On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 05:36:24PM +1000, Zenaan Harkness wrote:
On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 03:39:49AM -0300, Juan wrote:
“Free speech is not just another value. It's the foundation of Western civilization.” - Dr Peterson
hey Zen why do ypu keep promoting such a scumbag as peterson? Don't you understand that he's a fraud? You should really work on your critical thinking skills instead of being a putin-dailystormer-peterson echo chamber.
Happy to discuss a position, but generic handwaving doesn't move the conversation usefully, as far as I can tell.
That which is useful to some, may not be useful to you/ others. OK, but that does not stop what is useful from being useful - just like "all families are fascist dictatorships from which comes no good" is unlikely to stack up as a sane position, at least for some folks.
And anyway - what the hell is wrong with someone (in this case Peterson), daring to suggest that the mythology of Christianity might actually embody truths of an abstract sort which truths might be useful to the day to day, and life in general, pursuits of a human? And further, daring to suggest that such abstract principles (if the word "truth" is too much for you to stomach in a conversation which mentions the word Christianity) have substantial overlap with Buddhism? And more yet, that at least some of these abstract principles appear to have a biological emergent basis (one could say from the Darwinian perspective) - including an emergent basis for how to define ethics - this should I imagine be grabbed by both horns by the Sam Harris'es of the world! (As in, an atheist couldn't ask for much more!) Seriously, this is very cool science, mixed into (in this case Peterson's) psychological study of not only the biblican stories in Genesis, but at least those stories from Genesis. Peterson has said --so very much-- that a hand waving "he's full of shit" just does not cut it sorry. If you want to take Peterson down, at least attack some particular principle you claim to be false (or as in James D's case, an example of a position that appears to be manifestly unfair - the Lefty Loonies have had effectively unfettered "permission" to exploit Marxist doctrine for literally decades to smash open the Western hierarchy/ society apple carts, and only now when the Huwaite conservatives start to get going, Peterson turns around and says "oh no you don't - you're not allowed to do that" - sure, can't dispute that that's unfair, and from a practical perspective one could easily say in response (to this unfairness position) "sure, go to it, re-build the Huwaite tribes to the extent possible and use whatever damn principles achieve that result" - but at least be prepared to answer the objections raised by Peterson and his ilk :) ). Juan, I responded to your last Peterson- (and now Zenaan- ) bashing email, here: https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2018-August/042914.html Are you disputing the 300 million year basis for "dominance" hierarchies? What about Peterson's 'emergent basis for ethics'? Or are you just flailing at the windmill of Peterson using the word "Christian" in his talks? Ball's in your court...