Hi, As the founder of the Serval Project I can certainly confirm that while telephony is our head-line use-use that we certainly care about data, and are absolutely making data distribution tools that operate on our mesh layer, so I think you will find that our goals are even more compatible than it may first appear. We are also in the process of adding various other features that may be of interest to the FreedomBox community, such as: 1. strong cryptography that is not reliant on any global certificate authority. A key part of this crypto layer is that we are building a team that can perform a credible and open security analysis of the architecture, which is a step often omitted. 2. The Rhizome Retriever that you have already discovered allows the distribution of files, open-source maps (more on that in a moment) and messages (including updates to the Serval software) over the mesh. One of the interesting challenges we are addressing with this is how to secure the update process to prevent unlawful sabotaging of the Serval network through seizing or reverse engineering the signing key. I am happy to explain more of our thinking on this if there is interest. 3. The Serval Distributed Map Tool. This uses locally cached open street map tiles to provide mapping services without the use of internet. One of the really nice synergies of our platform is that we can use the Rhizome Retriever to automatically copy cached map tiles from other phones in the area. Not only does this really enhance the resilience of the mapping tool, but it also has the potential to get map data faster, and allow for updated map tiles in field. There are also other features that we are working on, but this is a selection of ones that I thought might be of particular interest. For further reading, I would recommend having a look at our white paper: http://developer.servalproject.org/site/docs/2011/Serval_Introduction.html It should also be said that while we are targeting Android initially, we are structuring the software so that it can run on any operating system, and we have preliminary work underway for porting to Linux, Symbian S60, iOS, and OSX. In terms of the requirement for root access on the phone, we have progressed the software so that for phones that can run as access points we can institute a kind of dynamic tiling approach to get AP and client devices to communicate in a kind of 2nd class mesh that is possible to form using almost any WiFi capable device. This allows mesh phone calls over one to two hops (AP->Client or Client->AP->Client), but more importantly it allows the Rhizome file dissemination process to occur without impediment, as that already spreads files one hop at a time to avoid the exponential decay in available bandwidth that occurs when sending data many hops on a mesh network. We are also actively engaging in the IEEE 802.11 standards process to get ad-hoc fixed (ask me if you need information about the problems with using ad-hoc WiFi to form mesh networks), and also to standardise the use of the cellular radio present in all phones to allow ad-hoc packet radio in the ISM915 band to allow long-range mesh networking. In terms of current progress for the Serval Project generally, we have alpha-quality developer releases that we are making periodically to help people find and report the glaring bugs and problems, as well as get a taste of some of the functionality we are providing. We have a dedicated community support engineer on the serval-project-developers list (Romain) who will do his best to respond to any issues, and we would welcome the FreedomBox community to take advantage of that resource if trying out our software, or suggesting feature enhancements. While Serval does not operate as a democracy, preferring the "benevolent dictatorship" approach to open source development while we undertake our initial build-out of core features to help maintain clear focus and keep development driving forward, we do have an intentional culture of listening to potential user's requests and, as far as is practical, taking them on board. For instance, aspects of the mapping service and Rhizome Retriever have been influenced by input we have received from humanitarian and aid organisations. We would thus welcome any input and suggestions from the FreedomBox community as we progress our development and planning activities. We do also welcome assistance from the open source community, and aim to work as cooperatively with others as we can. Paul. Founder, Serval Project, Shuttleworth Telecommunications Fellow, Rural, Remote & Humanitarian Telecommunications Research Fellow, Flinders University. On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 6:06 AM, ya knygar <knygar@gmail.com> wrote:

...

We've been keeping an eye on the Serval Project for a while. B They have a slightly different but still compatible goal in mind (telephony, as opposed to a general purpose data network). B One of the ways we differ is that we are not designing custom hardware for Byzantium, preferring instead to make maximal use of commodity hardware already extant (namely, laptops, netbooks, and wi-fi enabled mobile devices).

Hello,

the Serval's site states "b& without infrastructure, without mobile towers, without satellites, without wifi hotspots, and without carriers. Use existing off-the-shelf mobile cell phone handsets. Use your existing mobile phone number wherever you go, and never pay roaming charges again."

"Rooting the phone will allow for adhoc mesh network capability and is required for full functionality of the software. By choosing not to root the phone, the software will still be able to provide free calls to phones that are connected to the same Access Point."

actually [ http://developer.servalproject.org/files/Serval_Manual_Prototype_v0.05.pdf ] they provide

" b" Adhoc will enable you to participate in a mesh network. This option will only be B available if you have super-user privileges on the phone. b" Client will enable you to connect to an access point. b" Access Point will enable other phones in Client mode to connect to your phone. "

possibilities.

It is Village Telco that sells it's own Mesh Potatoes, AFAIK because they were willing to work with fully open source-able hardware and existed variants weren't able to provide this.

That all means - Serval Project isn't about designing a custom hardware.

Also, apparently from their mailing list, they have

"subproject ... to create an application that allows to spread files over the mesh network by exchanging with servers that the handset can see (could be peers and web servers). This app will eventually be merged to batphone."

some code here - https://github.com/rbochet/Rhizome-Retriever/

-- that is for the "data network" aspect.

also they have the well grown support and organization IMO, so i think - the allied efforts is a good idea.

@The Doctor

...

Byzantium is a distribution of Linux which makes it easy to set up an ad-hoc wireless mesh infrastructure.

...

Byzantium, preferring instead to make maximal use of commodity hardware already extant (namely, laptops, netbooks, and wi-fi enabled mobile devices).

That means - the users would need to install a separate Linux distro on all these devices?

Do you plan to provide the packages or virtual "images" to the existing OS's?

Distribution for the routers?

Applications for the poor mobile devices which are messed and would be messed enough so user can't install another or replacing OS on them?

Thank you in advance.

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