It is clear that whatever ID procedures were in effect, they were not effective. Many enlistees lied about their ages and got away with it. Marc de Piolenc Duncan Frissell wrote:
At 05:10 PM 12/13/01 -0600, Jim Choate wrote:
Which is beside your point. Your statement was that the government didn't do ANY identification for ANY of the soldiers in WWII. Patently wrong. Quit trying to change the rules in the middle of the game.
On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, F. Marc de Piolenc wrote:
It is clear that whatever ID procedures were in effect, they were not effective. Many enlistees lied about their ages and got away with it.
I have zero problem with that assertion. However, lying about ones age and getting away with it is a far cry from not having any security/identity checks at all. -- ____________________________________________________________________ Day by day the Penguins are making me lose my mind. Bumper Sticker The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage@ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------
Jim Choate wrote:
On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, F. Marc de Piolenc wrote:
It is clear that whatever ID procedures were in effect, they were not effective. Many enlistees lied about their ages and got away with it.
I have zero problem with that assertion.
However, lying about ones age and getting away with it is a far cry from not having any security/identity checks at all.
How do you figure? If I could lie about my age, seems to me I could lie about just about anything else, with the possible exception of sex. If I were going for a commission, or got roped into a high-security program that required background investigation, then I would need better backstopping than just a set of lies on an enlistment form, but as a plain old grunt nobody need ever know my name was NOT Michael J. McGillicuddy. Marc de Piolenc
On Fri, 14 Dec 2001, F. Marc de Piolenc wrote:
It is clear that whatever ID procedures were in effect, they were not effective. Many enlistees lied about their ages and got away with it.
At the time, insufficient age was an "open secret" for these so afflicted. Warm bodies are what drive a war machine (even if they are only driving the remote Predators), and when bodies are scarce, and war is plentiful, niceties such as age become moot as long as everyone agrees. The concept of "got away with it" is meaningless in this context, as nobody was really trying to "catch it".
Marc de Piolenc
Duncan Frissell wrote:
At 05:10 PM 12/13/01 -0600, Jim Choate wrote:
Which is beside your point. Your statement was that the government didn't do ANY identification for ANY of the soldiers in WWII. Patently wrong. Quit trying to change the rules in the middle of the game.
-- Yours, J.A. Terranson sysadmin@mfn.org If Governments really want us to behave like civilized human beings, they should give serious consideration towards setting a better example: Ruling by force, rather than consensus; the unrestrained application of unjust laws (which the victim-populations were never allowed input on in the first place); the State policy of justice only for the rich and elected; the intentional abuse and occassionally destruction of entire populations merely to distract an already apathetic and numb electorate... This type of demogoguery must surely wipe out the fascist United States as surely as it wiped out the fascist Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. The views expressed here are mine, and NOT those of my employers, associates, or others. Besides, if it *were* the opinion of all of those people, I doubt there would be a problem to bitch about in the first place... --------------------------------------------------------------------
On Thu, 13 Dec 2001 measl@mfn.org wrote:
The concept of "got away with it" is meaningless in this context, as nobody was really trying to "catch it".
Actually they were. I can direct you to the plethora of 1st person accounts during D-Day in Normandy for example. You will occassionaly run across a reference of a recruit having gotten through boot and across the big pond to only be turned back by an officer in combat. If a kid was found out, and the officers in their CoC gave a shit (some did, some didn't) they were returned home. It's a sad state that since the Civil War in this country a considerable number of young kids have died in combat before they were eligable for the draft. -- ____________________________________________________________________ Day by day the Penguins are making me lose my mind. Bumper Sticker The Armadillo Group ,::////;::-. James Choate Austin, Tx /:'///// ``::>/|/ ravage@ssz.com www.ssz.com .', |||| `/( e\ 512-451-7087 -====~~mm-'`-```-mm --'- --------------------------------------------------------------------
At 11:05 PM 12/13/01 -0600, Jim Choate wrote:
they were returned home. It's a sad state that since the Civil War in this country a considerable number of young kids have died in combat before they were eligable for the draft.
Many legal minors are far advanced over even the legislators who make up laws about minors. That being said, yes, wars about someone real estate are very regrettable.
participants (4)
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David Honig -
F. Marc de Piolenc -
Jim Choate -
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