almost all of those 142 are from you. <br></div=
><div><br></div><div>You can see the preponderance of your messages, versus=
 the others who post to the list, in the archive:</div><div>=C2=A0 <a href=
=3D"https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2023-September/author.ht=
ml">https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2023-September/author.ht=
ml</a></div><div><br></div><div>Meanwhile, I have identified a way of limit=
ing the number of messages that an individual can post in a 24-hour period.=
 This is an add-on to Mailman, the list software we use. I would like to ha=
ve the cypherpunks list discuss what a reasonable and appropriate number of=
 messages per day from each user might be.</div><div><br></div><div>Is this=
 all helpful for understanding what&#39;s going on?<br></div><div><br></div=
><div>Regards,</div><div>=C2=A0 Greg</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo=
te"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Fri, Sep 22, 2023 at 4:10=E2=
=80=AFPM Undescribed Horrific Abuse, One Victim &amp; Survivor of Many &lt;=
<a href=3D"mailto:gmkarl@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">gmkarl@gmail.com</a>&=
gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">[[I d=
on&#39;t believe you yet; the log you pasted talked about IP<br>
addresses rather than senders, and you described many other messages<br>
being sent from the same IP address. Am I missing something?]]<br>
<br>
[[I don&#39;t imagine most of the subscribers are reading them anyway,<br>
even if they are delivered ...]]<br>
<br>
I think the priority here we should be focusing on is the future of<br>
the list. It has few posters, but has a really important history. It&#39;s<=
br>
hard for me to hold that.<br>
<br>
Portals like this can undergo some change and then fade away,<br>
painfully or quietly or both.<br>
<br>
I&#39;m worried things could be painful. I guess maybe they already have be=
en.<br>
<br>
It&#39;s sad there&#39;s controversy over the content of the history, and t=
he<br>
content of the list.<br>
<br>
It&#39;s sad we almost all dropped end-to-end cryptography, and all that im=
plies.<br>
</blockquote></div>

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