On Tue, Oct 08, 2019 at 11:21:58PM +0200, Daniel Pocock wrote:
Hi all,
I've been looking through debian-private and I found messages from Alexander Wirt (formorer) about censoring various people from lists.debian.org. Some of those messages appear to be defamatory. You are in BCC because your name appears in debian-private.
I've written a blog to help people work around censorship and other dishonest practices, please tell me if this is helpful for you:
https://danielpocock.com/freedom-and-censorship-on-mailing-lists/
Does anybody know any other victims of censorship in Debian or any other free software community?
Stay free,
Daniel
Hi Daniel, Thank you very much for the time and care you've taken to write up your above blog. It's always reassuring to see someone notice, let alone take action, in relation to one or another of our freedoms - be that the freedom to communicate, the freedom to move and travel anonymously within our communities, or the freedom to engage in a vigorous and vicious verbal stoush with a "sworn arch enemy" for a few days, and turn around afterwards and still continue communicating with them - or not - as we so freely choose. When the screaming banshee snowflakes do all in their power to drown out discussion of rights, principles and freedoms because "muh safe space" and "how dare you f*ck with my safe comfy space, I'll have you censored, hounded out of the community, and have you lose your job to boot, because you said something I don't like", unfrotunately there are some list admins who happily ban the one exercising the free speech, and not the one wanting to "shut it all down, muh safe space!" And so the bannings, kickings, or worse even the shadow bannings are imposed and dissent is met with more bannings and finally a massive swinging CoC dangled in front "the community" - a set of rules or most often just a statement or 3 about how we having to be good to one another, which CoC is thereafter used as the justification for more bannings and censorship. If there is to be any line in the sand, what ought that line be?
From a mailing list administrator's point of view, expecting them to oppose "the statute law" is too much - many would simply close up shop altogether.
So in our present world, that is perhaps, perhaps, the only reasonably acceptable line for "you've crossed the line on free speech", and even then bannings or removal probably should not happen unless a court order is served on the list administrator. That's called presumption of innocence and assuming we do in fact have the right to live our rights. I appreciate your blog, and perhaps a few on the CypherPunks list may also appreciate it - CyphePunks is one of the few mailing lists that still strives to be staunch in standing for free speech - including the right of those who want to say "shut it down". Not the easiest journey apparently... Re RMS, I emailed him and encouraged him to withdraw his respective resignations (from FSF and MIT) - I don't know what the current status is. The email may be found here: reaching out -- was Re: Richard Stallman Gets SJW'd https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2019-September/076425.html And there's a whole (17 email) thread earlier, starting here: https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2019-September/076395.html Although a Google (Jewgle) search for "stallman site:lists.cpunks.org": https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=stallman+site%3Alists.cpunks.org&oq=&aqs= Brings up as at 20191009 11:15, only the following FOUR results: https://www.google.com/url?q=https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2018-November/073667.html&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwil7u3X8o3lAhVDNY8KHShlBIYQFjAAegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw0UWKX3FCLuktqWXrNgk7jL https://www.google.com/url?q=https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2015-January/051703.html&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwil7u3X8o3lAhVDNY8KHShlBIYQFjABegQIABAB&usg=AOvVaw1Nn9nXiGFSaKCI0YUev9eF https://www.google.com/url?q=https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2018-November/043886.html&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwil7u3X8o3lAhVDNY8KHShlBIYQFjACegQIAxAB&usg=AOvVaw3Oq0pcmX57hteVnBLAW6xv https://www.google.com/url?q=https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2018-November/043880.html&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwil7u3X8o3lAhVDNY8KHShlBIYQFjADegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw2gLWxmerK0hZ8xF__85HsX And do NOTE, I have disabled google's "safe search" and anything similar I could find. This campaign/war against our basic rights, goes incredibly deep, right into the heart of "Silicon Valley" in bed with the NSA, CIA etc. See also: on the necessity of a @snowflake codedoc annotation https://lists.cpunks.org/pipermail/cypherpunks/2018-November/043880.html